When will it all end?

El_Duderino 09 · 04-03-2021 12:17PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0303/1200589-coronavirus-vaccine/

So last week we failed to hit the miserly target of 100k shots. Will totally be recovered though.

Yeah the problem is that we don't know what the limit is on the Irish side yet. The bottleneck so far is vaccine supply. They seem able to administer at least as many vaccines as they have have received up to this point. Is administering 250,000 vaccines a week target realistic? We don't know because they haven't had anything near that number in supply in a week yet. Time will tell

ujjjjjjjjj · 04-03-2021 12:18PM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

RTE does have a reasonable standard. Look at America for an accessible example of terrible news. But there's no point me suggesting sources so you can shoot them down. You'll have to have a look for yourself. The in-depth discussion of what to expect is often in interviews, podcasts and foreign news sources.

RTE is grand as broadcasters go. It's not reasonable top expect news readers to be investigative journalists. The alternative at the moment is to have Rupert Murdock pick and edit your news for you and that's definitely inferior (but more entertaining) than RTE.

If you read primary news sources, then you're in the minority (I'm not suggesting you're not telling the truth). Very few people read government announcements at source or read research articles.

The bit in bold: I think i was pretty clear that i was talking about the people who were surprised at the length of the pandemic and restrictions post vaccine - not about people who don't like the length. I don't like the length but I was not surprised by it as I was getting news that talked about these kinds of issues over the last year. If someone is surprised by the vaccine process and the time needed to get back to normal, then they either we'ren't getting good news or weren't taking it in.

Well if you think RTE is 'grand' I think I'll stop here........thanks for the chat.

El_Duderino 09 · 04-03-2021 12:18PM

Sobit1964 wrote: »

Maybe they are surprised as we will soon be celebrating the one year anniversary of 'two weeks to flatten the curve'?

Maybe. If that's the level on which they take in news then I'd say that's not the only thing they're surprised about.

El_Duderino 09 · 04-03-2021 12:20PM

ujjjjjjjjj wrote: »

Well if you think RTE is 'grand' I think I'll stop here........thanks for the chat.

RTE is grand as a broadcaster. It depends on what you expect a broadcaster to do. If you expect it to be your mammy and daddy and teach you all you need to know, then you'll be disappointed when you find out the reality. I don't get cross with RTE, i just have a realistic expectation of what it provides.

Ok. Stop it there. Stop taking in new information - seems par for the course in these discussions. But whatever you do, don't forget the irony of your response when you generously called mine "glib" earlier.

ujjjjjjjjj · 04-03-2021 12:37PM

No worries - let's just agree to diasgree on RTE - I think they little more than a government mouthpiece (not because they are fundamentally out to get us....conspiracy story stuff) but because to get access to government they need to toe the line. Start really being a journalist and deeply questioning government and RTE will just get the 'spokesperson not available stuff'. I have no problem with the latter as it really means journalists are actually doing their job.

No self respecting journalist will ever stay in RTE long. But to those who stay I understand it - safe job, pension, access, profile and being surrounded by echo chambers - what is not to like ?

I think the issue with RTE is as we are all taxed (and we have no option) to support them we are entitled to ask questions.

You on the other hand think they are grand. That's fine.

We disagree. No issue with that.

El_Duderino 09 · 04-03-2021 12:55PM

ujjjjjjjjj wrote: »

No worries - let's just agree to diasgree on RTE - I think they little more than a government mouthpiece (not because they are fundamentally out to get us....conspiracy story stuff) but because to get access to government they need to toe the line. Start really being a journalist and deeply questioning government and RTE will just get the 'spokesperson not available stuff'. I have no problem with the latter as it really means journalists are actually doing their job.

No self respecting journalist will ever stay in RTE long. But to those who stay I understand it - safe job, pension, access, profile and being surrounded by echo chambers - what is not to like ?

I think the issue with RTE is as we are all taxed (and we have no option) to support them we are entitled to ask questions.

