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Covid vaccines - thread banned users in First Post

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,752 ✭✭✭hometruths


    I have directly answered astrofools specific questions on numerous occasions.

    He has yet to answer to answer the specific question of whether the regulators were right or wrong to conclude that reliable estimates of efficacy against severe disease could not be established due to insufficient data.

    its a question you have dodged too.



  • Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    But why would we bother answering your question when tou guys have dodged pretty much every question put to you.

    You're still not answering mine.

    Which is more likely?



  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,752 ✭✭✭hometruths


    Your question is a silly one because not only is it is too broad it is also irrelevant.

    I tried to give you a more sensible and relevant answer by using specific cases.

    but if you really want a literal answer to the either or question you posed, then the answer is if you take the vaccine then you are more likely to suffer the side effects of the vaccine than the effects of the virus.



  • Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Nope. It's not broad at all. It's specific and concise.

    And it's very relevant to ask what you believe is more likely to occur.


    You've answered it finally after several pages.

    You believe that you're more likely to suffer the side effects of the vaccine.

    Great. Evidence please. Please point to a study or a statement from actual doctors (ie. not a tweet or a youtube video) that backs up this claim.



  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,752 ✭✭✭hometruths


    Sure, from the Pfizer clinical trial data:

    Among all vaccine recipients asked to complete diaries of their symptoms during the 7 days after vaccination, 77.4% reported at least one systemic reaction. The frequency of systemic adverse events was higher in the younger than the older age group (82.8% vs 70.6%). Within each age group, the frequency and severity of systemic adverse events was higher after dose 2 than dose 1.

    So approximately 80% the of vaccine recipients suffered side effects from the vaccine.

    whereas less than 1% of the placebo group suffered the effects of Covid.

    https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/covid-19/info-by-product/pfizer/reactogenicity.html



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  • Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]




  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,752 ✭✭✭hometruths


    There’s a link in the post that lists them all.



  • Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Yup. I think that's why you're not mentioning what they are.

    Mentioning that the majority of that 80% is things like redness in the injection site undercuts your point a bit.


    So according to yourself, because of those side effects, the vaccine isn't worth the risk.



  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,752 ✭✭✭hometruths


    Systemic reactions do not include redness at the injection site.

    The fact you don’t know the difference between systemic reactions and local reactions undercuts your point a bit.



  • Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Cool. What side effects are you referring to specifically then?

    Fever? decreased appetite? Drowsiness?



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  • Posts: 966 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I think the vaxx is affecting your memory there, mate. Search back and you'll see you were the one who wanted to change it from 1k to €50, specifically, hahaha. I even offered to donate your 1k to charity. Breadcrumbs 🤣



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,151 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe



    One poster believes that vaccines are part of a greater conspiracy to microchip people run by a secret one world government

    Another poster believes all the vaccines are generally safe, but thinks that their role has been deliberately changed

    Another poster believes all the vaccines are highly dangerous and the cause of many deaths

    Another poster believes that the vaccines are safe, except for one, which is quote "dangerous"


    All of these are completely contradictory views, yet I've never seen a single one of these posters challenge each other



  • Posts: 966 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Vaxxed are 100% the ones in hospital, people suffering side effects in their droves, yet here you are in complete denial of any possible connection to the waxx, linking us to "factcheck.org". I suppose you also use Snopes as a fact-checker? 😄

    No wonder they sold you this bollox so easily. How many shots have you had?



  • Posts: 966 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    You vaccinated are 100% the ones in hospital with Covid. Try/cry harder, lol.

    Also, you defended Jeffrey Epstein. You should delete your account, honestly 🤣



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,313 ✭✭✭patnor1011


    Our self-taught epidemiologists and vaccine experts are like broken record. Somehow their resolve is slipping little bit I noticed they stop demanding "peer reviewed studies"...

    269 pages and the only thing which changed is constantly growing list of possible vaccine side effects.



  • Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,752 ✭✭✭hometruths


    You're now asking me to specify the side effects after I said your question was silly because it was too broad?!

    I am referring to all the side effects listed in Table 11 on the link I posted - eg Fever, fatique, headache, chills, vomiting, diarrhea, new or worsening muscle pain, new or worsening joint pain

    If these are not the side effects you meant when you asked your specific and concise question, perhaps you could specify the side effects you were talking about?



  • Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Ok. So according to you, these side effects make it so that the vaccine isn't worth the risk.

    I asked you to confirm because this is a very silly argument.

    If that's not what you were arguing, then you should have specified.


    But let's talk about the actual side effects that result in injury, hospitalisation, and death.

    The link you provided has a good definition to use:

    Serious Adverse Events

    Serious adverse events were defined as any untoward medical occurrence that resulted in death, was life-threatening, required inpatient hospitalization or prolongation of existing hospitalization, or resulted in persistent disability or incapacity.

