How can we integrate Unionism into a possible United Ireland?

The problem for me Fionn is I have seen it all before...'Oh, I am open to all sorts, but you have to do this first'.

The alternative to majority rule Fionn is the creation of an artificial majority /veto for the minority. Which is what happened in the north. It never works for reasons even the most belligerent knows even if they pretend they don't.

I didn't draw a single line bar the one on appeasement for the sake of it.

Trimble pretends to be 'open' but betrays himself by setting preconditions.

The electorate will be asked about anthems and flags etc, accepting what they decide is good enough for me and should be for any democrat.

It would be better if Trimble made suggestions about what he would like as an anthem. My thoughts on that is that a good few people haven't really thought about the issues relating to it and are probably open to persuasion on it.

It's often asked how to integrate Unionism, pointless to some such as the TUV and DUP supporters as they will never support a United Ireland, but it is rarely asked what have the Unionists ever done to entice Nationalists to their way of thinking. Not much is the answer. Even this week we had numerous politicians from the unionist persuasion tweeting Happy St. Patricks day with a Union Jacks in the background, could they not give it a rest for one day. Neither Unionist party has declared if they will accept a SF first minister if it should happen in May, hardly the sign of democrats. Hell they won't even enact the ILA, which was agreed up on, not big holding their side of the bargain. As it's only a few months away, will we ever hear any Unionist politician say that burning the Irish Flag on the 12th is a disgrace and should not happen, we all know the answer to this.

Aul Freddie has popped into this thread a few times with a hit-and-run style comment and zero further engagement. I've been foolish enough to address and respond to his posts, then he's slinked off for a while only to pop back in a while later as if nothing has happened with another soft anti-Irish post.

I won't be responding to him again, I'd suggest other posters do the same. I may strongly disagree with a number of people on this thread, but at least they engage in conversation and make a case for their position rather than this sort of sh*te.

You're not discussing a damn thing, you're landing in with pot shots and running off.

Case in point: the absolute nonsense in this post.

For the record, I'm Northern Irish, of a Nationalist persuasion myself but from a mixed family background and I've just spent a few posts arguing with, 'my mate' Francie about the need for Nationalists/Republicans to do more to make Unionists feel welcome, so take your slabber elsewhere.

Also for the record, I'm not blaming, 'the UK' for your slabber.....the blame for that lies squarely with you.

Good lad. None of your business really.

Your only interest seems to be to assert British superiority, hence your reference to St Patrick being "British". There wasn't very much going on in "Britain" at that time. They called it the Dark Ages, during which Ireland saved "Britain" by educating it. Google Irish monks in the Dark Ages if you don;t believe me.

If as a third party you would like to make a contribution, you're more than welcome but you will not have a vote to decide a UI one way or the other and while you may or may not have something new to say, the evidence would suggest you're here to act the dick.

Can you not see how ridculous it is for you to explain to Irish people who St Patrick is? You don't even understand the context. The Union Jack didn't exist. The UK didn't exist. "Britain" only existed because some Romans called it that. There was no concept of "Britishness" when Patrick was alive or indeed Irishness.

The issue of Britain's responsibiity for atrocities in Ireland is long settled whether you're in denial about it or not. Ireland does not need to invent imaginary reasons to remain deeply suspicious of anything currently masquerading as politics in London.

Your Home Secretary suggested food shortages in Ireland as a way to lever a Brexit deal and your PM sold unionists down the river with the NIP.

Tories managed to piss everyone off in Ireland.

So have you anything to say about 2022 or would you prefer to discuss ancient history some more. Maybe this is the wrong thead for you if that's the case.

As far as a compromise on the national anthem goes...Amhran na bFiann has a wonderful air but the words are a kind of throwback to mystic tribalism through a sort of 19th century nationalist lens. (Note: I'm not claiming it was written in the 19th century)

So one obvious compromise would be to keep the air and jettison the words. Either get new lyrics or just have no lyrics.

Something like 'Ireland's Call' is not the answer, of that I'm certain. Quality matters.

You have already said on this thread that you live in mainland Britain.

You have got it in one 👏

I am glad you are in touch with unionists thinking.

Oh it’s not difficult 😀😎

0/10

Ireland wouldn't be admitted to the UK if it asked to be, the British people would object. So a complete non-starter.

You have a very strange view off things.

ni would currently reject Irish unification So on your thinking it’s a non-starter and we should just move on?

I'm not exasperated at all, Downcow. Mildly amused, yes. Exasperated, no.

The only bit you're missing is little old Ireland chugging along before your lot showed up, but we'll avoid going back down that rabbit hole as I'm more concerned with the future of our island than the past.

You're totally welcome to your own views, I'll continue trying to do my own little bit to make my vision of a United Ireland a welcoming place to those of a Unionist persuasion (even the likes of yourself who will never be convinced).

I understand your fear; as I said earlier, how NI operated from the beginning must create a worry around what it would be like with the shoe on the other foot. "Accuse others of that which you are guilty" springs to mind again. Rest assured, the way NI was run was repulsive to me, and I would never support the creation of a state that treated a section of it's populace like that.

I've yet to see what Unionism intends to do to convince the middle ground in NI to remain part of the UK beyond getting increasingly screechy and, 'no surrender-y' of late, so I have little faith that you'll do much to convince the other >80% of the island that their best future lies with rejoining the United Kingdom.

I'd be willing to bet a pound to a penny that my vision for a United Ireland comes about before yours. We're doing pretty well on this side of the border while your Kingdom has rarely been less United. Hopefully we'll build a strong bond between a United Ireland and an independent Scotland so those of your cultural background continue to have strong ties to your cultural birthplace.

The Lords doing their bit to 'integrate' the island. 8 Irish Lords voted for this apparently.