Who’s going to get your dosh? Wills & Inheritance Discussion

irish_goat · 09-04-2021 3:16pm

Myself and the wife were discussing this recently. We'll probably look at some sort of equity release on the house and use the funds to travel and generally live well. Any leftovers will probably go to our nieces and nephews and likely to a local animal charity that my wife will probably have set up or be involved in when she's retired. :pac:

PMBC · 09-04-2021 3:34pm

I don't have much now and I doubt I will in the future and have no property,
If I predecease my wife everything/anything will go to her. If its the opposite everything will be split between my god-child 10% and my two children 45% each. I will leave oit to the older to organise and both are very honest people.
But 10% of little will be 'littler' still. I have a nice watch which will go to one and some hi-fi which will go to the other. If they want to 'hock' those I wont mind/be beyond caring.
I wont be making a will. I saw the colossal charges on my mother's estate and said f*** that.

09-04-2021 4:24pm

I would like to release the equity in my house when I get to 70 or so and spend it on women, wine and song. Looking at the current providers of these equity release schemes, they would only give me a lump sum of 25% of the house value. I know they have to cover themselves in case I live to get a card from the president, but given current life expectancy and interest rates, I thought they would be willing to lend more.

09-04-2021 4:39pm

irish_goat wrote: »

Myself and the wife were discussing this recently. We'll probably look at sone sort of equity release on the house and use the funds to travel and generally live well. Any leftovers will probably go to our nieces and nephews and likely to a local animal charity that my wife will probably have set up or be involved in when she's retired. :pac:

The King Puck retirement village

waxmelts2000 · 09-04-2021 5:21pm

Hi, just came across this thread. I'm nearing 50 pretty soon - I have my will made over 15 years or so. It's funny as I recently just requested a copy as I could not remember the details!

My parents and my god son will get my house 33% each, sell it or else they gift to my godson ( 2 years left in mortgage)
Any cash I have is to be split across my siblings (4) and if one of those die before me then their kids

I am worth more dead than alive though (in death service policy at work) so I often joke with that statement.

So I guess there will be tax implications for all based on 32,500 limit is that correct?

09-04-2021 6:34pm

waxmelts2000 wrote: »

Hi, just came across this thread. I'm nearing 50 pretty soon - I have my will made over 15 years or so. It's funny as I recently just requested a copy as I could not remember the details!

My parents and my god son will get my house 33% each, sell it or else they gift to my godson ( 2 years left in mortgage)
Any cash I have is to be split across my siblings (4) and if one of those die before me then their kids

I am worth more dead than alive though (in death service policy at work) so I often joke with that statement.

So I guess there will be tax implications for all based on 32,500 limit is that correct?

Hi and thanks for posting. Unfortunately boards.ie rules prevent “advice” so I just need to be cautious on how I reply

.

If you click on the link at the start of this thread you’ll see the current revenue limits for inheritance tax.
If your godson is a nephew then his inheritance tax free allowance is 32500 over his lifetime not just on a per inheritance basis. If he’s a non relative allowance is less- currently 16250

Some information on house inheritances here which might help or be applicable to your particular circumstance in the future
https://www.revenue.ie/en/gains-gifts-and-inheritance/cat-exemptions/exemption-for-dwelling-house/index.aspx

Inheritance threashold from child to parent listed here currently 335k- but you have to die first

https://www.moneyguideireland.com/inheritance-tax-in-ireland.html

assuming you outlive your parents then it’s your godson who will inherit your house - there will certainly be tax implications then at current rate of 33% minus any tax free allowance threshold he hasn’t used up -

In terms of siblings it again depends on what other inheritances they have got or will get before you die as to what tax free threshold they will have. Then it’s down to just how much dosh you have to share with them and their children which will dictate if tax is due or not.
Remember you may inherit monies in years to come also or you may have very little cash left but still have your house etc- so lots to consider
hope this helps

waxmelts2000 · 09-04-2021 7:12pm

Thank you for replying PlentyOhToole, yes my godson is my nephew.

I'll definitely take a look at the recommended sites!

