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Random EV thoughts.....

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Comments

  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 19,831 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1


    Also, look at UK, a £10m commitment per service station for EV charging infrastructure and we barely get that for the entire country



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,005 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    There's a few bright spots, for one thing they actually acknowledge that installing chargers is key to EV uptake. Generally government bodies have been quite happy to wave around the current grants and ignore the flaws with them

    I actually think a dedicated EV office would be good, instead of playing pass the buck with a bunch of government departments

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,207 ✭✭✭innrain


    The purchase subsidies available, an SEAI grant and VRT exemption, can amount to €10,000 per vehicle and serve to bring the market selling price of EVs in line with their ICE equivalents. Department of Public Expenditure and Reform (DPER) analysis suggests that subsidising 100,000 EVs, using 2019 levels of supports, would cost the Exchequer between €965 million and €1.23 billion, although some of the supports have since been revised.

    10k subsidies is not true as VRT is 7% and the max exemption works for 40k cars after that gets reduced one to one So max VRT exemption is 2.8k add 5k grant and max subsidy is 7.8k quid.

    100ks EV expected are something like 40k BEVs and 60k PHEVs. PHEVs have no VRT exemption and the grant is 2.5k So at max BEVs subsidies 312M and PHEVs 150M that's 462M. I didn't take into account the number of compamny cars which have no grant at all. Even though the figures quoted are for 2019 level of support way outdated, the title in the independent still trumpets the highest figure.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,326 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    I actually think a dedicated EV office would be good

    True, I'm not sure the SEAI are the ones that should own that office though as it wont really be an EV office then but just a backdoor to solidify the SEAI's existence and get more funding for themselves. I'm just skeptical of their track record.... lots of paperwork is what they are good at.... maybe I'm being harsh but its my experience of them.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 19,831 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1


    PHEVs should receive zero support, they don't need anything, well past adoption phase.

    Concentrate on BEV



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,510 ✭✭✭cannco253


    More stories on the report

    "Tax relief on electric vehicles should be extended beyond the end of this year but the relief should apply only to cars priced less than €40,000, according to proposals from the Tax Strategy Group (TSG).

    The Vehicle Registration Tax (VRT) relief of up to €5,000 on electric vehicles is due to expire at the end of 2021. However, the Government advisory group has called for these to be extended beyond this deadline while the current threshold of €40,000 should be reduced to €30,000 from next year.

    Currently, the €5,000 VRT relief on electric vehicles begins to taper off from €40,000, ending at €50,000. Under the new proposals, it would mean that a new electric car priced at €30,000 would receive the full €5,000 relief, but new or imported cars priced at €40,000 or more would not benefit from the tax relief."


    Will this see a drop in prices next year similar to what happened in the UK, or will the chip shortages/delays keep the prices where they are now or drive them even higher?



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 19,831 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1


    Ah that cap is very restrictive, all these cars are mostly brand new models so not going to be cheap and reference to imports a joke as Brexit killed that.

    From various media outlets, the chip shortages will extend through to late next year, there's a ten fold difference between an ICE versus an EV in terms of chips apparently which is exasperating the issue



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,373 ✭✭✭MightyMunster


    Not too many options starting under 30k



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,121 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    Under 30k you either get an outdated leaf, a silly priced Zoe or a chinese car.

    Not options I'd reccomend to anyone.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,179 ✭✭✭✭AndyBoBandy


    sub 30k you have the MG, Zoe, eCorsa, e208, so not exactly slim pickings...

    I don't know why but I'm really fond of the Zoe ZE50, with its 395km WLTP....



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  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 8,264 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    The Mini also starts under €30k, if the change is anything like the current band from 50k to 40k, then they'll still be decent subsidies between the 30-36 range which covers the entry level model of most available EVs.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,121 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    Those cars are only just sub the 30k and that's including the existing grants. If you look at the base price before grants and VRT (ie the book OMSP) they will be over 30k.

    And I wouldnt be reccomending anyone buy an outdated zoe or leaf, or a mini with 200km range as their first ev



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,231 ✭✭✭Kramer


    This could push entry level Model 3s up by €5k & no doubt the €5k SEAI grant threshold will lower too, initially probably from €60k to €50k, possibly adding another €5k to model 3 SR+.

    We could be looking at €60k for the cheapest Tesla, maybe €55k+ when they are built in Berlin (RHD Model 3 SRs from there are likely 2 years away).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,179 ✭✭✭✭AndyBoBandy


    A friend of mine in the U.K. just had a pod point charger installed, and since it’s been in his neighbour is complaining that it’s affecting her TV (which comes via an aerial on the roof).

    Anyone any experience of similar? And any possible solution? He said is charger is a smart Pod Point charger.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,790 ✭✭✭eddhorse


    I do remember someone saying they had radio interference on their Zappi charger. ELM maybe?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,434 ✭✭✭chewed


    Has he switched it off to confirm if has any affect on the neighbour's tv?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,179 ✭✭✭✭AndyBoBandy


    Yes, said he switched it off and about 15 minutes later the tv reception improved..



