People with a funny idea of the rules of the road.

lawred2 · 12-06-2021 9:54pm

Jeremy Sproket wrote: »

Yesterday, I was driving northbound on the M1. A car was joining from a slip road.

I was driving at 100 km/h.

I kept my pace. He was joining at the same speed as me and showed no sign of speeding up or slowing down to join in ahead or behind me. There was a stream of cars overtaking me at 120 km/h ++ (I was keeping left at 100 km/h).

If I didn't slow down we would have collided with the slower merger but as I slowed down, so did he, I was expecting him to go in on front of me as he was trying to push his way in. I ended up slowing to 40 km/h because he was merging on front of me and slowing down causing traffic behind to swerve to avoid us. He pushed in on front us at a snails pace and sped up to 80 km/h approx. I was unable to change lanes because at this stage there was even CE lorries in the overtaking lane because of the clown.

I overtook him and moved back left and continued at 100 km/h in the left lane.

We left the motorway at the same exit and he caught up to me at traffic lights, he gestured to wind down my window and said that "you have to give way to traffic joining a motorway" ..this is bullshit isn't it?

He said I should be thankful he doesn't have a dashcam because if he did he'd be reporting me to the Gardaí. He told me to learn the rules of the road. LOL

I passed B in Sweden and had to do motorway lessons, I passed A and D1 here and no motorway lessons. Do you have to do motorway lessons for B here?

When I started driving here at 19 almost 10 years ago I took it upon myself to learn any discrepancies there may be between Irish and Swedish rules of the road.

To be honest with you.. while that driver merging was making a mess of matters, why weren't you in the middle lane? It's good practice to move out to the middle lane when there is traffic merging into the left hand lane.

What's your insistence on traveling so far under the limit may I ask? Are you limited?

lawred2 · 12-06-2021 10:01pm

sumo12 wrote: »

This is MY rule - if someone is coming down the slip road to join the motorway and they do not indicate and just assume they are going to make me vanish so they can merge, I will under no circumstances let them join the motorway. Doubt that's in any Rule of the Road but it's in the common courtesy / etiquette imaginary one...

That's a great rule. And when you're picking yourselves out of your crashed cars, you can measure each others dicks.

tDw6u1bj · 12-06-2021 10:04pm

Spook_ie wrote: »

My sig shows cyclists the correct use of hand signals (if you think that's making fun then shame on you) not the pointing at the road for 0.75 seconds that seems to be the norm for right/left turns and the non existant use of the signal for slowing or stopping

Nah, definite notes of sarcasm there...also not really the place for an effective PSA.

Either way, no sense of irony at all...no?

Mimon · 12-06-2021 10:08pm

Jacksie66. wrote: »

A N plate driver nearly got me killed last week. Was on a bit of road that's a small bit bendy but nothing major. She was crawling along at 50kmph when the limit was 80. Came to a straight stretch and she was still doing 50, maybe touching 60. I decided to overtake her. As I was I could see a car in the distance coming in my direction but very far away and in no danger. As I was just passing this lady's driver door she put the boot down and floored it. I couldn't believe what she was doing. I should have been well in and past this car when I got worried about the oncoming car. I managed to get in and it was a very close shave. What goes through people's minds in this situation? Could have caused a serious crash. Driving for 50kmph for miles beforehand but when I go to overtake they floor it...

That has happened me twice, scarey and crazy thing to do. First time had a car with very little poke so had to abort the overtake.

Can't figure it out, is it that their ego will be bruised if someone overtakes them even though they were initially driving slow?

Kewreeuss · 12-06-2021 11:56pm

Here is another funny idea people have about the rules of the road: a red light isn’t red unless it has been red for at least four or five seconds. Especially on very large junctions. Until then it’s really green.

wandererz · 13-06-2021 3:49am

CoBo55 wrote: »

This is a great thread, it's covering pedestrians, driving in the US, cyclist's, all we need next are a few Russian road rage videos ( I love watching them)

It's a discussion forum about the rules of the road.
What have you contributed to the discussion related to that?

You have provided bad tire advice and also complained about & tried to avoid placing an EV charger at the front of your house.

Seriously, the last person to be accepting advice from on this thread.