The_Conductor · 09-04-2021 7:36pm

Hi all- just to reiterate what was mentioned a few posts up- while we can discuss the implications of the various options we might make when we are doing up our wills etc- offering financial advice per se, is verbotten on the site.

Please keep this in mind- and while its nice to read of everyone's plans and how folk might address what they intend to happen when they depart this mortal coil, lets keep away from offering specific advice to one another.

If you need specific information- please seek professional financial advice from someone qualified to offer such- and keep in mind that all our situations are different, something that is suitable for one person might be a folly for another.

Thanks!

09-04-2021 8:38pm

The_Conductor wrote: »

Hi all- just to reiterate what was mentioned a few posts up- while we can discuss the implications of the various options we might make when we are doing up our wills etc- offering financial advice per se, is verbotten on the site.

Please keep this in mind- and while its nice to read of everyone's plans and how folk might address what they intend to happen when they depart this mortal coil, lets keep away from offering specific advice to one another.

If you need specific information- please seek professional financial advice from someone qualified to offer such- and keep in mind that all our situations are different, something that is suitable for one person might be a folly for another.

Thanks!

Thanks The_Conductor- thread now with added Poll and referencing this mod warning. Cheers

Nody · 09-04-2021 8:47pm

I guess we're going to be an odd one out here but I'm planning to leave behind a sizable fortune behind when we die. We're working towards to live out our retirement on dividends rather than trusting the state (ha!) or pension companies to actually give us enough money to live on. As part of that plan 10% of the yearly dividends get invested, 90% gets put in a bank account and split by 12 for next year's "salary". Once both of us die the primary goal will be to ensure our pets get to live a long and happy life until their natural deaths (with a stipend to the people who look after them as incentive). My sister's children will get enough money for a down payment on their first apartment and the rest will be put in a fund in Luxemburg (preliminary plan; we've got a solicitor we are talking with on the topic) that will continue to own the shares and pay out the dividends (minus the 10% reinivested) every year to a set of causes we which to promote. This means we also got an personal interest in making sure we grow the funds as large as possible for obvious reasons.

09-04-2021 8:51pm

bubblypop wrote: »

Yep, I agree, anyone who inherits money should be happy to get some, and pay the bit of tax.

It was already taxed!

09-04-2021 8:53pm

Oscar Madison wrote: »

It was already taxed!

I'm aware of that, I'm the one who was taxed on it!
Point is, if you are lucky enough to get/inherit unearned money, then a bit of tax shouldn't bother you.
It wouldn't bother me if I inherited something.

Anyway, I guess I've repeated myself a few times now, so I'll leave the conversation without me butting in all the time!

magicbastarder · 09-04-2021 8:54pm

all money has been taxed at some point. the fact that it was already taxed is moot.

09-04-2021 8:56pm

If it ever comes to a point where I will be in a position to leave anything

to my children they will be getting it WELL in advance!

09-04-2021 9:02pm

Nody wrote: »

I guess we're going to be an odd one out here but I'm planning to leave behind a sizable fortune behind when we die. .

MAMMY/DADDY!

I'm heading into serious retirement planning myself over the next year once a few financial commitments end in early 2022 but with a certain level of pension planning already in place, thankfully. (Considering the forum we're in, probably couldn't have done it had I had kids)

I'm looking forward to learning more about the various investment instruments available so I'll be stalking forums like business and finance and Investments and Markets very soon

Best wishes for your retirement plans - hope all goes well and you make a good point around state pension- by the time I retire, the qualifying age will probably be 99

Geuze · 09-04-2021 9:09pm

PMBC wrote: »

I wont be making a will. I saw the colossal charges on my mother's estate and said f*** that.

There is no obligation to use a sol to do probate.

It is possible to do probate yourself, and avoid the high fees charged by sol in Ireland.

magicbastarder · 09-04-2021 9:10pm

Oscar Madison wrote: »

If it ever comes to a point where I will be in a position to leave anything

to my children they will be getting it WELL in advance!

just in case this is a reference to inheritance tax, inheritance tax is not just levied after the donor dies.
if you give your son €50k now, that counts towards his lifetime inheritance tax free quota of €335k. you'll just be lowering what you can leave tax free to him on your death.

