Relaxation of Restrictions, Part X Read OP For Mod Warnings

moonage · 01-04-2021 02:05PM

francogarbanzo wrote: »

I know that some (see: few) people believe that.

I'm highlighting the absurdity of implying someone is a conspiracy theorist because they used the phrase "mainstream media".

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-27772070

Is the BBC a "conspiracy theory" outlet?

The BBC, RTE and most of the world's mainstream media are now the propaganda wings of the governments. They are like Russia's Pravda and are in cahoots/are conspiring with the governments to push the doom and gloom narrative.

They are—deliberateley and blatantly—not impartial, objective and they never analyse the bigger picture or ask tough questions. Control the media and you control the narrative. There are many conspiracy deniers who just won't accept this.

What is the agenda that this conspiring is ushering in? Well, that's a discussion for a different forum.

TonyMaloney · 01-04-2021 02:07PM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

It’s very concerning, particularly the South African variant

So much so the South Africans didn’t actually shut the pubs

South Africa brought in blanket alcohol bans on multiple occasions.

Alcohol has been illegal for about 4 of the last 12 months there. They're planning to do it again over Easter.

corcaigh07 · 01-04-2021 02:08PM

SnuggyBear wrote: »

Soneone needs to have a word with George Lee

I've said it before and I still believe it, George Lee represents for NPHET. He's no journalist anyway.

TonyMaloney · 01-04-2021 02:09PM

corcaigh07 wrote: »

I've said it before and I still believe it, George Lee works for NPHET.

In that he communicates on behalf of them?

_Kaiser_ · 01-04-2021 02:10PM

Ashbourne hoop wrote: »

Guy with a razor gives his colleagues a 4 all over. Stop the presess....

Group of lads meet outdoors in a park at an early hour with no one around to play ball

Presses stopped, outrage commenced!

You can't have one rule for some, another for others - that indeed is WHY the public are as fed up with the current situation as they are.

normanoffside · 01-04-2021 02:11PM

TonyMaloney wrote: »

Yiz make it hard for a person to ignore George Lee.

Without you lot banging on about him endlessly he wouldn't feature in my life.

He puts the fear of god into millions of people every night and is responsible for a lot of the anxiety in this country.

Kivaro · 01-04-2021 02:11PM

TonyMaloney wrote: »

Yiz make it hard for a person to ignore George Lee.

Without you lot banging on about him endlessly he wouldn't feature in my life.

Speaking of which ..................
Last night on the 9 o' clock news, he looked like a cat ready to pounce across the desk on Sharon if she had dared mention anything positive. But she was safe in that regard.

His clanger that caused me to spit out my sup of tae this morning was when he was on the early news and he said, and you can rewind the tape if you don't believe me, he said ............... "perceived perception."

Jesus wept for poor George.

TonyMaloney · 01-04-2021 02:13PM

normanoffside wrote: »

He puts the fear of god into millions of people every night and is responsible for a lot of the anxiety in this country.

Fine. But how does complaining about him here every five minutes help?

Boggles · 01-04-2021 02:16PM

corcaigh07 wrote: »

I've said it before and I still believe it, George Lee represents for NPHET. He's no journalist anyway.

Doubtful, as there is always a collective sigh before he starts asking questions at the briefings.

PTH2009 · 01-04-2021 02:18PM

We have to remember it's a new virus we're dealing with in Ireland

Ashbourne hoop · 01-04-2021 02:23PM

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Group of lads meet outdoors in a park at an early hour with no one around to play ball

Presses stopped, outrage commenced!

You can't have one rule for some, another for others - that indeed is WHY the public are as fed up with the current situation as they are.

Who was outraged by the Dubs ? Not me, so not sure why you are bringing that up in the discussion. Both non stories then.

Billgirlylegs · 01-04-2021 02:24PM

Boggles wrote: »

There was 411 less dwellings completed in 2020 compared to 2019. -1.9%.

2020 - 20,676

2019 - 21,087

2018 - 18,072

2017 - 14,407

The level of home completions through an actual pandemic is quite impressive.

Anyway back to NPHET being evil, rar, rar, rar!

Not evil

Completely incompetent.

bb1234567 · 01-04-2021 02:26PM

2 insanely ridiculous things happening in schools right now..

My sister is doing her Leaving cert oral in irish and the way it ordinarly works for the sraith pictuir section of the exam is they head over to a table where all 12 page are laid face down, and they choose one randomly, then hold it for the duration of exam and discuss it with the examiner. These pages are recycled and shared with all students coming in throughout the day.

But now with COVID after they've picked up the page and showed the examiner what they have chosen, they must then lay it back down again in the original pile, as they are not allowed to hold it for the duration of the oral in case of COVID contamination of the papers. They must have all 12 pages printed and brought with them to so they have a personal copy of whatever they had chosen . Now maybe it's fair enough in theory but what makes no sense is the fact it's already potentially 'contaminated' when they pick up the page at the beginning anyway, lol.

