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Home charge points (purchase/problems/questions) (See mod note post#1)

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Comments

  • #3062
    KCross
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,321 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    GarvC wrote: »
    Long time viewer first time poster here..
    I have finally taken the plunge and purchased an EV. - Tesla Model 3
    I have had an electrician out to the house and he has said that before I get a charger installed I will need a “tails upgrade” - has anybody here ever had this done before and if so what was the cost? He has quoted me 1300€ just for the upgrade.

    A less than ideal alternative is to limit your charge point to 16A (instead of 32A). You wont need to upgrade the tails then but it will take twice as long to charge the car. Probably better to upgrade the tails for the long term gain but just giving you options.

    GarvC wrote: »
    I’m looking to get the Zappi 2 installed which he has quoted an additional 800€ after grant..

    Thats a little steep, considering he is onsite doing other major works at the same time.

    Are you set on using this particular guy? I'd get a second opinion at least based on that price.


  • #3063
    MAULBROOK
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,469 ✭✭✭MAULBROOK


    Pat201 wrote: »
    Hello
    I have just ordered a VW ID4 as my company vehicle, Hoping to get it for June if no delays. I am looking into charger installation at the moment. I would need a charger that can tell me how much units I have used so I could provide that data to my company. Based off this requirement I think the Wallbox Pulsar plus would be a good option. My house has already got a 32A cable ran from fusebox to outside by electrician when it was built for future use of electric car. Neither side is connected obviously at the moment. I asked the electrician who installed the cable for a quote to install the Pulsar plus and he quoted me 250 euro. Is this a fair price ? He said` material would cost 120 (I though it would only be RCD fuse and Isolator switch but did not question him yet on what 120 entailed)

    https://pinergy.ie/business-electricity/ev-charger/

    Have a look at this, its installed at you house and you use a card to access it for charging and your company pays the bill.
    no counting KWs


  • #3064
    GarvC
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5 ✭GarvC


    KCross wrote: »
    A less than ideal alternative is to limit your charge point to 16A (instead of 32A). You wont need to upgrade the tails then but it will take twice as long to charge the car. Probably better to upgrade the tails for the long term gain but just giving you options.




    Thats a little steep, considering he is onsite doing other major works at the same time.

    Are you set on using this particular guy? I'd get a second opinion at least based on that price.

    Thanks for that appreciate it, not at all set on using this guy, I have enquired around but unfortunately he’s the only one who has came back..

    What is involved in the process of getting the tails upgraded? The ESB have to come out and verify it? Stupid question I know but how long would this process usually take?
    He also said the charger can’t be installed until the ESB have inspected the connection so he would have to return a different day to install the charger...

    Appreciate the help,


  • #3065
    KCross
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,321 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    GarvC wrote: »
    Thanks for that appreciate it, not at all set on using this guy, I have enquired around but unfortunately he’s the only one who has came back..

    What is involved in the process of getting the tails upgraded? The ESB have to come out and verify it? Stupid question I know but how long would this process usually take?
    He also said the charger can’t be installed until the ESB have inspected the connection so he would have to return a different day to install the charger...

    Appreciate the help,

    The tails is simply a cable from your meter box to the consumer unit. It takes the full load of your house.

    The electrician has deemed that to be an insufficiently sized cable to be adding a 32A continuous load to it.

    So, he'd have to replace the cable (with a thicker one basically) and then ensure the rest of the wiring is up to scratch (consumer unit etc).

    The ESB will need signoff from the electrician that the work is done and then they fire it up again. I would have thought all done in a day. He cant leave you without power waiting for ESB to come out a few days later.


  • #3066
    Gatster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,413 ✭✭✭Gatster


    Just been told by one of the sparks (the one who hasn't even been to the house), that he can't come off the meter and it has to be from the CU? MY house doesn't lend itself to coming off the CU.

    Has anyone had a charging unit installed off the meter, I am sure I read here that it is done, but not a common practice?


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  • #3067
    Maddic_Irl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 48 ✭Maddic_Irl


    Gatster wrote: »
    Just been told by one of the sparks (the one who hasn't even been to the house), that he can't come off the meter and it has to be from the CU? MY house doesn't lend itself to coming off the CU.

    Has anyone had a charging unit installed off the meter, I am sure I read here that it is done, but not a common practice?

    Afaik, it can be done but it is not complaint for grant purposes. There are talks of changing this though.


  • #3068
    Sam W
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 377 ✭✭Sam W


    Gatster wrote: »
    Has anyone had a charging unit installed off the meter, I am sure I read here that it is done, but not a common practice?

    It is against the current legislation and you lose your 600 euro grant.

    The electrician who installed our charger mentioned that there’s ongoing talks to change this, but it might still be a long shot.


  • #3069
    Gatster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,413 ✭✭✭Gatster


    Can you direct me to where it states this in the regs as I can't find it anywhere?

    I don't care about the grant, it's a company car so I'm not eligible for it anyway.


