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Norwegian Air Discussion

1…3132333436

Comments

  • #1752
    Tenger
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 9,927 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tenger


    ironclaw wrote: »
    ..............
    I'd be a little put-off, and pretty annoyed if my direct flight was diverted for fuel.
    More put out than if your aircraft ran out of fuel due to stronger than forecast headwinds?
    Its either fuel stop or cancel the flight, which would you prefer?

    BTW if you stay on the plane then its still a 'direct flight'. 'Non-stop' is the term you are looking for.


  • #1753
    ironclaw
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,004 ✭✭✭ironclaw


    Folks, drop the pitchforks :)

    I'm aware of the flight dynamics at play, just expressing an opinion. I've even taken the flight in question. But for the regular Joe who books a flight from DUB to YHM, landing in Goose Bay isn't on the itinerary when you book, hence my question as to how this is handled (Before board, during takeoff etc) as it does incur a delay.


  • #1754
    roadmaster
    Registered Users Posts: 3,847 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    I see Norwegian are hiring in an A330 to fly to Stewart from Dublin would it have full on flight entertainment system or would you still need a tablet with you?


  • #1755
    Rawr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭Rawr


    roadmaster wrote: »
    I see Norwegian are hiring in an A330 to fly to Stewart from Dublin would it have full on flight entertainment system or would you still need a tablet with you?

    I'd bring a tablet with some stuff uploaded to be on the safe side.

    A bit of a lottery with the wet-leased wide-bodies that they've hired in over the years. I remember reading some reviews of Norwegian Long-Haul a while back and I think they ended up with a EuroAtlantic A330 with tiny in-flight screens with the entire system in Portuguese(!).

    That's not to say that this is likely to happen anymore, but I would recommend have an Entertainment "Plan B" handy, just in case.


  • #1756
    roadmaster
    Registered Users Posts: 3,847 ✭✭✭roadmaster


    Rawr wrote: »
    I'd bring a tablet with some stuff uploaded to be on the safe side.

    A bit of a lottery with the wet-leased wide-bodies that they've hired in over the years. I remember reading some reviews of Norwegian Long-Haul a while back and I think they ended up with a EuroAtlantic A330 with tiny in-flight screens with the entire system in Portuguese(!).

    That's not to say that this is likely to happen anymore, but I would recommend have an Entertainment "Plan B" handy, just in case.

    Cheers I have flown with them to steward several times and always found them fine. I believe it’s a Spanish airline that going to be covering the flight


  • #1757
    aaabbbb
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,674 ✭✭✭aaabbbb


    Got an email from norwegian to say that my upcoming flight DUB to Hamilton has been switched to another carrier. Does anyone have any idea what carrier this might be?


  • #1758
    Tenger
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 9,927 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tenger


    Evelop perhaps? Spanish charter company with an A330 that’s been in Dublin quite a lot recently?


  • #1759
    zell12
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,995 ✭✭✭✭zell12


    Norwegian will not resume flights from Cork or Shannon this year
    Due to the continued grounding of the Boeing 737 MAX by the European aviation authorities


  • #1760
    errlloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭errlloyd


    I'm really worried about Norwegian - they're an airline that makes my life a lot easier.


  • #1761
    Rawr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭Rawr


    errlloyd wrote: »
    I'm really worried about Norwegian - they're an airline that makes my life a lot easier.

    Diddo here. If they were to disappear, I'b be down to SAS for my direct flight from OSL to DUB. (SAS are fine, but can be a bit gouge-y with the price sometimes)

    My guess / hope, is that only their lean-long-haul model is the part at risk at the moment. I'm thinking that they really were counting on the MAX to make those routes work. With it being grounded for so long (and maybe even longer, you never know) their original plans may be all but ruined at the moment.

    Hoping that all goes back to plan when the MAX is made safe.


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  • #1762
    aaabbbb
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,674 ✭✭✭aaabbbb


    Rawr wrote:
    My guess / hope, is that only their lean-long-haul model is the part at risk at the moment. I'm thinking that they really were counting on the MAX to make those routes work. With it being grounded for so long (and maybe even longer, you never know) their original plans may be all but ruined at the moment.