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,576 ✭✭✭eagerv




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,326 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    about 15 minutes later

    Well its BS so. If the charge point caused it it would immediately be resolved by turning off the charge point... it wouldnt take 15mins for the interference to dissipate.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,005 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    Must be all the 5g in the air, stopping her from watching GB news as well as giving everyone covid 🤣

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,207 ✭✭✭innrain


    Following on the discussion of the last gov report which suggested the formation of OLEV and other such possible actions but nothing concrete. I came across a website from Germany, put up by the federal gov https://www.standorttool.de/strom/ladebedarfe/ Is in German so I used google translate

    The tool combines data on the existing vehicle fleet, the existing recharging infrastructure stock and the transport patterns of German drivers. For each zone, the StandortTool also provides information on how to connect to the medium-voltage grid. In doing so, potential investors can get a first idea of the potential costs of connecting a recharging station to the grid at any given location. The StandortTool can also project future expected needs (with a time horizon of 2022 and 2030).

    Now we know why the likes of Fastned are not going to come here anytime soon. They are given red carpet in other places and we give them red tape.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,319 ✭✭✭zg3409


    Ireland is probably too small for fastned to consider. They tend to go big. ESB also already have a sort of network with relatively low prices, hard to compete with. It would be relatively easy to find out grid connection costs and population density and traffic volumes, and factor in existing chargers. Main issue would be total cost for install.


    In NI grid costs are far higher, which turned off petrol stations and Ionity, there is talk of charging this or subsidising the costs of new high power connections. I forsee chargers located where power lines cross motorways, with a cafe coming along eventually. Big sites are the future, not ones and twos. Grid connection costs are a big part of the cost, but you would also need a motorway exit nearby.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,207 ✭✭✭innrain


    Ireland is probably too small for fastned to consider. They tend to go big.

    In UK Fastned has an average of 3.3 chargers per site across the 7 sites they have opened so far. The overall is 3.7

    It would be relatively easy to find out grid connection costs and population density and traffic volumes, and factor in existing chargers.


    I forsee chargers located where power lines cross motorways, with a cafe coming along eventually. Big sites are the future, not ones and twos. Grid connection costs are a big part of the cost, but you would also need a motorway exit nearby.

    That is the whole point of the German tool. Removes the guess work by providing an open and transparent framework for planing. And that is not exclusive for charging hubs. They also provide data for H2 and CNG/LPG fueling stations. This is showing to all stakeholder where the gaps are. Power grid management company finds that there is a gap in a certain area and plans for it accordingly. The gov finds an area without commercial interest and steps in.

    EU came up with a plan to have a charging station at every 60km by 2025, on major European roads, but they count only >150 kW units. The new ecars hub barley qualifies. Last week there was an article about Applegreen complaining abut the high costs but more about the lengthy waiting times, measured in multiples of years for high power connections to forecourts. These things don't show any planning whatsoever just the opposite. And the whole point is that we are competing to attract these companies here, or at least we should if we are serious about EVs.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,510 ✭✭✭cannco253



    "August was a special month for the European market, as the plug-in sales for the very first time outsold diesel cars!

    In August, EVs and plug-in hybrids outsold their diesel counterparts. This time last year, the volume of EVs was 158,300 units less than diesel car registrations, however last month we saw these EVs outsell diesel vehicles by 10,100 units."



  • Posts: 2,799 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Pretty sure anything with an exhaust is not really EV. Nobody plugs those ph cars in. Puffery for figures



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,648 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    Some definitely do.

    We have work colleagues who make a big fuss about getting a spot on the work charger to charge their PHEVs.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,648 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    Just listening to The Last Word, and apparently the government is going to increase the vrt on evs.

    You couldn't make it up. This government hasn't got a clue.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,005 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    I know it's bad, but am I the only one who was having a bit of a laugh at the fuel queues in the UK and thinking of all the ICE drivers who wouldn't get an EV because they have to queue for a charger?

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,231 ✭✭✭Kramer


    The shoe could well be on the other foot soon, the way things are going here. Sitting at home with a dead car, unable to charge to get to work because the electricity was needed to power a data centre.

    Worse, stuck at an eCars or Ionity hub on the motorway, half way home. No charging available - yep, rolling blackouts.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,005 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    True but I think it's more likely we'll see dramatic jumps in the cost of electricity, more than what we've been getting to date


    Since we don't have a price cap, suppliers can raise prices as much as they want, and there isn't as much competition so unlikely we'll see the rake of energy companies closing down like the UK

    Roll on the Celtic interconnector, get some energy from the continent when the UK decides to cut us off for being a bunch of insolent Paddy's

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



This discussion has been closed.
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