09-04-2021 9:18pm

magicbastarder wrote: »

just in case this is a reference to inheritance tax, inheritance tax is not just levied after the donor dies.
if you give your son €50k now, that counts towards his lifetime inheritance tax free quota of €335k. you'll just be lowering what you can leave tax free to him on your death.

Thanks M' but I'm aware of all that anyway but there's ways around everything!

bunny_mac · 09-04-2021 11:25pm

I volunteered with a very small charity once upon a time and part of my 'job' was trying to find potential funding sources. There are lots of fairly small trusts out there that make a modest income from property or whatever and then invite funding applications from charities once a year. They usually have a certain leaning (like animals, environment, education) and a limit to how much you can apply for. I'd like to set up something like that, something where smaller charities can benefit. Have no clue how I'd go about it though, but hopefully I won't have to worry about that for a long time.

If I found out I was going to die soon I'd leave everything to my friends. I have siblings but they're also childfree, so no nieces or nephews to consider.

markodaly · 11-04-2021 10:23pm

magicbastarder wrote: »

because they enjoy tax free status?

So, 'just cause'?

Not really an answer now is it? The family farm can be passed on, tax-free, but you think that isn't right, because its unearned income, yet a charity can 'earn' income via donations and not pay tax.

markodaly · 11-04-2021 10:31pm

magicbastarder wrote: »

also, if properly regulated, a charity *does* earn its income.

Can you explain how they earn the income when they are just given money when someone dies?
In the context of this discussion, it's inheritance and wills.

On one hand, you say all money left to a son, daughter, niece, nephew. etc.. is unearned so should be taxed.
Yet money left in the same way to a charity is earned, so is exempt from tax.

This doesn't make sense to me. Either it's all taxed, or there is tax-free status given to certain circumstances like there is now.
A charity has tax free status and a relative can inherit an amount tax-free up to a threshold.

Note, that many countries don't have any inheritance tax, Sweden for example has gotten rid of it.

simply taking money from my dead parents because they have 300k to give me does not mean i have 'earned' it.

Likewise to a charity.

magicbastarder · 11-04-2021 10:37pm

it's because a charity is legally obliged to put that money into causes of public interest. they're not allowed keep it, or spend it on 'themselves'. there are actually rules preventing charities building up too much cash; which can actually cause problems for some charities.

anyway, if you don't agree that there's a qualititative difference between giving money to charity, and giving money to a niece or nephew (say for them to buy a car, or a house), i suspect we're not going to see eye to eye.

Stihl waters · 11-04-2021 10:45pm

I plan to die penniless having spent all my money on frivolous stuff, right on schedule so far

markodaly · 11-04-2021 11:54pm

magicbastarder wrote: »

it's because a charity is legally obliged to put that money into causes of public interest. they're not allowed keep it, or spend it on 'themselves'. there are actually rules preventing charities building up too much cash; which can actually cause problems for some charities.

anyway, if you don't agree that there's a qualititative difference between giving money to charity, and giving money to a niece or nephew (say for them to buy a car, or a house), i suspect we're not going to see eye to eye.

You didn't answer my question though.

You never explained how charities earned their income when someone gives them an inheritance, as opposed to a close relative. How is it 'earned' in one case and not in the other?

As to the laws protecting money given to Charities. We have had years and years of revelations to show us that it's either not the case, or these laws are summarily ignored. It is seen commonly now, that charities are just another scam for those who run them in the higher ups.
Just this week.
https://www.thejournal.ie/bothar-ceo-david-moloney-high-court-5404560-Apr2021/?utm_source=shortlink

But this is not really the point of this thread.

I guess in summary, I find it hard to reconcile how a nameless charity or the government is more entitled to your money than a niece or nephew or a son/daughter.

pinkypinky · 12-04-2021 10:41am

A related query which came up in the genealogy forum.

