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Smart Tariff Unit Rates

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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,049 ✭✭✭ bullit_dodger


    Yup. And that's why people are posting smart assed replies. There simply isn't (as far as I'm aware) any provider out there who has a half decent smart tariff which is worth considering. Why would anyone willingly increase your leccie bill? That's not smart.....excuse the pun

    Pretty sure it's deliberate though as I mentioned previously in the thread. If there was a provider out there offering a good deal which requires a smart meter, then you'd have Joe Duffy on day-time TV telling everyone to "go get one" and save a tenner a month. You can imagine the fiasco of the the old age pensioners out there writing in on how they've been waiting months to get one. Since ESB networks have some 2.4 million homes to have smart meters fitted before 2024, I reckon they have deliberately done this with the electric providers to curb demand.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,247 ✭✭✭ paulbok


    They could offer the same day/night rates as the old meters and it wouldn't impact like that.

    But you are right, there has to be a reason they are making the rates so bad. Unless they simply reckon enough people will blindly sign up without realising and cream the easy profits.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,049 ✭✭✭ bullit_dodger


    I haven't done this myself (as it's not come my way yet) but I believe that you can remain on your existing day/night tarrif when you get in a smart meter. You don't have to immediately swap over to a smart tarrif because you have a smart meter. Naturally the meter itself can slice the raw data into a day/night tarffit just as easily as another time slice. But yeah, if they offer you to move to a smart tarrif when installing - unless something changes, decline. Stick with your day/night tariff as long as you can.

    Ultimately (and I could be wrong) once the market has been saturated with meters, I suspect both ESB networks along with the providers to start offering competitive rates to move. With smart meters, they can create fiscal imperatives to shift loads to say 2am and that helps them. In their last annual report they reckoned smart meters would reduce the high peak loads by 4%, and that could mean less power stations they have to build, better use of renewables at nighttime, etc

    They ain't stupid - they KNOW that people won't swap to smart tarrifs en masse if it's more expensive. There's an angle there.....in the short term.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,249 ✭✭✭ Alkers


    Has anyone contacted their politicians about this, namely the greens? I was going to pen something today because of how absurd it is but time got away from me so I thought I'd check whether anyone had some text I could copy in the first place?



  • Registered Users Posts: 30 fluffykre


    I know its a bit off topic however we are going that direction on this thread as we are talking day/night meters. If someone has not accepted the smart meter yet would it make sense to switch to to a standard day/night meter. I just ran my usage through bonkers and there only 2 cent in the different between the EI 24 rate and day rate on day/night meter.


    2 cent extra during the day and discount night sounds like a good deal if not comparable to 24 hour over the long run. I have solar installed so only consume arounf 1500 kWh a year.




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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,049 ✭✭✭ bullit_dodger


    Don't forget though, that it's not just the unit price to consider.. Your standing charge is higher (a good bit) on day/night rate. I think I worked it out and if you are doing approx 30% of your load at night time, it's definitely worthwhile. I reckon I was saving €20-30 quid every 2 months by being on a day/night over standard. If you don't shift your loads though.....it's more expensive.

    You may already know this, but if not most washing machines and dishwashers have a "Delay" function, so while it might be say 7pm I'd load up the machine and delay the start for 4 hrs and it would kick off at 11pm when the night rate comes in (in Winter) and 1/2 price. Easy-peasy



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,640 ✭✭✭ irishchris


    Jeez they sound high day night rates but I suppose that is the way all rates are going at the minute. I'm on the smart plan with bord gais and paying 5c less than that for day rate but 2c more for night rate but they do add in Sunday free Electricity with that too. If on day night shop around as smart plans getting terrible press but that electric Ireland one including higher standing charge too seems shocking!



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,270 ✭✭✭ MAULBROOK


    But with the EI bill its nice seeing -€210. €210 credit dose help. Even the low usage charge doesn't feel so bad. That being said I haven't got my first bill yet. Time will tell.

    Im not on a smart meter, day/night.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,819 ✭✭✭ garo


    No you are incorrect. Smart meters are currently unable to support a day/night tarrif This is not a limitation of the meters themselves but ESB Networks not supporting it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,640 ✭✭✭ irishchris


    True but at those rates you wouldn't be long flying through it. I was tempted by their 300 EUR switching smart plan they had over summer as with their night rate at 11c and partial night at only 6c my idea was to charge up batteries in that and use during the day. In end went with the bord gais deal as Sundays are busiest in this house at minute and charge up for Sunday night/Monday half day with the free part whilst getting all heavy load washing etc done then too.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,049 ✭✭✭ bullit_dodger


    Good to know - as I said, it's not come my way yet so that was only what I believed. Good to know the story. Only thing I knew for sure, is once you move off, you can't move back.

