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Licence query

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  • 09-08-2022 10:17am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 56 ✭✭


    Hi

    Famous age old question , but any idea how long Licences are taking in the Carlow area ?

    I sent in a application on 25th May & still waiting?

    I allready hold 2 firearms Licences, (air rifle / shotgun ) awaiting .223.

    My landowner has being contacted & confirmed .



Answers

  • Registered Users Posts: 11,759 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    The Gardai have 3 months to make a decision so the 3 months isn't up yet. I had a renewal that took nearly 5 months so it's anybody's guess.

    Contact the Carlow District Office and ask them about it.


    District HQ: Carlow

    District HQ Tel: +353 59 9136627



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,956 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    It's a national problem this year.Every division is slow in issuing and no one seems to know why.

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,759 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    COVID is slowing things up, that's certainly part of the problem.

    Firstly, there's a lot of absences related to COVID.

    Secondly, I know in the organisation I work in lots of holidays were carried over from last year due to people not wanting to take holidays while we were in lockdown or couldn't take holidays because we were so short staffed. I ended up having 8 weeks (in reality two months) worth of holidays this year. The Gardai are probably the same.

    Thirdly, there has been a lot of retirements in the senior Gardai ranks and this has led to a merry-go-round change of staff, and that slows up things too.

    Structures have been changed too. My restricted licences used to be processed in Kilkenny but they now go to Waterford where the Chief Super is based.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,619 ✭✭✭Feisar


    I had a substitution take eight weeks recently. Rang after six, FO said they were back from hols and apart from that was swamped with renewals. New Super as well who apparently wants references on substitutions, form clears says no need for subs but hey, let's make up the rules as we want.

    @Grizzly 45 I looked up then the three year licence came in to see if that was the reason for delays, i.e. I would expect a glut of renewals every three years from then but that came in 2015 so it's not that.

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Registered Users Posts: 56 ✭✭del boi


    12 weeks this week , they contacted myself 8 weeks ago . Rang my permissions 5 weeks ago . Still waiting.

    Feel bad for the shops for sales that are trying to operate a business & keep doors open.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 763 ✭✭✭tonysopprano


    The LAW states that after 3 months, it is an AUTOMATIC refusal, but most on here say "shor this is Ireland, give them a chance, they must be busy, ah convid is still here, the super changed, and other excuses like this, et al."

    THIS is the reason that they can get away with this CRIMINAL behavior, because people will not stand up for themselves, and because of this, they become more emboldened to try this on everyone.

    Either it is law or it is not. Bending over and taking it, ONLY results in you getting it from behind, and then they try it on everyone.

    If you can do the job, do it. If you can't do the job, just teach it. If you really suck at it, just become a union executive or politician.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 28,476 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cass


    That's a little unfair and harsh on those that actually have no power to change things. People are not "bending over and taking it", oh and it's not criminal behaviour to be slow.

    By all means stand up against made up laws and unfair or even illegal practices but the issue around the 3 month refusal is more complicated.

    The law says after three months it's deemed refused, but the problem is you are meant to receive a receipt when you submit your application and the clock starts from then. Plus the act also states all refusals must be done in writing. Seems to contradict itself when it says after 3 months it's an automatic refusal without the need for informing the applicant then say all refusals must be notified to the applicant via written letter.

    However the receipt of the application usually comes days or a couple of weeks before the grant letter and in some cases after the grant letter. This is because of the way the applications are processed, entered into PULSE and also why AGS can claim such a high rate of applications being done within the 3 month period, because the clock starts when they're ready not you.

    This moves us into the second problem, who do you complain to? If my FO is acting the maggot I go to the Sergeant as no Super would waste their time dealing with grievances below their station which rarely speeds up the process and only serves to piss off the FO.

    If the FO is on the ball then the application sits on the Super's desk until they're ready or available to sign off on it.

    So in short we have to complain to those that control the licensing process, about the licensing process. It's akin to using the Garda ombudsman, an utter water of time.

    However a small tip if you want to push the application or substitution, but should only be used when the clock is expired or on the verge of doing so. Send an email to your local Super, their addresses are on the Garda website for each station, and cc your FO. Once the Super gets enough emails about delays, problems, etc someone might take note and it provides a history should it be needed that complaints were made. If nothing else your FO will see your emails going directly to the Super as well and then and may want to avoid any questions from the Super by increasing efficiency/productivity.

    Post edited by Cass on
    Forum Charter - Useful Information - Photo thread: Hardware - Ranges by County - Hunting Laws/Important threads - Upcoming Events - RFDs by County

    If you see a problem post use the report post function. Click on the three dots on the post, select "FLAG" & let a Moderator deal with it.