You on the other hand think they are grand. That's fine.

We disagree. No issue with that.

Agree to disagree, but I think it's indicative that we're stuck talking about RTE as if they're the only source of news. They're not. They are a state broadcaster and (i think) they fulfil the role of national broadcaster "grand". They're still stuck with the established TV format of news presenter stabbing the obvious questions at politicians for 3 minutes and the politician has to stick to their prepared answers for those 3 minutes. It's not likely to be a very enlightening experience for anyone. But they're only one news source.

That's part of the picture, but it's not going to answer all the questions. The fact remains that lots of people either don't get good news or they just dismiss the news they don't want to hear. Every time you read someone on this thread say "Shur, we just need to vaccinate the over 85s, 80s, 75s etc. and drop the restrictions" you know they haven't been taking in any kind of in-depth discussions of the topic. Likewise when people dismiss the possibility of next winter causing a major problem, you know they haven't been engaging on the topic. These discussions have been held over the last year. Whether people get involved in them or not is a completely separate matter.

bluelamp · 04-03-2021 02:06PM

The airports in Belfast must be delighted.

Ryanair have launched 8 new sun routes from Belfast City airport, after having no routes from there in 11 years.

https://www.goqradio.com/belfast/news/q-radio-local-news/watch-belfast-city-airport-boss-welcomes-ryanair-return/

Plumbthedepths · 04-03-2021 02:20PM

bluelamp wrote: »

The airports in Belfast must be delighted.

Ryanair have launched 8 new sun routes from Belfast City airport, after having no routes from there in 11 years.

https://www.goqradio.com/belfast/news/q-radio-local-news/watch-belfast-city-airport-boss-welcomes-ryanair-return/

Going to make a nonsense of the €2000 fine travelling from Dublin airport.

ujjjjjjjjj · 04-03-2021 02:20PM

bluelamp wrote: »

The airports in Belfast must be delighted.

Ryanair have launched 8 new sun routes from Belfast City airport, after having no routes from there in 11 years.

https://www.goqradio.com/belfast/news/q-radio-local-news/watch-belfast-city-airport-boss-welcomes-ryanair-return/

Brilliant news for Belfast, Ryanair already getting ready for May June when travel restrictions lift in the UK and the Southern Irish flood across the border to get away.....once the North opens this thing is over bar closing the border.....

Tazz T · 04-03-2021 02:25PM

bluelamp wrote: »

I wouldn't write off travel just yet.

Greece has already jumped ship from the EU vaccine passport, saying its taking too long and they will allow anyone in with either a vaccine, or negative test, with no quarantine.

They have been open for travel since July last year - and despite the blame on all things travel in Ireland, Greece has done far better than us with case numbers.

Cyprus, Israel, and Greece are opening travel corridors with each other.

Spain has said it will act unilaterally and allow visitors in from the UK regardless of the EU decisions.

Portugal is pushing for freedom of movement within the EU as soon as possible.

The EU need to come up with an action plan soon if they want to manage travel as a group. Otherwise more countries are going to make their own decisions.

Greece is far from open for travel at the moment. They're talking about 1st June onwards, but currently battling a new wave despite severe lockdown since December (UK variant to blame by the looks of things). They need to get that under control before then, but two months will probably do it.

Looking at some of the new 'waves' in Europe, it seems to be the countries that managed to avoid the worst of earlier waves (or didn't have the full three waves) that are being affected. The learning might that severe lockdowns simply delay the inevitable and the best strategy is what it was at the beginning - 'flatten the curve' and protect the hospitals from being overrun while the virus runs its course.

ujjjjjjjjj · 04-03-2021 02:29PM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Agree to disagree, but I think it's indicative that we're stuck talking about RTE as if they're the only source of news. They're not. They are a state broadcaster and (i think) they fulfil the role of national broadcaster "grand". They're still stuck with the established TV format of news presenter stabbing the obvious questions at politicians for 3 minutes and the politician has to stick to their prepared answers for those 3 minutes. It's not likely to be a very enlightening experience for anyone. But they're only one news source.

