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What exactly is happening with AstraZeneca?

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Comments

  • #872
    gally74
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,949 ✭✭✭gally74


    The astra z is an absolute farce... its a serious threat to the eu.

    Theres is blame on both sides. Wrre the eu even having weekly calls on supply etc. And preparing for s run at risk. Common in med tech
    ...

    Else they were lied too. But the EU holds the CE mark and can crush AZ going forward.

    I expect anger will grow and it will get nasty. We truly have bret exit now.


  • #873
    fly_agaric
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,518 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    Melanchthon wrote: »
    Can you provide a source for the June thing? Because there has been this misinformation being put forwards by pro-EU posters a few times that the EU reached agreement with Astra Zeneca only a month after the UK.
    This is not the case, it was August

    I did post something in reply to you a while back. It appears that the "Inclusive Vaccine Alliance" group of countries did agree something with the company in June before the EU took over, and that is where 1 month vs 3 months argument (vs UK agreement timing) comes from.
    So depends on if you view the earlier agreement by Germany etc. with the company as completely voided, or expanded when the EU took over procuring the vaccines for all member states.
    I'm not a lawyer or a legal expert and don't know what is the right view here.

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=116068927&postcount=680


  • #874
    Melanchthon
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,116 ✭✭✭Melanchthon


    fly_agaric wrote: »
    I'm not a lawyer or a legal expert and don't know what is the right view here.

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=116068927&postcount=680

    Oh I get that sorry wasn't criticizing your post, the Bild letter, if true (not denying Bild are a bad source), would indicate that no money etc was given so Astra Zeneca hardly going to start production.


  • #875
    Melanchthon
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,116 ✭✭✭Melanchthon


    https://mobile.twitter.com/danibrrlr/status/1354467052652818432?s=20
    Q1704 Aaron Bell: I see the EU is hoping to make a decision on your vaccine by the 29th as well. Are those doses potentially from the same supplier or are they going to be supplied from other sites elsewhere?

    Tom Keith-Roach: No. We have built dedicated supply chains across the world to fulfil our contractual responsibilities. We have a dedicated UK supply chain for drug substance manufacture and for fill and finish. I am delighted to say that the majority of API for the UK come from UK‑based suppliers, and the vast majority of our filling, finishing and packaging also is being done in the UK. It is a dedicated supply chain and our ability to commit to that 100 million doses is not affected by approval status in other supply chains.

    Sir Mene Pangalos: API is drug substance, just to be clear what we are talking about.

    : Sir Mene Pangalos, Executive Vice President of BioPharmaceuticals Research and Development, AstraZeneca; and Tom Keith-Roach, President, AstraZeneca UK.

    From the parliamentary committee, has Astra Zeneca misled them? It seems to contradict the strong statements today from the EU vaccines minister?

    Interesting times :(

    (Credit to some Reddit poster!)


  • #876
    richardw001
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 575 ✭✭✭richardw001


    Looking at the news - I haven't seen the EU leaders this angry (ever)

    This is an interesting read

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/26/why-has-astrazeneca-cut-vaccines-to-eu-and-will-it-impact-uk-

    There was a precedent here before with PPE leaving the EU. If they take a hardline - they could block the pfizer vaccine to the UK or even the raw materials for the AstraZeneca vaccine (a lot of which comes from the EU)

    Anyways If the UK goes into a trade war with the EU - there will only be two losers - The UK and of course us (meaning Ireland)


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  • #877
    fly_agaric
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,518 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    Melanchthon wrote: »
    Oh I get that sorry wasn't criticizing your post, the Bild letter, if true (not denying Bild are a bad source), would indicate that no money etc was given so Astra Zeneca hardly going to start production.

    No I didn't think you were - apologies.

    Just thought you may not have seen it (I don't read all posts, even on threads I post in and miss things anyway).

    You are correct that the EU signed off their agreement in August. It is interesting that Bild article suggests that prior agreement did not include how much money they (AstraZeneca) would be paid (by the "Inclusive Vaccine Alliance" countries). However the company did know in June a huge order for a vaccine (one of the lead candidates?) was on the way from some of the largest EU countries.


