Relaxation of Restrictions, Part X *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

Boggles

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't know why people keep insisting that England is WAAAAY ahead of the rest of the UK in reopening

Who did that?

TonyMaloney

TonyMaloney wrote: »

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of the whole thing.

Lockdowns do not cause a surge in all-cause mortality rates. They prevent them by enabling or re-enabling the health service to operate as it should.
Things would get a lot worse for things like cancer screenings if we were to open up significantly right now.

You have the entire thing backwards.

You really have no idea if this is the case, you just feel like it is because it's the current prevailing wisdom based on early modeled scenarios that were wildly inaccurate. Were it the case, we would expect to have seen wildly different scenarios in all places that relied on less stringent measures. Which we did not.

Boggles

Boggles wrote: »

Who did that?

Google your own ****, Bog. I'm done talking to you in this thread.

hynesie08

Deleted User wrote: »

Google your own ****, Bog. I'm done talking to you in this thread.

Yes, when people were comparing England to the rest of the UK, They really should have figured in a Welsh roadmap that didn't exist till yesterday.......

PTH2009

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Wales:

April 12th

• Non-essential retail set to open.
• All education returning.
• Close contact services (salons etc.) opening.
• Ban on non-essential travel lifted (within CTA).
• Viewing wedding venues permitted.

April 26th

• Hospitality including pubs and restaurants for outdoor service set to open (no curfew or alcohol ban).
• Outdoor attractions including theme parks to open.

May 3rd

• Outdoor activities for up to 30 people.
• Weddings for up to 30 people.

May 10th

• Gyms, leisure centres and fitness facilities to open for 1-1 training

May 17th

• Children's indoor activities and community centres resume.

After May 17th but before June

• Indoor hospitality to open

Pilot events with crowds of up to 1,000 to take place in May.

I don't know why people keep insisting that England is WAAAAY ahead of the rest of the UK in reopening or what sort of point they think they're making, but it's awfully silly.

Self-contained holiday lets don't open in England until after April 12th but have been okay in Wales since earlier in March.

Stop.

Hard to read that and become very angry/depressed

We're taking the brunt of year's and year's of mismanagement of the health service here in Ireland

TonyMaloney

Deleted User wrote: »

You really have no idea if this is the case, you just feel like it is because it's the current prevailing wisdom based on early modeled scenarios that were wildly inaccurate. Were it the case, we would expect to have seen wildly different scenarios in all places that relied on less stringent measures. Which we did not.

Yeah, of course. It becomes impossible for hospitals to operate normally with ****loads of very sick people coming through the door constantly, and your already sick patients acquiring covid on top of their existing ailments.

Sweden postponed many cancer screenings etc too

robindch

dalyboy wrote: »

It’s either a failing of communication, deafness , or basic mathematical illiteracy that he is suffering from at this point. (Likely a combo of all 3)

Fair degree of mathematical and scientific illiteracy and concomitant deafness alright.

But less on the part of the epidemiologists and scientists than the people who spent science and maths class down the back, fast asleep.

hynesie08

hynesie08 wrote: »

Yes, when people were comparing England to the rest of the UK, They really should have figured in a Welsh roadmap that didn't exist till yesterday.......

Or maybe just not been so insufferably smug and self-assured about it. I've relatives got their hair cut more than two weeks ago and others on "staycation" in Wales. The trajectory was obvious even without a prescriptive list, but since the list wasn't explicitly laid out until yesterday and it presented a narrative opportunity... guess that's all that matters. I'm sure they shall all carry on without so much as an "oops" anyway, let alone a moment of reflection.

TonyMaloney

Deleted User wrote: »

Wales:

April 12th

• Non-essential retail set to open.
• All education returning.
• Close contact services (salons etc.) opening.
• Ban on non-essential travel lifted (within CTA).
• Viewing wedding venues permitted.

April 26th

• Hospitality including pubs and restaurants for outdoor service set to open (no curfew or alcohol ban).
• Outdoor attractions including theme parks to open.