If your parents and siblings are dead, are niblings of a single childless person the defacto next of kin?

magicbastarder · 12-04-2021 10:42am

you mean in terms of inheritance if you die intestate? or in terms of inheritance tax?

this is the order of succession, in terms of distributing the estate; this is not tax relevant though AFAIK:

If a single person (without children) dies without making a Will, leaving siblings, they will inherit equally. If there are any siblings that died before the recently deceased brother/sister (predeceased them), leaving children, those nieces and nephews take the share that their parents would otherwise have taken.

https://www.stonesolicitors.ie/ten-things-successioninheritance-may-know/

(note: that dates from 2014 and there's been at least one change to inheritance tax bands since)

magicbastarder · 12-04-2021 11:00am

i have just learned of the concept of 'favourite niece' or 'favourite nephew' where you can nominate one nibling, and this effectively bumps them into the same status as a son or daughter for inheritance tax purposes.
i suspect there's been a few family feuds created by that...

pinkypinky · 12-04-2021 11:41am

No, I actually mean in a medical decisions capacity - sorry I should have been clearer. If, for example, someone is in a coma, cannot make their own decision, but has no spouse, parents or siblings alive, but has niblings, and is not a ward of court.

I understand the order of succession for intestacy or wills.

magicbastarder · 12-04-2021 11:44am

just googled that, this was one of the first ones to come up:

Family members and Advance Healthcare Directives
If a healthcare issue arises and the patient is incapable of making a decision, it is the practice to consult with close family members. It is not clear what legal basis there is for this, as family members have no general right to make decisions on behalf of adults.

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/health/legal_matters_and_health/advance_care_directives.html

secondrowgal · 15-04-2021 1:39pm

magicbastarder wrote: »

i have just learned of the concept of 'favourite niece' or 'favourite nephew' where you can nominate one nibling, and this effectively bumps them into the same status as a son or daughter for inheritance tax purposes.
i suspect there's been a few family feuds created by that...

That's very interesting! Is it only one? Or one of each (one niece and one nephew) do you know?

Cherry Blossom · 15-04-2021 7:50pm

magicbastarder wrote: »

i have just learned of the concept of 'favourite niece' or 'favourite nephew' where you can nominate one nibling, and this effectively bumps them into the same status as a son or daughter for inheritance tax purposes.
i suspect there's been a few family feuds created by that...

This only applies to business assets and the favourite niece/nephew has to have worked for the deceased for at least 5 years prior to their death. It doesn’t apply to any personal assets or cash.

Also Starring LeVar Burton · 26-04-2021 10:35pm

Until this thread, I wrongly assumed being single and childless that as next of kin everything (not that I've a huge amount of assets, but some substantial savings all the same) would just go to my Mam if anything were to happen to me unexpectedly tomorrow, but didn't realise that since he's still living that my father would be entitled by law to half (and I don't owe him jacksh*t), so rectifying that and going to go make a will that will ensure it all goes to my Mam.

Can then update it when necessary to include Siblings and Niblings if I outlive my Mam, but appreciate this thread for bringing to my attention that I need something in place.

26-04-2021 10:38pm

Also Starring LeVar Burton wrote: »

Until this thread, I wrongly assumed being single and childless that as next of kin everything (not that I've a huge amount of assets, but some substantial savings all the same) would just go to my Mam if anything were to happen to me unexpectedly tomorrow, but didn't realise that since he's still living that my father would be entitled by law to half (and I don't owe him jacksh*t), so rectifying that and going to go make a will that will ensure it all goes to my Mam.

Can then update it when necessary to include Siblings and Niblings if I outlive my Mam, but appreciate this thread for bringing to my attention that I need something in place.

Yep, I realised the same thing when I bought my own house, will was made where mam gets it and the other lad gets zero

notsoyoungwan · 29-04-2021 9:04pm

I made my will aged 40, and am 41 now so it’s still current!
I have a lot of niblings, some of whom I’m very close to and others I’m not at all close to and only see at weddings/funerals.