    Which is more likely to result in these things? The virus or the vaccine?



  • Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Lol nope:

    We don't bother asking you guys as much because you guys always just ignore the question or go off on tangents about how peer review doesn't work anyway, then dump a link to a youtube video or tweet or something.


    You guys aren't pointing to any side effects that aren't already known. You aren't pointing to any safety issues. The vast majority of the thread isn't you guys providing these things, its you guys going off on any and all tangents to bad mouth vaccines regardless of evidence or reality..



  • Site Banned Posts: 1,258 ✭✭✭Whocare




  • Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Yes. I am very dismissive of conspiracy theories and medical opinions formed from tweets.

    I'm also very dismissive of tactics like ignoring questions to instead complain about tone as it's almost always a cover for the lack of a point.


    Why shouldn't I be dismissive of these things?



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  • Site Banned Posts: 1,258 ✭✭✭Whocare


    There nothing conspiracy theories about my friend/work colleague who had blood cloth and missing from work for months and had face to face chat about it he 100-percent positive that it was vaccine and went he questioning the doctor wouldn't deny it that it was vaccine.

    All I'm saying is if you're healthy like me .

    I would take risk of getting COVID instead of getting a vaccine especially it when covid is a non-issue now for healthy people (and I got the two vaccines but I won't be getting any booster anytime soon



  • Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Yes, that's what you claim. But I don't believe any of that is true.


    Even if it is true, you've nothing to show that it was actually due to the vaccine.


    And again, you're falling back to this silly contradictory conclusion.

    You're afraid of getting blood clots, so you take the course of action that puts you more at risk of blood clots.

    It makes no sense. And it's because you yourself didn't bother thinking too hard on it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,260 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    That's not what your doing though, your dismissing all news sources and evidence based medicine as conspiracy theories.

    Your tactic is whataboutism ignoring every question put to you. Not once have you backed up your opinion with any kind of data.

    From what I can see you mission is to stifle debate and dismiss everything unless it comes from a trusted news source like Odyssey or Astrofool. How much are you getting paid by the good information project?

    Your attitude isn't healthy, if something is a conspiracy thrash it out and prove your point rather than coming across as some kinda far left pharma shill.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,151 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    There is a higher proportion of unvaccinated Covid patients in hospitals. This is because the vaccine reduces hospitalizations and deaths from the virus.

    You personally have expressed a belief that vaccines are part of a greater plan to implant people with microchips. Do you still believe that?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,151 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    In very rare occasions the vaccines can cause blood clots. However Covid is 8 to 10 times more likely to cause a brain blood clot than the vaccines. Context of risk is important.



  • Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Nope. For example, I didn't dismiss the Israeli study you posted a while back.

    I just pointed out that it didn't actually say what you claimed it said.

    You then proceeded to dodge and avoid that fact and falsely claimed what you're claiming now.


    And sorry man, your accusations are still 100% your own fantasy. I'm not paid by anyone to post here or elsewhere. There's no campaign to stifle you or your beliefs. It's just that most people don't buy the same grifter arguments you were suckered in by.



  • Site Banned Posts: 1,258 ✭✭✭Whocare


    My god listening to this denial .it going to turn me into an mad anti-vaxxer unbelievable that you refuses to admit vaccine can cause illness and death in some people



  • Posts: 25,874 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Sorry, no. That's a strawman. No one here has claimed that vaccines can't cause illness and death.

    Please stop lying and trying to use that tactic. It doesn't work.


    Again, which is more likely to give you a blood clot, the vaccine or getting covid?

    The evidence shows that getting covid gives you the higher chance of getting a blood clot (on top of many other effects.)

    Do you disagree with the evidence? Or do you just think that it makes more sense to do the more risky option?



  • Subscribers, Paid Member Posts: 43,713 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    Just one more of a long line of anti vaxxers that have no comprehension of the concept of "rate"



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,151 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    269 pages in, the vaccines are safe and effective, over 95% of adults in this country are vaccinated. Their benefits vastly outweigh any drawbacks.

    You, an internet poster on a conspiracy theory forum, may think you "know more" than the global consensus of medical professionals, but you don't.

    Since Smallpox (which has been eradicated) there have always been anti-vaxxers, their arguments never change. They will always be around. Even if there were some global pandemic, in which millions died, and everyone got vaccinated, they'd be screeching hysterical about a handful of vaccine injuries/deaths. Their arguments are always rooted in personal paranoid of authority and lack of critical thinking. Which is why you are flanked by people who think space travel is fake, and that this is a plan to implant people with microchips and that Covid was a plaque "sent by god"



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