To Mask or not to two - Mask Megathread cont.

I see you can't actually respond to the points and real world impact in the studies, so you resort to couching your reply with that nonsense and irrelevences.

But in relation to the DM article.

The masks are being worn to contain droplets from nose and mouth, and the effective filtration of cloth masks as a barrier for that purpose is documented earlier in the thread. The cloth masks limit the distance of the droplets and their direct flow... Nobody is saying you're safe with a cloth mask if you are going to be in sustained close contact in a poorly ventilated space, for example.

Multi-layer cloth masks help reduce transmission of virus from an infected person, They block up to 50-70% of fine droplets and particles, and can slow those particles that were not captured. Cloth mask also reduce the wearers' exposure to infectious droplets by filtering fine droplets and particles. Masks with high thread counts work best. While a cloth face mask won't totally block the coronavirus, it’s an added layer of protection for you and the people around you. you should use it along with regular handwashing and social distancing measures like staying 6 feet away from others.

https://www.webmd.com/lung/coronavirus-face-masks#1

Good job to find article on dailymail. But you are still missing the point.

Edit: bastion.....lol

@RealEddieHobbs

Not a word about the Spanish Supreme Court crack down on vaccine passports or the principles behind it. Just more of the same blather as the public is treated to the latest leak from the technocracy as its daily Covid dose.

I would say the study is pro N95 and KN95 masks. Cloth masks filter 10% exhaled aerosol droplets, or to put it another way doesn't filter 90% of them.

And to finish the part you quoted "However, there is a very serious difference in the effectiveness of different masks when it comes to controlling aerosols."

I'm not trying to "sell" anyone anything. Just sad to see the mental damage being done to people by normalising mask wearing i.e. people wearing masks in their cars by themselves, out walking on a beach etc.

What 'mental damage' are you on about. It's already been explained on the thread multiple times why people typically wear a mask in a car or outside walking to\from\between shops. It's so they can fit the mask once properly and not taking it on and off again.

On a beach someone might be wearing it for the wind and sand or allergies as much as an abundance of caution about the virus.

You are the one expending mental energy on it, if you want to talk about who is 'damaged' by it.

Basic knowledge is like following the science!

Someone has to. A lot of people tossed it out of the window and lap up every scare story they hear. Some people even think that cloth or surgical face mask will save them from getting covid.

But then again, firm belief may be useful. Primarily for mental health as placebo sometimes works too.

OK, in the post I was referring to. you said:

You really should realize that if you are not over 80 years and 100 kilograms and in relative good health, getting vaccine or going around masked is not going to make any difference. 

This is a lie. It has nothing to do with the results in the study you linked to.

You also said:

Masks and vaccines may make a sense for some vulnerable people who simply will have to somehow shield themselves from just one more disease.

Which means that even a year and a half into Covid you have still not understood that the purpose of masks is not to protect the person who wears it. Or, you have understood it, and are deliberately spreading misinformation. Also, obviously, nothing to do with the study.

People with just basic knowledge about how immune system work would not compromise their health by extensive mask wearing.

Insinuating that mask wearing 'compromises the health' is a lie.

Now, regarding the study. The key piece of information is in the first sentence of the Results section:

SARS-CoV-2-naïve vaccinees had a 13.06-fold (95% CI, 8.08 to 21.11) increased risk for breakthrough infection with the Delta variant compared to those previously infected, when the first event (infection or vaccination) occurred during January and February of 2021.

This means, it is referring only to the Delta variant. And finds exactly what you would expect, that for the extremely rare case of breakthrough infections, someone who was infected with Delta naturally is less likely to get it than someone vaccinated.

It does not address being naturally infected with a pre-Delta variant vs. vaccination - which is the majority of Covid variants.

It does not question the efficacy of vaccines in protecting from Covid infection.

It does recommend vaccination on top of natural infection, for an additional improvement in protection:

Individuals who were both previously infected with SARS-CoV-2 and given a single dose of the vaccine gained additional protection against the Delta variant.

OK, to summarise: we have a meaningful, well intentioned study that looks at - extremely rare - cases of break through infections which occur both after being previously infected and being vaccinated. The study compares previous infection vs. vaccination, and find that with previous infection with the same variant, breakthrough is less common. It is a retrospective observational study, which means it looks at existing statistical data, and draws conclusions from those.

And, we have antivaxxers who deliberately misinterpret the study, to promote their idiotic antivax narrative. Which is an increasingly common disinformation tactic.

If natural gained immunity is the best, why not wear a mask so that somebody doesn't get it as bad and they still get immunity?

Because if you are not sick this whole "protecting others" is just woke nonsense and if you are sick stay home in bed. It is that simple. Craziness of this whole argument was shown when we found that asymptomatic do not infect others so mask lovers had to invent new scare - so called pre-symptomatic people.

I do not care if you wear a mask or not it is entirely up to you and if you like to wear one, if it make you feel better, go for it.

I do not like to wear them as they make my condition worse so I steer clear. I do use one only when absolute necessary for like 5 min I am able to tolerate it.

If people stay home when sick, it's easier to isolate people and control spread.

Increasing cases suggest people aren't staying at home. A year and a half into this, people cannot be that thick. So this suggests asymptomatic spread. It's that simple.

What about vaccinated people with the same viral load as an unvaccinated person? This means they can spread covid just as much as an unvaccinated person.

So you don't want to think about the person beside you on the bus who might be immunocompromised?

No masks and bar service last night in the pub I was in, great to see that once they are not longer a legal requirement, most people won't be wearing one.