Smart Tariff Unit Rates

SD_DRACULA · 28-06-2021 1:26pm #1

Let's compile a list of "smart tariffs" as this sounds like something everyone will need when switching suppliers

Is it just me or this is nowhere near as good as the standard night/day rate meters?

The night rate is expensive enough and apparently there's also a Paek rate where it gets even more expensive.

This is for BordGais which I am currently with, using an Urban 24 hour tariff where my unit rate is 14.94c/kw (VAT inc) but I am at the end of my contract and need to probably move.

One very strange thing that I was told is that once you move to a Smart Tariff, you CAN'T EVER go back to the non-smart tariffs, i.e. the 24hr one.

There's more things to take into account, like std charges which are not the same, etc.

Absolute nonsense if you ask me as this is the whole point of the smart meter but just looks like a way to get you ripped off even more as these rates are not great at all.

SD_DRACULA · 28-06-2021 1:58pm

Energia's smart tariff

And yes you have to have their own battery to qualify for their Grid tariff (the FIT one, that pays 7c/kw exported), I think they also mention €14,000 for 2kwp and 4.8kw battery system - what an absolute joke

Calahonda52 · 28-06-2021 2:25pm

whats an affinity code discount?
where is their low night rate for e-cars?

I presume this is only with folk with a smart meter, maybe best called a gouge meter

Dudda · 28-06-2021 2:30pm

SD_DRACULA wrote: »

Energia's smart tariff

You've a 38% discount shown?
If you select via Bonkers.ie saying you've a smart meter it gives you this option from Energia which says it has a 41% discount. It also doesn't have a peak rate.
Unit rate inc VAT (cent/kWh)
15.55 cent (day rate)
7.46 cent (night rate)

SD_DRACULA · 28-06-2021 2:32pm

Airtricity

SD_DRACULA · 28-06-2021 2:36pm

Dudda wrote: »

You've a 38% discount shown?
If you select via Bonkers.ie saying you've a smart meter it gives you this option from Energia which says it has a 41% discount. It also doesn't have a peak rate.
Unit rate inc VAT (cent/kWh)
15.55 cent (day rate)
7.46 cent (night rate)

Yeah that's the old non-smart tariff rate (two meters) which is way way better than the smart ones.

Calahonda52 wrote: »

I presume this is only with folk with a smart meter, maybe best called a gouge meter

100% - can we not cry to the EU or something because these prices are shockingly bad.

loyatemu · 28-06-2021 2:39pm

SD_DRACULA wrote: »

Airtricity

wow, why would anyone choose the smart option?

mp3guy · 28-06-2021 3:52pm

Pretty grim looking. The savings from PV amplified even more...

irishchris · 28-06-2021 3:56pm

The worst part is the extortionate standing charges. They were already ridiculous but massively increased for smart plans along with the rates

SD_DRACULA · 28-06-2021 3:56pm

I am assuming for FIT you will be forced to pick a smart tariff which will make it useless - time to stock up on batteries.

The worst part is the extortionate standing charges. They were already ridiculous but massively increased for smart plans along with the rates

Yes, usually €50 more as if they're doing you a favour with the horrendous Smart fees.
I spoke to someone in Energia today asking them about the smart tariffs and they told me to stay well away from them
But with their 41/39% standard tariff from Bonkers is still one of the best ones around, even with higher standing charges.

Bobeagleburger · 28-06-2021 7:49pm

Looks like I'll be refusing a smart meter until forced to get one! You'll be much better staying with an old meter than FIT if those prices are true.

I'm paying 14.86 a unit after VAT so unless it's a very generous FIT it's pointless.

SD_DRACULA · 28-06-2021 8:51pm

Well I think I am getting one in the next week or two but will probably choose to stay on the 24hr tariff for a while.
Looks like the day/night meters are the better value

graememk · 28-06-2021 9:00pm

SD_DRACULA wrote: »

Well I think I am getting one in the next week or two but will probably choose to stay on the 24hr tariff for a while.
Looks like the day/night meters are the better value

Been saying that all along!

slave1 · 28-06-2021 10:34pm

+1, stay way from Smart Meters until we know more

dloob · 29-06-2021 12:55am

With Energia at least the smart rates have a standing charge that is about 50 lower for the year than the day night meter.
But if you are charging an EV at night you won't be long paying that back and more with the higher night unit rate.