May 3rd

• Outdoor activities for up to 30 people.
• Weddings for up to 30 people.

May 10th

• Gyms, leisure centres and fitness facilities to open for 1-1 training

May 17th

• Children's indoor activities and community centres resume.

After May 17th but before June

• Indoor hospitality to open

Pilot events with crowds of up to 1,000 to take place in May.

I don't know why people keep insisting that England is WAAAAY ahead of the rest of the UK in reopening or what sort of point they think they're making, but it's awfully silly.

Self-contained holiday lets don't open in England until after April 12th but have been okay in Wales since earlier in March.

Stop.

Did you actually compare the plans in full before posting this?

It looks like you didn't bother your hole.

TonyMaloney

TonyMaloney wrote: »

Sweden postponed many cancer screenings etc too

Oh, are we allowed to compare Ireland to Sweden today?

Alrighty!

Sure, and maybe Sweden postponed more and maybe they postponed less. But you still don't know at present what the overall balance will be when it all shakes out. And that's not a personal attack. I'm sure you're super smart, but literally nobody knows, because the long-term consequences will have to be balanced against the short-term gains and vice versa.

TonyMaloney

TonyMaloney wrote: »

Did you actually compare the plans in full before posting this?

It looks like you didn't bother your hole.

I did, as it happens. But go on, tell everyone how smert you are. What's your objection?

paddyisreal

hynesie08 wrote: »

Yes, when people were comparing England to the rest of the UK, They really should have figured in a Welsh roadmap that didn't exist till yesterday.......

wales had rolling reviews every 3 weeks and with the vaccine roll out it is plain as day that they are ahead of england in lifting restrictions. if you looked and seen what has been lifted in wales in the last month that would be clear.

timmyntc

TonyMaloney wrote: »

Did you actually compare the plans in full before posting this?

It looks like you didn't bother your hole.

Top quality posting here from Tony

When you have been completely refuted by evidence, just throw out some baseless accusations against the other party

paddyisreal

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

The level of deference people have to someone's opinion purely because they're academics is baffling to me. I can only assume a lot of these people have never worked with, or been around, an academic. They're just as capable of getting things wrong as anyone else. Some of them are wildly uninformed regarding anything outside their specific area of study. That's not a criticism of them BTW - if you spend a lot of time studying a very narrow field, it's understandable that you won't be an expert in other fields, even if they're related.

On a related note, I also find it strange when people talk about the science being settled on matters related to COVID. That applies whether it's a positive or negative development. This thing has only been around for just over a year. We're nowhere near the point of science being settled, and won't be for quite some time, if ever. We can follow the best available information, but that information is always subject to change.

get what your saying about getting things wrong which happens but the problem is the likes of gerry killeen saying we need 100 percent vaccinations when everyone knows that is impossible. he is making a statement he knows cannot be possible to achieve but does it anyway to me that is just wrong.

Boggles

paddyisreal wrote: »

get what your saying about getting things wrong which happens but the problem is the likes of gerry killeen saying we need 100 percent vaccinations when everyone knows that is impossible. he is making a statement he knows cannot be possible to achieve but does it anyway to me that is just wrong.

No one charged with managing the pandemic is listening to Gerry.

The Big Easy

TonyMaloney wrote: »

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of the whole thing.

Lockdowns do not cause a surge in all-cause mortality rates. They prevent them by enabling or re-enabling the health service to operate as it should.
Things would get a lot worse for things like cancer screenings if we were to open up significantly right now.

You have the entire thing backwards.

Do you know what's actually going on in hospitals? People are avoiding them like the plague, they're probably the quietest they've ever been, certainly the A&Es anyway.

I'll speak from first-hand experience, I have type 1 diabetes and they've used Covid as an excuse to push out diabetic retinopathy screening from every one to two years. I have not been to a diabetic clinic in over two years and do not anticipate being called anytime soon, no matter how empty the hospitals are.

