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Female Police officer stabbed to death in France

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    #62
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    tayto lover wrote: »
    But you also have to think about why these people are attacking and killing police. There is a reason, a motive. Motive is what police everywhere look for.

    Do you care what the motivation of the ira and republicans here that murdered at least 23 gardai?
    Or were they just scumbag murderers?


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    #63
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users Posts: 28,739 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    tayto lover wrote: »
    But you also have to think about why these people are attacking and killing police. There is a reason, a motive. Motive is what police everywhere look for.

    Exactly this, and to be honest it's worrying BP doesn't seem to understand this given their profession


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    #64
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users Posts: 28,739 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    bubblypop wrote: »
    Do you care what the motivation of the ira and republicans here that murdered at least 23 gardai?
    Or were they just scumbag murderers?

    What was their motivation? Do you really not understand the connection between motive and action?


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    #65
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,652 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    bubblypop wrote: »
    Do you care what the motivation of the ira and republicans here that murdered at least 23 gardai?
    Or were they just scumbag murderers?

    Of course I do.
    That’s why we have to understand the reasons why.
    Motive.


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    #66
    Loverlyhorse
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 44 ✭Loverlyhorse


    Overheal wrote: »
    I think the point is that 1.8 billion followers, if the religion was the fundamental problem, not the radical extremism, then 1.8 billion people would all be radically violent sociopaths.

    Anders Breivik also cited God. Does that put Christians all on trial for his massacre? Should Norway close its borders to all Christians?

    Like I said, most people don't take their religion seriously and are hypocrites (aka moderates). "Fundamentalists" are a problem when there is a problem with the fundamentals. And the fundamentals of Islam are not pretty (infidels, jihad etc.) With an honest reading of the Quran, it is not hard to see how these extremists reach their conclusions. In fact, its harder to see how moderates ignore so much (but thankfully they do!).

    Have you read the Quran?


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    #67
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    _Kaiser_ wrote: »
    Exactly this, and to be honest it's worrying BP doesn't seem to understand this given their profession

    BP couldn't care less what their motivation is/was.
    Someone who murders anyone is a scumbag, someone who kills police is a bigger ducking scumbag to me.


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    #68
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 81,988 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    tayto lover wrote: »
    Of course I do.
    That’s why we have to understand the reasons why.
    Motive.

    Are we looking for understanding though, or confirmation bias.


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    #69
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,652 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Overheal wrote: »
    Are we looking for understanding though, or confirmation bias.

    From learning what caused an attack/ murder you may be able to prevent another. Find out how they think and how they act.


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    #70
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    tayto lover wrote: »
    Of course I do.
    That’s why we have to understand the reasons why.
    Motive.

    No, we do not.
    All those ira fcuked who killed gardai have absolutely no motive as far as I'm concerned.
    I don't care what they claim to be the reasons they did it.
    There is no justification and no motive.
    Just murdering scum. I wouldn't give them any excuses.


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    #71
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users Posts: 28,739 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    bubblypop wrote: »
    BP couldn't care less what their motivation is/was.
    Someone who murders anyone is a scumbag, someone who kills police is a bigger ducking scumbag to me.

    We don't disagree that the perpetrators of these attacks are scumbags and that if they survive themselves then they should feel the weight of law hit them like a sledgehammer.

    But motivation is absolutely key to not only determining what happened and why, but how to hopefully prevent similar occurrences in the future.

    Are you really saying you don't see the link and importance of this?


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    #72
    the purple tin
    Registered Users Posts: 10,943 ✭✭✭✭the purple tin


    Wahhabism is behind most of these attacks. Blame Saudi Arabia for pushing it on people for years and funding schools all over the Middle East and now in Europe too.


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    #73
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    tayto lover wrote: »
    From learning what caused an attack/ murder you may be able to prevent another. Find out how they think and how they act.

    Can you give us some excuses that explain why ira men could justify killing gardai?


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    #74
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,652 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    bubblypop wrote: »
    No, we do not.
    All those ira fcuked who killed gardai have absolutely no motive as far as I'm concerned.
    I don't care what they claim to be the reasons they did it.
    There is no justification and no motive.
    Just murdering scum. I wouldn't give them any excuses.

    And the reason you try to get to know how and why they act is to catch them and prevent more attacks. That’s how policing works.


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    #75
    Loverlyhorse
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 44 ✭Loverlyhorse


    I find it frankly incredible that the political left (Overheal being a fine spokesperson for them) confidently ascribe racist motivations to police shootings in the US with no evidence (and where officers involved deny any racism), yet deny the role of religion in this and other killings even when the perpetrators are telling us their motivation was their religion!.


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    #76
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,652 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    bubblypop wrote: »
    Can you give us some excuses that explain why ira men could justify killing gardai?

    I’m looking at it from the other side.
    Why do you think police everywhere try to infiltrate groups?


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    #77
    Overheal
    Registered Users Posts: 81,988 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    _Kaiser_ wrote: »
    We don't disagree that the perpetrators of these attacks are scumbags and that if they survive themselves then they should feel the weight of law hit them like a sledgehammer.

