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Ukraine (Mod Note & Threadbanned Users in OP)

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 935 ✭✭✭Detritus70


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,144 ✭✭✭✭PopePalpatine


    All that boot polish isn't good for your head.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,301 ✭✭✭patnor1011


    No I did not.

    I said that contrary to what was reported about bodies lining streets of Bucha, it was one street with about dozen of bodies. Some died because of fighting over there some appears to be executed. Why are you constantly try to twist what I say?

    Bodies are on the streets of every city and village where fighting is going on, they are put there to be collected later when it is safe to do so.

    There is no winner in any war. Many posters in here enjoy talking about heroic fight and constantly call for escalating hostilities when all what this bring is just more dead and suffering.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,057 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    I thought even most diehard conspiracy loons had stopped suckin on Putins teat.


    Real bottom of the barrel folk that are still believing his crap.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,363 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    My understanding is that there was very little fighting in Bucha. Russia had been occupying it but pulled back as part of the "next phase of the special operation" (i.e. retreating with tail between their legs) and Ukrainian forces and media arrived.

    Any civil war which may also be happening is merely Russian backed proxy fighters who have been fed Russian propaganda for a long time. They are essentially an extension of Russian forces, even if they are Ukrainian.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 440 ✭✭myfreespirit


    This post is suffused with nonsense.

    To educate you:

    There is NO civil war in Ukraine.

    The Russian invasion of an independent sovereign country is a criminal act of hateful murder and destruction, with absolutely no justification.

    The deliberate targeting of civilians, the horrible torture and cold-blooded murder of innocent people are war crimes.

    I expect the civilised world to pursue the animals who did this and to bring them to justice, as was done in Bosnia-Herzegovina, no matter how long it takes.

    Please educate yourself.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 440 ✭✭myfreespirit


    This is a complete misrepresentation of the known facts if not an outright lie.

    It is close to the "statement" issued by the speaker of the lower House of the Russian Parliament:

    "The situation in Bucha is a provocation aimed at discrediting Russia. Washington and Brussels are the screenwriters and directors and Kyiv are the actors. There are no facts - just lies."



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,711 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    A lot of false moral equivocation can be achieved if someone tries to squint and claim this is a Civil War.

    It's not.

    It's not remotely anything of the sort.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,673 ✭✭✭AudreyHepburn


    I’m honestly not surprised that there are people determined to hide their heads in the sand with regard to what is happening in Ukraine. People still deny the Holocaust after all.

    Personally I find bodies in the streets with their hands and feet tied and mass graves very concerning and if these things don’t get the international community doing more than just talking then nothing will.

    The western powers left Ukraine high and dry. I can understand them not wanting to risk World War III but they should have flooded them with weapons and ammunition from the start.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,301 ✭✭✭patnor1011


    That is precisely why wars happens and why this solution does not work.

    War is business for most of the parties involved. Wars are being sold as some heroic fight or something like that while simple truth is that big countries always go after smaller and weaker and everyone who involve itself in this is just making it go for longer. If you think that all this arms shipments "help" which is going to ukraine is free of charge you are mistaken. It will cost us and them but sadly they will pay more. They will have to pay for it after the war and will also pay with lives lost due to prolonging this conflict.

    Flooding any side with weapons and ammo just make the other party more determined or just to stay longer. It was apparent in korea, vietnam, yugolsavia, afghanistan, libya, syria... The result is more dead people.

    Wars should not start but since we do have so called "superpowers" they will always be inclined to take advantage of each other by fomenting direct conflicts or proxy wars.



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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 29,574 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    As should be abundantly clear to even the most feeble minds at this point - the result of not helping Ukraine with arms and ammunition will be a lot more dead people at the hands of the Russian invaders.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,301 ✭✭✭patnor1011


    You may be right about holidays but any other stuff we get from russia will still come from russia. It will be more expensive since it come through some intermediary but it will come nevertheless. There is no boycott of russian goods possible without sending us to stone age too. But you know that yourself.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,301 ✭✭✭patnor1011


    I know, I said it right in the post you reacted to. Wars should not start.

    My country is Ireland. I do not know about many Irish on their holidays/training in Ukraine to be honest. Why would you want them dead is a mystery to me.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,986 ✭✭✭ambro25


    It’s working well enough for Ukraine so far, even at the current lukewarm level of support provided by the rest of the world, with the Russian army in retreat everywhere but in the Donbas after some 6 weeks of fighting, and Putin down to his last few BTGs from the Far East.

    Ukrainian civilian deaths always were, and always will be, attributable solely to Russia’s decision to invade Ukraine. Motive, or the lack thereof, doesn’t come into it; no more than Russia’s capacity, or the lack thereof, to make its troops respect basic tenets of humanity in occupied areas.