That's part of the picture, but it's not going to answer all the questions. The fact remains that lots of people either don't get good news or they just dismiss the news they don't want to hear. Every time you read someone on this thread say "Shur, we just need to vaccinate the over 85s, 80s, 75s etc. and drop the restrictions" you know they haven't been taking in any kind of in-depth discussions of the topic. Likewise when people dismiss the possibility of next winter causing a major problem, you know they haven't been engaging on the topic. These discussions have been held over the last year. Whether people get involved in them or not is a completely separate matter.

Or perhaps they have reviewed all the data and information and come to the conclusion that once the elderly (whatever line they draw) and the medically vulnerable are vaccinated that the risk is minimal to the rest of the population and the risk of not opening up and damage being caused outweighs the minor risk left..................

Just because someone disagrees with the government approach and the RTE feeding of it does not mean they haven't been taking an in-depth approach to their own research and opinion forming.

ujjjjjjjjj · 04-03-2021 02:39PM

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Going to make a nonsense of the €2000 fine travelling from Dublin airport.

Entire thing will become a joke despite ranting and outrage on RTE - all that will happen is piles of Southern Irish will head North fly off to whichever sun destination is taking vaccinated tourists (Spain and Greece both look likely very soon) and there is sweet FA that the Irish government can do about it.

If the Irish government had half a brain cell it would immediately be working with the British government to create an identical travel strategy across the UK and Ireland under the CTA. As it stands the UK is honouring the CTA as you can enter the UK unrestricted from Ireland but the Irish government isn't as if you are coming from mainland UK you have to isolate etc. Of course many people who need to travel to Ireland from the UK are just using NI backdoor. This would allow free travel in the CTA with further overseas travel having exactly the same restrictions so if for example Greece takes vaccinated tourists Irish or British people can fly there.

If the Irish government doesn't do this it gurantees that people will head North to get away. The only way Ireland could ensure independent integrity with it's own travel restrictions is to close the NI border.

Anything else is a fudge.

El_Duderino 09 · 04-03-2021 02:42PM

ujjjjjjjjj wrote: »

Or perhaps they have reviewed all the data and information and come to the conclusion that once the elderly (whatever line they draw) and the medically vulnerable are vaccinated that the risk is minimal to the rest of the population and the risk of not opening up and damage being caused outweighs the minor risk left..................

Just because someone disagrees with the government approach and the RTE feeding of it does not mean they haven't been taking an in-depth approach to their own research and opinion forming.

Yeah but that’s finger in the air stuff. If people have made decisions about how vaccinating they over (insert age here) are vaccinated then we should open up, it’s based on the desire to open up, not any kind of analysis of the data.

You keep bringing up RTE.

The discussion about when exactly to reopen this summer is a fair one. The weather will be the bigger determining factor than the vaccination as the vaccine supply has been so much slower than anticipated so far. No point expecting any change this month. The giver has made its position pretty clear. Best we can hope for is an increased supply of vaccine and a warm March and April. We’ll open up during the summer.

The bigger questions are around next winter and what happens to hospitalisations and deaths. Only time will tell.

Tazz T · 04-03-2021 02:49PM

beggars_bush wrote: »

People in greece haven't been stuck inside all winter
They don't have a land border with one of the most highly infected countries in the world, a lot of whom decided to travel here before xmas

Greece have been stuck inside all winter. You need to apply online to go to the shop for groceries. And they've had huge problems with infections coming through the northern macedonian border.

04-03-2021 02:51PM

~70 people under 55 have died with Covid in the last year.
117 people 55-65 have died with Covid in the last year.

