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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,787 ✭✭✭mohawk


    Down the line there could be a need for vaccines that give ‘sterilising immunity’ (so there would be no transmission from vaccinated people). Think Smallpox vaccine as an example. The uneven distribution of vaccines worldwide could potentially backfire on those countries that have vaccines rolled out.

    Other thing to remember is that humans haven’t been wiped out by a virus yet. No epidemic or pandemic has ever lasted forever. They burn out by either mutating or running out of hosts. This looks like it will be endemic so we could all end up getting it a few times in our lives. It’s not all doom and gloom. Humans are resilient and eventually we will all just get on with it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 467 ✭✭nj27


    Why would you relax restrictions - add more!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,549 ✭✭✭Raoul Duke III


    Apologies if already covered.

    Now that the FDA has moved from 'emergency use' authorisation of Pfizer to full authorisation of it, this provides cover for employers to mandate vaccine coverage for employees. I see for the example the US Department of Defence (1.4 million employees) is doing this.

    My question is (without debating whether it is a good idea or not), could an Irish employer now do the same? i.e. make provision of a vaccine cert by the employee a term of employment. Anyone know what the legal position is if an employer did take this stance?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,682 ✭✭✭Penfailed


    Numerous unvaccinated young people dying from the virus? Depends what you call 'young' I suppose.

    Gigs '24 - Ben Ottewell and Ian Ball (Gomez), The Jesus & Mary Chain, The Smashing Pumpkins/Weezer, Pearl Jam, Green Day, Stendhal Festival, Forest Fest, Electric Picnic, Pixies, Ride, Therapy?, Public Service Broadcasting, IDLES, And So I Watch You From Afar

    Gigs '25 - Spiritualized, Supergrass, Stendhal Festival, Forest Fest, Queens of the Stone Age, Electric Picnic, Vantastival, And So I Watch You From Afar



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,448 ✭✭✭✭namloc1980


    Nah. Our data protection, discrimination and labour laws are much stronger than in the US.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,993 ✭✭✭Captain_Crash


    In a word, no! Discrimination laws prevent it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 461 ✭✭HerrKapitan


    There seems to be no mention of keeping or removing the vaccine cert after Christmas on this new road map plan, going on quotes from government ministers

    They are strongly hinting at keeping masks, while saying tgey are lifting all restrictions. It doesn't appear that mask and certs are considered 'restrictions'.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Yes, they are increasingly trying to normalise masks and to make people believe that they are not a restriction. Holohan tweeting recently that they were now 'second nature' to most people, Nolan saying mask wearing and social distancing would need to be maintained post-vaccination. Masks were always meant to be permanent, in my opinion.


    And Macron, who rolled out the appalling health pass in France, is in town for meetings. I imagine the health pass will be discussed during those meetings.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,808 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian



    Generally no, many healthcare workers got vaccinated at their workplaces back in January/February so there is likely a record of it there with their employers. There was also talk that an un-vaccinated healthcare worker would not be put in charge of the care of a vulnerable person but I'm not sure if it amounted to anything



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I agree, but it's not the virus I'm worried about, but rather the reaction to it. The virus may become similar to a cold, but governments don't like to surrender power(s).



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,808 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    Give it time... The announcement won't be until Tuesday

    Restrictions involving masks probably have the least impact on our day-to-day lives so will probably be the last to go



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,017 ✭✭✭DarkJager21


    There needs to be an end date for the mask requirement, simply no question about it. People can be free to wear them if they want to but they should no longer be considered mandatory. Give people a date and tell the unvaccinated to get sorted before then as there will be no further societal protection from masks past that point.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    That last there with crowds had Dublin in them and there were well over 40,000 at them but otherwise 40,000 would be a good ceiling for it.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    He said: “We’re going to be living with some level of mask-wearing.”

    Note: some level, not current level. This has been pointed out before



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    The prospect of restrictions easing further is really driving come people crazy



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,808 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    There are more important restrictions than masks to be removed, pregnancy scans and the hour limit of new fathers are the big ones that come to mind



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,017 ✭✭✭DarkJager21


    Totally agree but the maternity hospitals seem to be a law on to themselves in regards to restrictions. I've been there myself, had our first child in November last year and I didn't get to attend any of the scans or milestone checks - literally allowed in the morning she was moved to labour ward and thrown out about an hour after the birth.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,215 ✭✭✭Spudman_20000




  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Why any level?


    More hinting at them being permanent: "The vaccine is really effective, but it should still be considered as just one measure amongst a number.”" (Vaccines not a ‘magic shield’ against Covid-19 infection - De Gascun (irishtimes.com))



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,549 ✭✭✭Raoul Duke III


    Thanks - although I'm not thinking specifically of health workers, but rather any workers.

    e.g. if a US tech multinational mandated vaccines for its Irish employees, or a chain of Irish fashion stores, or a pub...or just about any employer you can think of.

    The response seems to be 'legally, you can't' which is what I was trying to understand. Thanks for all the responses.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,808 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    That is genuinely horrible... We hear so much about how hospitality, live events and mask wearers are suffering but it really pales in comparison to stories like this



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,582 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Then why keep harping on about Professor Nolan as if he is the only person in authority worldwide that has said vaccines will not eradicate the virus ? Nobody has ever claimed they would. Not from the companies who developed the vaccines too the regulatory bodies who verified their efficacy or anyone else.