    Your sanctimonious prose continues to be completely devoid of objectivity.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,301 ✭✭✭patnor1011


    Goods, produce, exports does not matter how do you call it. Maybe you pretend you do not know but in case you really don't, try to google what do we import from there.



  • Posts: 8,385 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    **** off, scum.


    Mods ban me all you want, at least people will know that you are actively ignoring such disinformation and Russia's open front on the net



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,065 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Not to side with partnor and his views which are now part of the rich diverse tapestry of modern Ireland but Diesel alone is going to be a problem.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,301 ✭✭✭patnor1011


    Sure, we go down to grammar when all else fails. So much for inclusiveness and tolerance. I would not say you are openly racist but grammar remarks and calls for bullets and javelins without even having slightest idea about ethnicity or where someone come from originally is very telling. I take it may be down to emotions or too much of a coffee.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,520 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    More pathetic attempts at giving cover to Russian atrocities. This is just an exercise in blaming the victim.

    It presumes that if Ukraine didn't resist the invasion, they'd just be left to go on their merry way.

    Except they wouldn't. We know what Russia had lined up for Ukraine - partition, plunder of resources, puppet rulers, the disappearance of Ukranian citizens to gulags or graves.

    You know what's a way to have less dead people? Don't shoot unarmed civilians.

    You know what they call a war when only one side has weapons? A massacre.

    What happens when a country cannot repel the invaders? An occupation.

    People don't just die in 'wars', they die in gulags, concentration camps, they die on the side of the roads with bullets in their heads and arms tied behind their heads.

    But yeah, it's the fault of the West for helping Ukraine for trying to defend itself. If you're morally and intellectually bankrupt maybe.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,544 ✭✭✭✭Sleepy


    If I have to pay €4 a litre for diesel and ration it's use until such time as the Russian people get off their arses and remove the criminal gang in charge of their country so be it. I was going to call their leadership Nazis but it no longer seems as if that's even applicable, National Socialism was an ideology, Putin and his followers are merely an organised crime gang and I look forward to see them becoming meat crayons dragged across Red Square by horses.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 935 ✭✭✭Detritus70


    Do we know that? What goods? How will this impact us? Have you any credible links to back this up?

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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 29,574 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    Gas is a problem, crude oil isn't really. It will require logistical changes and increase in other grades such as west african crude, but things will settle down as Russian crude goes to India and China and the North Sea and West African grades come to Europe.

    Gas that flows in pipelines is the biggest problem. Long term there will be issues also with various rare metals. There are already issues with wheat and sunflower oil.

    Obviously anything that increases the cost of living at the moment is far from ideal and supports need to be put in place for people here who are impacted by increasing costs of food and fuel. But its not a reason to not hammer Russia into the ground.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,301 ✭✭✭patnor1011


    I was not talking about Irish imports from russia. It is more complicated than that.

    We are integral part of EU and our market too. If we do not import some stuff from russia directly it does not mean russian stuff is not coming to us by importing it from some other EU or non EU countries.

    Like Pd for example which is needed for catalysts. Sure we can get around temporarily by allowing cars to be used without it. Or nuclear fuel which is used in many EU countries some of which supply us with power.

    What do you think that russia, China, India plus some other countries conducting trade in their own currencies will do with dollar or euro?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,301 ✭✭✭patnor1011


    LOL you really are funny. It is not my country. In fact russia invaded my country not that long ago so I do not have any warm and fuzzy feelings for them.

    You do believe whatever you want to. I do not care that much, some people simply do have problem controlling their emotions.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 29,574 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    What do you think that russia, China, India plus some other countries conducting trade in their own currencies will do with dollar or euro?

    Russia, China, India plus some other countries have been trading in their own currencies forever, so nothing?

    If you mean specifically trading oil in their own currencies then...not very much.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,301 ✭✭✭patnor1011


    I said it many times I do not know how many times do you need to hear it. I do not care a bit about russians. This whole situation for me is no different from any other war which happened or is happening recently. There are no winners in any war. Only death and destruction.

    I am not from russia ok comrade? (in case you are ukrainian since they used to be comrades too)

    Do you understand simple concept that someone can be Irish even if they were not born in Ireland?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,248 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    Apparently the Russian Embassy in Dublin is running out of heating oil and no one will deliver to them !! Made me laugh out loud to think of them freezing in the Embassy



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,849 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    How to Report a Post

    If you want to report a post there is a Flag button near the Thanks and Quote buttons on each post in a thread. Click on that and you can report the post and give an explainer about why you are reporting it before submitting it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,752 ✭✭✭✭josip


    That's the theory, but can some of the mods confirm that button actually works now?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,984 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    There's no civil war going on in Bucha, or Kharkiv, or Mariupol.

    This isn't some "backwater regional squabble", it's the largest array of armed forces since WW2, the full on invasion of a European country. Completely illegal war, based on lies. Every death is Putin's responsibility and no one elses. There's absolutely no justification for it.



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