SD_DRACULA · 29-06-2021 10:41am

dloob wrote: »

With Energia at least the smart rates have a standing charge that is about 50 lower for the year than the day night meter.
But if you are charging an EV at night you won't be long paying that back and more with the higher night unit rate.

The EV rate is only for day/night meter which I assume you can't get once you have the "smart" meter

irishchris · 29-06-2021 12:24pm

dloob wrote: »

With Energia at least the smart rates have a standing charge that is about 50 lower for the year than the day night meter.
But if you are charging an EV at night you won't be long paying that back and more with the higher night unit rate.

Their smart price plan has a standing charges of 198 euro for urban which means at least 30 euro more for rural. At the minute I'm paying 149 euro for rural standing charges with flogas for electricity only. So that 80 euro more for standing charges alone before taking in new extortionate rates which would buy a lot of electricity

dloob · 29-06-2021 3:26pm

irishchris wrote: »

Their smart price plan has a standing charges of 198 euro for urban which means at least 30 euro more for rural. At the minute I'm paying 149 euro for rural standing charges with flogas for electricity only. So that 80 euro more for standing charges alone before taking in new extortionate rates which would buy a lot of electricity

Energia go with lower rates and higher standing charges.
Their standard urban 24hr meter standing charge is 198, with day/night meter being 248.
Those are the urban rates, rural are 250 and 315.
The standing charges aren't smart meter specific, the crappy unit rates are though.

jkforde · 30-06-2021 7:39pm

SD_DRACULA wrote: »

Energia's smart tariff

And yes you have to have their own battery to qualify for their Grid tariff (the FIT one, that pays 7c/kw exported), I think they also mention €14,000 for 2kwp and 4.8kw battery system - what an absolute joke

This is too funny if it wasn't so insulting... see the attached Word doc... Energia's 4 smart plans are virtually identical. Will be switching from them in Jan 2022 and never going back to them.

(I briefly considered emailing them but what really is the point, if you don't get an AI Bot, you get generic replies from the human bots)

CRU complaint email: QCSOfficer@cru.ie (https://www.cru.ie/home/about-cru/customer-action-plan/#cru-complaints-procedure)
Irish Times Price Watch: pricewatch@irishtimes.com (https://www.irishtimes.com/news/consumer)
minister.ryan@decc.gov.ie

TheWonderLlama · 01-07-2021 9:49am

Iberdrola smart tariffs: (all VAT inclusive)

Green online saver 26 24hr smart:
Unit rate (24h) 18.19¢
Annual standing charge (Urban)€208.00
Annual standing charge (Rural)€248.81
Public service obligation levy€88.80
Exit fees€50.00

Green online saver 26 standard smart tariff:
Unit rate (Day: 08:00 - 23:00) excluding peak 19.59¢
Unit rate (Night: 23:00 - 08:00) 10.56¢
Unit rate (Peak: 17:00 - 19:00) 23.96¢
Annual standing charge (Urban) €208.00
Annual standing charge (Rural) €248.81
Public service obligation levy €88.80
Exit fees €50.00

Green online saver 26 weekend smart
Unit rate (Monday - Friday: 24hr) 18.41¢
Unit rate (Saturday & Sunday: 24hr) 17.65¢
Annual standing charge (Urban)€208.00
Annual standing charge (Rural) €248.81
Public service obligation levy €88.80
Exit fees €50.00

Calahonda52 · 01-07-2021 11:11am

so is the energia special rate for ev owners gone?

SD_DRACULA · 01-07-2021 3:05pm

It is still the but hidden away very nicely, you need to select standard not smart tariffs and go to page 2 using the arrows. The site is quite poor

Alkers · 01-07-2021 4:30pm

Are all the energy price increases which are being announced, also applying to the smart meter policies?

jkforde · 01-07-2021 5:06pm

Calahonda52 wrote: »

so is the energia special rate for ev owners gone?

the EV plan is not a smart plan, only available with the D\N meter afaik

Calahonda52 · 01-07-2021 5:20pm

jkforde wrote: »

the EV plan is not a smart plan, only available with the D\N meter afaik

yep need to get the d/n before they stuff me with a smart!

