Schools closed until March/April? (part 4) Mod warning in OP 22/01

km79 · 02-02-2021 07:32PM

WicklaBlaa wrote: »

83 deaths occurred through January, Still an awful number.

Numbers still dropping - great progress!

Ah sorry I missed that bit even though it was right there !
Still not great but not AS bad as i thought

Locotastic · 02-02-2021 07:36PM

WicklaBlaa wrote: »

83 deaths occurred through January, Still an awful number.

Numbers still dropping - great progress!

Terrible number of deaths, but most would be from 3 weeks post peak so unfortunately it is expected that the number of deaths will be high given the high number of cases at that point.

Hospital discharges are now much higher than the number of admissions. Which would also make sense, I think I read that the timeframe is about 2.5 weeks from onset of symptoms to discharge (or unfortunately passing away).

Our positivity rate now 1/4 of what it was a month ago. 6.7% over the past week.

We are slowly but surely coming out of this wave. ICU numbers slowly dropping (very slowly).

Responder XY · 02-02-2021 07:36PM

Stateofyou wrote: »

There are many. Here are some thst i sourced quite quickly highlighting the harms of halting education and the low risk provided to kids and young people by covid im general and its variants

That's some pretty fancy dancing around you're doing here. Trying to belittle and insult me as per your last comment just goes to show the shaky ground and logic you're really standing on.

You originally claimed the damage the virus does and its variants is less than the damage done in keeping children out of education (insert: they are still IN education here). I commented that I hadn't heard any experts conclude that is the case and asked for links. You actually admit to there being no research to point to it, but "judgement" aka your opinion is all you have here. Then you try to cleverly dance around all the research and expert conclusions you say of which "there is many" highlighting the harm "halting education" (they are still being educated here) and "the low risk provided to kids and young people by covid im general and its variants."

"And it's variants." Yeah, an article you posted talked about "the variants" but it didn't make the conclusions you claim it did. It simply speculated on how much the new variants might biologically affect children.

None of what you posted makes no expert comparisons or conclusions of the risk to health and health care systems of the new variants especially, to keeping schools open in spite of that and the reality of high transmission and overwhelmed hospitals.

So please, you won't be spelling anything out because you can't. You also made false claims saying there is no evidence the new variants have worse impact on children when there is research to suggest it is, but to the best of my knowledge nothing has been concluded yet.

You say you haven't seen any evidence of the harm yet the links you posted you admitted to "sourcing quite quickly" so you obviously quickly looked for things on google to support your own bias, instead of remaining open-minded. If you had googled just a little differently, you would also find links to articles showing data and signs pointing to the possible greater effect of new variants on children.

But the point is, at the end of the day, you have still not shown that experts have concluded that keeping schools open in light of the new variants spreading rapidly overwhelming health care systems and being more virulent, is the right course of action.

You are very much interpreting those the way you want to interpret them and in a way that misrepresents them. I've read quite a few media and scientific articles on the subject. That doesn't make me an expert, but I have shown that experts have not been able to conclude the way that those who want to lock down schools think they should.

If you have contrary evidence, please do share. Happy to consider it if you can find it.

Stateofyou · 02-02-2021 08:44PM

I am very much reading plain English, but, whatever you need to tell yourself.

You made a claim, which you can't back up because "experts have not been able to conclude the way that those who want to lock down schools think they should." Okay...:rolleyes:

This/you have already wasted enough time with this nonsense so feel free to google more about schools reopening and the impact of new variants yourself. At the end of the day our government have concluded (with a scientific advisory team) not overrunning the health system further impacted by 1million + in the education sector, with a slower reopening and lower numbers is the wiser course of action.

KerryConnor · 02-02-2021 09:02PM

In my mind its that cases dropped 50% in last fortnight. I'd go back now, I thought returning with classes of 6 (so 8 households in a room all day with no social distancing) seemed like a very bad idea in early- mid January.

markodaly wrote: »

OK, glad to hear it.

To be honest, a lot of that stuff was agreed last time out, like the phased reopening and the more vulnerable teachers being given leave to work remotely or not at all.
To be honest, it appears the issue two weeks ago as much ado about nothing looking at the agreement today.