What's the story with the EV charger anyway? Still trying to avoid it?

Dreamland is only just a few years away. You just have to be patient.

mgbgt1978 · 13-06-2021 9:48am

Martin567 wrote: »

Do driving tests have motorway driving now? That must be a fairly recent change.

Do people not read posts now before commenting. No change there then.

Try reading it again. No mention of Motorways, just dual carriageways. Where the same RotR apply when joining from a slip road.

Seth Brundle · 13-06-2021 9:57am

storker wrote: »

Or worse...drive to the end of the slip road and...stop.

I don't think I've seen this on motorways though, just on dual carriageways.

If someone merging is unable to merge by the end of the slip road, they must stop and wait until it is safe to enter the road. They are not allowed drive on the hatched markings or hard shoulder.
However, this would be a rarity and people stopping on a slip road is usually because they're a crap driver.

Seth Brundle · 13-06-2021 9:58am

lawred2 wrote: »

To be honest with you.. while that driver merging was making a mess of matters, why weren't you in the middle lane? It's good practice to move out to the middle lane when there is traffic merging into the left hand lane.

What's your insistence on traveling so far under the limit may I ask? Are you limited?

The vast majority of the M1 motorway has two lanes. Which if these is the middle lane?

CoBo55 · 13-06-2021 11:49am

wandererz wrote: »

It's a discussion forum about the rules of the road.
What have you contributed to the discussion related to that?

You have provided bad tire advice and also complained about & tried to avoid placing an EV charger at the front of your house.

Seriously, the last person to be accepting advice from on this thread.

What's the story with the EV charger anyway? Still trying to avoid it?

Dreamland is only just a few years away. You just have to be patient.

Where did I give bad tYre advice? Nothing to do with you whether I have a charger or not tbh. I actually wasn’t complaining I was asking the lads there would it still be cost effective to use a local 50kw charger which always seems to be unoccupied since payment was introduced. I got some very helpful replies they’re obviously better mannered than you. Your last dreamland sentence actually makes no sense it’s just jibberish. Oh I just noticed the time of your post.... That explains a lot.

lawred2 · 13-06-2021 12:22pm

Seth Brundle wrote: »

The vast majority of the M1 motorway has two lanes. Which if these is the middle lane?

Ah sure you got me.

The right hand lane is best place to be even traffic merging rather than getting into a duelling contest with a tonne of metal.

Seth Brundle · 13-06-2021 12:24pm

lawred2 wrote: »

The right hand lane is best place to be even traffic merging rather than getting into a duelling contest with a tonne of metal.

If you're pointing me back towards the first post then bear in mind that they were unable to change lane due to a steady stream of faster moving traffic.

lawred2 · 13-06-2021 12:26pm

Seth Brundle wrote: »

If you're pointing me back towards the first post then bear in mind that they were unable to change lane due to a steady stream of faster moving traffic.

You move out in advance of merging traffic. These junctions are well flagged in advance.

Seth Brundle · 13-06-2021 12:30pm

lawred2 wrote: »

You move out in advance of merging traffic. These junctions are well flagged in advance.

So what you're saying is that everyone in lane 1 should move to lane 2 when approaching the junction?
FFS :rolleyes:

Samuel T. Cogley · 13-06-2021 12:32pm

Seth Brundle wrote: »

So what you're saying is that everyone in lane 1 should move to lane 2 when approaching the junction?
FFS :rolleyes:

What he's saying is 'M50' :pac:

Fils · 13-06-2021 12:33pm

They should cap the numbers of cyclists in a particular peloton group. No one has the time to waste to have a long straight to pass the road train they make themselves.

lawred2 · 13-06-2021 12:34pm

Seth Brundle wrote: »

So what you're saying is that everyone in lane 1 should move to lane 2 when approaching the junction?
FFS :rolleyes:

Nope. I'm saying that those who don't want to get into situations like the OP did are better served avoiding them.

But if you want to get stuck in to such situations then feel free.

As it is, I'm really not sure why the OP chose to slow down causing issues in the left hand lane for traffic behind him already on the motorway. It's up to the merging driver to slow down.

