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How long until we see €2 a litre and will it push more to EV's faster?

24567102

Comments

  • Posts: 133 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Mine is 200 a year. I spend 12 times that on fuel.


    And what's the talk of driving licences . Once every 10 years. Not what you call a huge outlay

    I Know what I'd like to see



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,793 ✭✭✭Phil.x


    Electricity at night is only cheaper if you're on a night meter.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Car tax is a fairly negligible cost of running a car for many and it funds councils in a small way. It generates about €1bn annually. A fuel price tweak sounds more plausible as it can be applied at midnight and just as quickly reversed at a future midnight.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,513 ✭✭✭ongarite


    Not willing to pay price as it is now. I’m driving a big powerful diesel car but I’m not enjoying the driving anymore. I’m watching trip computer trying to drive as efficiently as possible. Smiles per gallon era is over IMO..

    New car was on the cards so going electric now is a no brainier for me. Free charging in work, night rate meter means daily top up charge of 100km costs €1.50 if I need to use it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,551 ✭✭✭Widdensushi


    Your cost of motoring will still go up if you spend money on a new electric car, te new car will depreciate at a higher cost than what you are spending on diesel.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,793 ✭✭✭Phil.x


    No I can't see that happening, the high vat, carbon tax etc etc is the stick to beat the motorist into changing (eamon ryans thinking) what they are thinking is reducing the already low motor tax on greener cars which will do nothing for the cost of living and as for the one off €100 off your electricity bill, again they don't want to lower any taxes or charges that would make a meaningful difference but to hope the price of oil and gas come back down before the carbon tax increase come in this summer.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭Lewis_Benson


    What electric car would suit for towing?

    I tow my boat to and from the water for fishing.

    Currently drive a vw tiguan sport 2.0.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    There will be **** all cuts in vat or taxes.

    The pandemic has to be paid for now.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,011 ✭✭✭harmless


    Do you know the weight of your boat and trailer?

    The Hyundai Ioniq 5 could potentially work for you if a reduction from the 2,000kg towing weight of the Tiguan to 1600kg of the Ioniq does not cause issues.

    If you need 2000kg or more there are EV's that can do it but unfortinatly they are in a higher price bracket than a Tiguan.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,917 ✭✭✭✭Toyotafanboi


    Yes, agree with that completely.


    I live in north Wexford and used to commute to Dublin daily, it would have cost around €45 a week, doing about 600kms doing 50mpg with diesel @ 1.30 ish.

    Since the dose i'm working closer to home, spending €30 a week to do 270kms. Albeit a different car, doing 45mpg, petrol @ 1.70.


    So, with rounding the numbers a shade, that's two thirds of the price to go a little less than half the distance, 3 years later.


    Or to put it another way, someone who is lucky enough to have an ok salary, say 40k, 14k above the infamous living wage and who is also lucky enough to work less than 30kms from home is paying around 5% of their take home salary or working one full day per month, to pay for the fuel to get to work. Before, you tax, insure, NCT or service the car or pay for the car itself, in a country where there are no real alternatives to owning a car.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,011 ✭✭✭harmless


    When you drive a car for fun like weekend outings on enjoyable roads the cost of fuel is still good value IMO.

    If you mostly drive long commutes then that's already depressing before you factor in fuel prices.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,541 ✭✭✭Leonard Hofstadter


    Didn't the carbon tax increase already come into affect for motorists? They never wait with taxes on petrol and diesel. I understood that it is only for home heating that the carbon tax increase was coming in May, but that is usual as they always delay that so that folks won't have to worry about heating their homes over Christmas, etc.

    I don't see them doing anything to reduce the cost of fuel, removing this year's carbon tax increase would be lovely but 2 cent a litre is €1.20 on a 60 litre tank, it's not going to make a substantial difference. To see it drop back by 10 cent would make a meaningful difference but that's beyond the Government's control. They could reduce the cost of toll tags (for example, the East Link toll bridge went up 50 cent or over 35%), car tax for older cars by €100, allow people to pay car tax in monthly instalments rather than the current situation of either 3, 6 or 12 months (paying a lot more if you don't get the disc for the whole year of course), that's something we'd all notice and appreciate.

