Greta Thunberg (Continued...)

One of the many angles people took on here to undermine Greta was the assertion that her traveling to a conference in the US by boat was not actually carbon neutral as the crew had to fly back and so she was still not doing enough. She will never win with some.

Where is the anger for those not doing anything, while in position to do something, instead of at a young adult for trying to set an example.

The attention and anger in this debate, whether it be at Eamon Ryan, or Greta, or anyone else who is making an effort is entirely misdirected.

When I hear people saying a plan is needed I think of some general who said that no plan survives contact with the enemy and Mike Tyson who I believe said everyone has a plan until they get a punch in the face.

Changing the climate plans were great while they were pie in the sky and theoretical. Now they are hitting reality.

If we are really lowering our carbon footprint living standards are going to be a lot lower. This fact is never highlighted not by the green warriors and not by governments. There is an idea out there that it will all be free like wind power.

Once people understand the true cost of what is being proposed \ planned and fact that they will have to pay for it through higher living costs and taxes they will cool massively on the green agenda.

Do we seriously think that Governments who cannot sort hunger, housing, access to water, wars unemployment, a cure for the common cold, cancer etc can change the global weather.

Have we (human race) ever sorted a predicted problem in our long history as opposed to an actual one.

Maybe it is misdirected but I think the only way things change is for leaders and celebrities and high-profile activists to lead by example.

If we are being honest here a likely outcome in the end is that everyday people are banned from, or just priced out of, international travel and maybe limited on purchases of meat or fuel or consumer products while the VIPs of our society face no such restrictions.

So while it's true that our current lifestyles are not sustainable I think we all know the VIPs will still be able to keep their lifestyles going. Can easily see a situation where you've got a couple sitting at home wishing they could go for a nice weekend away like they used to while the TV shows footage of Harry and Meghan being shot into space to enjoy 15 minutes of anti-gravity.

I think there is a lot of pretty justified mistrust here. We are eventually going to be asked to cut back on lots of different things but I don't think too many people really believe that the rich and powerful will be offering to go first. Climate related taxes will be us coughing up a % from every months paycheck and large companies telling their team of accountants and lawyers to find ways to get them out of paying.

It's a question nearly worthy of its own thread. Topics that immediately come to mind are the Y2K issue and the preparation of emergency field hospitals last year for the pandemic, I'm not suggesting that either was an unquestionable success but the issue that when something is said to be an issue, and steps are put in place and it doesn't become an issue, instead of saying that the mitigation worked, the reaction often is to say that it was unnecessary, or a waste of money or whatever.

As for people cooling massively on the green agenda because of taxes. What do you think the cost to the global society and economy will be if the scientists who are working in this area are correct because of the impact. I'm not advocating wasting money but this idea that solutions can be found that are going to be easily cost neutral isn't realistic.

I mean, they might be, if people used public transport or walked cycled where possible, didn't use disposable plastics if they could avoid them, limited air flight, and didn't invest so much in fast fashion or other consumer goods. But we know all these things would also impact the economy so the reality is, we've been lax on this for too long, and a price has to be paid.

Headlines like this don’t help. “Blah, blah, blah.” “This is what we hear from our so called leaders”. It’s the attitude of a petulant child, but one that’s an adult now. The changes will inevitably cause job losses and increased taxes. She’s is a media darling that’s unelected, why not enter politics in Sweden and make a change there. Let them cripple themselves economically first and see if it works there. These are not painless changes being called for, these are dramatic lifestyle changes. If her generation want changes then they can start making them, now in their own lives and change the world they are inheriting as they inherit it. The world doesn’t need to change for you, but you can change the world. If young people decide not to drive or fly abroad then that’s a big change. I won’t hold my breath though.

Great, well if we accept that there's always people who will have more then I want to be part of that group.

I'll continue to drive around and go on overseas vacations and eat loads of meat and use up loads of fuel.

After all, there will always be an elite who have more. So why not me? I volunteer myself for that elite class!

Probably would be a lot easier for people to swallow the end of international travel etc if "we're all in it together" became an actual thing. Rather than "know your place, you can't fly but the rich can".