The J Stands for Jay · 13-06-2021 2:07pm

lawred2 wrote: »

Ah sure you got me.

The right hand lane is best place to be even traffic merging rather than getting into a duelling contest with a tonne of metal.

As per the post you're discussing, there was faster traffic in lane 2 preventing them from moving over

The J Stands for Jay · 13-06-2021 2:07pm

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

What he's saying is 'M50' :pac:

M50 and N7, millions spent adding a 3rd lane that everyone refuses to use.

Isambard · 13-06-2021 2:15pm

McGaggs wrote: »

M50 and N7, millions spent adding a 3rd lane that everyone refuses to use.

needs some enforcement to make everyone use the lanes correctly

lawred2 · 13-06-2021 2:29pm

McGaggs wrote: »

As per the post you're discussing, there was faster traffic in lane 2 preventing them from moving over

That traffic was highlighted while he was already in the junction abreast of the merging car.

Junctions are flagged well in advance.

But listen, whatever, if people want to be in such situations then they are free to be so.

dsmythy · 13-06-2021 5:05pm

The one thing I'd say about not indicating towards the end of a merge lane. This depends too much on the person on the motorway.

They might not be interested in seeing things more than 3 meters ahead of them because why would you sure.

They might not know this particular junction. They may be unaware the merging lane is ending. The surprise of a car moving out without indication may not end well.

micar · 13-06-2021 5:38pm

Fils wrote: »

They should cap the numbers of cyclists in a particular peloton group.

To what ?

8, 10, 12, 14 ......

TBH, any groups I've been in have been max 12 ..... usually between 8 and 10.

greenflash · 13-06-2021 11:13pm

dsmythy wrote: »

The one thing I'd say about not indicating towards the end of a merge lane. This depends too much on the person on the motorway.

They might not be interested in seeing things more than 3 meters ahead of them because why would you sure.

They might not know this particular junction. They may be unaware the merging lane is ending. The surprise of a car moving out without indication may not end well.

Why, in normal circumstances, would anyone be near the end of the merge lane and still in it?

ClosedAccountFuzzy · 13-06-2021 11:26pm

They need to do a big campaign here on "merge like a zip"

AndrewJRenko · 13-06-2021 11:39pm

Fils wrote: »

They should cap the numbers of cyclists in a particular peloton group. No one has the time to waste to have a long straight to pass the road train they make themselves.

They should cap the number of cars in a particular traffic jam group. No one on a bike has time to waste to have to find a wide section to filter past piles of mostly single occupancy vehicles. .

Lord, please give me the self entitlement level that leads me to think that my journey is more important than 10-15 other people.

13-06-2021 11:59pm

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

They should cap the number of cars in a particular traffic jam group. No one on a bike has time to waste to have to find a wide section to filter past piles of mostly single occupancy vehicles. .

Lord, please give me the self entitlement level that leads me to think that my journey is more important than 10-15 other people.

Having read your cycling posts, God has answered.

14-06-2021 12:01am

Anything to be said for roundabouts? No indicators, left lane, right lane, any old exit......

Mimon · 14-06-2021 12:14am

FuzzyThinking wrote: »

They need to do a big campaign here on "merge like a zip"

That's only really relevant when traffic is heavy though which is not the case at most Irish motorway junctions.

Mimon · 14-06-2021 12:20am

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Anything to be said for roundabouts? No indicators, left lane, right lane, any old exit......

Think it's been done to death on here before.

Would rather no indication than indicating wrong. The amount of people that indicate wrongly is increasing?

I've had three cars indicating to continue around the a three exit roundabout recently but all got off at the exit in front of me. I know they probably only wasted me 15 seconds but jaysus it is fairly intuitive to know which that you indicate left when taking the first turn.

Fast2move · 14-06-2021 2:05am

I have to admit I find reading these posts exasperating. Why is this so difficult to comprehend the onus is on the traffic merging to yield to the traffic already on the motorway.