Hurry the **** up, get over 65s then over 55s vaccinated and open up.

bucketybuck · 04-03-2021 02:55PM

ujjjjjjjjj wrote: »

If the Irish government had half a brain cell it would immediately be working with the British government to create an identical travel strategy across the UK and Ireland under the CTA.

If this government has shown anything, it is that they don't do anything.

No plans, no ideas, no improvements, no suggestions, nothing. They have sat on their hands and buried their heads in the sand when even just a small amount of proactivity could have helped a lot of people.

Talking to their closest neighbour and developing some simple coping strategies wouldn't even be a massive challenge politically and they couldn't manage even that.

They are utterly useless.

Tazz T · 04-03-2021 02:57PM

bluelamp wrote: »

The airports in Belfast must be delighted.

Ryanair have launched 8 new sun routes from Belfast City airport, after having no routes from there in 11 years.

https://www.goqradio.com/belfast/news/q-radio-local-news/watch-belfast-city-airport-boss-welcomes-ryanair-return/

I brought this up a few pages back. This was a cert. City of Derry next.

Scotty # · 04-03-2021 03:03PM

Deleted User wrote: »

~70 people under 55 have died with Covid in the last year.
117 people 55-65 have died with Covid in the last year.

Hurry the **** up, get over 65s then over 55s vaccinated and open up.

How many have been hospitalised?

ujjjjjjjjj · 04-03-2021 03:07PM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Yeah but that’s finger in the air stuff. If people have made decisions about how vaccinating they over (insert age here) are vaccinated then we should open up, it’s based on the desire to open up, not any kind of analysis of the data.

You keep bringing up RTE.

The discussion about when exactly to reopen this summer is a fair one. The weather will be the bigger determining factor than the vaccination as the vaccine supply has been so much slower than anticipated so far. No point expecting any change this month. The giver has made its position pretty clear. Best we can hope for is an increased supply of vaccine and a warm March and April. We’ll open up during the summer.

The bigger questions are around next winter and what happens to hospitalisations and deaths. Only time will tell.

Read the CSO data and you will clearly see there is an tiny risk to younger and middle aged people and the death and hospitalizations are heavily weighted to the very elderly......... This data is mirrored across the world and has been since last Jan with the first sets of Chinese data.

If you are under 65 Covid should not be a concern for you unless you have a severe underlying health condition - if you are concerned you are either neurotic or you have totally bought into all the hysteria been fed to us.

If you are over 65 is Covid a death sentence ? - no, but some caution and care is sensible and it's clear now that our dysfunctional health service can't cope with any significant load so the government will continue to lockdown so to speak.

If you are 80 plus or in very poor health it is a more serious risk and the numbers of dead in this age bracket show that more caution is needed but the great irony is the one section of the population that needed protecting wasn't as the virus got into nursing homes which could have easily been prevented.

There is huge logic to drawing a line in the sand and opening up once a certain age cohort have been vaccinated. It is a balance between the damage being caused by the virus and damage being caused by lockdown.

ujjjjjjjjj · 04-03-2021 03:09PM

bucketybuck wrote: »

If this government has shown anything, it is that they don't do anything.

No plans, no ideas, no improvements, no suggestions, nothing. They have sat on their hands and buried their heads in the sand when even just a small amount of proactivity could have helped a lot of people.

Talking to their closest neighbour and developing some simple coping strategies wouldn't even be a massive challenge politically and they couldn't manage even that.

They are utterly useless.

Agree entirely.

Mr. Karate · 04-03-2021 03:09PM

Deleted User wrote: »

~70 people under 55 have died with Covid in the last year.
117 people 55-65 have died with Covid in the last year.

Hurry the **** up, get over 65s then over 55s vaccinated and open up.

Over 200 GPs are complaining that they haven't received their batch of the vaccines to start vaccinating the over 85s yet.

When does the HSE finally get taken to task for their constant incompetence?

You would figure that after the protest in Dublin and the campus street party last weekend that the Govt and HSE would cop on and realize that people are beyond fed up of this and are moving on whether they like it or not.