Secondly..they are doing their oral with masks on..and a big plastic screen between exmainer and teacher. So both parties have to speak into a microphone so that they can actually hear one another. Now this is already ridiculous enough but the examiners aren't external because of COVID..all these precuations are with the teachers they see up close in class every day , where there are not barriers such as the big plastic screen.

themacattack. · 01-04-2021 02:29PM

PTH2009 wrote: »

We have to remember it's a new virus we're dealing with in Ireland

yes very true...it is a patriotic virus specific to ireland bombing around the place with a tricolur but it has feelings too because it has just announced a truce for childrens shoes

01-04-2021 02:30PM

bb1234567 wrote: »

2 insanely ridiculous things happening in schools right now..

My sister is doing her Leaving cert oral in irish and the way it ordinarly works for the sraith pictuir section of the exam is they head over to a table where all 12 page are laid face down, and they choose one randomly, then hold it for the duration of exam and discuss it with the examiner. These pages are recycled and shared with all students coming in throughout the day.

But now with COVID after they've picked up the page and showed the examiner what they have chosen, they must then lay it back down again in the original pile, as they are not allowed to hold it for the duration of the oral in case of COVID contamination of the papers. They must have all 12 pages printed and brought with them to so they have a personal copy of whatever they had chosen . Now maybe it's fair enough in theory but what makes no sense is the fact it's already potentially 'contaminated' when they pick up the page at the beginning anyway, lol.

Secondly..they are doing their oral with masks on..and a big plastic screen between exmainer and teacher. So both parties have to speak into a microphone so that they can actually hear one another. Now this is already ridiculous enough but the examiners aren't external because of COVID..all these precuations are with the teachers they see up close in class every day lol.

As dumb as all that is, why wouldn't they laminate the papers to disinfect between exams, and put a music stand beside the chair so they can have the paper there without touching it?

All seems like pointless theatre again.

Pdoghue · 01-04-2021 02:32PM

Kivaro wrote: »

Speaking of which ..................
Last night on the 9 o' clock news, he looked like a cat ready to pounce across the desk on Sharon if she had dared mention anything positive. But she was safe in that regard.

His clanger that caused me to spit out my sup of tae this morning was when he was on the early news and he said, and you can rewind the tape if you don't believe me, he said ............... "perceived perception."

Jesus wept for poor George.

Just saw the 6 o'clock segment. At least he mentioned the vaccine on the SixOne news. By 9 o'clock he had omitted the vaccine from the story!! Talk about lacking context..

Nqp15hhu · 01-04-2021 02:33PM

Northern Ireland’s case rate is 48/100,000, with a positivity rate of 0.89% today! We are still in a strict lockdown with no end in sight.

Just what do these medical advisors want? Unreal when you compare it to December.

TonyMaloney · 01-04-2021 02:35PM

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

Northern Ireland’s case rate is 48/100,000, with a positivity rate of 0.89% today! We are still in a strict lockdown with no end in sight.

Just what do these medical advisors want? Unreal when you compare it to December.

But that's a different country entirely

We can't unlock on the basis of some other country's success

Nqp15hhu · 01-04-2021 02:36PM

TonyMaloney wrote: »

But that's a different country entirely

We can't unlock on the basis of some other country's success

I am making the point that we have very low cases and are still locked down. Whilst the rest of the U.K. is reopening.

TonyMaloney · 01-04-2021 02:37PM

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

I am making the point that we have very low cases and are still locked down. Whilst the rest of the U.K. is reopening.

They're not. You're thinking of England who are, unsurprisingly, taking a bit of an early gamble

paddyisreal · 01-04-2021 02:40PM

TonyMaloney wrote: »

They're not. You're thinking of England who are, unsurprisingly, taking a bit of an early gamble

why is it a gamble ? did israel gamble also ?

Nqp15hhu · 01-04-2021 02:40PM

At this point 60% of the adult population in England has had their first dose. What more do you want?

Remember last summer everything was open without the vaccine!

01-04-2021 02:48PM

Keyzer wrote: »

That vulnerable minority are the older generation and those with underlying medical conditions. Shouldn't we protect the most vulnerable in our society? Or should we just leave them to die? Sure they'll die anyway won't they so no great loss, right?

This really is a bad way to pose this question.

I get the emotionality. Everyone has been propagandised for a year and it sticks with some more than others. But focusing on "the vulnerable" to covid ignores the people who become vulnerable by dint of the restrictions themselves.

We don't yet know the extent to which lockdowns prevent deaths from Covid, but since places where such harsh restrictions have not been implemented have gone through "waves" that have lapsed themselves, we know that it is not 100%. So what we're looking at is an unspecified difference between travel restriction and stay at home order type restrictions, and masking, social distancing, track & trace and those sorts of voluntary measures.