It makes me think of a riddle… How many Irish people does it take to plug in a lightbulb?? Well one person to tell them how to do it properly... We’re just waiting for everyone to finish arguing about the instructions to get the final tally

Fast2move · 14-06-2021 2:22am

Indulge me in a moment of simplistic heavenly bliss of wishful thinking

Q. Hang on a sec I’m travelling at 120 km an hour and a car already in lane one is travelling 120 km an hour what happened then

A. The onus is on the vehicle merging to yield to the traffic already on the motorway

Q Yes but some laneway is a really short so what do I do then

A. The onus is on the vehicle merging to yield to the traffic already on the motorway

Q. Yes but I drive a 40 ton lorry and if I slowdown it’s going to take me ages to speed up again

A. Apologies for your inconvenience but the onus is on the traffic merging to yield to the traffic already on the motorway

Q. Yes but everyone already on the motorway should anticipate that there is emerging traffic and move over to Lane 2 so that I don’t have to experience any inconvenience of having to think or exert any effort

A. We all aim to live your life but sadly the onus is on traffic merging to yield the traffic already on the motorway

Q. Yes but what about when the traffic is bumper-to-bumper on the motorway and what am I supposed to do just stay on the slip road and wait for the end of rush hour

A. Well the onus still remains on the traffic merging onto the motorway to yield to traffic already on the motorway please be patient and give the traffic on the motorway time to give you space to move in. Do not barge in because the onus is on the traffic merging to yield to traffic already on the motorway

I have this vision of being wheeled down the corridor in the straitjacket to the padded cell and I’m saying to the care assistant “all I am saying is the onus is on the people merging on the motorway to yield to traffic already on the motorway....why is it so hard to understand?? “

The J Stands for Jay · 14-06-2021 7:38am

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Anything to be said for roundabouts? No indicators, left lane, right lane, any old exit......

Enter roundabout, indicate right just before exiting.

14-06-2021 8:35am

People seem to have completely given up indicating when taking the first exit of a roundabout. It was rare enough to begin with and non existent now.

Isambard · 14-06-2021 8:36am

Fast2move wrote: »

Indulge me in a moment of simplistic heavenly bliss of wishful thinking

Q. Hang on a sec I’m travelling at 120 km an hour and a car already in lane one is travelling 120 km an hour what happened then

A. The onus is on the vehicle merging to yield to the traffic already on the motorway

Q Yes but some laneway is a really short so what do I do then

A. The onus is on the vehicle merging to yield to the traffic already on the motorway

Q. Yes but I drive a 40 ton lorry and if I slowdown it’s going to take me ages to speed up again

A. Apologies for your inconvenience but the onus is on the traffic merging to yield to the traffic already on the motorway

Q. Yes but everyone already on the motorway should anticipate that there is emerging traffic and move over to Lane 2 so that I don’t have to experience any inconvenience of having to think or exert any effort

A. We all aim to live your life but sadly the onus is on traffic merging to yield the traffic already on the motorway

Q. Yes but what about when the traffic is bumper-to-bumper on the motorway and what am I supposed to do just stay on the slip road and wait for the end of rush hour

A. Well the onus still remains on the traffic merging onto the motorway to yield to traffic already on the motorway please be patient and give the traffic on the motorway time to give you space to move in. Do not barge in because the onus is on the traffic merging to yield to traffic already on the motorway

I have this vision of being wheeled down the corridor in the straitjacket to the padded cell and I’m saying to the care assistant “all I am saying is the onus is on the people merging on the motorway to yield to traffic already on the motorway....why is it so hard to understand?? “

well that's only 100% true. !

Not hard to understand that at any junction one stream has priority over the other . Most people wouldn't expect to not yield coming out of a side road after all.

grogi · 14-06-2021 8:56am

Mimon wrote: »

Think it's been done to death on here before.

Would rather no indication than indicating wrong. The amount of people that indicate wrongly is increasing?

I've had three cars indicating to continue around the a three exit roundabout recently but all got off at the exit in front of me. I know they probably only wasted me 15 seconds but jaysus it is fairly intuitive to know which that you indicate left when taking the first turn.

The problem originates somewhere else.

It is not illegal in any way to actually indicate your intention to turn or exit the roundabout, but fail to do so. When I need to give way, I give absolutely no attention to indicators on the cars on the RB or main road. If majority don't pay attention to them, they are also very likely not to use them themselves.