They are not and have no intention to allow the hospitals to operate as normal because they believe they need all this extra capacity for a fourth wave that just will not come during summer months, with vulnerable people being vaccinated every day, and the ongoing immunity from those who have already contracted the virus.

Even with all this in their favour they are not willing to run outpatient clinics and possibly decrease the backlog of waiting lists.

I don't know if you have moved to Ireland recently, but Ireland has always had a big HSE (mis)management crisis.

paddyisreal

Boggles wrote: »

No one charged with managing the pandemic is listening to Gerry.

thanks for that, i thought he was michael martins special advisor on it. thanks for the clarification.

Along with all the VARIANTS!!!!!! scaremongering I hope everyone remembers the scum counting stillbirths as Covid deaths and making headlines with it. Nowhere else in the world did it happen except Ireland and just those 2.

MOH

Boggles wrote: »

No one charged with managing the pandemic is listening to Gerry.

So not a single person involved with managing the pandemic has listened to anything he's said - not even listened to it and dismissed it?

Do you have evidence of this?

paddyisreal

Deleted User wrote: »

Along with all the VARIANTS!!!!!! scaremongering I hope everyone remembers the scum counting stillbirths as Covid deaths and making headlines with it. Nowhere else in the world did it happen except Ireland and just those 2.

Hard to believe they stopped that low, it was a slow news day and they needed something to keep covid at the front and center.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Along with all the VARIANTS!!!!!! scaremongering I hope everyone remembers the scum counting stillbirths as Covid deaths and making headlines with it. Nowhere else in the world did it happen except Ireland and just those 2.

On the variants: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9423329/Coronavirus-Pfizer-vaccine-protect-against-Brazilian-South-African-Covid-variants.html

"Pfizer Covid vaccine 'is 100% effective against South African variant, beats Brazilian strain'"

Nothing on rte.ie about it, of course. They'll have to find other variants to worry about.

hynesie08

Deleted User wrote: »

On the variants: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9423329/Coronavirus-Pfizer-vaccine-protect-against-Brazilian-South-African-Covid-variants.html

"Pfizer Covid vaccine 'is 100% effective against South African variant, beats Brazilian strain'"

Nothing on rte.ie about it, of course. They'll have to find other variants to worry about.

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0401/1207436-pfizer-biontech-coronavirus/

5 minutes after the daily mail........

ypres5

[Deleted User] wrote: »

On the variants: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9423329/Coronavirus-Pfizer-vaccine-protect-against-Brazilian-South-African-Covid-variants.html

"Pfizer Covid vaccine 'is 100% effective against South African variant, beats Brazilian strain'"

Nothing on rte.ie about it, of course. They'll have to find other variants to worry about.

'But what about the super scary variant that doesn't exist yet ?' say nphet. It might be like a whole new virus

hynesie08

hynesie08 wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0401/1207436-pfizer-biontech-coronavirus/

5 minutes after the daily mail........

Thanks. Sorry, I was looking for it on the website, but couldn't find it.

ypres5

ypres5 wrote: »

'But what about the super scary variant that doesn't exist yet ?' say nphet. It might be like a whole new virus

This is the problem with potential anything. Potential could mean a year or 20 years down the road.

Boggles

MOH wrote: »

So not a single person involved with managing the pandemic has listened to anything he's said - not even listened to it and dismissed it?

Do you have evidence of this?

That's next level pedantry, fair play to you.

PTH2009

You'd swear the Dublin players killed a puppy in the park the way the reaction is

Boggles

PTH2009 wrote: »

You'd swear the Dublin players killed a puppy in the park the way the reaction is

Did you miss the reaction on here yesterday when it was announced that inter county players can resume training on the 19th?

PTH2009

Boggles wrote: »

Did you miss the reaction on here yesterday when it was announced that inter county players can resume training on the 19th?

Bit there's load of groups of people in parks kicking balls around

Whatsisname

Boggles wrote: »

That's next level pedantry, fair play to you.

:pac: