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Heavyweight Boxing

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,645 ✭✭✭squinn2912


    Just got caught up on the face off. Usyk is so impressive I think he’s hilarious the facial expressions he makes and the eyes going nuts, a real cool character. He doesn’t look too worried about Joshua but he’d need to improve an awful lot on the Chisora showing for Joshua not to win. I’m convinced of this one and I’m thinking his excellent movement will count for something but only to keep him in there longer. I’ve said R7-9 but it wouldn’t surprise me if it’s even earlier. It’s rare enough that a smaller fighter will move up weights and beat a good champion and rarer still the heavier you go. Jones Jr and Haye came up and fought very poor belt holders, Holyfield did do fantastically well. I’m not sure if Usyk is as strong as Holyfield was - I’m not gonna say as good - so I don’t see him doing as well. I’m really looking forward to seeing it unfold and praying I’m wrong but I can’t make a case for Usyk at all.



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,453 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright




  • Registered Users Posts: 54,495 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Ok..

    No idea why it being last year matters too much…



  • Registered Users Posts: 54,495 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    squinn

    No disrespect to Usyk, but he’s nowhere near the fighter a prime Holyfield was..



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,453 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    It was before he got any publicity things could change because of his exposure with this AJ fight ,

    The interview was during lockdown when Usyk really didn't have nay real buzz around him, the fight between Usyk & Aj wasn't even made at the time , the question was a "what if"

    Things change quickly in boxing as we all know ,



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  • Registered Users Posts: 20,453 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    That a good question who was better , i reckon Usyk was as good a cruiser weight as Evander was but with different styles of course,

    Evander looked to have huge help in his switch for cruiser to heavyweight if you know what i mean ,



  • Registered Users Posts: 54,495 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Evander was far smoother and a far better overall puncher, combinations, jab, inside work, mid range etc....A joy to watch when throwing shots

    Plus, he met far superior talent at HW. Usyk has met two nobodies in Chisora and Whiterspoon. This is his first test vs AJ

    I'd also back Evander to KO AJ prime vs. prime. He has far too much...

    Evander v Usyk at any weight when at their best....Holyfield 10/10 times....



  • Registered Users Posts: 54,495 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    I was listening to Eddie this morning giving a tour of Spur stadium.....

    Chap is 112 kgs......247 or so lbs.......he said roughly 10 lbs heavier than AJ...

    I know Eddie must be 6 feet 4 or thereabouts, but would not have thought he'd be that heavy!!!



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,645 ✭✭✭squinn2912


    Not sure the gap is as wide as that. I was actually trying to be conservative because I was expecting a backlash saying Holyfield was better. I’d say more suited to HW. Rougher, tighter man. No way chisora would be bullying him around and throwing him to the floor. Usyk might have a nicer jab throw and better footwork I think that’s a given but I’d say Holyfield 7/10 times possibly a draw and 2 for Usyk.

    To be fair to Usyk here Holyfield has already done it all at HW with or without help, we’ll not know that for sure but can have our doubts. Usyk still might. If he were to beat Joshua and then do it again in a rematch, then beat the winner of Fury and Wilder then I think we’d have to revise our opinions on who’d be the best.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,645 ✭✭✭squinn2912


    It’s as well he doesn’t stand on the scales himself. I couldn’t see him being within 10kgs of Joshua. Joshua is huge beside him, much more muscle. I think Eddie might be at it



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  • Registered Users Posts: 54,495 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Just on the jab....Holyfield had one of the best jabs in history. Fast, hard, rhythmic, effortless, technical and sustained....doubles and triples as well. I'd be firm in saying it was better than Usyk's



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,453 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    I'm only speaking about Cruiser weight obvious no comparison at heavy weight,

    I think cruiser weight would be a great fight and close,

    Usyk will never be as good at heavy weight as Holyfield , Evander had an advantage making the jump because of his style & the Jesus juice ,



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,933 ✭✭✭Blanco100


    Holyfield at HW is tainted by his juicing, no matter what anyone says. The transition wasn't natural. Terrific fighter though, well rounded.