  • #3070
    the_amazing_raisin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,000 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    Gatster wrote: »
    Just been told by one of the sparks (the one who hasn't even been to the house), that he can't come off the meter and it has to be from the CU? MY house doesn't lend itself to coming off the CU.

    Has anyone had a charging unit installed off the meter, I am sure I read here that it is done, but not a common practice?


    Back when the ESB were installing chargers they would do this, however they stopped when they brought in the grant.


    It CAN be done, however you basically have to add a CU outside the house beside the meter box. There are 2 circuits coming from this main CU, one to the charger and one to your CU in the house, which becomes a sub board of the CU outside.


    While it's possible, I haven't heard of anyone getting it done as it's generally a bigger job than routing a cable from the existing CU

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • #3071
    Gatster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,413 ✭✭✭Gatster


    From doing a bit of research, it seems that you split off the 63A MCB in the meter box (in my case, which is not the ESB fuse and is after the meter), one feed to the existing CU and one to a new breaker external to the meter box that is adjacent to the chargepoint.

    Just need to find another electrician, the last dude just texted me saying he thinks he can come off the downstairs socket ring main :eek:


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  • #3072
    Pat201
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 156 ✭✭Pat201


    Have decided to go with a Pulsar Plus as Charger as it suits my needs to be able to submits bills to company for charging. Im a bit confused at moment on model types. I see 2 online that are same price but end in different manufacturing version. It is not clear to me what the versions signify? The 2 Model types i have seen are PLP1-0-2-2-3-001-A and PLP1-0-2-2-3-001-C. Does anyone know what this signifies?


  • #3073
    meercat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,909 ✭✭✭meercat


    Gatster wrote: »
    Can you direct me to where it states this in the regs as I can't find it anywhere?

    I don't care about the grant, it's a company car so I'm not eligible for it anyway.

    Page 6 covers chargers and previous pages cover what’s permitted in meter box.

    https://safeelectric.ie/contractors/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2019/07/July-2019-Newsletter-Final.pdf


  • #3074
    Gatster
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,413 ✭✭✭Gatster


    "Installation of the protective device for the final circuit is not currently permitted in the external meter cabinet"

    Which it won't be, so theoretically compliant.


  • #3075
    Risteard81
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,566 ✭✭✭Risteard81


    unkel wrote: »
    Install shouldn't really be much more than about €100
    You very clearly have no concept about what a Registered Electrical Contractor needs to charge to run a viable business.


  • #3076
    meercat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,909 ✭✭✭meercat


    Gatster wrote: »
    "Installation of the protective device for the final circuit is not currently permitted in the external meter cabinet"

    Which it won't be, so theoretically compliant.

    Where’s it going


  • #3077
    meercat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,909 ✭✭✭meercat


    Gatster wrote: »
    From doing a bit of research, it seems that you split off the 63A MCB in the meter box (in my case, which is not the ESB fuse and is after the meter), one feed to the existing CU and one to a new breaker external to the meter box that is adjacent to the chargepoint.
    :

    That’s not permitted


  • #3078
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,662 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    unkel wrote: »
    Also a 40A RCBO, also cheapest from eurosales as in KCross link. Install shouldn't really be much more than about €100, so every chance you can do it all for free. If anything, having an EV is about saving money first :cool:

    Speaking as an experienced electrical engineer and qualified electrician I can tell you that a Registered Electrical Contractor would be very doing well just to cover the cost of the materials out of €100. As a rule of thumb any REC that charges less than €30 per hour would make more money working for someone else. Most likely an EV charging point that costs this little does not comply with the regulations. The consequences of this can be severe.

    I have seen the aftermath from people cutting corners with electrics. In some cases premises went on fire, other times people were severely injured from electric shock and other times from arc flash. I also arrived on the scene just after someone was electrocuted, in this case a "DIY expert" had wired a cow shed and an old woman lay dead in front of me as a result. I know this sounds very melodramatic, but it made quite an impression on me.

    My advice would be to pay the money to get the work done properly which certainly means avoiding anyone that charges €100. Ignore this at your own risk.

    If you want to save money you would be better off looking elsewhere.


  • #3079
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,182 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    2011 wrote: »
    Speaking as an experienced electrical engineer and qualified electrician I can tell you that a Registered Electrical Contractor would be very doing well just to cover the cost of the materials out of €100. As a rule of thumb any REC that charges less than €30 per hour would make more money working for someone else. Most likely an EV charging point that costs this little does not comply with the regulations. The consequences of this can be severe.

    I have seen the aftermath from people cutting corners with electrics. In some cases premises went on fire, other times people were severely injured from electric shock and other times from arc flash. I also arrived on the scene just after someone was electrocuted, in this case a "DIY expert" had wired a cow shed and an old woman lay dead in front of me as a result. I know this sounds very melodramatic, but it made quite an impression on me.

    My advice would be to pay the money to get the work done properly which certainly means avoiding anyone that charges €100. Ignore this at your own risk.

    If you want to save money you would be better off looking elsewhere.

    I don’t think Unkel means the total cost should be €100. The RCBO is about €40 alone, the cable, glands and clips could be another €40 plus depending on length of cable run.

