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Do men need a license to be allowed socialise (MOD NOTE IN OP)

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,335 ✭✭✭✭Ash.J.Williams


    on the news yesterday the showed a long shot of a victim walking into court and out again, only a pic of the accuser. I thought both shots were anti women. the first shot would have intimidated her going in, and the 2nd shot showed her mixed emotions, which was unfair, she was obviously traumatised and probably deservedly happy , but do we really need to have a camera on her face for such a long shot?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 257 ✭✭jbv


    All this is water under the bridge. It will be forgotten and nothing will be done to stop it from happening.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,512 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    But nothing can be done to stop it from happening.

    Do you really think Ireland will be able to implement policies that mean another woman is never going to be murdered by a man again. Ever?

    Time to get real. This is all talk. Nothing will change I'm afraid as it's the nature of humankind. There are just some sick people out there who will murder. It's always been the way, always will be the way.

    Guys giving off to their mates about chat in WhatsApp groups ain't going to fix it.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,292 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    That's the interesting and worrying thing about too much of current 'feminism'. It can harken back to remarkably old fashioned conservative views of men and women with irony all over the place. A full on patriarchal Victorian man steeped in the misogyny of his era would agree with this statement: Men can be brutes when exposed to female flesh and dirty books and women are vulnerable and agentless victims that need protection from such brutes and men have to do the protecting. Many's the current 'feminist' mouthpiece that would fully agree with him.

    One interesting aspect of the Suffragettes back in the day* was they campaigned for equal rights in court sentencing, including the death penalty. That women should be hanged for horrific crimes the same as men(even then women tended to get less harsh sentences). Today their great granddaughters are more likely to argue that women should be treated more leniently in the courts. Cos patriarchy and the like.

    They seem to have looked westward to American TV news for their cues and that's incredibly ghoulish, because ghoulish sells advertising. It's got absolutely nothing to do with that poor woman's memory or family, but it gets more handwringers and rubberneckers and crawthumpers for the cause de jour tuning in. Until the next tragedy they can mine comes along.


    *much of their history has been whitewashed down the years. Like the fact that a large faction of them were gung ho for war and were a part of the white feather campaign against men who refused to fight in the Great War. Hollywood leaves that out.

    Many worry about Artificial Intelligence. I worry far more about Organic Idiocy.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,292 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    The truth of the matter is our society is getting more violent,

    No it is most certainly not. We in the West live in the least violent and safest time in human history.

    I've long wondered that because for most of human history violence was far more common, that we evolved emotional responses to deal with that, so now when it's far less violent our emotional responses have yet to catch up so we imagine more horrors because of that? Like an analogy of our immune systems. We've never lived in cleaner healthier environments, but we've also never had so many people with allergies. Our immune systems evolved to deal with a lot more insults to it, so in their absence it overreacts to everything.

    Many worry about Artificial Intelligence. I worry far more about Organic Idiocy.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,353 ✭✭✭SAMTALK


    I'm sitting here with tears in my eyes thinking of that family in the last few hours with their daughter. There are no words

    Even worse is the absolute crap on radio/TV/social media on women being whistled at / spoken to etc

    This girl was MURDERED .

    Please do not come on and speak about the time you were whistled at whilst out jogging . Jesus wept... there is a time and place

    Shame on media for hi jacking this most cruel and heartbreaking crime , and leave the family to grieve in peace. Stop with the cameras , who needs to see these pictures.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,193 ✭✭✭Eircom_Sucks





  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,147 ✭✭✭rightmove


    If you dont think men get groped in nightclubs by women you are sadly mistaken and they know that the chap couldnt complain. I was quite young (17/18) and in a nightclub. New shirt the mother had bought for me, went onto the dancefloor with my mates and a girl from the locality came over as if to join the group for a dance and looked at the shirt and grabbed the middle of it and then literally ripped it open and left me with a shirt hanging off in the middle of the dancefloor. Now I was pissed off but ofcourse I am a man, I love having my new shirt ripped apart on a dancefloor. Reverse it for a sec. Imagine if I had ripped her blouse off in the middle of the floor and left her there in her bra!!! I woulda been lynched!!!

    also what has wolf whistling and stupid incidents like mine have to do with a murder???????



