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The kickstarter adventures of Sólás - solaswatches.com

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  • Registered Users Posts: 16,467 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    Certainly looks like it 1st glance.

    @Thirdfox hope all is well you and the family, that ye are settling into new rhythm's of life with a baby.

    Still smile whenever I wear my Sólàs and I'm very much looking forward to the next one. In fact it's the only watch I'm currently 100% certain I'm buying 😂



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,110 ✭✭✭Thirdfox


    @banie01 All's well in the Fox family - I'm learning all about the joys of "tummy time" and sleep deprivation management.

    Something that I'm currently looking into (maybe for model 4) - Irish "mined" (from the bog), and smelted iron - from one of our long time posters here on boards too... I think if we can get enough of it made - while a steel dial might not be traditionally something that is often seen as a dial material - having this as an Irish forged material and built into a watch could be very interesting... we still have a long way to go but their furnace makes my little alcohol stove look like a toy 😁

    Currently you can see the pieces are a bit too small to be cut into dials - I'm looking at commissioning a large piece to be made - closer to when model 4's R&D begins (which isn't too far away actually - model 3's R&D is ongoing while model 2's is in the physical prototyping stage) - got an updated rotor design - we're not quite there yet but getting close now.








  • Registered Users Posts: 7,110 ✭✭✭Thirdfox


    All silver retail Starlights sold out :) - that's a little bit of extra Equinox marketing spend warchest now. I hope it's heartening for KS backers to see that our RRP isn't some kind of DFS "imaginary" figure - but something that regular consumers paid too, should be helpful when it comes to convincing people that the next/last KS campaign for the Equinox is set at a genuine "discount" too and that I'm quite serious about the actual RRP of circa €1299 (that's a VAT inclusive price).

    Oh and a photo that wouldn't be out of place from those pseudo "leaks" that tech companies actually use as marketing - I have asked the factory to try and provide a clearer photo soon :D -

    The bracelet was custom made to my design - well there aren't many off the shelf tungsten bracelets out there in any case... but Sólás is a five character word - the bracelet is a five link design... the name of the brand will be somewhat integrated into the design of the bracelet too - just like our Sólás Cónocht ogham text in the bezel - subtle design cues in the bracelet too referencing Sólás that wouldn't necessarily make sense for other brands.

    Can't wait to show off the actual finished product in the next two months or so (in the Instagram post above the second photo shows the polished tungsten links - they still need to undergo final cleaning.

    Post edited by Thirdfox on


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,110 ✭✭✭Thirdfox


    A long time since an update but as we're getting closer to the public reveal of the finished review units here is hopefully an interesting smorgasbord of info on the Equinox:

    1. Dive bezel:

    Here is the dive bezel - You can see that green and black are the signature colours of the Equinox. One thing that marks out the Equinox as something I want real divers to use are the two no deco markers on the bezel - one for 18m (PADI open water dive limit) and another for 30m (PADI advanced open water dive limit) - just in case of a dive computer failure novice divers will be reminded of the maximum dive time allowed (if it's their first time that day). The key details (no deco indicators and dive pip) are in C3 X1 lume whereas the rest is in BGW9 since C3 lasts the longest (and X1 is superior to the grade A BGW9).

    2. Bracelet:

    Slightly less grainy photos now available:

    You can see that tungsten has a deeper colour than stainless steel - and with tungsten it will keep that high polish finish much, much longer than steel. I can't wait to see the final product - you can see the edge links are bevelled too - those bevels cost a pretty penny but gives the bracelet an extra nice bit of higher quality finishing... bevelling tungsten isn't as easy as bevelling steel.

    3. Ogham

    A simple design graph of how the ogham for Sólás Cónocht will look as the teeth on the bezel - it's interesting I think that because of the use of the ogham you will only see teeth on the topside of the bezel from the 12h to 3h and 6h to 7h areas.