Responder XY · 02-02-2021 09:03PM

Stateofyou wrote: »

I am very much reading plain English, but, whatever you need to tell yourself.

You made a claim, which you can't back up because "experts have not been able to conclude the way that those who want to lock down schools think they should." Okay...:rolleyes:

This/you have already wasted enough time with this nonsense so feel free to google more about schools reopening and the impact of new variants yourself. At the end of the day our government have concluded (with a scientific advisory team) not overrunning the health system further impacted by 1million + in the education sector, with a slower reopening and lower numbers is the wiser course of action.

So the answer is you can't back up your claims. You are happy to misrepresent the back up I've provided to pretend it supports your viewpoint, but completely unwilling to share any evidence yourself.

The government did want to open up schools by the way (for Leaving Certs and Special Classes initially), it was union objections that stopped them.

Millem · 02-02-2021 09:03PM

SusanC10 wrote: »

Couple of questions

Also, any thoughts on when older Primary kids (5th/6th) and non-Exam Secondary students will be going back ?

8th March for primary? Principals will have a major headache now sorting out staff shortages. A good lot of staff will now be allowed to work from home as they pregnant/high risk.
Maybe they could provide online support to students???

wirelessdude01 · 02-02-2021 09:11PM

km79 wrote: »

http://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1356667315169935374

That’s horrendous

One of those deaths was a 19 year old.

PoolDude · 02-02-2021 09:15PM

I'm not sure if 22nd of Feb or even 8th March will be too early - 59% of cases on Saturday were aged 35 - 45 and the highest transmission rate was coming from the 18 - 24 year olds.

So if the average teacher age is in the median age group that is getting the virus and the 6th year students are in the median age spreading the virus - surely thats a recipe for disaster they must be factoring in to decision making?

Icyseanfitz · 02-02-2021 09:27PM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

One of those deaths was a 19 year old.

Thats leaving cert age for some, horrible, RIP

Stateofyou · 02-02-2021 09:53PM

Responder XY wrote: »

So the answer is you can't back up your claims. You are happy to misrepresent the back up I've provided to pretend it supports your viewpoint, but completely unwilling to share any evidence yourself.

The government did want to open up schools by the way (for Leaving Certs and Special Classes initially), it was union objections that stopped them.

I didn't make an absurd claim to back up, unlike you. :pac:

You didn't have backup, you had "quickly' googled links according to yourself which didn't have anything whatsoever to do with your claim. As I've already shown.

I'm not sharing evidence of a claim I didn't make. Obviously.

As for the circle jerk of unions/governments making the decisions, do us all a favour and read the last few pages. No one should have to make the same arguments raked over so recently. :rolleyes:

Millem · 02-02-2021 09:54PM

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

Thats leaving cert age for some, horrible, RIP

So so so so sad

Sick of listening to teacher bashing now. Today I came to the conclusion that they can’t cope with their own children at home.
Yes it’s tough. I am a mother of 3 and I am struggling too.

What other job are you expected to go into a room with 30 students with no masks on? Or 30 students who are 18 with masks on.
My gp isn’t letting anyone into the surgery and is conducting all consultations by phone. I had to email them pictures ahead of a telephone consultation for my child. I am not complaining they are right but my mind boggles when people accept it’s not safe for my children to go to the gp but yet the it’s safe for them to go to school??

02-02-2021 09:56PM

Millem wrote: »

So so so so sad

Sick of listening to teacher bashing now. Today I came to the conclusion that they can’t cope with their own children at home.
Yes it’s tough. I am a mother of 3 and I am struggling too.

What other job are you expected to go into a room with 30 students with no masks on? Or 30 students who are 18 with masks on.
My gp isn’t letting anyone into the surgery and is conducting all consultations by phone. I had to email them pictures ahead of a telephone consultation for my child. I am not complaining they are right but my mind boggles when people accept it’s not safe for my children to go to the gp but yet the it’s safe for them to go to school??

It’s great when people leap to conclusions on other people’s lives

downthemiddle · 02-02-2021 10:06PM

Deleted User wrote: »

It’s great when people leap to conclusions on other people’s lives

Thankfully nobody jumps to conclusions about teachers.