14-06-2021 9:04am

Fils wrote: »

They should cap the numbers of cyclists in a particular peloton group. No one has the time to waste to have a long straight to pass the road train they make themselves.

That would make sense from a courtesy point of view but as they'll tell you, they don't have to. It's never high on their agenda.

Isambard · 14-06-2021 9:06am

grogi wrote: »

The problem originates somewhere else.

It is not illegal in any way to actually indicate your intention to turn or exit the roundabout, but fail to do so. When I need to give way, I give absolutely no attention to indicators on the cars on the RB or main road. If majority don't pay attention to them, they are also very likely not to use them themselves.

to paraphrase : indicators give an indication of possible manoeuvre

Mimon · 14-06-2021 9:08am

McGaggs wrote: »

Enter roundabout, indicate right just before exiting.

Amazing how many people do this. Is it just my perception or is the standard of driving dropping?

The one I don't get is people cutting across on to the wrong side when turning right at a junction. I regularly have to stop when approaching a junction as I will end up colliding with these numpties.

Was one of the first things I was taught when learning to drive. To drive in at a right angle and not cut the corner on the junction.

AndrewJRenko · 14-06-2021 9:38am

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Having read your cycling posts, God has answered.

Apologies, silly me, I forgot that it was motorists that owned the roads.

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

That would make sense from a courtesy point of view but as they'll tell you, they don't have to. It's never high on their agenda.

Why would that "courtesy" obligation apply solely to cyclists and not other road users?

Spook_ie · 14-06-2021 12:01pm

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Apologies, silly me, I forgot that it was motorists that owned the roads.

Why would that "courtesy" obligation apply solely to cyclists and not other road users?

I'll bite

Because at the end of the day regardless of the number of single occupancy cars in a queue of traffic a cyclist is permitted to overtake on either side, that's probably reason enough for cars etc. not to worry about cyclists in the queue.

CoBo55 · 14-06-2021 12:23pm

Did you ever eat so much popcorn you got a heartburn? Not nice I'll tell ya!! Crisps are worse especially those English ones, burn de guts out of ya...

Fast2move · 14-06-2021 12:43pm

Fast2move wrote: »

Indulge me in a moment of simplistic heavenly bliss of wishful thinking

Q. Hang on a sec I’m travelling at 120 km an hour and a car already in lane one is travelling 120 km an hour what happened then

A. The onus is on the vehicle merging to yield to the traffic already on the motorway

Q Yes but some laneway is a really short so what do I do then

A. The onus is on the vehicle merging to yield to the traffic already on the motorway

Q. Yes but I drive a 40 ton lorry and if I slowdown it’s going to take me ages to speed up again

A. Apologies for your inconvenience but the onus is on the traffic merging to yield to the traffic already on the motorway

Q. Yes but everyone already on the motorway should anticipate that there is emerging traffic and move over to Lane 2 so that I don’t have to experience any inconvenience of having to think or exert any effort

A. We all aim to live your life but sadly the onus is on traffic merging to yield the traffic already on the motorway

Q. Yes but what about when the traffic is bumper-to-bumper on the motorway and what am I supposed to do just stay on the slip road and wait for the end of rush hour

A. Well the onus still remains on the traffic merging onto the motorway to yield to traffic already on the motorway please be patient and give the traffic on the motorway time to give you space to move in. Do not barge in because the onus is on the traffic merging to yield to traffic already on the motorway

I have this vision of being wheeled down the corridor in the straitjacket to the padded cell and I’m saying to the care assistant “all I am saying is the onus is on the people merging on the motorway to yield to traffic already on the motorway....why is it so hard to understand?? “

Sorry I forgot to add one other one

Q. Yes but I am a very considerate driver and I like to always move over to another lane to let cars merge nice and easily it gives me a great feeling of well-being that I have done my bit of kindness for the day

A. It is advisable to seek other ways where you can express your kindness and contribute to a better world because these unnecessary lane changes increase the risk of road accidents due to the speed that vehicles are travelling on the motorway. It is far safer to maintain your course and your changing lanes adds an element of confusion into an already very simple procedure because as it has been explained ad nauseam the onus is on the vehicles merging to yield to the traffic already on the motorway