    I simply don't see it happening because the Greens love making the lives of motorists miserable (except wealthy people who can afford massive electric luxury cars and SUVs).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,067 ✭✭✭✭fryup


    easy to make really? please tell i'm all eyes & ears😶



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,738 ✭✭✭✭BorneTobyWilde



    You need the gear and ingredients, and the feedstock, so many vids on youtube, not complicated.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,130 ✭✭✭coolbeans


    Any source for that at all? I don't believe it to be true.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,380 ✭✭✭Indestructable


    Highest I've seen for petrol in Kildare today was 179.9.

    I expect another few cent increase this week based off the increase in Brent on Friday.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,082 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    France and Sweden are most notable for having nuclear energy (lets see them run those calculations for Poland and Germany). We don't have that luxury and given the mental state of most Irish people, this country never will, so expect lots more of this:

    Wind 20-1-22.jpg

    At around 6pm, 22-1-22, wind was contributing less than 1% of the power required. Thank goodness for coal and gas.

    It takes 50% more CO2 to make an EV than a petrol ICE. A Tesla 3 causes 180% more damage to a road than does something like a Honda Civic because of the extra weight.

    Petrol prices will probably come down again. Voters gonna vote. Current fuel costs are probably going to change the politicians perception that they can continue to increase CO2 taxes and energy costs, because the populace is more worried about global warming than energy costs. Not any more, they aren't. Warm fuzzy greenie sound bites don't pay power bills, of which taxes are a stupidly high percentage.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,082 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    Weren't they asked why they didn't just cut the tax on electricity, instead of the one off €100 power bill rebate, and they replied they couldn't afford it - lying tossers, of course. We get €100 and the UK get £395. My fill of hetaing oil last week cost €895. Revenue smiling ear to ear at the massive energy taxes windfall isn't going to get my vote come the next election.

    I got a crazy idea for the government, as they appear lost for ideas - how about dropping CO2 taxes altogether? They are predicated on people being abe to choose alternatives, when that clearly isn't the case.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,736 ✭✭✭WishUWereHere


    Where in Kildare OP?

    I notice Circle K in Kill is now cheaper than McLoughlins in Ballymany, which I think is a first.

    Strange times, eh.



  • Posts: 15,362 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    You love your single data points, always gives me a laugh when you post them. Unfortunately they still don't form the basis of any argument for anything, but they're entertaining nonetheless.

    As regards weight, sure sounds like an issue. Sounds like we should start pushing for more people to get out of the car and onto bikes, walk, use PT. On paper it looks like a win-win option as it'll reduce emissions, save wear and tear on the road network and be a healthier choice.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,082 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    Ah, yes, your precious bicycles. I don't know what country you live in, but here in Ireland there is howling, gusty wind with horizontal rain, and it's been like that for the past 48 hours at least. Anyone on a bike not blown off the road or into the path of a sensible vehicle, has probably only avoided that fate due to being soaked to the core and thus weighing more.


    Screenshot_20220206-154547_Weather.jpg

    Ideal cycling conditions - if you're a seal.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭Lewis_Benson


    Boat trailer and engine is about 1200kg unloaded.

    Those ionic are awful looking things, one thing the EVs are is not good looking cars.

    All look very pedestrian.

    I'm probably considering another tiguan next time round, or a jeep of some sort.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,736 ✭✭✭celtic_oz


    Paying back the carbon debt

    However, it’s also possible to compare the vehicles over time, to see how long it would take to repay the initial “carbon debt” incurred by the production of a carbon-intensive battery pack for EVs. For example, as already noted above, a new Nissan Leaf EV bought in the UK in 2019 would have lifetime emissions some three times lower than the average new conventional car. Looking at this over time, in the figure below, shows that while the battery causes higher emissions during vehicle manufacture in “year zero”, this excess carbon debt would be paid back after less than two years of driving.