  • #878
    KrustyUCC
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,108 ✭✭✭KrustyUCC


    richardw001 wrote: »
    Looking at the news - I haven't seen the EU leaders this angry (ever)

    This is an interesting read

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/26/why-has-astrazeneca-cut-vaccines-to-eu-and-will-it-impact-uk-

    There was a precedent here before with PPE leaving the EU. If they take a hardline - they could block the pfizer vaccine to the UK or even the raw materials for the AstraZeneca vaccine (a lot of which comes from the EU)

    Anyways If the UK goes into a trade war with the EU - there will only be two losers - The UK and of course us (meaning Ireland)

    Fair article really


  • #879
    Donald Trump
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,325 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    richardw001 wrote: »
    Looking at the news - I haven't seen the EU leaders this angry (ever)

    This is an interesting read

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/26/why-has-astrazeneca-cut-vaccines-to-eu-and-will-it-impact-uk-

    There was a precedent here before with PPE leaving the EU. If they take a hardline - they could block the pfizer vaccine to the UK or even the raw materials for the AstraZeneca vaccine (a lot of which comes from the EU)

    Anyways If the UK goes into a trade war with the EU - there will only be two losers - The UK and of course us (meaning Ireland)




    I don't think that the EU would block the Pfizer vaccine to the UK unless the EU forces AZ to "replace" vaccines shipped to the UK and the UK stopped them from doing it.


  • #880
    richardw001
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 575 ✭✭✭richardw001


    KrustyUCC wrote: »
    Fair article really

    I thought so as well.

    The BBC ones seem to be going along the lines of the big bad EU block want to steal this 100% made and owned UK vaccine - not very helpful :-)


  • #881
    85603
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,184 ✭✭✭85603


    Its looking like a desperate Bojo with 100k deaths on his hands picked up the phone to AZ, redirected EU stock.

    EU finds out, gets together, and says fix that or we're blocking future Pfizer stock to make up this shortfall.
    UK aghast as ever that the EU aren't to be fcked with. Ex-Brexiters point to the nasty eu.

    Its waddling and quacking. 60% mysteriously not delivered, storage in UK, Bojo in charge, UK govt patting themselves on the back.


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  • #882
    Tyrone212
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,570 ✭✭✭Tyrone212


    https://mobile.twitter.com/FergalBowers/status/1354570597976649735


  • #883
    Kermit.de.frog
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,774 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    Serious anger building over this. The commission is furious and MEP's openly talking about trade sanction moves against UK. This could get ugly especially in the context of Brexit. EU feels it's been screwed over by UK contract with AZ which apparently would see UK get British made product on basically a first come, first serve basis.


  • #884
    Tyrone212
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,570 ✭✭✭Tyrone212


    Kermit.de.frog wrote: »
    Serious anger building over this. The commission is furious and MEP's openly talking about trade sanction moves against UK. This could get ugly especially in the context of Brexit. EU feels it's been screwed over.

    Crazy times


  • #885
    Bit cynical
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,338 ✭✭✭Bit cynical


    Looks like Hungary are joining Germany in doing an outside deal.
    “It is a great honour and pleasure for me to announce that today we have signed an agreement under which Russia will deliver the vaccine to Hungary in three stages,” Hungarian foreign minister Peter Szijjarto said in Moscow on Friday.

    “Speeding up vaccination is a national priority. Due to slow deliveries of the vaccine we were forced to look for a new source to secure quick deliveries of a reliable vaccine,” Russian media quoted him as saying.
    URL="https://www.irishtimes.com/business/health-pharma/hungary-buys-sputnik-vaccines-for-1m-people-saying-eu-has-been-too-slow-1.4465272"]source[/URL


  • #886
    McGiver
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,995 ✭✭✭McGiver


    Melanchthon wrote:
    Can you supply information that supports your point that there was not a 3 month gap between the signing of contracts, if not will you retract that post
    The gap is irrelevant.

    Agreement made in June. Contract signed in August. AZ had 5 months minimum. 1 month before first delivery (based on status of the EMA) approval they turned up and said they will only deliver 25% of volume for March.


  • #887
    Bit cynical
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,338 ✭✭✭Bit cynical


    Kermit.de.frog wrote: »
    Serious anger building over this. The commission is furious and MEP's openly talking about trade sanction moves against UK. This could get ugly especially in the context of Brexit. EU feels it's been screwed over.
    What are the UK alleged to have done?


  • #888
    Tyrone212
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,570 ✭✭✭Tyrone212


    Bit cynical wrote: »
    Looks like Hungary are joining Germany in doing an outside deal.
    “It is a great honour and pleasure for me to announce that today we have signed an agreement under which Russia will deliver the vaccine to Hungary in three stages,” Hungarian foreign minister Peter Szijjarto said in Moscow on Friday.

    “Speeding up vaccination is a national priority. Due to slow deliveries of the vaccine we were forced to look for a new source to secure quick deliveries of a reliable vaccine,” Russian media quoted him as saying.
    URL="https://www.irishtimes.com/business/health-pharma/hungary-buys-sputnik-vaccines-for-1m-people-saying-eu-has-been-too-slow-1.4465272"]source[/URL

    They're using the Chinese vaccine already as far as I know.


  • #889
    hotmail.com
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,566 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    Have we asked Britain yet for a donation of supplies?