    But motivation is absolutely key to not only determining what happened and why, but how to hopefully prevent similar occurrences in the future.

    Are you really saying you don't see the link and importance of this?

    Easy to see how it's relevant; reckless to apply that sense against other Muslims, for no other sake than being Muslim.


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    #78
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,652 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Overheal wrote: »
    Easy to see how it's relevant; reckless to apply that sense against other Muslims, for no other sake than being Muslim.

    The vast vast majority of Muslims are against this type of behaviour.
    The people committing these murders have been radicalised. They are Muslims but radicalised and extremely dangerous.


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    #79
    Loverlyhorse
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 44 ✭Loverlyhorse


    Overheal - you so confidently deny this has anything to do with Islam. Have you read the Quran?


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    #80
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    tayto lover wrote: »
    I’m looking at it from the other side.
    Why do you think police everywhere try to infiltrate groups?

    We know why?
    To get information.
    I don't care to allow people to make excuses for their behaviour.
    No excuse for murdering police. End of.


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    #81
    Loverlyhorse
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 44 ✭Loverlyhorse


    tayto lover wrote: »
    And the reason you try to get to know how and why they act is to catch them and prevent more attacks. That’s how policing works.

    It's amazing this had to be said. My 5 year old understands this.


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    #82
    Loverlyhorse
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 44 ✭Loverlyhorse


    bubblypop wrote: »
    We know why?
    To get information.
    I don't care to allow people to make excuses for their behaviour.
    No excuse for murdering police. End of.

    Motive =/= Excuse.


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    #83
    TomSweeney
    Registered Users Posts: 3,195 ✭✭✭TomSweeney


    o1s1n wrote: »
    The man with the knife, who plunged it into another person, is the least if it?


    Yes, when the "liberals" continue to appease and bow down to the ideology that is doing this - it's given more radicals a platform and a pass to do this - long term more people get killed , if society had a zero tolerance approach to it, it would be nipped in the bud a lot more.


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    #84
    TomSweeney
    Registered Users Posts: 3,195 ✭✭✭TomSweeney


    Overheal wrote: »
    Which is only as laughable of turning every stabbing involving some radical extremist into an indictment on 1.8 billion adherents to Islam


    What % of that 1.8 BILLION have sympathies with these attackers ?


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    #85
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,652 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    bubblypop wrote: »
    We know why?
    To get information.
    I don't care to allow people to make excuses for their behaviour.
    No excuse for murdering police. End of.

    Of course there’s no excuse for murdering police but you have a duty to try to prevent the next attack. You have to understand your enemy and to do that you have to know why they do it and how they think. That’s what police try to do.


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    #86
    Princess Consuela Bananahammock
    Registered Users Posts: 33,173 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    Loverlyhorse wrote: »
    Like I said, most people don't take their religion seriously and are hypocrites (aka moderates). "Fundamentalists" are a problem when there is a problem with the fundamentals. And the fundamentals of Islam are not pretty (infidels, jihad etc.) With an honest reading of the Quran, it is not hard to see how these extremists reach their conclusions. In fact, its harder to see how moderates ignore so much (but thankfully they do!).

    Have you read the Quran?

    Fundamentalists of every religion are nasty people. A fundamentalist Chrsitian is going to be a dirtier piece of work than a moderate muslim (or moderate anything else for that matter). Fundamentalism is the enemy here, not Islam.
    Loverlyhorse wrote: »
    Overheal - you so confidently deny this has anything to do with Islam. Have you read the Quran?

    Have YOU?

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



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    #87
    TomSweeney
    Registered Users Posts: 3,195 ✭✭✭TomSweeney


    Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »
    No, my arugment is with the person who puts it in "inverted commas" in order to pretend the actions of one person is a more reliable yardstick than the beliefs of well over one billion.




    300 to 500 million muslims support violent jihad.


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    #88
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    tayto lover wrote: »
    Of course there’s no excuse for murdering police but you have a duty to try to prevent the next attack. You have to understand your enemy and to do that you have to know why they do it and how they think. That’s what police try to do.

    So what did they understand about the reasons that republicans murdered gardai?
    What insight into their motives did AGS gain, that stopped future murders of members?


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    #89
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,652 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    bubblypop wrote: »
    So what did they understand about the reasons that republicans murdered gardai?
    What insight into their motives did AGS gain, that stopped future murders of members?

    You should know that yourself.
    Many were arrested on the way to kill people.
    It’s the same with the criminal gangs in Dublin.
    The Gardai have infiltrated them.
    You already know this.


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    #90
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,456 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    bubblypop wrote: »
    Can you give us some excuses that explain why ira men could justify killing gardai?


    Some times an operation went wrong.

    Sometimes conflict's are messy.

    There was a standing order to all Volunteers that the Guards were not to be fired upon if at all possible. That was largely followed, at great effort and cost.

    The knife man in France followed standing order in his green book.


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    #91
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,456 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    tayto lover wrote: »
    And the reason you try to get to know how and why they act is to catch them and prevent more attacks. That’s how policing works.

    There are motives for nearly everything.
    People can view those motives as wrong but they still exist.

    Bubbly pop doesn't understand what the word motive means.


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