    4.Rotor

    A 3d render of the custom rotor - it will be in a dark green (similar to the bezel) with gold highlights for the Sólás logo. This rotor's unit cost costs more than a Seiko NH35 movement (nevermind the thousands for base R&D) so people might be interested in getting an idea of what everything costs within the Equinox. The triquetra fractal (each arm of the triquetra is a triquetra in itself) is something I'm quite proud about designing - hopefully the cost of this pays off 😁


    5. Pieta

    Here's the custom caseback on the "one of a kind" Pieta unit that will be raffled off:

    Ó dhorchadas go solas - while 2.5k was raised for Alone (for a 500-ish watch) - hopefully more can be raised for this 1000ish watch in the Equinox - though I do realise that amount raised is probably more dependant on the charity chosen than the value of the prize itself. Having had more time to speak to Pieta it means I can add their logo to the Equinox too at least for the caseback.

    Equinox's public reveal should come in at end of October/beginning November - then comes the harder job of getting some of the larger watch publications to agree to cover it. There's an expanded budget for marketing this time round as it's quite a bit different trying to raise money for a 300 euro KS watch compared to an 800-900 euro (price to be confirmed) one.

    I'd like to think that people can see the bargain that this is for all the design...and then in tungsten not steel :D

    More reveals to come - still some special ones to show off ;)



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,467 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    Ahhhm...


    Edited to add:

    I may well put an omega purchase on hold for this one 😉 unless I can convince the Mrs I absolutely need a GMT diver. I could say that you've definitely saved me money @Thirdfox 😉 but if I do? I'll probably have to spend it on her 😂

    Post edited by banie01 on


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  • Registered Users Posts: 585 ✭✭✭Pablo_Flox


    That bezel looks slick.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,110 ✭✭✭Thirdfox



    Ha the brownie poins could be significant if it's difference in price between an Omega and a Sólas. Hopefully enough people will be interested in something genuinely quite different in the diver category but the job has been made tougher in getting it produced as MOQ has risen to 500 rather than 300 with the requirement of getting a SW300 movement, tungsten cases etc. Hence an increase in marketing budget (which takes away funding from adding say an extra bevel on the case/bracelet or actual watch features) - you can build the best watch in the world, but if no-one knows about it they can't buy it either so I can understand how there are rumours/speculation that Rolex is spending 50% of costs on marketing - sure everyone knows about Rolex now but it can be a quick move from being ubiquitously known to entering the cobwebs of collective memory...

    The top or the side?

    If you look carefully you can see that for the bezel I've actually chosen to have a beadblasted finish applied rather than high polish - I think that gives it 1. better tactility/grip for actual use and 2. it matches closer to the "ogham stonework" effect I'm aiming for.

    Oh and if you look at the transition from black to green on the top of the bezel - you can see there is a subtle S built into the design - lots of fun design cues to notice in this watch and all tried to done in a coherent/cohesive manner.



  • Registered Users, Subscribers Posts: 13,424 ✭✭✭✭antodeco


    Still haven't managed to out the starlight on yet even though received it a long time ago. Its a present for my daughter's 18th which is the very start of November, so not long to go!



  • Registered Users Posts: 993 ✭✭✭Time


    I have to say when you said you were going with a dive watch for your next project i thought you were a bit mad, given its the most saturated market segment, but i think you're onto another winner here. I absolutely love that the transition from Green to Black and back again isn't just a boring perpendicular line, it really makes the bezel stand out. The small Orange accents are a nice touch too, even though i've no idea how they're supposed to work (you might fill me in on that one)



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,467 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    The orange markers are the NDC limits for PADI diving.

    The marker at 20 indicates that you can do 20 minutes at 30 metres without a decompression stop.

    The marker at 55 indicates you can do 55 minutes at 18mtrs without a decompression stop.

    You set the pip to your start time, and you can quickly see time remaining at either depth. A really handy indicator tbh.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,110 ✭✭✭Thirdfox


    Doxa has a cool no-deco time limit (the limit you can spend at the bottom of a dive before requiring decompression safety stops (something that all amateur/recreational divers are told to avoid)) - i.e. the bends (potentially fatal bubbles of nitrogen in the blood):

    Here it is in feet and at 20mins they mark the depth as 110 feet (I'm more conservative and go for 100ft/30m).