    Would it ever be possible for them to make their long haul service possible using a different type of aircraft? (I know nothing about these things so apologies if it's a dumb q)


  • #1763
    Marcusm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,427 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    aaabbbb wrote: »
    Would it ever be possible for them to make their long haul service possible using a different type of aircraft? (I know nothing about these things so apologies if it's a dumb q)

    From London they are trying to make it work with a Dreamliner, ie B787. That’s too big for Ireland. They will be due some compensation from Boeing and that might be supplementing them at the moment. However, there were some doubts about their expansive business models before 737Max problems. A downturn would not be good for them - the mainstream airlines have better scope for price cutting.


  • #1764
    Rawr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭Rawr


    aaabbbb wrote: »
    Would it ever be possible for them to make their long haul service possible using a different type of aircraft? (I know nothing about these things so apologies if it's a dumb q)

    I think I remember a report of them ordering (or wanting to order) the A321 LR. If it would work for Aer Lingus as a 757 replacement, it would probably work for them too.


  • #1765
    Locker10a
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 4,185 Mod ✭✭✭✭Locker10a


    Rawr wrote: »
    I think I remember a report of them ordering (or wanting to order) the A321 LR. If it would work for Aer Lingus as a 757 replacement, it would probably work for them too.

    Isn’t part of their problem going for the bottom of the barrel low fare low yield, they don’t carry long haul cargo on the Irish routes or nothing of significance anyway and they don’t have premium cabins both of which are the money earners for long haul carriers, they’re trying the low cost model on very long routes and simply can’t get the same aircraft utilisation to sweat the assets and make money like can be done on short haul. They’d be operating very close to the margin and and rise in fuel would soon put an end to the small bit of profit they might or might not be making from their current set up.
    I think their European short haul network most makes money, especially from Scandinavia, the long haul especially on the 737 I wouldn’t be so sure.


  • #1766
    Noxegon
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,558 ✭✭✭Noxegon


    Marcusm wrote: »
    From London they are trying to make it work with a Dreamliner, ie B787. That’s too big for Ireland. They will be due some compensation from Boeing and that might be supplementing them at the moment. However, there were some doubts about their expansive business models before 737Max problems. A downturn would not be good for them - the mainstream airlines have better scope for price cutting.

    I don’t know why you’d say a 787 is too big for Ireland. There are a lot of widebodies going between DUB and NYC every day.

    I develop Superior Solitaire when I'm not procrastinating on boards.ie.



  • #1767
    Blut2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,073 ✭✭✭Blut2


    Noxegon wrote: »
    I don’t know why you’d say a 787 is too big for Ireland. There are a lot of widebodies going between DUB and NYC every day.


    A 787 DUB to JFK is one thing. A 787 DUB to PVD would be very different - a lot harder to fill multiple times per week.


  • #1768
    kevinandrew
    Registered Users Posts: 1,251 ✭✭✭kevinandrew


    Noxegon wrote: »
    I don’t know why you’d say a 787 is too big for Ireland. There are a lot of widebodies going between DUB and NYC every day.

    Not with Norwegian's business model they don't. Norwegian can barely fill a 737 outside of peak season and even during peak season they rely on the lowest yielding business to fill their aircraft, it's not a good fit for the 787.


  • #1769
    Rawr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭Rawr


    Locker10a wrote: »
    I think their European short haul network most makes money, especially from Scandinavia, the long haul especially on the 737 I wouldn’t be so sure.

    They are quite large over here in Norway. Have used them a lot on domestic commuter routes around Norway (where the mountainous terrain can make land-transport very time-consuming), and the flights are usually packed with people, even on very saturated routes like Bergen to Oslo.

    Also for transport around Europe they are really giving SAS a run for the their money. (Even the old SAS Airport bus routes in Oslo has been rebranded with Norwegian logos :D )

    swptmoupeafpcfkahqoh.jpg

    So they're pretty big over here still, but I do wonder about the long haul. Almost feels like they've stretched themselves too far there.