SD_DRACULA · 06-07-2021 11:15am

Not smart meter charges but Electric Ireland seem to have the lowest standing charges but expensive unit rates so I'm not sure if makes sense to go with them VS Energia with their lower unit rates but ridiculous standing charges, 234 elec and 123 gas
Good months with the PV won't matter but afraid of their winter shafting
Also it looks like their hikes are not factored in yet.

slave1 · 06-07-2021 11:43am

Prices only going one way, Energia were good but by Thursday this week they'll have had a 19% increase in a little over 3months.

TheWonderLlama · 06-07-2021 12:14pm

It really annoys me that they tie you in for 12 months and then raise the prices without you being allowed to change supplier.

If a broadband or phone provider changes the terms of the contract, you get to walk away. I'll never understand why utilities providers are allowed to get away with this.

SD_DRACULA · 06-07-2021 12:30pm

That variable rate contract is a joke, basically you're just supposed to take the hits whether you like it or not

slave1 wrote: »

Prices only going one way, Energia were good but by Thursday this week they'll have had a 19% increase in a little over 3months.

Good to know, I'll hang back and see what they do. Also on bonkers their standing charges are higher than if you go via their site.

unkel · 06-07-2021 12:49pm

TheWonderLlama wrote: »

It really annoys me that they tie you in for 12 months and then raise the prices without you being allowed to change supplier.

Not sure what you mean. I signed up with Energia for a new contract a few months ago and my unit prices are fixed for the year. 4.8c / kWh night and 16.8c / kWh day. Both including VAT

Alkers · 06-07-2021 1:32pm

TheWonderLlama wrote: »

It really annoys me that they tie you in for 12 months and then raise the prices without you being allowed to change supplier.

If a broadband or phone provider changes the terms of the contract, you get to walk away. I'll never understand why utilities providers are allowed to get away with this.

There are fixed price contracts available also, I think you can filter by this on bonkers.ie

SD_DRACULA · 06-07-2021 2:00pm

Alkers wrote: »

There are fixed price contracts available also, I think you can filter by this on bonkers.ie

Not sure that's true 100% of the ones I can see are variable rate

slave1 · 06-07-2021 2:22pm

unkel wrote: »

Not sure what you mean. I signed up with Energia for a new contract a few months ago and my unit prices are fixed for the year. 4.8c / kWh night and 16.8c / kWh day. Both including VAT

They're increasing the standing charge on you though....ba$t@rd$

KCross · 06-07-2021 7:08pm

unkel wrote: »

Not sure what you mean. I signed up with Energia for a new contract a few months ago and my unit prices are fixed for the year. 4.8c / kWh night and 16.8c / kWh day. Both including VAT

Most plans are variable though. I think thats his point. And they can up those prices with no more than 30 days notice and you are stuck with the increased price until the end of the 12 months (or take the hit of the termination fee) whether you like it or not.

Energia still have the one fixed rate plan that you got. All the rest are variable.

That one fixed rate plan has got alot more expensive though... 20.28/5.84 for day/night inc vat and an increased standing charge.

You'd need to be very sure of keeping your day usage down to go for that plan now considering their normal variable plan is 15.55/7.46 for day/night and cheaper standing charge.

irishchris · 06-07-2021 7:45pm

KCross wrote: »

Most plans are variable though. I think thats his point. And they can up those prices with no more than 30 days notice and you are stuck with the increased price until the end of the 12 months (or take the hit of the termination fee) whether you like it or not.

Energia still have the one fixed rate plan that you got. All the rest are variable.

That one fixed rate plan has got alot more expensive though... 20.28/5.84 for day/night inc vat and an increased standing charge.

You'd need to be very sure of keeping your day usage down to go for that plan now considering their normal variable plan is 15.55/7.46 for day/night and cheaper standing charge.

Switched few weeks back to flogas for electricity. Still low standing charge around the same as Electric Ireland but with slightly better unit rates.

irishchris · 15-07-2021 7:19am

Good to have boards back 😀

Just got call yesterday to say they are installing smart meter on Monday. I'm assuming can stay on legacy electricity plan for remainder of contract as only recently signed up to new 12 month plan

Bobeagleburger · 15-07-2021 7:23am

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117611497#Comment_117611497

I would assume so as you are contracted?