    Around 95% of the population vaccinated is pie in the sky. In all probability those that cannot avail off a vaccine is higher than 5%, let alone those that refuse to for whatever their reasoning. On mask-wearing the only specific mention by Professor Nolan going forward was in relation to public transport where he said he believed it was only good manners. I have already said why similar to flu season I agree with him. I have not had my personal experience lessened by wearing one on public transport and I fail to see how anybody`s would be either. I haven`t seen vast numbers on there eating their lunches. unlike the claim regarding bookies premises made here some time ago by a poster.

    Mask-wearing is primarily about protecting others. While I would not be greatly worried about those that refuse to avail of a vaccine, even outside of it being just good manners on public transport, if it`s a help to those unable to avail then I do not see it as any great imposition on my freedoms.

    This whole palaver here over "loss of freedoms" in Ireland I have never got. Do some believe it`s some kind of cunning Black Adder like plan by the Irish authorities to establish North Korean type control over the Irish population, or have they not actually noticed that during this pandemic the same "loss of freedoms" have been virtually world-wide. If they have noticed, then other than it being a world-wide conspiracy by governments to follow this cunning plan for other than North Korean like objectives then I do not see what it`s purpose could possibly be. Especially not when attempting to achieve it causes so much problems for their economies.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 786 ✭✭✭foxsake


    where was the mistake?

    The CSO numbers were quoted - I don't have linking rights yet so you'll have to look them up yourself.

    the poster said numerous deaths of young people from the virus. yet the cso stats say under 25 years old that is zero



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 461 ✭✭HerrKapitan


    Your last sentence is correct, they are putting that in place, or at least inferring that they will. I think it will be a logistical nightmare given the roster struggles in hospitals in normal times.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,808 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    Yeah all the above employers can ask (freedom of speech) but no employee in any of your cases is obliged to give an answer because of our data protection rules



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,004 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    Ah but......If you own or have connections to a Company manufacturing or importing "Face Coverings" then you will certainly have great concern about the health of the General Public (your customers) 😉

    It's all academic anyway,as the GAA have obviously had a Holohan memo landed on their Laptop over their "Lack of Leadership" in enforcing Facemask rules on the VAST numbers of their attendees who thankfully were perfectly entitled to sat "Thanks for that advice Tony,but no thanks all the same,beggin your pardon Sir ".

    Quite why the NATIONAL BROADCASTER had to chase down a former GAA President is ,as yet,unexplained in the article....but hey-ho any port in a storm 🙄 https://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2021/0826/1242918-collective-leadership-needed-on-masks-at-croke-park/

    Ex President O'Neill does appear to have a particular view of his Customers,who have I suppose Purchased their tickets in a commercial transaction,as opposed to participating in some black-magic ritual in which Tickets were given to the best dressed Warlock/Witch ?

    "We need to start having a reflective message that people who are privileged to go to these games have a responsibility. It's not too much to ask anybody to wear a mask.

    "We (the GAA) have a reputation for doing the right thing, we just need to be reminded that we need to keep doing it".

    O'Neill said that a message should be emailed to all ticket holders, reminding them to wear a mask and be followed up on.

    Mr O'Neill urged "collective leadership" whereby people at the matches should urge others to wear a mask and be responsible.


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 999 ✭✭✭Stormyteacup


    I’m not so sure. Healthcare have reasons for only allowing vaccinated to perform certain roles, and unvaccinated will be repositioned and not dismissed, and vaccinated and unvaccinated employees will still presumably mingle in canteens etc.

    But for large multi-nationals that may not need employees in the office, it’s a grey area I think, and as we’ve seen laws can be introduced pretty swiftly and accepted widely if they’re billed as being in the interests of maximising safety.

    Why couldn’t Google or Facebook decide that for new hires vaccination is required for any role that would necessitate office time, face to face meetings or travel (considering quarantine requirements for vaccinated vs unvaccinated, which will be in place in some countries for a long time). Some roles require a full clean driving license, so if you’ve a disability that precludes you from driving, you are ineligible. You don’t need to disclose the nature of your disability but the job is off-limits anyway.

    Could a large multi corp not just phrase the role/contract in a certain way that immediately disqualifies anyone unvaccinated, without directly asking and without requiring personal information being disclosed?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 481 ✭✭mariab21


    Nonsense all ireland hurling final last week 40k

    Football semi final this week 24k

    Football final next week 40k

    Why is 40k not safe this weekend? Is it because half them coming from a diff country, that cant be the reason as if they win why will 40k still be allowed at the final.

    700 people are allowed attend UCDs cup game tonight, 400 are allowed attend Bohs cup game Sunday. Both have only 1 stand (rest ground not fit for purpose) and Bohs stand holds double the amount that UCD does.

    Make sense of it all?

    What exactly have they being learning from these pilot events, no testing, no way of knowing who is at them etc... Its all nonsense



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,582 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    With the return to full capacity for public transport social distancing will be gone so face mask will be basically the only restriction left for public transport with likely a recommendation for crowded areas. Going from a pandemic to that I for one would not look on as a great loss of my freedoms.

    How this master-plan of the government to exert totalitarian control using just face-masks is going to work is a puzzler though.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,017 ✭✭✭DarkJager21


    its just another measure that the government will drag their heels on when there isn’t any further need for it with the vaccination rates. I wouldn’t put it past them to try and keep it in place over the winter not for covid reasons but to again try and cover the ass of the health service they have supposedly been “upgrading” for the last 18 months.



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