  • #1770
    Marcusm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,427 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    Noxegon wrote: »
    I don’t know why you’d say a 787 is too big for Ireland. There are a lot of widebodies going between DUB and NYC every day.

    Absolutely but not into Stewart or Providence. I think 738 or Max 8 is ideal for those locations. Going bigger, adding premium cabins and cargo capacity all militate towards non point to point traffic and hub airports. I’m not saying it can’t work, I just mean that it would need to build over time with greater acceptance of the (frankly) tertiary airports.


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  • #1771
    aaabbbb
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,674 ✭✭✭aaabbbb


    Tenger wrote:
    Evelop perhaps? Spanish charter company with an A330 that’s been in Dublin quite a lot recently?


    Has anyone flown with these before or flown on the Dublin to Hamilton route recently?
    Just wanna know how bad its gonna be do I can mentally prepare for the torture


  • #1772
    Rawr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭Rawr


    aaabbbb wrote: »
    Has anyone flown with these before or flown on the Dublin to Hamilton route recently?
    Just wanna know how bad its gonna be do I can mentally prepare for the torture

    https://www.tripadvisor.com/Airline_Review-d10661145-Reviews-Evelop

    The TripAdvisor reviews paint an interesting picture of them alas. Lowering your expectations may be wise in this case.


  • #1773
    kevinandrew
    Registered Users Posts: 1,251 ✭✭✭kevinandrew


    I haven't personally flown it but from what I've heard it's hit and miss.

    - Standard 2-4-2 configuration on the A330, quite comfortable.
    - Limited entertainment options, some of which is dated.
    - Possibility of no personal screens depending on aircraft.
    - No wifi available.
    - Average crew, mainly Spanish with representatives from Norwegian on board.
    - Don't expect any information from the flight deck. 

    I don't think it can be considered bad by any means, some aspects are a step above Norwegian and others could be considered a downgrade.


  • #1774
    errlloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭errlloyd


    aaabbbb wrote: »
    Has anyone flown with these before or flown on the Dublin to Hamilton route recently?
    Just wanna know how bad its gonna be do I can mentally prepare for the torture
    kevinandrew wrote: »
    I haven't personally flown it but from what I've heard it's hit and miss.

    - Standard 2-4-2 configuration on the A330, quite comfortable.
    - Limited entertainment options, some of which is dated.
    - Possibility of no personal screens depending on aircraft.
    - No wifi available.
    - Average crew, mainly Spanish with representatives from Norwegian on board.
    - Don't expect any information from the flight deck. 

    I don't think it can be considered bad by any means, some aspects are a step above Norwegian and others could be considered a downgrade.



    On Flight Radar, that route is being flown on a Norwegian 737 800 (not the Max 8). Specifically this one.

    So it is a single-aisle plane in the 3-3 configuration. You will get no meal, and there will be no in-flight entertainment at all. Bring a tablet. Your hold baggage limit is 10KG on light fare. At Dublin airport, they will probably weigh your bags at check-in, and for US flights you have to check at the desk, not sure on Canada.

    The crew are nice, you can't select a window seat at check in without paying a lot. But at the desk they are often pretty good if the flight isn't full. Happy to move you around. They've let me away with 14kg-15kg before which is pretty good. And often turn a blind eye to an additional bag if it's small or if you give them plausible deniablity over whether or not they have seen it.

    The planes are modern. The seats are a pretty slim factor. I find them mostly comfortable at 6'2. They won't be turning down the cabin lights at all as it is a daytime flight and you won't get a little kit with a blanket / eye mask etc. The 737 800 is not the Max, and therefore if the wind isn't favourable you might not make Hamilton without an extra stop. But it looks like most flights are making it in one RN.

    I like Norwegian tbh. Ryanair Rules, but not quite the kind the same level of strict adherence to those rules that makes Ryanair sometimes unpleasant. They don't frantically try to upsell stuff either. Bring a tablet, bring a sandwich, bring a bottle of water. Bemoan the now bottom of the barrel experience that flying has become, but enjoy a dirt cheap transatlantic return. And maybe make sure you travel insurance is covered for Airline Insolvency.


