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Where is the cost of living crisis exactly?

13468911

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,670 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...but it sometimes can be used to further increase leveraging, i.e. to borrow more, yes this is more debt, but sometimes that can lead to further accumulation of assets, sometimes....

    ...now the other side, what if you dont own any assets at all, but are trying to get access to such markets, i.e. first time buyers etc, as current asset owners play this game also, i.e. try to accumulate more assets, this generally helps to cause further asset price inflation, as more and more money enters the market, particularly in the form of credit. this situation generally, but not always, will give the current asset ownership the edge, i.e. the ability to effectively outbid the non asset owner....i.e. this approach sets off whats called a positive feedback loop, leading to asset booms, and subsequent busts.....



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,819 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Nah, you way over thinking it. Most home owners don't see their home as a commodity, they see it as a home, an extremely expensive bit of kit that costs a fortune to run and maintain. The idea they are on the pigs back is nonsense.

    The very act of committing to such a financial burden means you have immediately limited your choices, I imagine that extends to "social leverage", whatever that actually means.

    Of course none of that has anything to do with the challenges in the market at the minute, a market which is cyclical, wasn't that long ago we were bulldozing housing estates and people were financing 60%+ negative equity homes.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,256 ✭✭✭Andrewf20


    Yes but you can choose to sell it if you want to (generally).

    People still choose buy a house knowing full well its years of debt. Im not sure what a viable alternative would be. The leverage is the luxury of having the choice.

    Post edited by Andrewf20 on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,670 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...again, you need to define the term, 'pigs back'?

    again, most are feeling the cost of living crisis, including current home owners, but we re not all feeling it the same...

    many non asset owners, are frantically doing everything they can to get access to these markets, trying to save as much as possible, while still trying to survive right now, you ll find most current asset owners, in particular home owners, are not frantically trying to save for such a purchase, as they already have done so, i.e. we re not all experience our current situation the same....

    again, this gives current asset owners, i.e. home owners, a major step up, as more of their income can be used to accumulate more assets via pension plans, and other investments....

    again, 'security of accommodation' is a critical human need, and current asset owners, including current mortgage holders, are potentially closer to achieving this requirement, but of course theres risks involved...

    whats happening now, is that younger generations are being pushed further back with achieving common, and sometimes critical life goals, including child raring etc, this is in fact critical in maintaining a functioning society and economy, for all, including for older asset owners. one such critical need is being able to provide adequate elder care for such asset owners, i.e. younger generations are required for this, but if they are unable to provide themselves with such critical needs, i.e. security of accommodation etc, it is very unlikely they ll be able to provide us asset owners with our critical needs, in old age.....



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,819 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Huh?

    Like I said it was only a wet week ago we were bulldozing housing estates.

    The market is cyclical. You are over reacting to a moment in time.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,819 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    In the current market selling the family home would not be an option for most people.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,670 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    where were we bulldozing housing estates, and what were we doing this for, and was this being done on a large scale?

    yes markets are indeed cyclical, but theres clearly something catastrophically failing now with many of our most critical of markets, property being the most obvious, but not the only one, we re clearly also experiencing a dramatic deterioration of our health systems...

    ...am i really just over reacting, really, to a moment in time! as this seems to be a very long moment in time, going on arguable for a couple of decades now, and in many other countries also!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,948 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    I would suspect cost of living crisis is not seen by those who have far more disposable income than they need.

    In the two decades since I graduated from university, there has been nothing that comes anywhere close to 2022 as regards inflation. This is definitely a shock to the system.

    Three examples.

    ESB Bill is routinely 50% higher than it was three years ago.

    Cost of holiday accomodation (holiday home) - was paying circa 700 per week three years ago, now 1000.

    Mortgage has just gone up 100 per month.

    Then there are all those little charges. Getting a bike repaired, getting a new radiator put in. Things that used to cost 80 euro all now seem to cost 200.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,948 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    TBF lads this is a discussion on the cost of living crisis (which affects everyone), not on the housing situation.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,670 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    both are a part of the same argument, as the cost of housing is also still spiraling out of control.....



