Brexit discussion thread XIV (Please read OP before posting)

If the Scottish SNP say they are unhappy and want another referendum, because of the English overruling their own Brexit vote, we all know the UK government won't change their mind to allow it, so what makes you think they would renegotiate anything?

Der Spiegel suggest in an article that Johnson and Frost are simply trying to get rid of the Protocol : undermine it bit by bit with the hope that it no longer exists in a couple of years.

The "renegotiation" is clearly a nonsense. They view the Protocol as an affront and are trying to worm their way out of it.

It's hard to figure this one out. Most English people seem completely disinterested in the Protocol story - the only people you ever hear commenting on it and complaining about it regularly are the cranks who write for the Daily Telegraph (but those guys attack the EU for a living).

Whats probably eating up the UK government is they probably feel a bit robbed, all of Boris's bluster about the NIP being invisible basically relied on him getting an amazing UK-EU trade deal. IF the trade deal was more extensive and way more in the UK's favour then the NIP would have been invisible as he promised, but they completely floundered the trade deal and when that flatlined it turned the NIP into a problem. He basically overpromised on one with the expectation he was going to win big in the following negotiation.

It's almost like a gambling addiction.

And considering we've seen similar gambles from him in relation to Covid, I'm kinda concerned that I'm still in the UK.

Why? As a British citizen, what difference would it make to your life for the EU to change Johnson's oven-ready deal? What is it about GB->NI exports that has such a disruptive effect on your life that you want to see it changed now, six months after Johnson proclaimed it to be such a great victory? And why is it important for you to have six of Ireland's 32 counties kept in the "United" Kingdom, at such an enormous financial cost to GB (the equivalent, per annum, as the UK's membership of the EU)? It's your taxes that are paying to prop up NI's economy - what value are you getting for your money?

As sausages seem to be a baseline for you argument then are those produced in NI not British?

I'm sure unionist pig farmers of NI will be interested in your assignation.

Are they not central to complaint?

In fairness I did become a fan of a good venison cumberland sausage when I lived in inglaterra, son muy buenos!

Far from Cumberland's you were raised. I'm speaking of the big standard banger.

It'd be like moving from Ireland to Italy and putting a dollop of Italian butter on your Italian steak. 🤷

Bangers d'Inglaterra are generally woeful.

You are right, I did find the standard of food there subpar compared to Ireland, but thankfully Lidl and Aldi stocked a lot of Irish produce.

It pointless getting into an argument of NI belonging where. It is currently, and its citizens are happy to continue, as part of the UK.

What any of us think is irrelevant.

What is relevant is the GB felt it completely acceptable to sign the NIP, and all it entails, as a price worth paying for Brexit.

What is ironic is that the unionists, those that want to he ruled by GB, are now demanding that both the democratic will of the people of the UK, along with decision of their own government, is overturned simply because they don't like it.

They have ended up supporting a regime that has used them as a bargaining chip.

The British were really the Brythonic Celts who lived in what is today England historically prior to the coming of the Normans. They were largely pushed into Cornwall and what is today Wales by the Angles and Saxons prior to the arrival of the Normans. As a result of that I always found it very strange they called themselves British.

I guess the only legitimate aspiration is Unionism so?

It really showed in the 2016 euros in France where English fans were taking over bars stopping non English from entering. It's like a recreational imperialism matched only by Russian hooligans during that tournament. The mentally of an Englishman is never a foreigner abroad is pure Victorian era supremacy.

I guess the point I'm making is that if the union really 'was' cherished, the England fans would boo all visiting teams but make an exception for the Scots as they see them as brothers and sisters. Instead, they were treated as if they were as 'foreign' as all the continental sides. In the context of Brexit and the whole UK leaving the EU, the sight of Scotland being booed was a striking one.

Which also raises the question of what the Scots are supposed to think when they see and hear that. It does have shades of the former Yugoslavia in the period before it began to break up.

The Scots would have fully expected to be booed at Wembley - I'm not sure though I see much difference between Brexit UK and the former Yugoslavia in the years before the break up. Relations between England and the devolved nations genuinely 'are' pretty bad (thanks mainly to the election of an English nationalist government at Westminster with a huge majority).