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ESRI confirms Irish welfare dependent population is TWICE that of Germany or France

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,067 ✭✭✭Murph85


    the government should be helping them to get their lives together, not bribing them with increased welfare payments every budget as a vote buyer. It is a morally corrupt disgrace. Its typical Irish , dont deal with the problems, just bury the heads... very Low income earners here contribute virtually nothing in income taxes, we differ here hugely v our european piers. Then you have even low income workers, hit by an idiotic rate of marginal tax of FIFTY percent of your wage, while those with more money than god i.e the multinationals, pay a pittance. The whole thing is rotten to the core...

    https://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/rents-rise-8-as-registered-tenancies-fall-by-nearly-a-third-1.4757855



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,040 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    its more we dont want to truly stand up and accept we re failing to meet the needs of probably most citizens, including workers, we also dont want to accept, we re failing to meet the actual needs of welfare recipients, as you say, throwing money at them doesnt resolve all of their issues.

    globally we also dont want to do what needs to be done in regards wealth accumulation, including with large corporations, the latest agreement of 15% shows, we still dont have a long term plan here, the default position of increasing taxation on labor and consumption, isnt gonna work!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,580 ✭✭✭Luxembourgo


    And so we need an examination of these issues and serious attempts to prevent this become a multi generational way of living.

    The constant carrot isn't working



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,040 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    yes we do indeed need a serious examination of why things such as generational failures are occurring, we now have a far better understanding of these issues and their causes, but yet, nothing has changed!

    what carrots would they be?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 757 ✭✭✭generic_throwaway


    That seems impractical. But I'm pretty sure that folks who spend their lives working in any capacity are a lot closer to paying their way than those who opt to live on the state's charity.



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  • Posts: 1,010 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Social spending is increasing year on year. I would consider social protection and health social spending. also look in the explosion in the "other category over the last few years. I suggest this is money funding quangos and charities(think homeless housing and mental health for example, so social spending too



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,580 ✭✭✭Luxembourgo


    Reinstatement of Xmas bonus for long term only, a seemingly social first approach to housing, children's allowance for all children, a very soft judicial system and a very sympathic media in which questions are never asked.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    I've been reading through this and realised that I don't currently know anyone who is long term unemployed, this is a huge change from 10 years ago when about half the people I knew including myself weren't working,

    I've had roughly 12 jobs in 35 years with a few stints on JB, it's a safety net between jobs, trying to make out it's a lifestyle choice is not true, last time about 10 years ago I'd actually given myself a deadline if I hadn't found work I'd end it,



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    Don't have one on them other than their absence from everyday use



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,461 ✭✭✭Bubbaclaus


    You have gone from an opinion that they are in decline and will be gone in 10 years to not having one. Interesting.

    Microsoft have over 20% market share in cloud services. To suggest they are absent from everyday use implies that you don't use the Internet.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,461 ✭✭✭Bubbaclaus


    Microsoft's market share of the cloud services business is almost 3 times larger than Google's share. Are you just saying random things now for the sake of it or what?



  • Posts: 6,455 [Deleted User]


    You need to realise that the lifelong spoungers ARENT on Jobseekers.

    For two reasons.

    One they would be hassled into Activation and meeting a Case Officer to seek employment, need to attend to sign on etc .

    Secondly they can't get as much money out of Jobseekers.

    You'll find they are all on Carers and Disability. If a partner and spouse are on Carers and Disability they both get paid full personal rates and split the kids so it's better financially as both can't receive full rates on Jobseekers.

    The real cherry on the top though is the lone parents, they make their child "disabled" and then they get full rate OFP, half rare Carers, Domiciliary Care and the Respite Care grant(few grand lump sum in the summer).

    Those women are pulling in e500-700 a week between the Carers/OFP/Domiciliary and Child Benefit along with the few grand in the summer. You can be sure most aren't "lone parents" either.

