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COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 2 [Mod Warning - Post #1]

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Comments

  • #9092
    hmmm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,203 ✭✭✭✭hmmm


    Deathofcool wrote: »
    That's what I make it out to be from the previously linked article below

    https://www.zdf.de/nachrichten/panorama/corona-impfstoff-herstellung-lieferung-2021-100.html

    Germany are getting 342 million doses for a population of 83 million. I am assuming this doesn't include any of Germany's own deals.
    I believe we had purchased 14 million doses before the end of 2020, so it wouldn't surprise me if we were higher than that now. It's all peanuts anyway compared to the economic cost of lockdown.

    I believe that any excess purchases in EU countries will be going to poorer countries, so all good.

    I suspect in reality some of that spare capacity might end up used to purchase booster doses for high-risk groups later in the year.


  • #9093
    monkeybutter
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,141 ✭✭✭monkeybutter


    Micky 32 wrote: »
    Not too many. Experts reckon it won’t mutate much more in the future. The mutants won’t be able to keep up with the vaccines.

    Where are you getting this, a crystal ball?


  • #9094
    Micky 32
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,625 ✭✭✭Micky 32


    monkeybutter wrote: »
    Where are you getting this, a crystal ball?


    Yeah, just giving it a bit of a shine as we speak. Very therapeutic.


  • #9095
    Gael23
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,149 ✭✭✭✭Gael23


    NIMAN wrote: »
    It's a massive disappointment.
    Maybe it's because I'm hearing the figures from the UK and NI, which are putting us to shame.

    But maybe the UK is an outlier and all of the eu is going slow?

    The U.K. are nit giving people enough in itprder to give some to more people. That will soon backfire


  • #9096
    blackcard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,317 ✭✭✭blackcard


    Gael23 wrote: »
    The U.K. are nit giving people enough in itprder to give some to more people. That will soon backfire


    ??????????????


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  • #9097
    josip
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,750 ✭✭✭✭josip


    Will figures be released at some stage what has been the %age uptake in the various Groups?
    Are we expecting 80-90% uptake of the vaccine across all Groups?


  • #9098
    Water John
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,832 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    I think some survey showed over 80% willing to be vaccinated. I would expect that to be higher in older groups and less among younger groups.
    You couldn't have an accurate % of any group until that cohort have all been offered it and then some may have delays eg having active Covid.


  • #9099
    Wolf359f
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,399 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    Deathofcool wrote: »
    Based on the previous article linked with the German vaccine allocation I make out our equivalent allocation below. Obviously highly caveated.

    vac-no.png

    That's a big ramp up with Pfizer, being one of the hardest to produce, while AZ should be the easiest.


  • #9100
    eoinbn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 877 ✭✭✭eoinbn


    Wolf359f wrote: »
    That's a big ramp up with Pfizer, being one of the hardest to produce, while AZ should be the easiest.

    mRna vaccines aren't more difficult to make it is just that nobody has produced then at scale before. Once the infrastructure exists they are apparently easier to produce than the AZ platform. The evidence would suggest this is true. Pfizer/BioNtech and Moderna have hit their targets while AZ have missed most of theirs.


  • #9101
    Wolf359f
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,399 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    eoinbn wrote: »
    mRna vaccines aren't more difficult to make it is just that nobody has produced then at scale before. Once the infrastructure exists they are apparently easier to produce than the AZ platform. The evidence would suggest this is true. Pfizer/BioNtech and Moderna have hit their targets while AZ have missed most of theirs.

    I'm just amazed how much has changed on the vaccine front within a year.
    Posters on here saying we will never have a vaccine for a coronavirus, to it will take years to create a vaccine, to where we are now with so many proving efficient.
    Takes a global pandemic for the world to take action I guess.


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  • #9102
    Irish Stones
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,308 ✭✭✭Irish Stones


    afatbollix wrote: »
    Nothing is 100%, A PCR test is 97% and also costs e99 each. It has to be checked in a lab, It's not like you will be spending that kind of cash per day.


    Many tests (antibodies tests and antigenes tests) in other fields are up to 99.5% accurate. So, it is true, you're right, nothing is 100%, but I think that 99.5% is very close to it, and for just 15 euro, which is a very good price.


  • #9103
    Hmob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 256 ✭✭Hmob


    What's the verdict on healthcare workers refusing the vaccine and should they be allowed to continue to work?

    Seems to me that they pose a risk?


  • #9104
    funnydoggy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,065 ✭✭✭funnydoggy


    Good morning folks. Here's to another week of positivity and great news.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dguz0IsCuKU



    Ooh child
    Things are gonna get easier
    Ooh child
    Things'll get brighter

    :D:D


  • #9105
    Irish Stones
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,308 ✭✭✭Irish Stones


    namloc1980 wrote: »
    Aren't you supposed to hang around for 15 minutes in case of reaction?