I’ve left a significant portion to a charity very close to my heart and I’m very happy with that decision. I have left my house to be split between my two godchildren (both niblings). I know about the tax implications, but I can’t avoid it and I’m of the same opinion as another poster who says that even after paying the inheritance tax, they’ll still be a good bit better off than they were. I’m leaving the rest between the niblings I’m close to, and two dear friends. I’ve a letter of wishes done up for jewellery, art and some other collectibles.

It’s as future-proof as I could make it. It has accounted for any of the niblings dying before me and leaving kids behind etc. I had good legal advice at the time and I’m pleased with it.

Separately, I have also set up an enduring power of attorney, and have nominated 2 attorneys, my sister and my closest friend, whom I trust to act in accordance with my pre-existing wishes if I’m incapable of doing so. We have enough morbid conversations for them to know what my wishes are!

magicbastarder · 03-08-2022 9:22am

i think you need the legal issues forum - this is the 'childfree by choice' forum.

Flinty997 · 03-08-2022 9:24am

https://www.gibsonandassociates.ie/blog/how-to-contest-a-will/

You'd have to challenge it. No idea the success rate of that.

"...How can the Probate process be contested when there is no Will?.."

wench · 03-08-2022 9:56am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119422335#Comment_119422335

You would need to find out if it is held as Joint Tenants, or Tenants in Common.

For a Joint Tenancy, the house would pass directly to the surviving son, and not form part of the estate at all.

For a Tenancy in Common, the son owns 1/3, and the parent's 2/3s would form part of the estate.

03-08-2022 10:16am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119422335#Comment_119422335

What a nightmare. I wonder how he managed to get on to the deeds without anyone else knowing in the family ie siblings

Flinty997 · 03-08-2022 10:21am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119422710#Comment_119422710

Might be the parents thinking he'd be the last at home.

markodaly · 03-08-2022 10:27am

Seems like he has just inherited a house for himself, but he will have to pay tax on the bit if the house is worth that much. Can he afford a 100k+ tax bill?

What else does the will say?

kippy · 03-08-2022 10:47am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/116862246#Comment_116862246

Thems the rules that we, as a democracy, have essentially signed up to. Granted everyone might not agree but that democracy for ya.

Have kids myself so not entirely my area but having been involved in administration of an estate recently, whatever about the tax implications at the very least try ensure ya have some kind of a will in place or liquidate and spend everything before you pass!

olestoepoke · 03-08-2022 12:00pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119422751#Comment_119422751

There is no will, our mother passed suddenly of a heart attack. I've no idea what the thinking was when they put his name on it, may have been as a poster said because he was the last to leave. I'm sure he'd have some money but could also mortgage the tax bill if necessary. A bank would have no issue lending a young man with a decent job and record a 100k to acquire a house worth over 600k. It is a bit of a mess, the other siblings feel they should get their share but the youngest has started to move in already.

03-08-2022 12:13pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119423148#Comment_119423148

My advice would be family meeting to discuss further- a legal case, if that what it would take to get your share, will be costly along with the obvious family fallout - it’s doubtful you all get on well given what’s happened and IMHO it was mean of the brother to move back in without explaining himself first- but you/all of you may have to hold your tongue a bit for the time being to avoid any escalation- certainly if he’s only entitled to 1/3rd of the house then I’d be like, “fine, give me my share of what’s left and if you can’t afford to, then we’re selling the house”

Its all down to his rights to the whole property or not- Jammy git if he got the lot but I’d be querying how this came about especially if parents had any type of dementia or were temporality impaired in their decision making -

03-08-2022 12:24pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119422726#Comment_119422726

Which is the stupidest reason to do that- it sounds like he’s well able to earn a crust, he’ll have a tax liability which will be sorted with a small mortgage and he’ll then be rattling around in a 600k house - it’s a daft decision and so selfish and uninformed of the parents - solicitors really need to question more when parents go this route - it leaves such a bad taste for the remaining siblings

shesty · 04-08-2022 10:07am

Who’s going to get your dosh? Wills & Inheritance Discussion

Comments

The post by olestoepoke has been moved to the legal discussion forum - any further discussion on it take place here.

Thanks,

Shesty