Cycle infrastructure planned for south Dublin

First Up · 02-03-2021 01:36PM

CramCycle wrote:

As someone who lived there for years, I do wonder do you actually live in the area. It will add very little time on in commuter times. Loads of alternatives as I imagine you actually know if you live around the area.

I know the area well enough to know that the roads around Sandymount and Lansdowne Rd that lead to the East Link are not designed or suitable for heavy commercial traffic. You don't care but if DCC are taking away the Strand Rd option you would like to think they have thought about the consequences.

First Up · 02-03-2021 01:38PM

DoraDelite wrote:

What's your final destination, not a point on the journey. Are you going to Swords? Navan? Drogheda for example?

Dublin Airport, A ferry terminal, 3 Arena. Take your pick.

First Up · 02-03-2021 01:40PM

Fighting Tao wrote:

Jaysus. The Port Tunnel (if that is what you meant) is not a destination unless you are going to the company that operates it. LOL. To get there from Blackrock go in the Merrion Road and head for Samuel Beckett bridge onto Guild St, turn right onto Sheriff St Upper, go to end of road, turn left and straight to the tunnel.

So the East Link Bridge is effectively redundant going north?

Seth Brundle · 02-03-2021 01:41PM

First Up wrote: »

I know the area well enough to know that the roads around Sandymount and Lansdowne Rd that lead to the East Link are not designed or suitable for heavy commercial traffic. You don't care but if DCC are taking away the Strand Rd option you would like to think they have thought about the consequences.

You mean like banning large commercial vehicles from the area?

CramCycle · 02-03-2021 01:47PM

First Up wrote: »

I know the area well enough to know that the roads around Sandymount and Lansdowne Rd that lead to the East Link are not designed or suitable for heavy commercial traffic. You don't care but if DCC are taking away the Strand Rd option you would like to think they have thought about the consequences.

There was going to be a ban on such vehicles in the area so that point is mute, any coming up there should be out to the M50 and around by the port tunnel. Those who have exceptions to be in the area would more likely go up the Rock Road into town and across the Liffey. Your own point is beyond daft as the Strand Road wasn't designed or suitable for heavy commercial traffic, the only part near there that is is at the East Link Toll around the recycling centre. Again, I don't think you live in the area at all. Once you hit Irish town, the roads are not heavy vehicle usage roads and are not built to accomodate them. In fact this plan makes the Strand Road at least usable for outbound heavy vehicles.

So just to be clear, you don't live in the area and you don't know what you are talking about, have I got that right. I say this as someone who thinks the bike track is unnecessary, but the single lane one way system is very necessary. Put an average speed camera system at both ends, limit it at 30kmph, job done.

Also, for the love of god please google traffic evaporation before posting again as I will have to start presuming that you are not willing to engage in discussion.

First Up · 02-03-2021 01:47PM

Seth Brundle wrote:

You mean like banning large commercial vehicles from the area?

Which also means they can't use the East Link Bridge.

Don't you think that's a lot of trouble for the sake of a few hundred meters of boardwalk?

CramCycle · 02-03-2021 01:50PM

First Up wrote: »

Which also means they can't use the East Link Bridge.

Don't you think that's a lot of trouble for the sake of a few hundred meters of boardwalk?

You are missing your own point quite blatantly, Strand Road itself was not designed or suitable for heavy commercial vehicles en masse. Never has been. You said so yourself when you named other surrounding roads that are equally unsuitable.

AndrewJRenko · 02-03-2021 01:50PM

First Up wrote: »

I know the area well enough to know that the roads around Sandymount and Lansdowne Rd that lead to the East Link are not designed or suitable for heavy commercial traffic. You don't care but if DCC are taking away the Strand Rd option you would like to think they have thought about the consequences.

Is Strand Road designed or suitable for heavy commercial traffic? Residential street, lots of private cars stored on public space, outdoor amenity spaces adjacent?

First Up · 02-03-2021 01:55PM

CramCycle wrote:

So just to be clear, you don't live in the area and you don't know what you are talking about, have I got that right. I say this as someone who thinks the bike track is unnecessary, but the single lane one way system is very necessary. Put an average speed camera system at both ends, limit it at 30kmph, job done.

I never said it was unnecessary. I never even said it isn't a good idea. I just said that closing Strand Rd to cars, minibuses, delivery vans and all other motorised traffic and the resulting disruption is a perverse way to do it, when a few hundred meters of boardwalk solves the problem.

DoraDelite · 02-03-2021 01:57PM

First Up wrote: »

Dublin Airport, A ferry terminal, 3 Arena. Take your pick.

Great examples of infrequent journeys from Blackrock, particularly the Ferry terminal, what's that one, once a year at best?

Dublin airport - M50, currently 34 mins on google maps. Lets not forget that a lot of the flight schedules are early morning/late evening so your trip on the M50 is generally off peak.