El_Duderino 09 · 04-03-2021 03:16PM

bucketybuck wrote: »

If this government has shown anything, it is that they don't do anything.

No plans, no ideas, no improvements, no suggestions, nothing. They have sat on their hands and buried their heads in the sand when even just a small amount of proactivity could have helped a lot of people.

Talking to their closest neighbour and developing some simple coping strategies wouldn't even be a massive challenge politically and they couldn't manage even that.

They are utterly useless.

That’s just a silly statement. I don’t plan to defend government for doing a brilliant job, but to stay they have done nothing is silly. They kept things open at the start, and closed things down when they had to. They brought in a furlough system to pay people and support businesses. They opened up again in the summer, closed down again when things got bad again. They tried to allow some normality for Christmas because people said they really wanted that. Then they closed down again when things got out and hand again.

Now they’re rolling out all the vaccines they get and will begin reopening next month.

It might be fair to say they didn’t do anything unique compared to other countries. Our infection rates per population and deaths per population rates are lower than other countries which reflects the fact that Ireland was locked down more effectively than comparable countries.

You can argue about the things the Irish government did, but I don’t think you could make the case that they did nothing.

El_Duderino 09 · 04-03-2021 03:17PM

Mr. Karate wrote: »

Over 200 GPs are complaining that they haven't received their batch of the vaccines to start vaccinating the over 85s yet.

When does the HSE finally get taken to task for their constant incompetence?

You would figure that after the protest in Dublin and the campus street party last weekend that the Govt and HSE would cop on and realize that people are beyond fed up of this and are moving on whether they like it or not.

Does the HSE have the vaccines and they’re not distributing them properly or wasting them? Or are they distributing all the vaccines they get?

Mr. Karate · 04-03-2021 03:22PM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Does the HSE have the vaccines and they’re not distributing them properly or wasting them? Or are they distributing all the vaccines they get?

God only knows with these idiots.

Scotty # · 04-03-2021 03:25PM

bucketybuck wrote: »

Talking to their closest neighbour and developing some simple coping strategies wouldn't even be a massive challenge politically and they couldn't manage even that.

I sometimes wonder do people here read the news at all? (from any news source!)

El_Duderino 09 · 04-03-2021 03:27PM

Mr. Karate wrote: »

God only knows with these idiots.

How do we know they’re idiots if we can’t tell the difference between them ballsing it up and them effectively distributing the vaccines they have?

Mr. Karate · 04-03-2021 03:34PM

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

How do we know they’re idiots if we can’t tell the difference between them ballsing it up and them effectively distributing the vaccines they have?

HSE gone from scandal to scandal to scandal. They're Idiots. Incompetence should be unacceptable with this. The media love calling anybody not following these restrictions to the letter "Granny Killers". Maybe that term should be reflected back at the HSE. Lord knows their incompetence will kill more people than John or Jane Doe not wearing a mask 24/7 or going an inch over 5kms.

Kunta Kinte · 04-03-2021 03:39PM

Mr. Karate wrote: »

God only knows with these idiots.

So you have no idea but just decided to have an auld rant for the sake of it anyway? Surprise surprise.........not.:rolleyes:

Mr. Karate · 04-03-2021 03:43PM

Kunta Kinte wrote: »

So you have no idea but just decided to have an auld rant for the sake of it anyway? Surprise surprise.........not.:rolleyes:

And I should care about what you think....why?

HansKroenke · 04-03-2021 03:47PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

~70 people under 55 have died with Covid in the last year.
117 people 55-65 have died with Covid in the last year.

Hurry the **** up, get over 65s then over 55s vaccinated and open up.

172 people too many, just so you can have a pint. And long covid too.

Hurr durr rabble rabble.

Context is the word totally lost on anti-relaxxers and covid doomers. Don't even try to highlight that mental health is a far, far greater worry for the U55s than covid.

When will it all end?

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