    The orange accents are there to give people a reminder about the actual depths... and instead of Doxa doing a full no-deco scale I've opted for the two key ones - one at the max of the PADI open water max depth (18m) and the other at advanced open water max depth (and general recommendation as max depth for recreational divers anyway - 30m). It means if you go down to 30 metres underwater (so your 3ATM watch should still be fine since it's tested to overpressure of 5ATM anyway...) you can only safely stay there for max 20 minutes before needing to ascend (or use nitrogen clearing safety stops - recreational divers are told never to be in a position to need that).

    The 20min and 55min minute markers are lumed with C3 X1 - two horizontal bars for the deeper depth and one horizontal bar the the higher depth - C3 X1 as it glows brighter than BGW9 - you can see that the timing pip and no-deco indicators are in C3 X1 while the rest is in BGW9 - priority is always given over to C3 for the key safety/dive critical components.

    Then minute hand (most important hand for a dive watch) will be lumed by C3 also - so basically on a dive you are referring mainly to the minute hand, dive pip and potentially those no-deco time indicators. It's a touch that I think divers will appreciate (if not at least recognise that this is a real dive feature designed by a real diver.

    People like lots of lume for fun aesthetic reasons - and yes our indices will have lots of BGW9 lume generally - but for the key dive components I'm using use C3 X1.


    As for dial material - two options (I learnt from the Starlight and some people loving the microrotor but hating aventurine):

    1. The "less flashy" option for those who want a subdued (some may say boring) dial - I'm determined to still give them some quality mineral dials - black onyx:

    2. What I consider the default dial option (and what the watch is built around) - malachite:

    You can see why I've chosen the black and green motif - one dial option is a bit more "black and green" than the other - but both fit into this general colour scheme.


    For the black dial could have gone with a cheaper material "it's just glossy black" (could have gone with glossy black paint for some savings) - but I want Sólás to be known for its interesting dials and even "simple" black shouldn't be simple in my eyes. Sólás Eclipse will have a spectacular dial (not mineral but made MsThirdfox go "wow" which is some feat for someone not particularly into watches).

    I am cognisant that I need to make a watch that sells (not just something for my own whims) so I wouldn't be surprised if the onyx dial turns out to be more popular than the malachite one. The Pieta version is actually made with an onyx dial 1: to appeal (or at least not unappeal) to the general audience and 2: "darkness into light" - well having a dark dial seemed more appropriate there.

    Similar to aventurine - I want to show people that it's not just high-end Swiss that use "luxury" mineral dial materials - if you like the actual material you can get them in reasonably priced watches too. I realise that goes back to the issue of "affordable crystalware" - and the absolutely dreaded phrase of "affordable luxury" - if it's affordable, by definition it's not luxury. I don't see Sólás as necessarily "luxurious" - but hopefully the watch will be a desirable one - though going into the 1000+ price range perhaps any such watch should be considered luxurious in a world when a 15 euro Casio F91W does a better timekeeping job at least. But in that light - even the Starlight would be a "luxury" piece :D

    I could have pretty easily gotten "Swiss Made" put on the dial (just get the final assembly done in Switzerland and tack on another X00 to the price to factor that in) - but for me it was much more fulfilling (though commerically unwise?) to stick with "deartha in Éirinn".



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,110 ✭✭✭Thirdfox


    The raw, still unpolished tungsten outer case. Hopefully people can see the design cues that have carried over from the Starlight into the Equinox - the lugs have been beefed up somewhat as this is a diver.

    This picture reveals why I'm quite proud of having reached 11.4mm with a 200m WR diver - by no stretch is that particularly "thin" for a 200m WR diver - BUT - other thin divers are built out of a one material case design. With tungsten an entirely separate inner core (made from steel) will be needed to hold the movement and provide the structure for screws to lock into - so in effect the Equinox has two casings - an inner steel core and a tungsten outer shell - and it still maintains a slim 11.4mm profile (including front and back sapphire crystal (sapphire back adds around 1mm to height) and bezel) and even more impressively (in my mind) a 42mm case size - there's an inner case and outer tungsten case adding considerable thickness to diameter - I would have loved to have been able to get to a 40mm diameter but that would have necessitated a wafer thin tungsten shell and it simply wasn't doable with the material and the requirement for it to be a useable diver's watch.