    I said this weeks ago that we should ask Britain for some vaccines as it would help both islands get out of this.


  • #890
    E mac
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 406 ✭✭E mac


    Bit cynical wrote: »
    What are the UK alleged to have done?

    If allegedly the UK did secure vaccinations meant for the EU it would be the biggest popularity boost Boris Johnston could hope for. He’d be up there with Churchill.


  • #891
    hotmail.com
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,566 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    E mac wrote: »
    If allegedly the UK did secure vaccinations meant for the EU it would be the biggest popularity boost Boris Johnston could hope for. He’d be up there with Churchill.

    No such luck with our useless ministers.


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  • #892
    lucernarian
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,243 ✭✭✭lucernarian


    Bit cynical wrote: »
    I thought there was something arrogant in the Commission's attitude in this FT article from about 3 weeks ago:
    The commission also hit back at criticism of its vaccine strategy, which was agreed by member states in June. “We have actually signed contracts that would allow member states to get access to 2bn doses, largely enough to vaccinate the whole of the EU population,” said Eric Mamer, commission chief spokesman.

    He said it was “quite astonishing” that some people were asking why all doses were not immediately available, pointing to predicted manufacturing constraints, which meant distribution around the EU would gradually build up until a “big delivery” around April.
    Sounds like they were already expecting delays but that it subsequently became politically unacceptable among the member states, hence the outburst against AZ.

    https://www.ft.com/content/c9bbc753-97fb-493a-bbb6-dd97a7c4b807
    This is not based in reality. AZ themselves have said that they have recently hit issues which result in them not being able to supply what they promised for February, which itself is a lot smaller than what's predicted for April. It's just worse than expected now.


  • #893
    E mac
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 406 ✭✭E mac


    lucernarian wrote: »
    This is not based in reality. AZ themselves have said that they have recently hit issues which result in them not being able to supply what they promised for February, which itself is a lot smaller than what's predicted for April. It's just worse than expected now.

    “It’s just worse than expected now” That could be the motto of 2020/20021.


  • #894
    Melanchthon
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,116 ✭✭✭Melanchthon


    fly_agaric wrote: »
    However the company did know in June a huge order for a vaccine (one of the lead candidates?) was on the way from some of the largest EU countries.

    Don't get me wrong I am defending astra Zeneca a bit but the more I read the more I think they massively screwed up in terms of over promising. Like knew there was delays with UK stuff but had forgotten/didn't realize so big and so long delayed, and that's before any of the EU issues.


  • #895
    mick087
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,123 ✭✭✭mick087


    E mac wrote: »
    If allegedly the UK did secure vaccinations meant for the EU it would be the biggest popularity boost Boris Johnston could hope for. He’d be up there with Churchill.


    No the UK invested secured and paid and approved the vaccine before the EU. The EU has still not approved this vaccine.

    The EU have screwed up we now need a new plan we are not getting the amount AZ said it was going to send us.


  • #896
    hotmail.com
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,566 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    Why isn't Ireland sourcing it's own vaccines?

    The EU have messed it up for us.


  • #897
    E mac
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 406 ✭✭E mac


    mick087 wrote: »
    No the UK invested secured and paid and approved the vaccine before the EU. The EU has still not approved this vaccine.

    The EU have screwed up we now need a new plan we are not getting the amount AZ said it was going to send us.

    Ah don’t let facts get in the way! Boris bested the Euros because being British is best.....ugh ...


  • #898
    Wolf359f
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,700 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    mick087 wrote: »
    No the UK invested secured and paid and approved the vaccine before the EU. The EU has still not approved this vaccine.

    The EU have screwed up we now need a new plan we are not getting the amount AZ said it was going to send us.

    The EU also invested secured and paid for the vaccine.


  • #899
    Wolf359f
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,700 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    hotmail.com wrote: »
    Why isn't Ireland sourcing it's own vaccines?

    The EU have messed it up for us.

    How have the EU messed it up? The production delay is on AZ's side, the EU purchases the vaccines they don't actually produce them.


  • #900
    AlmightyCushion
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 35,279 Mod ✭✭✭✭AlmightyCushion


    hotmail.com wrote: »
    Why isn't Ireland sourcing it's own vaccines?

    The EU have messed it up for us.

    We can buy we can only receive them after the EU has received the vaccines it ordered.


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  • #901
    Call me Al
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,041 ✭✭✭Call me Al


    E mac wrote: »
    If allegedly the UK did secure vaccinations meant for the EU it would be the biggest popularity boost Boris Johnston could hope for. He’d be up there with Churchill.

    Yes, because everybody will forget about over the 100k deaths to date in UK due to Covid-19 as long as they've got one over the EU.


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