    What's the point of waiting 15 minutes if you're getting a reaction an hour later?
    I know people who felt bad much later than 15 minutes after taking the vaccine.


  • #9106
    iamwhoiam
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,248 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    Irish Stones wrote: »
    What's the point of waiting 15 minutes if you're getting a reaction an hour later?
    I know people who felt bad much later than 15 minutes after taking the vaccine.

    In case of an allergic reaction which usually happens within 15 minutes .


  • #9107
    Irish Stones
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,308 ✭✭✭Irish Stones


    iamwhoiam wrote: »
    In case of an allergic reaction which usually happens within 15 minutes .


    Yes, I got it, but what if someone is feeling bad an hour later, as it happened?


  • #9108
    iamwhoiam
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,248 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    Irish Stones wrote: »
    Yes, I got it, but what if someone is feeling bad an hour later, as it happened?

    Well I guess you ring your GP then .


  • #9109
    harr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,511 ✭✭✭harr


    Speaking to relatives and friends in U.K. over the weekend that have been vaccinated one in his 50,s with mild asthma and another who had cancer 10 years ago both are now fully vaccinated which makes the roll out here even more disappointing. It’s crazy to think people like my parents in their early 80,s might not be fully vaccinated till April a full 4 months after the vaccine arrived in the country.


  • #9110
    Martina1991
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,548 ✭✭✭Martina1991


    Irish Stones wrote: »
    Many tests (antibodies tests and antigenes tests) in other fields are up to 99.5% accurate. So, it is true, you're right, nothing is 100%, but I think that 99.5% is very close to it, and for just 15 euro, which is a very good price.
    No antigen or antibody rapid test has an accuracy of 99.5%. Not in a real life setting.

    Often assay study populations include a high proportion of people who have symptoms and highly suspicious of having the disease. Therefore it will say in the literature those tests should only be used in those with symptoms and PCR should then be done on negatives.

    But people don't read or heed that and think the test will be just as accurate in those with no symptoms as a screening test when it is not.


    Example of a device from Abbott
    INTENDED USE: ID NOW COVID-19 assay performed on the ID NOW Instrument is a rapid molecular in vitro diagnostic test utilizing an isothermal nucleic acid amplification technology intended for the qualitative detection of nucleic acid from the SARS-CoV-2 viral RNA in direct nasal, nasopharyngeal or throat swabs from individuals who are suspected of COVID-19 by their healthcare provider within the first seven days of the onset of symptoms

    PERFORMANCE CHARACTERISTICS:
    Clinical Study:The performance of ID NOW COVID-19 was evaluated using contrived clinical nasopharyngeal (NP) swab specimens obtained from individuals with signs and symptoms of respiratory illness. The samples were prepared by spiking clinical NP swab matrix with purified viral RNA containing target sequences from the SARS-CoV-2 genome at concentrations approximately 2x LOD and 5x LOD.

    https://www.fda.gov/media/136525/download


  • #9111
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    harr wrote: »
    Speaking to relatives and friends in U.K. over the weekend that have been vaccinated one in his 50,s with mild asthma and another who had cancer 10 years ago both are now fully vaccinated which makes the roll out here even more disappointing. It’s crazy to think people like my parents in their early 80,s might not be fully vaccinated till April a full 4 months after the vaccine arrived in the country.
    Well, if you can magick up some vaccines we'll all be pleased. The why of this has been explained many, many, many times.


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  • #9112
    Irish Stones
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,308 ✭✭✭Irish Stones


    Martina1991 wrote: »
    No antigen or antibody rapid test has an accuracy of 99.5%. Not in a real life setting.

    My mistake, I apologise, but not so far from what I meant, there are tests, in other clinical fields, with sensitivity and specificity in excess of 98%. Which is rather good, in my opinion, much better than 92%.


  • #9113
    pconn062
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,370 ✭✭✭pconn062


    hmmm wrote: »
    I don't think we are going to be reopening once the highly vulnerable have been vaccinated, it will need much more widespread vaccinations first. If we let the virus spread unrestricted through the "non-vulnerable", it is still more than capable of causing widespread hospitalisations and deaths.

    However once everyone who wants a vaccine has got one (late Summer I'm hoping for) and the vaccines prevent against most hospitalisations and deaths, I can't see governments not lifting most restrictions. An argument that we need to eliminate it because there might be mutants in the future just won't cut it - we know there will be a flu pandemic at some time in the future, but we live with the risk.

    The economic impact of keeping lockdowns "just in case" will be too much, and we won't want to be too far behind other countries when they drop restrictions.