    MPGe = Miles per gallon equivalent ( roughly estimated based on price of petrol and electricity )

    Renault Zoe = 180 MPGe = 1.31 L/100km

    Peugeot e208 = 170 MPGe = 1.38 L/100km

    At around 6pm, 22-1-22, wind was contributing less than 1% of the power required. Thank goodness for coal and gas.


    Gas is the preferred fuel now to help with fluctuations with renewables, it was never going anywhere, until we get more interconnectors and storage.

    However gas is expensive and future plans are to develop huge amounts of wind off the west cost ... sell it into the UK grid and drive the marginal cost of electricity in Ireland down at the same time, we are extremely fortunate to have such an abundance of energy AND car manufacturers are scaling up EVs such that they will be cheaper than ICE in a few years. Really helps with the security of supply also.



  • Posts: 15,362 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Not heavy enough to be an issue though, in terms of the fears for the road network that you pointed out.

    Given the huge increases that have occurred on the price of fuels and the future increases that will be coming from carbon taxes, what do you think is a viable answer seeing as carbon taxes are here to stay.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,541 ✭✭✭Leonard Hofstadter


    Polestar themselves have said that their 2 SUV can take as much as 201,000 km before there is a net positive benefit in terms of CO2 emissions over the equivalent petrol Volvo XC40. Obviously this would be even more if it was a comparison against diesel, and I don't even like diesels. Anyone that's thinking of buying an EV on the spurious grounds of saving the planet would be well advised to read this. In fairness, at least they've the courage to be honest about the supposed 'greenness' of EVs.

    https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry/analysis-polestar-lifts-lid-lifetime-ev-emissions



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,011 ✭✭✭harmless


    Are you changing this year? Other manufactuers will catch up with Hyundai, might not take as long as you'd expect.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 659 ✭✭✭Killer K


    Not surprising but good to see it in black and white. Fair play at least to them for releasing that data. Laughed out loud when I read: VW "compensates for unavoidable emissions through climate protection projects”.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,654 ✭✭✭con___manx1


    Oil prices will skyrocket if that war starts in ukraine.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,654 ✭✭✭con___manx1





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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,541 ✭✭✭Leonard Hofstadter


    VW once said that over 200,000 km, an e-Golf would have a net CO2 saving of just 13% over a 1.6 TDI Golf.

    I just watched a video from Nobby on Cars about the BMW iX. He found that it was using 28.6 kWh/100 km, which, at our current electricity mix (296 grams of CO2 per kWh in 2020 according to the 2021 SEAI report, 293 according to Our World in Data) means that really its CO2 emissions are 85 g/km, rather better than the 179 g/km you offically get in an X5 30d obviously, but a very long way from the zero emissions car we're lead to believe they are (in fairness, BMW never claims its EVs are zero emissions, more that they provide 'locally emissions free' driving - a very different thing).

    We have cleaner electricity than Germany (according to Our World in Data), in Germany your iX actually emits 86.1 g/km of CO2 at 28.6 kWh/100 km energy consumption, and believe it or not, the Netherlands is worse again, at 318 grams of CO2 per kWh this means in reality an iX is emitting 91 g/km. For comparison, a Toyota Yaris hybrid is officially rated at 98 g/km.

    If you live in Poland well you definitely should not be buying an EV to save the planet - at an intensity of 744 grams of CO2 per kWh your iX will actually emit more CO2 than the official rating of a 40i X5 with 3.0 litre straight six under the bonnet (the X5 40i has a CO2 rating of 209 g/km, at 744 g CO2 intensity, an iX will emit 213 g/km), never mind the diesel one!

    My source for all the claims on CO2 intensity can be found in the link below. The formula is finding out the real CO2 per km of the iX is easy: CO2 intensity (grams per kWh X 28.6, all divided by 100 since it's 28.6 kWh per 100 km):

    https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/carbon-intensity-electricity?tab=table



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