    Moderators - Cass otmmyboy2 , CatMod - Shamboc , Admins - Beasty , mickeroo



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,956 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    RE the Garda Ombudsman.

    Involving them is your ultima ratio option, and only if say a Super or chief was acting the complete bollix and refusing to issue a license after being told to do so by a DC,or calling you every name under the Sun for wanting a particular type of license or something of that nature. Yes, they will investigate, and in the majority of cases, they will find in the favour of the super...

    However, it is a career black mark for them to find a colleague sitting behind their desk one morning having a read of a particular file, and these incidents are and have been noted in GO HQ over the years that there does seem to be a problem in these matters with the AGS. Thankfully,not as much as it once was.

    So don't be afraid to use the GO's services, that's what they are there for, but use them for something serious, not for delays or perceived refusals. The law might say it is an automatic refusal after 90 days, but the expression "The law is an ass!" does apply too in this case.

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 28,476 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cass


    To be clear I'm not saying to use the Garda ombudsman, I'm saying making a complaint about a licensing issue to the very people that the compaint is about is the SAME as making any other compaint to the ombudsman. An utter waste of time that will go nowhere

    It's why I stopped using the FPU. Last time I rang up about an issue with my FO the FPU spent the entirety of the call questioning me about the firearm ( they thought it was illegal to own, God help me) rather than deal with my issue.

    Forum Charter - Useful Information - Photo thread: Hardware - Ranges by County - Hunting Laws/Important threads - Upcoming Events - RFDs by County

    If you see a problem post use the report post function. Click on the three dots on the post, select "FLAG" & let a Moderator deal with it.

    Moderators - Cass otmmyboy2 , CatMod - Shamboc , Admins - Beasty , mickeroo



  • Registered Users Posts: 552 ✭✭✭Munsterlad102


    Surely the super/chief super would see your application before the ombudsman sees your complaint.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 56 ✭✭del boi


    Thanks all , I'll give it another week.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,759 ✭✭✭✭BattleCorp


    Did you ring the District Office?

    I was waiting on two restricted licences and had to ring the District Office twice. That gave the process a bit of a push. One tip, always be polite but state the urgency of your licence. Not saying you'd do this, but being a d1ck gets you nowhere.



  • Registered Users Posts: 763 ✭✭✭tonysopprano


    I presume that you have fallen to the recent affliction of failing to use the word NOT, in the first sentence above. Funnily enough this is the 3rd or 4th time, in recent times that this has occured in the shooting forum

    If you can do the job, do it. If you can't do the job, just teach it. If you really suck at it, just become a union executive or politician.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 28,476 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cass


    Not following, the word not (while not capitalised) is there.

    Forum Charter - Useful Information - Photo thread: Hardware - Ranges by County - Hunting Laws/Important threads - Upcoming Events - RFDs by County

    If you see a problem post use the report post function. Click on the three dots on the post, select "FLAG" & let a Moderator deal with it.

    Moderators - Cass otmmyboy2 , CatMod - Shamboc , Admins - Beasty , mickeroo



  • Registered Users Posts: 588 ✭✭✭steyrman


    Hi I use the same district 17 weeks for new application 5 months ago I got a sub licence and renewal licence in 10 days hit and miss atm



  • Registered Users Posts: 763 ✭✭✭tonysopprano


    So are you saying to use the Garda Ombudsman, " I'm saying making a complaint about a licensing issue to the very people that the compaint is about is the SAME as making any other compaint to the ombudsman. An utter waste of time that will go nowhere" or are you saying NOT to use the Garda Ombudsman as " I'm saying making a complaint about a licensing issue to the very people that the compaint is about is the SAME as making any other compaint to the ombudsman. An utter waste of time that will go nowhere"

    See?

    If you can do the job, do it. If you can't do the job, just teach it. If you really suck at it, just become a union executive or politician.



  • Registered Users Posts: 39,157 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    I can’t see how it’s illegal, let alone criminal. By all means, you are entitled to go down to the station after 3 months and demand your legally mandated refusal - but I really can see how that’s a benefit.

    People are willing to give some leeway on time, if it lead to the result they want.

    Those two versions (in quotes) are identical. I’m not sure what you’re getting either, the NOT is there in Cass’s above. It makes sense to me

    He is not saying to use the ombudsman, as it’s a waste of time.



  • Registered Users Posts: 56 ✭✭del boi


    Update : license received yesterday, 3&1/2 months



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