We know that there will be economical, health, and human costs to this pandemic going forward. Murmurs about debt, increased taxes, prolonged cancer waiting times, missed diagnoses, mental health issues in adults and children, increased cardiac deaths, increases in domestic violence and so on have broken through the wall of Covid-centric reporting despite the apparent general agreement that all messaging should be working to keep people on board with the restrictions-of-unspecified-effectiveness.

So the choice isn't a binary "protect those vulnerable to Covid-19 at all cost because [insert moralising language about "vulnerable", "we should", etc.]." vs. "Let it rip, **** the oldies!" It's a more nuanced discussion about how the restrictions affect everyone in society and whether the "good" of saving (e.g.) "just one life" is worth the "bad" consequences when they start stacking up.

Much of that is currently unquantifiable, and will likely not shake out properly until looked into by scientists and mathematicians in a decade or two from now who were not personally invested or politically incentivised in finding one or the other outcome. But suggesting that the only possible reason a person could oppose lockdown measures is because they consider the death of a person to be "no great loss" is disgustingly manipulative horse ****.

paddyisreal · 01-04-2021 02:49PM

Nqp15hhu wrote: »

At this point 60% of the adult population in England has had their first dose. What more do you want?

Remember last summer everything was open without the vaccine!

exactly, when we hit 60 percent here the narrative will be just wait for another 3 months to relax restricitons as the risk is to great. remember sam mcconkey said 1 person dying in a thousand is a risk the country might struggle to accept.

dubdaymo · 01-04-2021 02:50PM

I liked George Lee when he was RTE Economics correspondent. He was good at what he did.

However, he has no qualifications to be an "Environment and Science Correspondent". You can't blame HIM. All he is there for is to be the RTE puppet of the Doom-Meisters known as NPHET and George's doom-laden delivery method is perfect for that. He is still good at what he does but that's as far as it goes. That video posted is a classic example. Thankfully, sensible people just sit back and enjoy the nightly comedy sketch. However, I feel for the people who are terrified into believing every word spoken.

Everyone should beware of "models" and "modellers". They should not be let anywhere near any Govt. decision-making. Many will recall the Volcanic Ash crisis when the "modellers" were "modelling" their computers to produce daily maps showing Northern Europe coloured in bright red. Nothing left the ground. Everyone knew this was nonsense. Eventually, Willie Walsh and Mick O'Leary sent up a couple of planes that came back without a scratch and the whole thing died a death.

Any Govt. that would allow a rake of "mathematicians" (with the word "University" added in for extra "credibility") to poison their thinking in making decisions that affect millions of people needs to cop itself on and quick.

There was more nonsense this morning. A crowd of lads out in the fresh morning air doing non-contact training are being vilified. There are only so many ridiculous rules that people will abide by.

The Big Easy · 01-04-2021 03:03PM

paddyisreal wrote: »

exactly, when we hit 60 percent here the narrative will be just wait for another 3 months to relax restricitons as the risk is to great. remember sam mcconkey said 1 person dying in a thousand is a risk the country might struggle to accept.

Jesus. McConkey really is the worst of the lot. I don't know how he still gets wheeled out. A lot of these 'scientists' and 'professors' could do with having their credentials revoked, they are a disgrace to their profession.

True scientists understand implicit bias and the shortcomings and fallibility of 'science'. Only non-scientists tend to see science as the answer to everything and infallible.

Science is and always will be fallible, a natural consequence of such is that sometimes it will be downright wrong!

That's not to say we should dismiss it, it is our best means of understanding and interpreting the world around us. There are, however, many scientific zealots out there, who cling to findings of science, like those who cling to the teachings of the Koran or the Bible.

Pdoghue · 01-04-2021 03:08PM

Deleted User wrote: »

This really is a bad way to pose this question.

I get the emotionality. Everyone has been propagandised for a year and it sticks with some more than others. But focusing on "the vulnerable" to covid ignores the people who become vulnerable by dint of the restrictions themselves.

We don't yet know the extent to which lockdowns prevent deaths from Covid, but since places where such harsh restrictions have not been implemented have gone through "waves" that have lapsed themselves, we know that it is not 100%. So what we're looking at is an unspecified difference between travel restriction and stay at home order type restrictions, and masking, social distancing, track & trace and those sorts of voluntary measures.

We know that there will be economical, health, and human costs to this pandemic going forward. Murmurs about debt, increased taxes, prolonged cancer waiting times, missed diagnoses, mental health issues in adults and children, increased cardiac deaths, increases in domestic violence and so on have broken through the wall of Covid-centric reporting despite the apparent general agreement that all messaging should be working to keep people on board with the restrictions-of-unspecified-effectiveness.

So the choice isn't a binary "protect those vulnerable to Covid-19 at all cost because [insert moralising language about "vulnerable", "we should", etc.]." vs. "Let it rip, **** the oldies!" It's a more nuanced discussion about how the restrictions affect everyone in society and whether the "good" of saving (e.g.) "just one life" is worth the "bad" consequences when they start stacking up.

Much of that is currently unquantifiable, and will likely not shake out properly until looked into by scientists and mathematicians in a decade or two from now who were not personally invested or politically incentivised in finding one or the other outcome. But suggesting that the only possible reason a person could oppose lockdown measures is because they consider the death of a person to be "no great loss" is disgustingly manipulative horse ****.

Excellent post - I agree.

01-04-2021 03:11PM

TonyMaloney wrote: »

They're not. You're thinking of England who are, unsurprisingly, taking a bit of an early gamble

Wales:

April 12th

Non-essential retail set to open.
All education returning.
Close contact services (salons etc.) opening.
Ban on non-essential travel lifted (within CTA).
Viewing wedding venues permitted.

April 26th

Hospitality including pubs and restaurants for outdoor service set to open (no curfew or alcohol ban).
Outdoor attractions including theme parks to open.

May 3rd

Outdoor activities for up to 30 people.
Weddings for up to 30 people.

May 10th

Gyms, leisure centres and fitness facilities to open for 1-1 training

May 17th

Children's indoor activities and community centres resume.

After May 17th but before June

Indoor hospitality to open

Pilot events with crowds of up to 1,000 to take place in May.

I don't know why people keep insisting that England is WAAAAY ahead of the rest of the UK in reopening or what sort of point they think they're making, but it's awfully silly.

Self-contained holiday lets don't open in England until after April 12th but have been okay in Wales since earlier in March.

Stop.

TonyMaloney · 01-04-2021 03:15PM

Deleted User wrote: »

This really is a bad way to pose this question.

I get the emotionality. Everyone has been propagandised for a year and it sticks with some more than others. But focusing on "the vulnerable" to covid ignores the people who become vulnerable by dint of the restrictions themselves.

We don't yet know the extent to which lockdowns prevent deaths from Covid, but since places where such harsh restrictions have not been implemented have gone through "waves" that have lapsed themselves, we know that it is not 100%. So what we're looking at is an unspecified difference between travel restriction and stay at home order type restrictions, and masking, social distancing, track & trace and those sorts of voluntary measures.

We know that there will be economical, health, and human costs to this pandemic going forward. Murmurs about debt, increased taxes, prolonged cancer waiting times, missed diagnoses, mental health issues in adults and children, increased cardiac deaths, increases in domestic violence and so on have broken through the wall of Covid-centric reporting despite the apparent general agreement that all messaging should be working to keep people on board with the restrictions-of-unspecified-effectiveness.

So the choice isn't a binary "protect those vulnerable to Covid-19 at all cost because [insert moralising language about "vulnerable", "we should", etc.]." vs. "Let it rip, **** the oldies!" It's a more nuanced discussion about how the restrictions affect everyone in society and whether the "good" of saving (e.g.) "just one life" is worth the "bad" consequences when they start stacking up.

Much of that is currently unquantifiable, and will likely not shake out properly until looked into by scientists and mathematicians in a decade or two from now who were not personally invested or politically incentivised in finding one or the other outcome. But suggesting that the only possible reason a person could oppose lockdown measures is because they consider the death of a person to be "no great loss" is disgustingly manipulative horse ****.

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of the whole thing.

Lockdowns do not cause a surge in all-cause mortality rates. They prevent them by enabling or re-enabling the health service to operate as it should.
Things would get a lot worse for things like cancer screenings if we were to open up significantly right now.

You have the entire thing backwards.

paddyisreal · 01-04-2021 03:22PM

The Big Easy wrote: »

Jesus. McConkey really is the worst of the lot. I don't know how he still gets wheeled out. A lot of these 'scientists' and 'professors' could do with having their credentials revoked, they are a disgrace to their profession.

True scientists understand implicit bias and the shortcomings and fallibility of 'science'. Only non-scientists tend to see science as the answer to everything and infallible.

Science is and always will be fallible, a natural consequence of such is that sometimes it will be downright wrong!

That's not to say we should dismiss it, it is our best means of understanding and interpreting the world around us. There are, however, many scientific zealots out there, who cling to findings of science, like those who cling to the teachings of the Koran or the Bible.

yep very true, at the beginning of this mcconkey said there would be 60-80 thousands deaths and that it was basically the spanish flu and the civil war rolled into one . You would have to question where they got their qualifications from.

Then you have the like of Gerry killeen saying the country should not be opened up until we have 100 % vaccinations knowing full well that is impossible.

https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/arid-40208198.html

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part X *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part X Read OP For Mod Warnings