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,948 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    No, one is a subset of the other.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,670 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...and now we re starting to play with words....

    have rents and mortgages gone up or down, in recent months? has the cost of building gone up or down?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,948 ✭✭✭Tombo2001


    Would love to ask Boards....

    what is the economic model with some 'member' that routinely starts discussions with provocative, emotive and usually incorrect opening posts, and then f**ks off.....doesnt engage in discussion, just leaves it at that.

    Only to start another thread in a similar way.

    Had Boards.ie disclosed whether they have Bots starting threads, or what is going on here?

    Feel a bit stupid for participating in this discussion.



  • Posts: 9,106 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I think there’s a few distinct groups out there-

    1. Those with no mortgage, high levels of disposable income and secure jobs or incomes won’t be too bothered but whilst there are a lot of people in that position in Ireland, and good luck to them, they’re still in the minority.
    2. People considered on “decent” incomes will adjust- they’ll reduce weekly shopping bill by buying less luxuries, will reduce discretionary and social spending like going out to restaurants etc They might think twice on changing car and may limit number of holidays or breaks away - whilst they’re taking some actions to reduce outgoings, they’re not “worried” per se
    3. People with low incomes- these people are worried- theres very little wriggle room on weekly costs- their weekly shop is traditionally made up of must haves and essentials- they don’t take many holidays and budget carefully to get away somewhere once a year; they never planned on having to meet mortgage interest rate rises and heating etc bills is really getting them worried; if they are commuting long distances to work and using a car, theyre extremely under financial pressure now already - a time will come where they can’t cut back anymore and may lean towards potential spiralling debt


  • Posts: 9,106 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    My advice for those on low incomes right now who are stating to struggle- bin the credit card or at least keep it at zero and get rid of any over drafts- they’ll just get worse - and don’t go to illegal lenders - you’re asking for a whole heap of trouble



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,929 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Like I said it was only a wet week ago we were bulldozing housing estates.

    This was a week ago? Or was it 10 years ago?

    A lot can happen in ten years.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,929 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    House prices are the highest they have been since the boom. If now is not a good time to sell, when exactly is?

    You have also confirmed the issue of house prices for those who don't own any property.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,819 ✭✭✭✭Boggles




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,929 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    So, young people should wait ten years to see if house prices crash....

    OK!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,189 ✭✭✭Brucie Bonus


    Thats suggesting people don't want to ever get off it. I know it flies in the face of an often too common preconception, but we can't claim record high employment figures and expect anyone made unemployed to never want to work again. Then we've working people getting assistance too. And of course the minority of chancers who game the system, but we can't treat everyone like a leech because they fall on tough times. I am okay with money being increased if needed, not arbitrarily raised.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,819 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    It's young people getting caught up in the current frenzy.

    If we could stop projecting the hyperbole and whipping the masses up we may have a chance of a normal property market, one with less pronounced peaks and troughs.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,819 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    If you have to sell you have to buy.

    The best time to sell your family home depends on when you bought it and the current market conditions.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 39,089 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    How do you justify taxpayers being forced to pay for religion teachers?

    I'm partial to your abracadabra,

    I'm raptured by the joy of it all.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,929 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    True, if you need to sell, you have to buy, BUT at least one has a property that has appreciated in value to sell in the first place.

    An FTB has no such property to sell, so it's extra hard for them. Hence the points being made.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,929 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    It's young people getting caught up in the current frenzy.

    If we could stop projecting the hyperbole and whipping the masses up we may have a chance of a normal property market, one with less pronounced peaks and troughs.

    Ah ok. It's young people's fault that the property market is what it is.

    Nothing to do with the rules and policies set down at the behest of existing property owners and the NIMBYism that exists in many areas.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,819 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Nope, less variables in a first time buyer who has secured a mortgage.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,929 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    Apart from them being poorer because they don't have equity in a house already.

    Anyway, if you are seriously suggesting than a FTB is better off than an existing homeowner, then you have lost the plot.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,819 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    The rules are robust around lending, they needed to be after the cluster fúck of the celtic tiger.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,819 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Of course there are in certain circumstances, in a market that can change rapidly, speed can save you a fortune.

    There is also a raft of first time buyer incentives to avail of.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,274 ✭✭✭EOQRTL


    Where are all the people in their 40's and 50's who haven't already got a house/mortgage going to live when they reach retirement? We are going to need to massively ramp up social housing over the next 10 years because this is an oncoming disaster. 😮



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