    Its quite similar to Canelo's transition to MW/LHW, there were certain enhancements that his team will just want folks to stop talking about.

    Can't wait for this fight, Usyk looks bloated i'm starting to wonder if it will take away from his stamina and elusiveness. Still tipping him to KO AJ though, have few quid on it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,910 ✭✭✭normanoffside


    AJ 240lbs

    Usyk 221lbs

    About what everyone expected. Both look in great shape.



  • Registered Users Posts: 54,495 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Great to see two confident and respectful and mature fighters behaving for a change. They don't need to be assholes.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,910 ✭✭✭normanoffside


    I have no idea how this will go at all. I can see an argument for any result. Just looking forward to watching it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,453 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    I agree but i have to say the press conference yesterday was dour ,

    There was no real tension or even anyone asking good question where a fighter would have to say anything interesting ,

    I'm not asking for fireworks or anything like that but even for one of them to say I'm going ko him and I'm the best would have added to the event

    I find AJ a total bore & don't get me started on him when he tries to sound like a wise man

    I know i know its still a good fight but i just found it very underwhelming ,



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,453 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    I know its heavy weight so it doesn't matter but AJ should d be made take his shoes & trackie bottoms & head phones off,

    Just to get the true weight although it probably not more than a pound ,

    I'm just a stickler for seeing things done correctly



  • Registered Users Posts: 54,495 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Bang on....and I bet it would be more close to 2-2.5 bs....


    My 238 or so guess spot on then!!!!!



  • Registered Users Posts: 871 ✭✭✭AdrianG08


    Usyk by KO. Expect AJ to visit the canvass a couple of times.

    He will take AJ's power when it lands, he will move Joshua around the ring like nobody ever has. This is a guy who knows how to win. I think the British boxing public are so used to the likes of washed up Povetkin, Pulev etc... being billed as dangerous that they are conditioned to think its easy work for Joshua (after the fact).

    Usyk is the real deal, forget about cruiserweight, the guy has whiskers, he is a heavyweight not, a HW with a brain and skills. He was asked a while back, why he wanted to face AJ, he simply said he knows how to beat him, no bullsh*t trying to sell it. Just stating his belief. Undefeated, rarely beaten in the amateurs either, he is coming to win, not for the payday.

    AJ has size, but Usyk has the ability to adapt during a fight depending on what is happening, as someone else mentioned AJ can adapt between fights rather than during. He successfully adjusted to beat Ruiz the 2nd time but took him an entire camp to get his tactics right.

    His only hope is to take it to Usyk in the opening 3 rounds, make him eat punches.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 54,495 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Very persuasive..

    I am also seeing this utter winners attitude and aura about Usyk. Always have..

    If he can take the weight/power as you have alluded to, then he can win. But it will be a hard earned win.

    I said it before, but taking the power isn’t the whole picture. If he’s taking it and being moved/buzzed by it, then his own offence may suffer.

    His best plan should be very slick movement and blocks/parries and riding shots. Using AJs power/offence against him, while pecking and swiping and poking and bewildering AJ.

    I still make AJ a favorite. I’ll stick with KO within 5-6 rds



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,645 ✭✭✭squinn2912


    Back to the jab comment, yea - that’s why I said nicer but Holyfield more powerful with the jab. I’d say not a lot in it there. Speed and footwork Usyk and then combos, toughness and brute strength Holyfield. I think we broadly agree anyhow.


    Didn’t see weigh in but I’m gonna watch the clips later on. Those weights sound like about what we expected. Usyk not going to try to be too blown up but he’s put on 3/4 kgs isn’t it? I find a lot of his press conferences are mild enough and mainly due to language issue. It’s hard to brash talk with an interpreter. A bit of dislike might make it intriguing too but I agree with the earlier comments, I like sportsmen to be respectful and sporting. All that oul shite becomes transparent too like Wilder’s nonsense, Tyson begging forgiveness after Lewis Ko’d him... looks very foolish even if it does sell tickets. I think the fight will have fireworks.