    This is the major issue for a lot of people. While the vaccine news is largely positive there needs to be a dramatic shift in the noise coming from the government about the virus. There needs to be a clear plan about how we are going to reopen the country in line with the vaccination programme. It's simply not good enough to keep pushing out the lockdown and the continuous vague comments about opening up and foreign travel. While this is difficult it is the single mist important part of this whole process. These are people's real lives and jobs at stake here and at this stage it's more important than daily case numbers. (I say this as someone whose spent three years building a business which has been decimated in the last year and will unemployed when this is over).

    My concern is that we need to be grown up enough as a country to accept that even with vaccines people are going to catch, be hospitalised and die from Covid, as they do many other diseases. Unless we can accept that and realise that lockdowns cannot be used for future outbreaks and we will have to accept a certain level of infection, even with vaccines, I fear normal life is a long way off.


  • #9114
    Hmob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 256 ✭✭Hmob


    harr wrote: »
    Speaking to relatives and friends in U.K. over the weekend that have been vaccinated one in his 50,s with mild asthma and another who had cancer 10 years ago both are now fully vaccinated which makes the roll out here even more disappointing. It’s crazy to think people like my parents in their early 80,s might not be fully vaccinated till April a full 4 months after the vaccine arrived in the country.
    I'm losing interest tbh

    I see one of the government experts in the UK is advising no large gatherings,.masks and SD to stay for years

    If they do it we'll do it here , we're even more conservative


  • #9115
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Hmob wrote: »
    I'm losing interest tbh

    I see one of the government experts in the UK is advising no large gatherings,.masks and SD to stay for years

    If they do it we'll do it here , we're even more conservative
    We hear from such experts all the time. Like everyone else they are making it up at the moment because they don't know what May, never mind September will look like. As for ourselves, once our cases come down and hospital numbers decline we will see moves to reverse restrictions, quite simply because our politicians, for all their faults, understand we cannot live our lives like this indefinitely.


  • #9116
    Hmob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 256 ✭✭Hmob


    is_that_so wrote: »
    We hear from such experts all the time. Like everyone else they are making it up at the moment because they don't know what May, never mind September will look like. As for ourselves, once our cases come down and hospital numbers decline we will see moves to reverse restrictions.

    Im sick of them

    Even after vaccination they refuse to let go of restrictions

    If this is the way forward after vaccination, people will have to take back their freedom forcibly and it will happen


  • #9117
    Multipass
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,678 ✭✭✭Multipass


    harr wrote: »
    Speaking to relatives and friends in U.K. over the weekend that have been vaccinated one in his 50,s with mild asthma and another who had cancer 10 years ago both are now fully vaccinated which makes the roll out here even more disappointing. It’s crazy to think people like my parents in their early 80,s might not be fully vaccinated till April a full 4 months after the vaccine arrived in the country.

    Same situation here. It’s frustrating.


  • #9118
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Hmob wrote: »
    Im sick of them

    Even after vaccination they refuse to let go of restrictions

    If this is the way forward after vaccination, people will have to take back their freedom forcibly and it will happen
    Well, the CMO has already sent a letter to government alerting them to a likely decline in compliance, something he mentioned almost a year ago. I don't fault these experts so much as it's a media hunger for more COVID stories and viruses escaping vaccines will keep us hooked longer. As has been repeated here, we need to look to Israel over the next few months to see if that gloom is justified. The early signs are that it's not.


  • #9119
    seamus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 68,190 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    Irish Stones wrote: »
    What's the point of waiting 15 minutes if you're getting a reaction an hour later?
    I know people who felt bad much later than 15 minutes after taking the vaccine.
    Reactions that require emergency treatment will hit the patient within 5-10 minutes.

    "Feeling bad" is not a medical emergency that requires immediate attention.


  • #9120
    Icantthinkof1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 410 ✭✭Icantthinkof1


    If the AZ vaccine does not protect against the SA strain what’s the point in taking it?
    I understand it’s effective against the Kent & original strain and will protect us from that but is it not just a matter of time before the SA strain becomes the dominant strain?
    I feel so utterly hopeless today I have as good as cocooned, including staying out on unpaid/ sick leave as medically advised since the beginning of this and now feel like I’m back at the beginning except it’s worse as I know the isolation and despair I will be facing in to.

    Also the government do not inspire me with confidence considering they were going to vaccinate our most vulnerable members of society with a vaccine with the least efficacy. Should they not have been giving the Pfizer/ Moderna all along to the elderly- they decided not to due to storage issues but they found a solution to that fairly lively when they needed to


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  • #9121
    harr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,511 ✭✭✭harr


    is_that_so wrote: »
    Well, if you can magick up some vaccines we'll all be pleased. The why of this has been explained many, many, many times.
    I really don’t care how many times it has been explained it’s not an explanation I was after, what ever the excuse or the logistics of the roll out it doesn’t make it any less disappointing that elderly people have to wait 4 months.


This discussion has been closed.
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