    For comparison have a look at Rado and their large tungsten bezels in their Diastar models - big and thick - easier to make (though it's their iconic design too of course) - a slim tungsten diver just hasn't ever been done before :)

    I am quite enamoured with the gun metal grey of tungsten - looking at it polished up you can tell it is not stainless steel and once you pick it up you'll definitely feel it on the wrist. And wait until you see how I demonstrate the scratch resistance of the material (I call it the "brick wall test" :D - I do not suggest running polished stainless steel across brick walls which often contain silica/quartz based materials) Tungsten is close to the density of gold so the Equinox will be closer to a Yachtmaster in weight (an affordable way of finding out if a solid gold watch is to your liking perhaps ;) )


    We are getting very close now to the official assembly and public reveal of the Equinox - 10/1 is a national holiday in China so there'll be another pause in work - but by mid-November I would think that we would be getting close to assembly of the review units.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,110 ✭✭✭Thirdfox


    As I couldn't quite wait for the official pantone colour correct version to come from my supplier here is a hand coloured version I coloured in myself (so forgive me going outside the lines somewhat 🤣)- the green should be slightly darker than what is rendered here (for those with a pantone colour wheel it is 5606c)




  • Registered Users Posts: 16,467 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    I remember chatting with you about a triquetra months ago TF and I expected perhaps a nicely engraved, perhaps even partially cut out edge waited rotor.

    To see how far you have pushed that idea, to see it skeletonized and in colour is absolutely and utterly amazing.

    Your energy and imagination in getting this project moving and in being so fresh with it really are inspirational @Thirdfox



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,908 ✭✭✭hitemfrank


    What's the lug to lug length of the case?



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,110 ✭✭✭Thirdfox


    That was actually an initial "cheaper" design where we could have reused the SW300 rotor - stamp out a triquetra or two, laser on a Sólás logo and be done with it...would be nice and adequate for a 600 KS/900 retail watch perhaps. I'm serious about this being on par with (or honestly, above) Omega quality in many aspects and so having this one component cost more than many affordable watches is part of that. At least on this one component (rotor) it should have most Omegas beat.

    Of course we're not unique in using custom rotors - Bremont, Blancpain are some who have used interesting rotors that I've seen (my stance is for divers - if you don't have something worth showing off then a nice solid caseback design is the eminently cheaper and better option to go with).

    Here's a Blancpain:

    And a Bremont too.


    And while I don't expect anything to come from it - the Equinox is intended to be entered into the GPHG (at least it's using a Swiss movement this time) - let's see what other innovative divers are coming out in 2022 ;)


    @Time you're right that the diver market is saturated - and I said from the beginning I wouldn't make a watch if I don't see what new thing it offers (hence I have no GMT or chronograph ideas - seems like there are lots of great options out there... but for the diver market while saturated, it is also the most popular and with a diver that offers something worthwhile and is not a homage of anything - could be appealing to the (tens of) thousands of people who like divers and are willing to consider microbrands.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,110 ✭✭✭Thirdfox




  • Registered Users Posts: 16,467 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    I should start looking for extra discount for all these segues I keep giving you to talk your design cues 😉



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,110 ✭✭✭Thirdfox


    Ha! You haven't even mentioned that the design and campaign has the strength of a runaway freight train yet...

    Though I was reminded by a Starlight backer that I should let people know about the pre-KS pre-order soon enough - the final pricing will be determined very soon (need to price in the box).



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,467 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    I am looking forward to seeing the lessons learned in the Starlight PR campaign and the feedback after played out with the experience you've gained.

    The pre-KS order is one I think I have an in on as a super early bird 1st time round, and you can have that order any time you want it.

    On a Sólás Starlight note, a bit of advice from you would be appreciated regarding a little mod?

    I'm very much considering a 2xAR crystal, if I could find something as transparent and reflection killing as a Sinn crystal 😉

    For you TF and the starlight owners, my thinking would be that it would put the Dial really front and centre and it would give me something noone else has!