Dublin port - according to google maps take Tritonville Road, currently says 21 mins. Here's the ferry schedule currently, all off peak times:
Dub - France 16:00
Dub - Holyhead - 08:15, 8:05, 14:30, 14:45

3 Arena - you'd be quicker cycling when there's a concert on even with Strand road open. 30 min hop on a bike. But if you insist on driving and you'll need to park, then you are heading for the car park on north wall road, you have several options to get there also.

Seth Brundle · 02-03-2021 02:03PM

First Up wrote: »

Which also means they can't use the East Link Bridge.

Don't you think that's a lot of trouble for the sake of a few hundred meters of boardwalk?

You're going around in circles. If you took the brief time required to look at a map you would see that there are plenty of routes to access the East Link from the southside. Stop convincing yourself that there aren't!

as for a boardwalk, I don't want one. I never said that I did and if I were to back one, I know that between NIMBY residents, local councillors and opposition for environmental reasons, it would take many many years and a heck of a lot of money if it ever happened.

tomasrojo · 02-03-2021 02:04PM

The relevant bit of text is slightly obscured, but did the NTA say that the off-road alternative would take six years to develop?

https://twitter.com/0xB0D/status/1362557259906244620

First Up · 02-03-2021 02:05PM

AndrewJRenko wrote:

Is Strand Road designed or suitable for heavy commercial traffic? Residential street, lots of private cars stored on public space, outdoor amenity spaces adjacent?

It is able to handle private cars, minibuses, tradesmen in white vans - even oil delivery trucks. All of which would have to go somewhere else.

breezy1985 · 02-03-2021 02:15PM

DoraDelite wrote: »

Great examples of infrequent journeys from Blackrock, particularly the Ferry terminal, what's that one, once a year at best?

Dublin airport - M50, currently 34 mins on google maps. Lets not forget that a lot of the flight schedules are early morning/late evening so your trip on the M50 is generally off peak.

Dublin port - according to google maps take Tritonville Road, currently says 21 mins. Here's the ferry schedule currently, all off peak times:
Dub - France 16:00
Dub - Holyhead - 08:15, 8:05, 14:30, 14:45

3 Arena - you'd be quicker cycling when there's a concert on even with Strand road open. 30 min hop on a bike. But if you insist on driving and you'll need to park, then you are heading for the car park on north wall road, you have several options to get there also.

And driving to the airport or a gig is a leisure drive

First Up · 02-03-2021 02:20PM

Seth Brundle wrote:

If you took the brief time required to look at a map you would see that there are plenty of routes to access the East Link from the southside. Stop convincing yourself that there aren't!

So through Ballsbridge, down Shelbourne Rd in as far as Pearse Street and then down through the narrow streets of Ringsend. Which of us is going around in circles?

Seth Brundle wrote:

as for a boardwalk, I don't want one. I never said that I did and if I were to back one, I know that between NIMBY residents, local councillors and opposition for environmental reasons, it would take many many years and a heck of a lot of money if it ever happened.

A boardwalk would be lovely and well within engineering capability. You didn't say why you don't want one but some Strand Rd residents might prefer it to going around in circles.

tomasrojo · 02-03-2021 02:20PM

breezy1985 wrote: »

And driving to the airport or a gig is a leisure drive

Yeah, good point! If it's not shopping or commuting it's leisure. Them's the rules.

Fighting Tao · 02-03-2021 02:26PM

First Up wrote: »

So the East Link Bridge is effectively redundant going north?

No. You can still go there if you are so obsessed. I just did the route with the better roads and no tolls. The route from Timbuktu to the North Pole vis the East Link put me off tolls.

If you are driving to the 3Arena, having lived in the area for years, I’d recommend parking in Ringsend rather than spending over an hour in traffic waiting to cross the East Link, but you may be happy to be traffic for so long.

silverharp · 02-03-2021 02:27PM

The Roslyn Park site has been flooded once or twice with freak tides so extending the promenade would come with lots of side benefits but while from an engineering perspective looks as simple as you can get, wont be seeing it in the 5 years anyway.

AndrewJRenko · 02-03-2021 02:35PM

First Up wrote: »

It is able to handle private cars, minibuses, tradesmen in white vans - even oil delivery trucks. All of which would have to go somewhere else.

That's not the question that I asked you though.

yascaoimhin · 02-03-2021 02:43PM

First Up wrote: »

A boardwalk would be lovely and well within engineering capability.

Building a boardwalk into a protected UNESCO biosphere would require full planning permission. An additional hurdle to overcome to have permission granted to build into a biosphere is an admission that you have exhausted all other alternatives.

The on-road cycle track is an alternative. It must be considered first and proven to be unworkable for the boardwalk to be considered.

A small increase in existing traffic levels as the traffic study pointed has already out would not be reason enough to have the project be considered unworkable.

Especially when one considers that the cycle lane will have the impact of reducing traffic to a degree.

The original consideration and plan for the boardwalk predates the designation of all of Dublin Bay as a biosphere.