  • #1775
    kevinandrew
    Registered Users Posts: 1,251 ✭✭✭kevinandrew


    I wasn't aware (or forgotten) they'd secured a 737-800 for Hamilton, that's good news! Thanks errlloyd for the more accurate information! 

    I wonder how this route is genuinely performing, they were singing its praises very early on which is always a warning sign in my opinion. It's currently just 3 weekly and still expected to end in early September.


  • #1776
    ironclaw
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,004 ✭✭✭ironclaw


    aaabbbb wrote: »
    Has anyone flown with these before or flown on the Dublin to Hamilton route recently?
    Just wanna know how bad its gonna be do I can mentally prepare for the torture

    I posted two pages back and I live in Hamilton:

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=109885666&postcount=1739

    With respect to the point above regarding stopping, yes, a few flights have dipped into Goose Bay for a refuel after the Atlantic leg. I think it adds about 45 mins to an hour to the flight time.


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  • #1777
    Tenger
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 9,927 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tenger


    In defense of the "lowering your expectations" in reagrd to Evelop. I have to say getting them to operate some routes is better for the customers than just cancelling. Look at it like a bus. If you are self sufficient you will be fine. (neck pillow, hoodie, headphones, tablet, music, snacks, water and book)


  • #1778
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,917 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    ironclaw wrote: »
    I posted two pages back and I live in Hamilton:

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=109885666&postcount=1739

    With respect to the point above regarding stopping, yes, a few flights have dipped into Goose Bay for a refuel after the Atlantic leg. I think it adds about 45 mins to an hour to the flight time.

    I wouldn’t overplay the refuelling stop - it only appears to have happened twice since the route started.


  • #1779
    aaabbbb
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,674 ✭✭✭aaabbbb


    ironclaw wrote: »
    I posted two pages back and I live in Hamilton:

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=109885666&postcount=1739

    With respect to the point above regarding stopping, yes, a few flights have dipped into Goose Bay for a refuel after the Atlantic leg. I think it adds about 45 mins to an hour to the flight time.

    I was more referring to flying with Evlop since my flight has been moved and it seems it will be with them


  • #1780
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,917 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    aaabbbb wrote: »
    I was more referring to flying with Evlop since my flight has been moved and it seems it will be with them

    As posted before the Hamilton flights are being operated by Norwegian using Boeing 737-800 aircraft.

    Evelop is flying the Stewart/Providence routes.


  • #1781
    TomSweeney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭TomSweeney


    I see Norwegian are back, are they stable to book with ? you think they could go bust in the next year ?



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  • #1782
    Noxegon
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,558 ✭✭✭Noxegon


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118149997#Comment_118149997

    All airlines could go bust at any time. You pays your money, you takes your chance....

    I develop Superior Solitaire when I'm not procrastinating on boards.ie.



  • #1783
    sportsfan90
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 641 ✭✭✭sportsfan90


    I was a little surprised to read the news but it’s great to have them back!



  • #1784
    The_Dave
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 438 ✭✭The_Dave


    Would you not get refunded if you paid through a credit card, as these payments are insured?



  • #1785
    kevinandrew
    Registered Users Posts: 1,251 ✭✭✭kevinandrew


    Which one are we talking about? Norwegian restructured and refocused as a short haul carrier again. It never actually went away but has abandoned its long haul and pan European ambitions. The short haul business should be stable enough, they’ve wisely chosen to stick with what they know and I see no problem booking with them on these routes.

    Norse Atlantic has emerged from the ashes of Norwegian’s failed long haul business but with the same people behind it with the same aircraft and business model. It will fly transatlantic from Olso but this time to secondary US airports such as Fort Lauderdale, Newburgh and Ontario, Los Angeles. It also intends to fly from Paris and London.



  • #1786
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,466 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    How on earth they think that'll work without a short haul network to feed into / subsidise it is a mystery.

    Scrap the cap!



  • #1787
    L1011
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,536 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    It won't!



