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Ukraine (Mod Note & Threadbanned Users in OP)

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,866 Brussels Sprout
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    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118833833#Comment_118833833

    Absolutely and I have yet to see the issue of EU membership come up in any of the peace talks. Turkey talked about 6 areas of disagreement and the EU wasn't even mentioned (NATO was). I'm wondering is it one of those things where the Ukrainians think that it's self evident that they should be allowed to join the EU so haven't even raised it. There's no way that Russia will willingly allow them to join. It would be more of an actual threat to Putin than NATO for the reasons outlined above.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,111 Christy42
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    If you want to change public opinion in a particular direction then it is handy to have opposition in that direction. People will naturally go to the middle of any debate with some on either extreme. People will talk about both sides and the natural expectation will be some compromise will win out with people forgetting there may be a few more sides that should be considered.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,554 hotmail.com
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    Irish people bending over backwards for Ukraine and Ukrainians and their President effectively dismisses it.

    Is this like WW 2 again when Britain tried to guilt Ireland into joining the war. It didn't work then and let's hope it doesn't work now.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,049 growleaves
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    'Also, seeing one of his long time peers succumb to Covid probably won't do Putin's paranoia about the virus much good.'

    Though I'm not a big believer in polls, since the wording of the questions usually influences the result, the Russian authorities are far more enamoured of 'health' security infrastructure than the Russian people according to the below poll.

    As in so many other things, Russia mirrors Ukraine. In both countries only 35-40% of the population have consented to be vaccinated so far. Zelensky is of course a 'health' fanatic and according to some reports wants to amalgamate vaccine passports with other official documents.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 17,287 Quin_Dub
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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,818 10000maniacs
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    We'll give him that. His country is in ruins. But he needs to realise Ireland's army is tiny.

    He also needs to acknowledge that the Irish are doing their bit.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,554 hotmail.com
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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,890 Larbre34
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    What Zelenskiy said today is irrelevant.

    He is in the middle of the most stressful period any one person could find themselves. All he sees is a balance sheet of weapons / no weapons. All other considerations are secondary.

    Yes Ireland will send aid and take in tens of thousands of refugees, but that's not Zelenskiy's radar and nor should it be right now.

    We act with the EU on all matters, we should just keep doing what we're doing and ensure that maximum external pressure is brought to bear on Russia every second of every day, until they implode.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,554 hotmail.com
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    Pretty amazing to single us out. Obviously there's emotion at the moment, but it does feel a bit ungrateful.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,222 Dohnjoe
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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,554 hotmail.com
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    Ireland is entitled to protect our own interests, which come first and foremost, at all times.

    So it's natural for us to comment on his remarks.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,222 Dohnjoe
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    They are being invaded and blown to bits, it's his job to keep asking for every type of help and intervention, even if it's a complete stretch or not possible (obviously he knows the limits, e.g. that NATO will never implement a no-fly zone, he has to keep pressing for it), it's important for morale and to keep up the pressure on the international community (who have a habit of losing interest in these things and waning support)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,049 growleaves
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    ???

    Its a digression from the main discussion obv. Its not really clear to me what you object to, can you elaborate?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,554 hotmail.com
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    Pressure on the international community is grand but he singled out Ireland for not doing enough.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 9,846 Manach
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    I completely agree. Given our history of being a neighbour to a larger regional power, it behooves us to support Ukraine given that while the international rules based systems has flaws it is far better than the alternative.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 15,034 josip
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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,866 Brussels Sprout
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    Very interesting statement from the chief of the Russian army a while ago

    The chief of the Russian army says Russia will now focus its main war effort on the "complete liberation" of the eastern Ukrainian Donbas region.

    The defence ministry said Russia had been considering two options for its "special military operation" - one covering the whole of Ukraine and one focusing on the Donbas.

    The comments - carried by Russian state news agencies - hinted at a possible downgrading of Russia's war aims. Russian forces have met strong resistance in the north of Ukraine and around Kyiv.

    Could this be an admission that they simply don't have the numbers or ability to capture Kyiv, Odessa & Kharkiv and instead they'll try and make do with the greater Donetsk and Lukhansk regions?

    Kherson and Melitopol, which are currently under their control are not in those provinces - presumably they'll try and hang on to those too.

    link



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,222 Dohnjoe
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    He said "Ireland, well almost". Not much to go on, but I wouldn't read into it



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,657 Loafing Oaf
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    they'll try and make do with the greater Donetsk and Lukhansk regions?

    Which they already had before the invasion. No way they could spin that as a victory or even an honourable stalemate...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,866 Brussels Sprout
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    They only controlled smaller parts of them before (including the 2 major cities). They'll have picked up Mariupol - which they have utterly destroyed in the process but gives them the port there which has strategic importance.

    If they hold onto Berdyanksk and Melitopol, neither of which are in Donetsk, then they will control the sea of Azov on all sides.

    Supplying water to Crimea is also a major goal (the Ukrainians switched it off years ago). I'm not sure if they would need to control Kherson for that or if controlling just Melitopol but be sufficient for that purpose.

    The Ukrainians have the momentum now so I'd imagine they will launch counter offensives against Kherson (this may in fact already be underway) and Melitopol.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,222 Dohnjoe
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    They only had portions of them, they want to grab more. At this stage I think they want to take as much of Donbas as possible and hold a land corridor to the South (or at the very least control the water to Crimea, which Putin is obsessed with)



  • Posts: 4,546 [Deleted User]
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    Surely nothing surprising really. They'll surely hold Kherson and the canal with the water supply to Crimea, a very high price paid for it but they won't let go now.

    They'll smash Mariupol too, and hold the port and coast, that's a win for them. Russia is battered but by no means defeated.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,866 Brussels Sprout
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    I would say it's a "gain" for them. In the grand scheme of things this invasion has most definitely not been a "win".





  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,554 hotmail.com
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    Which has Britain as one of it's main members, NATO.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,554 hotmail.com
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    Unless he was confused about Ireland, not sure where Ireland is etc. That's quite possible.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,890 Larbre34
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    I believe what is now evident as everything in a range from demotivation and low morale to desertion, mutiny and murder, will only spread in the Russian forces.

    A trooper in a mechanised unit ran over his own Colonel in a tank yesterday in protest. His leg were crushed and he died subsequently.

    There are simply not enough troops who believe in Putin's War and they are not trained enough or rewarded enough to fight for him unconditionally. Stories of the levels of death and losses simply cannot be prevented from spreading among the Military and among soldier's families and by consequence, the whole Community back in Russia. State Control of the media and the Internet is useless against that information snowball effect.

    Russia may now have new aims, just to secure the northern and Eastern border, but even that is not certain how and the Ukrainians will be emboldened to take back the whole lot now, Crimea, the Donbas, everything. All they need is continued backing of food, fuel and missiles.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,866 Brussels Sprout
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    More from that announcement from the Russian military:

    • The goal was always only to liberate the Donbas
    • Everything else was a distraction in order to assist the primary goal
    • They never intended to capture Kyiv or Karkhiv
    • They don't target civilians
    • 1,351 Russian soldiers have been killed


    Where to begin....





  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,330 VinLieger
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    Didn't you know they've always been at war with Eastasia?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,709 Strazdas
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    Seems the Ukrainian army are making big inroads at Kherson as we speak and may have a chance to retake the city.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,729 SafeSurfer
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    I think Ukrainian forces are a long way from launching an offensive aiming to retake Crimea. It is arguable whether the same level of international aid and support would be forthcoming for an offensive war to restore pre 2014 borders.

    Multo autem ad rem magis pertinet quallis tibi vide aris quam allis



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