CoBo55 · 14-06-2021 1:01pm

Fast2move wrote: »

Sorry I forgot to add one other one

Q. Yes but I am a very considerate driver and I like to always move over to another lane to let cars merge nice and easily it gives me a great feeling of well-being that I have done my bit of kindness for the day

A. It is advisable to seek other ways where you can express your kindness and contribute to a better world because these unnecessary lane changes increase the risk of road accidents due to the speed that vehicles are travelling on the motorway. It is far safer to maintain your course and your changing lanes adds an element of confusion into an already very simple procedure because as it has been explained ad nauseam the onus is on the vehicles merging to yield to the traffic already on the motorway

God you're a patronising git, do want some popcorn?
Me being so nice n'all...

frozenfrozen · 14-06-2021 1:08pm

I've actually found the standard of motorway driving has gone up since the start of the pandemic in my experience.

A lot less people welded to lane 2. Generally fewer crazy high speed and crazy low speed people. Nice stream of people I pass who are doing 115 and a nice stream who pass me who are doing 130.

Only issue lately I had just at the start of the new average speed camera test zone, I moved into lane 2 because someone was merging at a low speed, a guy with CD plates drinking a bottle of water while entering a motorway. He then sped up and matched me speed side by side. I just stayed on the horn for a long time until he slowed down and allowed me to move back into lane 1.

The rest of the time I'll just be ready to move into lane 2 and I'll move if someone looks like they are going to end up side by side with me. I'm not out there to enforce the rules it's safer for me if I can move into lane 2 and if they speed up above 120 then I move back into lane 1 and don't go alongside them

Yesterday I only had a couple cars who I came up behind then I'd move out to overtake and they would speed up. It used to be a lot more common

14-06-2021 1:13pm

Fast2move wrote: »

Sorry I forgot to add one other one

Q. Yes but I am a very considerate driver and I like to always move over to another lane to let cars merge nice and easily it gives me a great feeling of well-being that I have done my bit of kindness for the day

A. It is advisable to seek other ways where you can express your kindness and contribute to a better world because these unnecessary lane changes increase the risk of road accidents due to the speed that vehicles are travelling on the motorway. It is far safer to maintain your course and your changing lanes adds an element of confusion into an already very simple procedure because as it has been explained ad nauseam the onus is on the vehicles merging to yield to the traffic already on the motorway

Anyone who doesn't do this is a d*ck, IMO. That's kind of all there is to it

Fast2move · 14-06-2021 1:19pm

CoBo55 wrote: »

God you're a patronising git, do want some popcorn?
Me being so nice n'all...

Yes I may be a patronising git and you appear to be an ignorant individual that feels it’s okay to insult somebody. But here’s the thing that we both have to remember

The onus is on the vehicle merging to yield to the traffic already on the motorway ðŸ‘

CoBo55 · 14-06-2021 1:24pm

Fast2move wrote: »

Yes I may be a patronising git and you appear to be an ignorant individual that feels it’s okay to insult somebody. But here’s the thing that we both have to remember

The onus is on the vehicle merging to yield to the traffic already on the motorway ðŸ‘

Nah I just move over and let them in and drive off into the sunset, life is a lot easier when you don't act like a dick on the road trying to be the motorway police.

stoneill · 14-06-2021 1:26pm

If it is safe to do so, I will move over to lane 2 to allow traffic to merge, not out of courtesy, but because it is quite common that the merging car is trundling down the slip way and only accelerates to speed once on the motorway, and I do not want to be stuck behind them.

If I cant swap lanes as there is already traffic using the lane then I will do my best to get ahead of the merging traffic, for the same reason.

Fast2move · 14-06-2021 1:26pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Anyone who doesn't do this is a d*ck, IMO. That's kind of all there is to it

It’s funny because I see everybody that DOES that is a d*ck because their driving, as I said, increases the risk of accidents by engaging in unnecessary manoeuvers in a vehicle travelling at high speeds on the motorway with other vehicles travelling at high speeds around them.

There is actually a reason why the rules of the road exist. People have actually put thought into this it’s not just a heap of mumbo-jumbo that some random person came up with one night during lockdown

People with a funny idea of the rules of the road.

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