Tippex · 02-02-2021 10:07PM

TTLF wrote: »

https://www.instagram.com/p/CKwkgFDBLiW/

I'm going to scream.

My son is Fuming. The level of incompetence in the dept / government is outstanding. They are a disgrace sitting on their holes for the last year and still non the wiser

02-02-2021 10:08PM

downthemiddle wrote: »

Thankfully nobody jumps to conclusions about teachers.

Cuts both ways. Those that assume what teachers in general think should equally look at themselves

Necro · 02-02-2021 10:35PM

Mod:

Scoondal, quit the trolling or I'll forum ban you. That's three threads now you're attempting to derail this evening

billy_beckham · 02-02-2021 10:58PM

Millem wrote: »

So so so so sad

Sick of listening to teacher bashing now. Today I came to the conclusion that they can’t cope with their own children at home.
Yes it’s tough. I am a mother of 3 and I am struggling too.

What other job are you expected to go into a room with 30 students with no masks on? Or 30 students who are 18 with masks on.
My gp isn’t letting anyone into the surgery and is conducting all consultations by phone. I had to email them pictures ahead of a telephone consultation for my child. I am not complaining they are right but my mind boggles when people accept it’s not safe for my children to go to the gp but yet the it’s safe for them to go to school??

How did schools return last September? same rooms, same kids without masks in national and with masks in secondary.

I have 2 kids at home, I can cope perfectly well with them being home, along with working etc. My issue is that they are not receiving the same education and they are missing out badly on that plus the other social and developmental aspects of school...

khalessi · 02-02-2021 11:03PM

billy_beckham wrote: »

How did schools return last September? same rooms, same kids without masks in national and with masks in secondary.

I have 2 kids at home, I can cope perfectly well with them being home, along with working etc. My issue is that they are not receiving the same education and they are missing out badly on that plus the other social and developmental aspects of school...

Yep unfortunate but pandemic in all. At least they can develop other skills while at home.

Yeah September case numbers were much much lower, the CMO wasn't insisting people needed to stay home and there weren't the contagious variants that are around now but sure you alreaddy know that.

billy_beckham · 02-02-2021 11:49PM

khalessi wrote: »

Yep unfortunate but pandemic in all. At least they can develop other skills while at home.

Yeah September case numbers were much much lower, the CMO wasn't insisting people needed to stay home and there weren't the contagious variants that are around now but sure you alreaddy know that.

We were in Level 5 last term... CMO was telling people to stay home. Covid-19 no matter what the variant is contagious!

But you knew that already too..

Teacher2020 · 02-02-2021 11:50PM

Some people definitely can't manage behaviour when their children are at home. I'm getting countless messages asking me to send voice notes giving out to their children who aren't behaving but apparently will listen to teacher. I'm getting absolute rubbish back in terms of quality work from children who work extremely well in school and complete work independently in school are not doing it at home. If I give honest feedback and tell them that I expect more from them I get horrible messages from parents - if I say well done I get messages saying that I'm not giving proper feedback. It feels like I cannot win.

wirelessdude01 · 02-02-2021 11:52PM

Teacher2020 wrote: »

Some people definitely can't manage behaviour when their children are at home. I'm getting countless messages asking me to send voice notes giving out to their children who aren't behaving but apparently will listen to teacher. I'm getting absolute rubbish back in terms of quality work from children who work extremely well in school and complete work independently in school are not doing it at home. If I give honest feedback and tell them that I expect more from them I get horrible messages from parents - if I say well done I get messages saying that I'm not giving proper feedback. It feels like I cannot win.

What kind of horrible messages are you getting back?

Stateofyou · 03-02-2021 12:01AM

billy_beckham wrote: »

We were in Level 5 last term... CMO was telling people to stay home. Covid-19 no matter what the variant is contagious!

But you knew that already too..

Khalessi said Sept not term, and the cases were under 100 then.

I'm sure they meant more contagious, but you already knew that...

khalessi · 03-02-2021 12:17AM

billy_beckham wrote: »

How did schools return last September? same rooms, same kids without masks in national and with masks in secondary.

I have 2 kids at home, I can cope perfectly well with them being home, along with working etc. My issue is that they are not receiving the same education and they are missing out badly on that plus the other social and developmental aspects of school...

khalessi wrote: »

Yep unfortunate but pandemic in all. At least they can develop other skills while at home.