Trudee · 02-03-2021 02:46PM

DCC and NTA ran the Eastern Regional Model with Strand Road reduced to one lane and Merrion Gates no entry - and to quote from this ERM modelled change “The increases are shown to be unsurprisingly on Merrion Road where city bound traffic in general will now use along with vehicles wanting to access the East Link”

Fighting Tao · 02-03-2021 02:48PM

Trudee wrote: »

DCC and NTA ran the Eastern Regional Model with Strand Road reduced to one lane and Merrion Gates no entry - and to quote from this ERM modelled change “The increases are shown to be unsurprisingly on Merrion Road where city bound traffic in general will now use along with vehicles wanting to access the East Link”

Seeing that the Merrion Road will take them quite far inland, do you not think many will opt to use the Samuel Beckett bridge instead?

Trudee · 02-03-2021 02:57PM

Not from the predicted increases in Sandymount Avenue, Sandymount Road, Park Avenue, Serpentine Ave also from same same study. Some may use Samuel Beckett bridge but the predicted increases on surrounding roads would suggest a lot won’t.

First Up · 02-03-2021 03:03PM

AndrewJRenko wrote:

That's not the question that I asked you though.

What was your question?

Heavy commercial traffic doesn't use Strand Rd anyway but lots of other vehicles do. The vehicles currently using Strand Rd are big and numerous enough to create problems on all alternative routes to the East Link.

First Up · 02-03-2021 03:04PM

breezy1985 wrote:

And driving to the airport or a gig is a leisure drive

Not for everyone.

Fighting Tao · 02-03-2021 03:18PM

First Up wrote: »

What was your question?

Heavy commercial traffic doesn't use Strand Rd anyway but lots of other vehicles do. The vehicles currently using Strand Rd are big and numerous enough to create problems on all alternative routes to the East Link.

Stop with the lies. There are lots of 5 axle trucks using Strand Road.

AndrewJRenko · 02-03-2021 03:27PM

First Up wrote: »

What was your question?

Heavy commercial traffic doesn't use Strand Rd anyway but lots of other vehicles do. The vehicles currently using Strand Rd are big and numerous enough to create problems on all alternative routes to the East Link.

Are you the same poster that was telling me at length about all the heavy commercial traffic using Strand Road and heading to the port?

My question was about whether Strand Road was designed and suitable for heavy traffic. You were complaining about the local roads not being designed and suitable for heavy traffic, so I asked you the same question about Strand Road.

Larbre34 · 02-03-2021 03:30PM

Fighting Tao wrote: »

Stop with the lies. There are lots of 5 axle trucks using Strand Road.

There aren't. There really are not. Head down there and do a morning and evening count for yourself.

Also, any HGV with business in the area, such as delivering construction materials or supplying a business, are perfectly entitled to go where they like. You would have to have the data to subtract those vehicles to get a net extraneous traffic figure.

CramCycle · 02-03-2021 03:31PM

First Up wrote: »

It is able to handle private cars, minibuses, tradesmen in white vans - even oil delivery trucks. All of which would have to go somewhere else.

Again, they actually don't in one direction and in the other direction DEPENDENT ON THEIR FINAL DESTINATION, there are several other options with little or no time penalties.

First Up wrote: »

So through Ballsbridge, down Shelbourne Rd in as far as Pearse Street and then down through the narrow streets of Ringsend. Which of us is going around in circles?

Again this proves you don't live there as most locals would not use that route, you would cross the Liffey further up, most locals do anyway as with traffic at commuter times, it is the same time to do that without the risk of some muppet stalling or not having change at the toll.

A boardwalk would be lovely and well within engineering capability. You didn't say why you don't want one but some Strand Rd residents might prefer it to going around in circles.

Protected Biosphere, if you think it would be easy? I suspect more likely that you know its not but don't care. As I also said before, I don't care about the cycle lane, restricting the Strand Road to one way is a good idea fundamentally.

First Up wrote: »

Heavy commercial traffic doesn't use Strand Rd anyway but lots of other vehicles do. The vehicles currently using Strand Rd are big and numerous enough to create problems on all alternative routes to the East Link.

You were the one asking where heavy vehicles would go earlier so which one is it? You mentioned trucks being forced through the village (not what will happen), you mentioned commercial transport using the road, you repeatedly mention trucks using the Strand Road. Stop changing the goal posts.

First Up wrote: »

So now we can add evaporation to repurposed. Keep 'em coming.

This is a legitimate theory in traffic management. How can you keep talking with such certainty when you don't even understand the basics of wat you are talking about. Go onto google and read up on it before posting as it actually hurts to listen to someone who can't even listen to valid, researched points. Most posters have listened to yours and come up with points that either agree or counter yours. Please engage properly in the discussion going forward.

Peregrine · 02-03-2021 03:34PM

First Up wrote: »

the roads around Sandymount and Lansdowne Rd that lead to the East Link are not designed or suitable for heavy commercial traffic. You don't care but if DCC are taking away the Strand Rd option you would like to think they have thought about the consequences.

First Up wrote: »

Heavy commercial traffic doesn't use Strand Rd anyway but lots of other vehicles do.

You're now arguing against yourself.

Cycle infrastructure planned for south Dublin

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