There is no comparison between an infant's full throated primal screech and a coffee grinder.
The average baby's cry has been observed at 130 decibels, the average coffee grinder is 76 decibels.
Sounds above 86 decibels will impair hearing over time. In conclusion many parents how think their spawn make acceptable levels of noise may be already suffering hearing loss.
How is it derogatory? What next, "fruit of my loins" to be banned!
In this post, it is now 'spawn'. You are making your general thoughts about children very clear.
I think your comments where spot on.
If they want peace and quiet a coffee shop is not the place.
Not only kids but theres other people.
Some on their phone [bet they wouldnt have said anything to a 6 foot man]
Some waffling away to their mates and laughing wayyyyyy too loud.
Kids having a whinge is to be expected.I dont agree with being allowed to run wild.
Plus the man sat near you and moaned when he could have sat somewhere else.
Once the kids are under control, not roaring and not legging it about the place coming up to me and the parents saying ah isn’t that cute I’m fine with it.
Same as people who let dogs off leashes in public. It’s not cute that your dog is darting toward me.
And I don’t care how friendly you say it is. If it comes up to me I will kick it. Should be the same with randoms children.
And for what it’s worth I do bring my kids to cafes and restaurants but if they kick up we leave as it’s not fair on others.
Some people bring their kids to the pub for Sunday dinner and let them run around the pub for a few hours. Great parenting.
What are my thoughts on children?
I was a child once and I know children can be loud and excited, what's new about that?
My issue is with parents who think all cafes = creches/playgrounds.
Anyone saying cafes are fair game for romper rooms have probably already sustained hearing loss.
Wow, some of the people in this thread! I always assumed children were allowed make noise because stressed parents had no alternative, but this thread seems to demonstrate that it's because many parents have no consideration for others.
You got me. Case closed on this inconsiderate parent.
This comment is not relevant to my original post. You've questioned the veracity of my post based on some pseudo-psychology and then just made up your own version to suit your own ends.
If you reread my post you responded to I said you needed feedback about your children's impact on others in a non creche/playground scenario.
An inconsiderate parent wouldn't give a toss what anyone thought and certainly wouldn't be looking for feedback.
I think you're conscientious about their behaviour, but you do seem to have some problem with people who've had to endure them.
Playgrounds and creches are designed for kiddies and their excess energies, whereas cafes aren't; although there are cafes that have designated kiddy and parent areas which I approve of very much.
There's a pub in Beaumont that's great for grumpy **** that hate kids being around, the manager is the king of hating on kids.
I've re-read and I'm still not sure what you are saying in that post to be honest.
Nobody had to endure anything. A child making a few noises before being removed by parents.
The problem is many parents consider the high decibel levels they've become inured to as a few noises, but to everyone else it can be highly uncomfortable, be it they reading quietly, or trying to chat with friends without having to raise their voices to be heard above the screeching.
So what you tell us was a few noises was enough to create a reaction from separate tables.
There are ongoing studies examining the hearing damage endured by parents so I won't be surprised if more sound proofed kiddy containment rooms become more popular in cafes.
Do you think pubs should also be designed child screaming areas?
That's really down to the premises in question. I have mixed view on pubs that attempt to be all things to all people. Is it a wateringhole with all the drunken shenanigans that go with it or a family friendly part restaurant.
Same sort of goes for coffee shops. Up to the counter with yer €4.50 coffee and ask for a refund due to the activities of the other patrons. Up to the premises if they want to refund you or eject the problem.
I get that coffee shops aren't fine dining but with drinks costing half a carvery dinner it's sort of a luxury experience.
I'm coming at this from having been a barman, you'd often have people sitting having meals a couple of yards from lads drinking and speaking foully. Yer diner complains, what can ya say to the lads, it's a pub but I'm charging yer man €30 for his steak.
First they came for the socialists...
Thanks for the perspective, but from your own experience would people socialising need ear protection for staff when you consider a toddlers screams can far exceed decibel levels that would require ear protection in any other workplace?
We are coming at this from totally different perspectives and are never going to agree, and to be honest I can't think of anything more ridiculous than wasting time arguing (all debates online end up in arguments) with strangers.
We'll agree to disagree. Take care.
If you're so "hurt and upset" by a random comment like that from a stranger you really need to develop a thicker skin.
That doesn't seem like a reasonable summation of the thread. I was pleasantly surprised to see lots of reasoned debate on both sides. The consensus seems to be that children are fine in cafes as long as their parents are responsible and considerate. As always, there were a few extremists on either side but most people are savvy enough to know not to pay much heed to these.
Why wouldn't they want his business? His money is as good as anyone else's and its not exactly as if there are people queuing up outside for seats.
Kicking a dog isn't cool, its a bad sign of a person who isn't kind to animals.
Would you prefer the adult not interfere when a dog is mauling a child to death?
well done, award for dumbest post of the day goes to you.
Put your damn dog on a leash then. They shouldn’t be coming near me.
I was bitten as a teenager by a dog that was off a leash. Just ran over beside me and bit my ankle.
Wont happen again I’ll tell ya. Control your animal and control your kids. If you can’t don’t go to a public park or cafe respectively.
Have consideration for others.
Anyone who makes snide comments on the side without addressing you directly is a pr!ck irrespective of what your kids were doing.
I'm glad you called them out on it.
We have only the ops word that they're children weren't out of control.
So say it to the parents instead of childish snide comments
Do you include snide comments made to a two year old about "ignorant people in the shop" but meant to be overheard, in that?
Who said anything about kids screaming? The guy is a grouch, gives out to kids for getting off their seats for a minute.
This place has "The Best Carvery in Ireland" (untrue) so there's food served and families eating.
I'm not personally bothered by very young kids making a bit of noise but you can't expect everybody to feel the same.
That said, for some people, any kind of noise from kids is unacceptable even if they tolerate stuff like loud conversation from fellow adult diners.
There's also a lot of idiots that think it's OK to have their kids 'expressing themselves' by tearing around a restaurant or cafe.
My kids are old enough now to behave in places like that but when they were younger, I would absolutely not let them leave the table in a restaurant or cafe and if I felt they were really acting up or being excessively noisy or cranky, I'd just leave.