    For clarity, what EV Charging point are you talking about that’s so cheap it doesn’t comply with regulations? Just so people can avoid it.

    Bottom line is people charging €1400 plus for these installations are ripping people off. If it’s a long run and complicated install then additional costs can be explained but these €1400 quotes don’t include priority switches if required which puts the price up by €300 in cases.

    I had 3 quotes for my parents house recently. Just to show my dad that my Safe Electric Registered mate wasn’t getting into him.

    Prices ranged from €1250 to 1500.
    I bought the chargepoint myself. A UK built product with CE Certification for €231. I’m paying a SE Registered Electrician €600 tomorrow to install but he’s supplying all the bits and bobs. He’s also putting an external double socket outside with a switched spur inside included in that price. That is reasonable in my opinion.

    It includes certification so he will also get the €600 grant back in due course.
    Total outlay will be €231.


  • #3080
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,662 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    Gumbo wrote: »
    I don’t think Unkel means the total cost should be €100.

    Really? That’s the way his post reads to me.

    Nothing wrong with shopping around, I agree with you on that.
    I only posted because €100 was is so ridiculously low for this work.


  • #3081
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,182 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    To keep the process up to date, i'll outline my parents process here and update once complete.

    QUBEV 32a/7kw Home Charger purchased from here - https://evonestop.co.uk/products/qubev-ev-charging-unit-type-2-socket-32-amp-7-2-kw-ip65

    For some reason I got it for £206 through their Amazon Shop so €231 Delivered to my door.

    Fitted yesterday by Safe Electric Electrician. His costs were €600 for labour and materials.

    So total Outlay so far is €831.

    Certificates and Grant form sent to SEAI this morning so I will update once the Grant comes through or any further info the request.
    Its a shame they don't allow email or online upload as if anything goes missing in the post, the Certs are originals so you then have to chase the Electrician for replacements.


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  • #3082
    2011
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 12,662 Mod ✭✭✭✭2011


    ^^^ sounds very reasonable.


  • #3083
    slave1
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 19,822 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1


    Gumbo wrote: »
    To keep the process up to date, i'll outline my parents process here and update once complete.

    QUBEV 32a/7kw Home Charger purchased from here - https://evonestop.co.uk/products/qubev-ev-charging-unit-type-2-socket-32-amp-7-2-kw-ip65

    For some reason I got it for £206 through their Amazon Shop so €231 Delivered to my door.

    Fitted yesterday by Safe Electric Electrician. His costs were €600 for labour and materials.

    So total Outlay so far is €831.

    Certificates and Grant form sent to SEAI this morning so I will update once the Grant comes through or any further info the request.
    Its a shame they don't allow email or online upload as if anything goes missing in the post, the Certs are originals so you then have to chase the Electrician for replacements.

    You'll get an email to say they have received your forms, then wait, I was 17 working days to money in my account.
    AMZ lower as you likely struck lucky, the vary their prices constantly


  • #3084
    gomamochi1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 542 ✭✭✭gomamochi1


    Any good suppliers for 32amp 5 meter cable type 1 to type 2 for a 2017 leaf? Thanks


  • #3085
    slave1
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 19,822 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1


    gomamochi1 wrote: »
    Any good suppliers for 32amp 5 meter cable type 1 to type 2 for a 2017 leaf? Thanks

    Do you have your Charge Point installed yet?


  • #3086
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 42,182 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    2011 wrote: »
    ^^^ sounds very reasonable.

    He also supplied and fitted an outdoor socket on the other side of the house included for that price. Will be handy for granny charging in the future and the outdoor Christmas lights. No more cables through the letter box :)


  • #3087
    gomamochi1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 542 ✭✭✭gomamochi1


    slave1 wrote: »
    Do you have your Charge Point installed yet?

    yes have it installed just looking for a cable as i have a springyone i bought but i think it causes lock failure on the zappi over time as its puttin downward pressure on the cable.


  • #3088
    slave1
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 19,822 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1


    Oh okay, I was thinking more that you could use the stock Nissan cable with an adapter like this...

    https://evonestop.co.uk/collections/adaptors/products/newstyle-type-1-to-type-2-adapter-converter


  • #3089
    403 Forbidden
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 435 ✭✭403 Forbidden


    Just got my Zappi unit installed today! Very happy with it so far! Now just need to wait for the car to arrive :)


  • #3090
    Aph2016
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 495 ✭✭Aph2016


    403 Forbidden wrote: »
    Just got my Zappi unit installed today! Very happy with it so far! Now just need to wait for the car to arrive :)

    Did you get the myenergi hub? If so how far was it from the Zappi for signal strength?


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  • #3091
    403 Forbidden
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 435 ✭✭403 Forbidden


    Aph2016 wrote: »
    Did you get the myenergi hub? If so how far was it from the Zappi for signal strength?

    I didn't get the Hub today but I've ordered it this afternoon. Should arrive on Tuesday. Ive got two options of placement about 3m away from the Zappi or 10m away...

    I rather put it in the cabinet with the router which is 10m away.

    I'll let you know!


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