    The Usyk confidence aura is fantastic to see. He’s a born winner and he looks well convinced that he can win tomorrow. I didn’t even think Ruiz looked like he thought he’d win the first fight but he did look game as f**k. All of Joshua’s other opponents looked like a beaten ticket early on. Even Wlad as much as he performed well-ish.



  • Registered Users Posts: 54,495 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Hand speed is equal, if not in Evander's favorite....certainly faster combination hitter....



  • Registered Users Posts: 871 ✭✭✭AdrianG08


    Usyk has always been hit in his fights, but has a canny knack of riding/rolling with these punches. Its for this reason im not as worried as others. If he was a clinical technician whose entire career was based off not getting hit, then i'd be worried.

    I think he will do exactly as you say late in your post, slick movement, blocking punches, riding/rolling those that do get through, and confusing the absolute hell out of him. Expect to see AJ looking bemused in the corner asking McCracken what he should do. He really needs to get on top of him, impose his physical dimensions and throw plenty of punches from range early. Hurt him early in order to take away his offence.

    Say whatever you like, AJ is a vulnerable HW, you do not need to be a big puncher to hurt him, crisp accurate punches especially to the temple will hurt him. He is a hugely vulnerable fighter and its why his fights are good to watch. Usyk has serious skills, always thinking, no crisis for him to throw a gameplan out the window after a round or 2, he can adjust, he is methodical.

    Does Hearn also promote Usyk by any chance? Do matchroom have options on Usyk? The fact Usyk went after the AJ fight so aggressively tells me they see something. I know he is number one with WBO, but he and his team fancied this one for a long time, he has the style to win impressively here.

    15/2 are the odds on a Usyk KO, lumped €50 on it



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,453 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    Your first line is why i think Usyk will lose, he does gets hit in every fight & hard ,

    I think AJ will catch him early and finish the job ,

    I love Usyk but i just don't see his style carrying over well to the big boys ,



  • Registered Users Posts: 821 ✭✭✭Coneygree


    Heart says Usyk by utter disassembly job but head says Joshua catches him. Usyk has it all against him but he's not one to panic too much and he's one of the finest operators to lace them up for many a year.



  • Registered Users Posts: 821 ✭✭✭Coneygree


    I agree with that he gets hit but hardly if ever, flush and hard. Usyk's ability to roll and ride with punches to lessen the blow is one of his greatest strengths.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,977 ✭✭✭✭Rjd2


    I know he probably knocks him out in the 1st round, but lads......

    WTF is Campbell Hatton doing so high on the card? Ahead of Smith and Marku ffs.


    https://twitter.com/MatchroomBoxing/status/1441409588759195649/photo/1



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,645 ✭✭✭squinn2912


    Gotta say I admire your conviction and I’ll be in the queue to congratulate you if Usyk pulls this off as you’ve outlined. I really hope you’re right.

    I dont think he’s going to be able to do that for as long as he will need to. My judgement comes from his performances against much inferior opposition than Joshua. Gassiev was a close fight, he couldn’t get rid of Hunter, Bellew won the first 3 rounds I think and then there are the two HW bouts during which he didn’t impress very much. I don’t see where the argument really comes from that this culminates in a stoppage victory over Joshua.

    Joshua, like all of them, has his vulnerability. He doesn’t take a shot well and he doesn’t evade or ride a shot well. I’m not sure I can see Usyk being able to find him with a shot let alone a clean enough one to wobble him. If he does this then I’ll be shocked. But I am praying for the upset all the same.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,873 ✭✭✭selectamatic


    Usyk Gassiev wasn't a close fight Quinn. Usyk danced for the 12 and made Gassiev look like the mummy Ali stated Foreman to be.

    I waited that whole fight for Usyk to tire and he never dropped an ounce of output, it was phenomenal. One of his best performances ever.



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