    What do you think? Worth it or not?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,110 ✭✭✭Thirdfox


    A lot of lessons learnt - and important connections made - GPHG academy members, watch factory sources, watch publication contacts etc. - I won't be starting from zero with the Equinox, but the challenge has grown too in terms of the Equinox being a quite more expensive piece and MOQ requirements. The KS environment continues to deteriorate in my opinion due to the scammers out there (Hamtun just went kaput a few weeks' back - I know other posters have their Kraken watches too - successfully getting the H2 was what prompted me to believe I could successfully deliver the Starlight - who knows how things would have turned out if I never got the watch I backed from Hamtun 2 years ago).

    Here's something that isn't going up on our other public facing outlets:


    This would have been the "easy" road to take to get some triquetras of sorts onto the Equinox - much cheaper and "gets the job done" - either cut out (cheap) or lasered on (cheaper) - it's still technically a custom rotor but will it be "desirable"? And make no mistake - even with the custom rotor design I have currently there are still compromises made since I had to balance building something that may rival the Blancpains of the world, and being able to charge the price needed for those features.


    And @banie01 by 2xAR do you mean outer and inner coated AR? I am a personal believer that inner coated AR is superior over double coated from a mechanical point of view - with an outer coated AR layer you lose "scratch resistance" of the sapphire crystal of sorts as AR can always be scratched - hesalite mod for the Starlight might be more fun actually. For the Starlight it wasn't that having outer/inner coated sapphire was difficult or much more expensive - it was a design decision based on seeing reports of people scratching their Omegas' top AR coating. Having said that - as a dress watch you probably won't be scuba diving with it (though you probably could :P ) so maybe the risk of scratches is reduced and the benefit of clearer crystals is worth it. Something that doesn't work for an Omega Seamaster necessarily may work for an Omega Constellation etc.

    This is one of the areas where mineral crystals have an advantage over sapphire - they are much more transparent and less prone to reflections. Maybe Seiko was right to go the "Hardlex" route? :D



  • Registered Users Posts: 16,467 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    The custom rotor is a far, far better choice than the modded one TF, it really is a USP.

    On the crystal, given it's a dress watch I'm thinking inner and outer AR. If the outer AR doesn't work? It's easy enough to polish off and just rely on inner 😉 I'm my own worst enemy sometimes when it comes to tinkering but I may give it a try, just to "see".



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,813 ✭✭✭fat bloke


    Sorry if I missed it above but what's an approximate timeline for this kicking off Thirdfox, and have you rough pricing?

    Be good to have a decent heads up in order to get my cash-money ducks in a row :)



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,012 ✭✭✭njburke


    Hi TF, that all looks great so far. It's much more ornate and detailed than a standard dive watch. The ndl limits are perfectly executed.I have a do a and they are not as easy to read. Did the bungee endlinks ever get made?



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,110 ✭✭✭Thirdfox


    Yeah I didn't go with a NDL table - just the two key markers that divers may need (and lumed too) - not as comprehensive as Doxa's full outer ring but should be more useful and useable - the diver can glance down and see how close they are to hitting the double line (30m) or single line (18m) limit (if their computer has failed).

    And heh - those endlinks were indeed made - it's going to be a special reveal after we get the physical units in - for others who don't know this is a feature suggested by NJB and after researching into it something I incorporated as an extra nod to actual divers - instead of the microadjust bracelet which is fine for recreational wetsuit diving - there will be a dedicated "pro" diving attachment that uses bungee cords - it means that:

    1. As we are using dual cords - if one cord breaks, the watch will still remain attached to the suit/wrist;
    2. Bungee is elastic by its nature and so as divers dive deeper the watch will still remain snug against wet/drysuits - btw this is why the Tudor Pelagos has that spring loaded clasp (auto tightening the bracelet as deeper depths entered into) - this solution however is cheaper, more durable and less finicky to use for actual diving in my opinion;
    3. Works just as well for drysuits as wetsuits;
    4. It's meant for actual dive use - so aesthetics are less important - the attachments are in steel for strength, I don't think divers would care about getting some scratches on an actual tool piece.