    Interesting.....I wonder legally though where would that would stand? I mean, for the sake of argument say you have a 12 month contract with provider "x" to supply leccie at Day/night rates, then they come along and swap out the meter and no longer give you that rate.... Not that I'm planning on going off to court or anything, but just curious.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,819 ✭✭✭ garo


    If you consent to the swapping of the meter you lose the day/night rate. They can offer to switch you back to the normal 24 hour rate but that's about it. I think the rate you get is tied to whether you have a D/N meter or not and contract has wording to include that possibility.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,270 ✭✭✭ MAULBROOK


    Watch out for the T&Cs on the free Sunday, fair usage and all that shxte



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,640 ✭✭✭ irishchris


    Yep cheers, found that out after signing up that it's restricted to 100kwh a month so essentially 25kwh each Sunday. Fine for me as no ev and max I have been able to push it to do far is 23kwh last Sunday but for someone with an ev planning to charge it would be of no use I'd imagine



  • Registered Users Posts: 21,221 ✭✭✭✭ ted1


    they can support it, they log in 1/2 blocks which are timestamped and dated , this gets uploaded to the utility who can bill in ant TOUS tariff they want.


    what they don't have is an output for older storage heaters.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,243 ✭✭✭ graememk


    They can technically support it, but they don't support the traditional day night tariffs only the "smart" tariffs and the 24 hr one. Eg you can't get Energia's ev tariff on a smart meter.



  • Registered Users Posts: 21,221 ✭✭✭✭ ted1


    Not that they support it, they just don’t offer that as a product.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,022 ✭✭✭ SD_DRACULA


    Yes I actually phoned them and asked wtf do you mean you can't do day/night on smart meter you have all the data there. They mumbled some incoherent reason why they can't (i.e. they won't) and said smart tariffs only blah blah blah and they even told me to avoid them which is laughable tbh.



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,968 ✭✭✭✭ fritzelly


    Smart meter due to be installed shortly, thought I was being stupid looking at the smart plans and thinking they will cost a lot more money



  • Registered Users Posts: 358 ✭✭ Geeyfds53573


    I had a smart meter installed right at the start of their rollout - didn’t ask for it just coincidence but didn’t decline either - when renewing utilities this year I wanted a day/night tariff but couldn’t get one…



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  • Registered Users Posts: 47 Fantana2


    I was the same as you, they switched mine to a day/night meter without issue, I was mid contract rather than renewing.



  • Registered Users Posts: 358 ✭✭ Geeyfds53573


    How long ago was that and which company put the request through for you? Maybe it has changed but no utility company would offer me a day/night rate that was akin to the old circa 6-7 cent per unit



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,400 ✭✭✭ jkforde


    giving up on the smart metering, ordered my D\N meter today (primarily for BEV charging during the coming winter months), can always order a smart meter if the regulators ever wake up and enforce a proper smart market 😩



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,022 ✭✭✭ SD_DRACULA


    Wish I would have done that, rushed to get the smart one in place for FIT that came in July.... tossers the lot of them



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,784 ✭✭✭✭ KCross


    I'm of the same opinion, that its all technically possible just that the providers dont support it in their billing systems.


    I have come across one person who says they have a day/night plan with a smart meter. Personally I think s(he) is in for a shock when the next bill comes or else they have actually started supporting day/night plans with smart meters but I doubt it somehow.

    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117963665#Comment_117963665



  • Registered Users Posts: 47 Fantana2


    Was around May this year as they wouldn’t come out during level 5, Board Gais.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,819 ✭✭✭ garo


    As I said its not a limitation of the meter but of ESB Networks. Most likely they haven't done the backend work to support it yet.



  • Registered Users Posts: 21,221 ✭✭✭✭ ted1


    Nothing to do with Networks. The data is passed to the utility in 1/2 hour intervals to bill and use anyway they want. It’s uploaded nightly



  • Registered Users Posts: 217 ✭✭ DM1983


    Everyone is hammering the smart plans. I've run the numbers and based on last year's usage, the electric ireland smart plan with the extra low night rate between 2am and 4am is best for me. My calcs assume 80% night rate usage which is my ratio from last year. Also assumes that I will use 3 hours night rate per night which seems a good guess - dishwasher, washing machine, tumble dryer are all 3 hour ish programs. EV gets a decent whack in that time. Cashback brings this option under the standard day/night rate offer. Maybe I've missed something but don't think so...



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,819 ✭✭✭ garo


    Are they actually passing the data to the utility? If so, the retail billing company hasn't done the backend work. One more twist is that ESB was charging smart meter installs the same as the day rate. That is meant to change soon.



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