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,399 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    I shouldn't have to preface this with saying how horrific this murder has been and how awful it is for all who know her and her family, but if I don't no doubt I'll be accused of something or another.

    All our media have really gone all in on the coverage, no space for the family, and treating it as if it's the first murder of a woman in the county, which in a way devalues the lives of all those who suffered before. The RTE crime guy has been particularly morbid.

    Not sure if I agree with the president and Taoiseach attending. Yes, it's a gesture, but what about all the other murder victims?

    We know our legal system when it comes to sentencing is pretty soft, all the politicians involved are in a position for reform, but they sit on their hands.

    I've a couple of kids, one pretty young. We shelter them from such violence when they're at a such a young age, they don't need to know that yet, plenty of time to come. Now we'll have explain the murder of a teacher to them after the minutes silence in school, and no doubt that fear will dwell with them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,512 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    Of course you will be accused of being insensitive, that how social media works.

    I asked previously where was the minutes silence for those 3 innocent children murdered by their mother? All the vigils?

    It's not unfair to say the media have really jumped on this case. I also agree it was a terrible tragedy, but RTE have now set themselves a precedence, and I wonder will it follow for subsequent murders in this country, or only certain ones?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,646 ✭✭✭Melodeon


    Our national media can't believe their luck with this, they've gotten their very own Sarah Everard event.

    It's their best ever late Christmas present.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,550 ✭✭✭zv2


    What the hell is Fintan O'Toole talking about women walking in fear and how men need to imagine how fearful it is to be a woman? Has this guy read a newspaper in the last 30 years? Men know all too well how scary the streets are. There are plenty of streets I would not walk down because I might not get to the other end. I actually had my lip busted open in Gardiner Street walking home with a punctured bicycle. Men are being murdered and maimed for life more often than women are. Every man on this thread knows how scary the streets are. But Mr. O'Toole thinks we have to 'imagine' how difficult it is for women. What planet is this guy on? When was the last time he wiped the RTE glitter of is glitterati ass and took a walk at night on the street? Like MacConkey, O'Toole is just another yes man saying what people want to hear; "Look at me I'm a real enlightened empathetic male standing out among the common ogres explaining them stuff so they'll be real civilized like me." wtf? He's just a yes-man in the RTE glitterati and will say whatever it takes to keep him on his gold-leafed plinth on planet Fintan: Put yourself up Finto by putting men down as if they were too dumb to understand from their own experience what being a women is like. Go out and get your lip busted like I did and it might knock the arrogance out of you.

    It looks like history is starting up again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,100 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    Now all we need is the guards to stuff up the investigation we can milk it for murder mystery podcasts and maybe a tv series.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,910 ✭✭✭✭billyhead


    I've been groped by woman in nightclubs before on numerous occasions. I didn't bat an eyelid at it Also the sexual talk women have amongst themselves about men is just as filty if not worse than men. Anyway it's got nothing to do with this awful crime.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,335 ✭✭✭✭Ash.J.Williams




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭Brid Hegarty


    I came across a girl recently at an open mic who read a vulgar poem off her phone about how paddy jackson and stewart olding. Before she read the poem she announced to everyone in the bar that there were really guilty. Everyone clapped afterwards. I clapped just a little bit!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,335 ✭✭✭✭Ash.J.Williams




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,797 ✭✭✭✭rob316


    Well Covid is about as scary as a puppy now.

    There is a real hierarchy of victim here at what sells.

    Young, Irish, White, teacher is murdered. The country stops, vigils everywhere, christ even RTE is televising the funeral today.

    "She was going for a run". Is her life worth more than a eastern european prostitute out working the streets murdered?

    Paul Reynolds on RTE said the reaction was so huge as she was so "accomplished". What has that got to do with anything?