  • #1788
    TomSweeney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭TomSweeney


    So for flights to Norway from EU should be fine ??



  • #1789
    Cookiemunster
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 12,181 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cookiemunster


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118150519#Comment_118150519

    Why wouldn't they be? Norway is part of the EEA and the Schengen area.



  • #1790
    kevinandrew
    Registered Users Posts: 1,251 ✭✭✭kevinandrew


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118150519#Comment_118150519

    I’d say so, Norwegian Air Shuttle (the original short haul business) was always a decent enough airline with a sound operation. The long haul subsidiaries were the biggest risk to the overall business but they’re gone now.



  • #1791
    Rawr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭Rawr


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118151188#Comment_118151188

    Pretty much this. I can confirm locally here in Norway that the "classic" inter-Europe low-fares Norwegian Air Shuttle never went away and are running as usual. But yea...that whole Long-haul operation appears to be gone. You can still get a flight between Dublin and Oslo, no trouble.



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  • #1792
    Tabnabs
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 15,750 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tabnabs


    Good news for the airline and hopefully more flights added from Dublin.

    (Bloomberg) -- Norwegian Air Shuttle ASA reached an agreement in principle with Boeing Co. for the purchase of 50 737 Max jets, to be delivered when the carrier’s existing leases end.

    The airline will take delivery of the planes between 2025 and 2028, according to a stock exchange filing Monday. Norwegian expects to finalize the order, which also includes options for an additional 30 aircraft, by the end of June.

    Norwegian has focused on rebuilding its operations as a regional carrier after pivoting away from discount long-haul flights following since emerging from insolvency. The airline plans to make pre-delivery payments for the new Max jets through “positive cash flow from operating activities,” it said.

    https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/norwegian-airlines-agrees-to-buy-50-boeing-737-max-jets-1.1772249



  • #1793
    Rawr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭Rawr


    Good to hear.

    Much of their old long haul fleet (and notably some people who used to chair NAS) have moved over to a new low-cost long-haul carrier Norse Atlantic Airways.

    Untitled Image

    Norse Atlantic appear to be offering a very similar product to the old Norwegian long haul, with similar routes to North America and apparently the seating on these Dreamliners are pretty much the same as what Norwegian had installed.



  • #1794
    Amenhotep
    Registered Users Posts: 206 ✭✭Amenhotep


    Im surprised they are getting MAX jets, I thought they weren't going for them due to the safety issues and sticking with the 737-800s...



  • #1795
    Rawr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭Rawr


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119138253#Comment_119138253

    I think the MAX jets were a core pillar to their cheaper long-haul strategy. The whole Dublin to North America thing they tried was very dependent on the Max and it's range compared to the 800. They'd totally have gotten more if it weren't for the Max grounding, their own financial woes and then Covid.



  • #1796
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,466 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Yeah but they're out of long haul for good now aren't they?

    Scrap the cap!



  • #1797
    john boye
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,587 ✭✭✭john boye


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119138253#Comment_119138253

    Initial cancellation had nothing to do with safety issues.



  • #1798
    Rawr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,079 ✭✭✭Rawr


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119139123#Comment_119139123

    I think so. Although I've a feeling they might do some deals with Norse Atlantic where Norwegian passengers can do connecting flights with them to offer a long-haul product. Too many Norwegian-ish elements in the new Norse Atlantic, so I can't help but wonder if it's a cheeky way to maintain the original long-haul product while packaging it in a new brand / limited company.



  • #1799
    Cookiemunster
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 12,181 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cookiemunster


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119139123#Comment_119139123

    Ryanair aren't in the longhaul market either, yet they're still buying the MAX. New MAX aircraft may world out cheaper in the long run than old 800s.



  • #1800
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,466 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    No doubt the MAX is a lot more fuel efficient than the 800s, Ryanair know what they're doing... Norwegian didn't.

    Scrap the cap!



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  • #1801
    Tabnabs
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 15,750 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tabnabs


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119139549#Comment_119139549

    Norweigan posted a profit for 2021, while Ryanair suffered a loss. That in itself says a lot.



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