    So you're plan to attack Jobseekers would be futile as 95% of the ones who are living in the council houses with 5 kids and not a penny contributed will be unaffected.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,845 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,239 ✭✭✭Pussyhands


    I wish we had a proper party that would be harsh on scroungers and scammers. But I suppose so many people in this country are on some kind of welfare payment so wouldn't vote for them.

    We should be building more prisons and putting more people to jail. Feral kids should be thrown inside too for a while. Less of this "community officer meeting" rubbish. Punishments are the only thing that will change actions.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer


    They are no longer in my day to day view compared to 10-15 years ago, compared to Apple or Google, you have your little bubble and I have mine, what's commonplace in your life isn't necessarily in everyone elses,



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,191 ✭✭✭RandomViewer




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,850 ✭✭✭gameoverdude




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,461 ✭✭✭Bubbaclaus


    Microsoft

    2011 Revenue: 69 billion USD

    2021 Revenue: 168 billion USD

    Over 2.4 times bigger Revenue than it had 10 years ago. And it has an exponential growth rate going on the last few years. Just imagine what growth they would have if they weren't in "decline" the last decade!

    :)



  • Posts: 6,455 [Deleted User]


    That I don't know... Well since the bulk of these people aren't raising their kids correctly then they're half way there.

    But I suppose if Mary McD arrives into her GP saying her child has ADHD or some other condition like Anxiety etc then the GP isn't going to want to be deeply involved in disputing it and will fill the forms out.

    Similarly to an adult going in saying they have severe anxiety. If you were a GP sitting in a room alone with some dreg would you dispute their claims or just fill the forms and get rid of them?.

    Anyway these lay abouts know the ins and outs of that aspect better than me and pass it down from generation to generation but I suppose the key is the conditions can't be physical or can be disproven so they'd be using mental conditions.

    But it's amazing that 99% of them end up having a disabled child and even more so, when you see how much more money it gives you per week(as you can be paid to "Care' for that child as well as OFP and then get Dom Care and Respite Care).



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,152 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    Perhaps some sort of amnesty should be looked at along with a sustained education campaign for under 18s about entitlements and the importance of having a job.

    Then you could say in 2026, for example, those hitting 18 that year and from then on will no longer have the same entitlements as went before right across the board. You could have a serious tightening of the rules and thresholds. A complete reset.

    That's one way to transition out of this destructive cycle.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,067 ✭✭✭Murph85


    I wouldnt pay put welfare until at least secondary education has been completed or base it on what you have paid in...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,548 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    Inbreeding helps. As do drugs and alcohol during pregnancy. And crappy parenting, with no preschool education and dodging well-child health checks. And having lots of kids: make enough,an you are more likely to eventually hit the jackpot.

    Not necessarily conscious decisions, but the result of life choices which aren't really understood.

    Post edited by Mrs OBumble on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,239 ✭✭✭Pussyhands


    This is exactly it.

    Anyone who goes into a doctor etc and is insistent that their child has ADHD, the doctor is going to diagnose them as ADHD.

    I have family members who are diagnosed as autistic, getting disability payments yet there isn't anything wrong with them at all!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,845 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    What happened when you reported the fraudulent doctors involved to the Medical Council? You're aware of how Social Protection use their own doctors to validate disability claims, right?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,845 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    You do have some good sources for your claims about the effectiveness of punishment, right?



  • Posts: 25,611 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The trouble seems to be that an awful lot of people don't seem to accept that people who have no income probably should live to a slightly "lower" standard of living than a couple of people both working. While that's not accepted we'll never be able to actually improve things.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,460 ✭✭✭Viscount Aggro


    I was at a party recently, Dublin 8 area.

    A double celebration.... 40 years on the dole / moving to old age pension.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,643 ✭✭✭Packrat


    “The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command”



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,239 ✭✭✭Pussyhands


    How many people have the social protection doctors refused to validate? Why would social protection docs even care? They get paid anyways. It's easy just to tick a box.



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