    Again - while simple, I don't think any watch brand has made something like this ever before - so it'll be another one to add on to our watch world "firsts" along with a tungsten microadjust clasp.

    Oh and to prevent normal users using the attachments incorrectly - I'm not including bungee cord in the package - people who dive and use bungee cords for their other equipment will know how to tie the correct knots to allow adjustability and security - here's a good video of someone showing you a way to attach a dive computer via bungee cord:

    Simple and effective - the definition of "tool" - I was impressed by Pelagos technical prowess on that bracelet...but I think real divers (like NJB) would find the bungee solution more useful especially as I understand he prefers wearing the drysuit ;)


    Oh and as for pricing - still have the last few things to work out - it is 87% likely that first KS tier will be below 900 euro (inclusive of 23% VAT so take that off if you're ordering from the US/UK) - retail is tentatively set at 1399 euro but need to balance between the people who see that final price and don't think it's enough of a "discount" to KS and having a realistic retail price too - again the profits from this are being rolled on into the 3rd model - the Sólás Eclipse which I hope to be able to self-fund so that's the "boring" business side of things vs the trying to be innovative in watchmaking side of things.

    I would say that there will be around 100 €850 (691 ex VAT) spots, 150 €950 (772 exV) spots and 150 €1050 (853 exV) spots with the last 100 at retail pricing €1399 (1137 exV). *fingers crossed - if this is something that gets nominated for a GPHG then people should have gotten themselves a bargain at any of the price points...* I'm not sure if I've done enough networking with academy members for a nomination but there are people who are interested in the watch in the background definitely.



  • Registered Users Posts: 849 ✭✭✭Blanchy90


    Just caught up on this and it all sounds amazinr, really looking forward to getting my hands on it :)



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,813 ✭✭✭fat bloke


    Sounds cool alright, though all that dive speak is akin to my getting giddy about the 200mph capability of my new Ferrari which I will ever only tootle around at 60 in :)

    Have you an approximate timeline TF? Are we talking 2021? Or beyond?



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,813 ✭✭✭fat bloke


    FYI.

    I'm not at all looking to pin you down for times and prices, just real ballpark stuff. Like should I cancel Christmas basically :)



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,110 ✭✭✭Thirdfox


    Ha - I'm sure out there somewhere someone will be saying "but it doesn't have 1000m water resistance, can it even be dipped in water?" :D

    Sure you can take the Ferrari out to the Autobahn (or Isle of Man I believe) and take it off the leash... I guess the equivalent would be going out to Tenerife/Egypt/Turkey/Cyprus and doing a scuba tour. Irish cold water coral reefs are very cool too to be fair - I dive occasionally off Kerry (maybe one day I'll get to see basking sharks).

    Very provisionally the launch date is spring equinox 2022 (March 20) - it's a reflection of the amount of marketing that needs to be done once the actual watches are done (that is the easy part for me as I know watches... the marketing part is much tougher) - tens of thousands will be spent on marketing (evil necessity) so people on boards really are getting a very very insider look at everything before we start the proper pre-launch campaign. Of course if I can see that I have 400 people lined up to put an order down I can begin sooner - but for people who saw the first Starlight campaign, I absolutely cannot have a failed launch and am aiming for a "funded in X hours" scenario.

    Oh and my inbox got sent quite a few messages yesterday on account of the 2nd microbrand (Baltic) to launch with a HZ5000A:

    Their "MR01" movement - I think it's great that another microbrand has also adopted the movement.



    Retailing for 666.25 euro which is a fair price I think - hopefully the people who got a KS Starlight for 329 euro are chuffed. Seems to be sold out now.

    You can see Baltic got Worn & Wound, Monochrome coverage etc. - that's the type of coverage I will be looking for once Equinox is ready to go (in addition to all existing reviewers who looked at the Starlight).

    At least one part of what I wanted to do (have microbrands make more interesting watches) seems to have occurred - Sólás gets to forge a new path, others may follow but you only get to be first once 😋



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  • Registered Users Posts: 994 ✭✭✭Mitch Buchannon


    Taken from the comments on Hodinkee.



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