  • Posts: 19,178 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    'The truth of the matter is our society is getting more violent'

    no it is not, it is getting less violent, now is one of the safest times to live.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,797 ✭✭✭✭rob316


    Yep. It's just we are more aware now as everything is recorded and uploaded to social media.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,147 ✭✭✭rightmove


    not really but look at your response. Again reverse the genders and would you have said that so tongue in check?

    Main worry I had was not letting my mother see what happened the shirt.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,627 ✭✭✭Padre_Pio


    I have absolutely no issues with people holding vigils and remembrances for the deceased, but every "social commentator" is having a field day with this. Another chance to get their face on telly or their tweet in some newspaper.

    A whole lot of nobodies have a new crusade to garner themselves some publicity, and as usual, the more shocking and outrageous their comment, the more publicity it gets.

    Hence this thread, ironically.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,787 ✭✭✭Markus Antonius


    The media and all these women's rights organisations who seem to equate murder to things like pay disparity and women not holding enough government positions - they are all trying to milk it as much as they can before the perpetrator potentially turns out to be from a minority/non-national group. Then the deafening silence will follow...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,237 ✭✭✭Pussyhands


    The past week has shown a terrible side to Irish society.

    And yes, those who immediately jumped to "men don't understand what women go through on a daily basis" are included in that. They just had to make it about themselves didn't they?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,146 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    It was on the 10 o'clock news last night from ITV and a woman was speaking about the zero tolerance approach to misogyny and sexism. The article on the National Woman's Council says similar.

    Misogyny and sexism includes street harassment, or whatever you believe that you should be able to say to a woman in the street.

    Someone else here said why are there no men in the media getting airtime giving views similar to what have been expressed here by some people.

    The answer is because that is (a) they would not air these views in public and (b) people are not interested in promoting misogyny and sexism. The majority of men and women would not have an issue with not being able to comment /whistle at / "compliment" random people , mainly because they do not do it, dont approve of it, would not want it done to them, so having it stopped does not really apply to them from a negative point of view. For some reason, a small cohort here are unwilling/unable to cease and desist with that type of behaviour, despite being told not to do it, that its, juvenile and frankly a bit neandertal at this stage.

    Maybe just call it a day and dont say it. Im not sure why that is difficult to understand.

    As Roooonan says "you say it best, when you say nothing at all."



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,496 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    these ideas of introducing radical new teaching plans for boys didnt spring up in the past week , the likes of the NWC or other marxist NGO,s were calling for feminist influenced theories to be put into practice in terms of the public education corriculum for a long time

    while feminist theories are an important part , the goal is much wider , it involves marxists ideas of " privilege " ( new term for class consciousness)economics and most important of all , the role of the state , it has also incorporated the environmental movement of late as well as the housing one ( see the ever increasing profile of marxist academic Rory hearne )

    hence why all these commentators irrespective of their primary area of " expertise " , all share pretty radical left politics where the role of the family is downgraded and the role of the state hugely promoted , parents are seen as less important in terms of instilling morality in children than the state , its no co-incidence that even mammies have been derogitarily referred to on social media for how they " raised their sons " in the past week , these ideologues do not believe parents are best placed to instil values in their children , this should primarily be the role of the state


    the vast vast majority of feminist commentators in the public arena in ireland are also committed marxists , beit aibhe smyth , oral o connor , sarah benson , RTE while mostly of the champagne socialist bent , has always at best been very sympathetic to marxism , hence why the Paul Murphys and Richard Boyd Barrets and Brid Smiths , Ruth Coppingers get such hugely disproportionate levels of airtime relative to their electoral support

    stiffer sentences for the men who commit violent acts against women , absolutely , be wary however of the underlying broader agenda which is at play here

    Post edited by Mad_maxx on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,237 ✭✭✭Pussyhands


    RTE broadcasting the funeral on tv? The family asked for privacy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,417 ✭✭✭Allinall


    You don't think they checked with the family?

    Or maybe you're just trying to get outraged for the sake of it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,353 ✭✭✭SAMTALK




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 467 ✭✭nj27


    Some real jerk was on the radio saying Ireland isn't a safe place for women. Where is safer?



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