Should her generations first step be to stop consuming, then? A very simple "vote with your wallet" starting point?

What's really going on? These kids are encouraged to take a day off school to "protest" on Friday but then it's back to the consumer life on Saturday?

She has nothing but empty words herself. "We can no longer let the people in power decide what hope is. Hope is not passive. Hope is not blah, blah, blah. Hope is telling the truth. Hope is taking action. And hope always comes from the people." Haha. How does it go? Blah blah blah?

It's a bit of a pantomime. Banging on about "hope" isn't going to fix anything.

Neither Communist or Marxist led governments have a great track record when it comes to environmental protection. Look what the Soviets did to the Aral Sea. Look what they did to cities such as Chelyabinsk and Kasnoyarsk. Look at the top 50 most polluted cities in the world, the majority in China.

Then make the change and convince her own generation to make these changes. It doesn’t need to be mandated, convince her piers to not drive and not fly.

Who said anything about "taken down"? I said if this is going to work then they would need to lead by example.

A situation in Ireland where people are all walking to cycling to work through the winter as the VIPs glide by in their nice warm private cars just isn't going to work. Especially not if people have the option to ditch the bike and just drive in tomorrow.

You can't really have spokespersons and figureheads (and I am not referring to anyone specific here, before you start) standing up on stage imploring the masses to take action to save the planet and then immediately being driven off to their private jet to take them home.

If they won't lead by example then what's the point?

so if 80 or 90% of people are cycling or walking to work it wont do any good? i cycle to work all year round by the way, Ireland is a perfect climate for it.

We all know the figureheads aren't leading by example, except for Greta really. This is why Greta is calling them out, they just utter meaningless words, none of them want to change or have the balls to implement the changes that would upset voters.

How does this response relate to the post that I made in any way?

It is nonsensical if people are looking for a singular example of someone using carbon heavy travel to negate their entire argument that we should be cutting down on it.

Eamon Ryan already frequently cycles to the Dail and yet still gets lambasted. So too does Ivana Bacic. Or at least she did while she was a senator.

Greta, as we saw, travelled to the US by ship and even then people are saying she should be doing more.

If everyone on the planet was to use 10% less resources then they are currently using, we probably wouldn't be having this discussion.

They are all the same government but Ryan is the posterboy for green bullsh1t.

Reduce emissions where it can be done without drastic effects on everyday life. Personally I would focus on reduction of CO2 only after cancer causing emissions had been seriously worked on. The whole diesel car push back in 2008 is a classic example of green pushing a dodgy agenda. Tax the hell out of people based on CO2 and don't worry at all that the same diesel car is much more dangerous than petrol in terms of Nox etc.

I don't buy into the warming theories re doom.

Firstly, much of the predictions of flood etc appear to assume that man is just going to sit on his hands and do nothing in terms of Engineering to help live with rising levels etc.

Secondly, it would appear that any upward temperature trend is over a tiny timescale when compared to the history of the planet. All the current theories appear to ignore natural cycles on this planet.

I believe we are heading to a solar minimum phase where temperatures will drop slightly. This doesn't seem to be acknowledged at all. I'm not talking so much about the direct effects this particular event may have but moreso re cycles in general and the various effects through the centuries.

We had the ice age and it went away. A natural change far beyond what we are currently seeing or will see in the next 1000 years.

Should emission reducing strategies be introduced - not if it means shutting down power plants that are actually needed to heep the lights on while forcing people to buy imported briquettes from Germany.

Do you think we should push an agenda of penalising and closing Irish business due to the activity being seen as not environmentally friendly then importing product from other countries that would be produced in the same manner?

Do you think we should be facing power shortages due to these policies in times where government are grant aiding Electric cars?

The mind boggles really.

There are obvious things government could be doing. Feed in tariff is the obvious one. Instead of making a solar install cost effective by selling electricity back to the grid, they instead do it by grant aiding the installation and purchase of batteries. It's nuts.

hey can you tell me how Eamon Ryan closed the peat plants down if it was announced in 2019 they were to be closed?