If you don't want it installed yet you can refuse it too.

irishchris · 15-07-2021 7:47am

Tried to refuse it but was told all are being installed by law to be fitted everywhere by 2024. Didn't see the point in stopping it if more than likely going to have to have it it in any way in the next 2.5 years as may as well get the measly fit out of them in the meantime if they ever introduce it

SD_DRACULA · 15-07-2021 11:02am

Yeah they're supposed to come install it today for me too.

Just have to be smart and not use any of the smart tariffs but I suspect the 24hr ones will go away once everyone is on "smart" meters

graememk · 15-07-2021 11:07am

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117611583#Comment_117611583

Get a request in for a day/night in the meantime!

irishchris · 18-07-2021 1:45pm

I noticed electric Ireland have a smart meter own with 10c night rate and just under 6c between 2-4am. Their day rate is extortionate though unfortunately. Makes sense to start looking at drphils lifepo4 AliExpress batteries more now as at those night rates in winter it would make sense to store it for daytime use

slave1 · 18-07-2021 4:53pm

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117611583#Comment_117611583

Have a search here, you can refuse, it's been covered and confirmed by the Gov.

I'll be 100% refusing

irishchris · 18-07-2021 9:51pm

From what I'm reading though you can still keep your existing non smart plans on the smart meters

SD_DRACULA · 19-07-2021 9:32am

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117629644#Comment_117629644

Yes as long as you don't switch to a smart plan, apparently you can't ever change back if you do, the cheek of them...

Smart meter went in last week, waiting on garbage fit plans now...

Bobeagleburger · 19-07-2021 12:04pm

Are people willingly switching to a smart meter?

You can refuse one as I don't see any any benefit. It's far more beneficial to keep your old meter.

SD_DRACULA · 19-07-2021 2:18pm

Well it is required for FIT so might as well (won't be going to a smart tariff however, they are all useless)

Looks like Bordgais have the cheapest electricity rate but I called them and they said prices going up next month by 11% so not as good after

Their smart one is a lot more (about to be higher after 8th August)

KCross · 19-07-2021 5:00pm

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117629644#Comment_117629644

I think that depends.... if you are currently on a 24hr plan I think you can keep that. If you are on a day/night plan you cant (for now).

The Smart meter plans we have seen so far are a bad deal for the consumer. I wont be taking a smart meter until I see more competitive plans and we see more detail on FiT.

Darc19 · 19-07-2021 5:12pm

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117602382#Comment_117602382

not necessarily. The market has suggested oil and gas is at a peak. Gas is now twice the price of last July. Fracking companies are back at full steam and market is showing signs of over supply again on oil and gas. Oil prices are falling back from multi year highs, gas usually follows oil price trends, so hopefully we'll see the start of a downtrend as oil and gas prices feed into inflation and governments around the world want to avoid inflation.

Darc19 · 19-07-2021 5:22pm

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117631578#Comment_117631578

Where's the issue?

I have smart meters in 3 properties - 2 residential, 1 business. No more estimated bills. 100% accurate and now options of lower prices depending on the usage profile.

there are some eejits who believe sensationalist media bull that ran stories on "major issues" with the early 1st generation - in very very few cases there was some conflict with some led bulbs (the dimmable ones that hardly anyone uses). That was about 5-6 years ago.

2nd Generation meters are used by ESB. They never used the 1st generation ones. 2nd generation are 100% accurate and there have been zero reports for the conspiracy theorists to work themselves up with - so they simply moved to a new subject for their anti whatever cravings

Sarn · 19-07-2021 5:24pm

We’ve had a smart meter for the past year. Still on the standard 24 hour plans (never had a day/night meter). The smart plans are appalling value based on our usage, so won’t be switching over to them anytime soon.

KCross · 19-07-2021 5:41pm

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117633549#Comment_117633549

If you are on a 24hr rate and you get a smart meter and stay on the same 24hr rate then its all good... as you said more accurate readings and additional features around being able to see when power is being used.

However, In the context of this renewable forum I think alot of people would be focussing on day/night rates and Solar integration etc and the smart meter plans they are currently offering there are very poor value and not conspiracy theory or sensationalist at all.

To cut to the chase... if getting a smart meter results in an increased bill then you should refuse it as long as you can.

Smart Tariff Unit Rates

Comments