Yeah September case numbers were much much lower, the CMO wasn't insisting people needed to stay home and there weren't the contagious variants that are around now but sure you alreaddy know that.

billy_beckham wrote: »

We were in Level 5 last term... CMO was telling people to stay home. Covid-19 no matter what the variant is contagious!

But you knew that already too..

Lets i answered your query re September but sure you know that and yes were in Level 5 but not when we came which is what you referred to in September.

I think someone is a silly billy

Teacher2020 · 03-02-2021 12:23AM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

What kind of horrible messages are you getting back?

I'm ruining their child's life by putting too much pressure on, I'm putting a huge mental strain on their family, their child hates me, the sound of my voice is enough to put anyone off learning- that's a flavour of the kind of things I'm getting. Any teacher gets this at some stage in their career but the fact that parents have the ability to contact us day and night means that it is a lot worse. I've received ranting, abusive emails that have been sent at all hours of the night. It just feels like parents are using teachers as punch bags.

Idbatterim · 03-02-2021 12:27AM

billy_beckham wrote: »

How did schools return last September? same rooms, same kids without masks in national and with masks in secondary.

I have 2 kids at home, I can cope perfectly well with them being home, along with working etc. My issue is that they are not receiving the same education and they are missing out badly on that plus the other social and developmental aspects of school...

You are right but it's a government decision.... dont you agree?

billy_beckham · 03-02-2021 12:29AM

Millem wrote: »

What other job are you expected to go into a room with 30 students with no masks on? Or 30 students who are 18 with masks on.

My comment re September was in relation to this, not what the case numbers were then..

khalessi wrote: »

Yep unfortunate but pandemic in all. At least they can develop other skills while at home.

Not a bit condescending..

khalessi wrote: »

Lets i answered your query re September but sure you know that and yes were in Level 5 but not when we came which is what you referred to in September.

I think someone is a silly billy

You answered a question that wasn't asked...

Wonder whose turn is it now to patronise me?

BonsaiKitten · 03-02-2021 12:31AM

Teacher2020 wrote: »
I'm ruining their child's life by putting too much pressure on, I'm putting a huge mental strain on their family, their child hates me, the sound of my voice is enough to put anyone off learning- that's a flavour of the kind of things I'm getting. Any teacher gets this at some stage in their career but the fact that parents have the ability to contact us day and night means that it is a lot worse. I've received ranting, abusive emails that have been sent at all hours of the night. It just feels like parents are using teachers as punch bags.

"The sound of my voice is enough to put anyone off learning"....seriously, wtf.

If a parent sent anything like that to a teacher at my school, they wouldn't be allowed to directly contact that teacher anymore. All communication would be through office from then on out. Where is your principal in all this? Do they know?

billy_beckham · 03-02-2021 12:32AM

Idbatterim wrote: »

You are right but it's a government decision.... dont you agree?

Nope...

billy_beckham wrote: »

https://www.thejournal.ie/teachers-union-back-to-school-leaving-cert-5318602-Jan2021/

THE ASSOCIATION OF Secondary Teachers in Ireland (ASTI) and Teachers Union of Ireland both directed their members today not to co-operate with the Government’s plan for in-school teaching for Leaving Cert students.

The ASTI instead directed members to engage with remote learning from Monday onwards.

wirelessdude01 · 03-02-2021 12:34AM

Teacher2020 wrote: »
I'm ruining their child's life by putting too much pressure on, I'm putting a huge mental strain on their family, their child hates me, the sound of my voice is enough to put anyone off learning- that's a flavour of the kind of things I'm getting. Any teacher gets this at some stage in their career but the fact that parents have the ability to contact us day and night means that it is a lot worse. I've received ranting, abusive emails that have been sent at all hours of the night. It just feels like parents are using teachers as punch bags.

Forward them to your principal and let them do their job.

That isn't on.

Wouldn't be allowed in our school, parents also know not to overstep in our place.

Schools closed until March/April? (part 4) **Mod warning in OP 22/01**

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Schools closed until March/April? (part 4) Mod warning in OP 22/01