Interdepartmental Higher Executive Officer 2020 - (Serving Civil Servants ONLY)

carnie · 16-12-2020 2:48pm #1

Closing date is 12 January 2021

https://www.publicjobs.ie/en/?option=com_jobsearch&view=jobdetails&cid=127370&campaignId=20267403

Information booklet https://www.gov.ie/en/circular/b1a1d-192020-interdepartmental-competition-for-promotion-to-higher-executive-officer-heo-in-the-civil-service/

Bon chance

Ollie321 · 16-12-2020 3:18pm

carnie wrote: »

Closing date is 12 January 2021

https://www.publicjobs.ie/en/?option=com_jobsearch&view=jobdetails&cid=127370&campaignId=20267403

Bon chance

Is there an information booklet? I cant seem to find it

carnie · 16-12-2020 3:25pm

Ollie321 wrote: »

Is there an information booklet? I cant seem to find it

I have received it but only through WhatsAPP. Just looking for a link now.

carnie · 16-12-2020 3:28pm

Ollie321 wrote: »

Is there an information booklet? I cant seem to find it

Found it https://www.gov.ie/en/circular/b1a1d-192020-interdepartmental-competition-for-promotion-to-higher-executive-officer-heo-in-the-civil-service/

SortingYouOut · 16-12-2020 6:17pm

Is this interdepartmental only? If not, the booklet doesn't advise that you must have a level 8 degree if applying through the open stream.

SortingYouOut · 16-12-2020 6:26pm

Treetirty wrote: »

Yes, this does appear to be interdepartmental only as the booklet states that you need to have 2 years service within the Civil Service by the closing date of application.

What stood out to me from the booklet is this: "It is not envisaged that appointments will be made from this competition after 31 January 2023."

That can't be right surely?

That's the usual two year timeframe right?

SomeSayKos · 16-12-2020 6:56pm

Treetirty wrote: »

I might be incorrect on that, but for other interdepartmental competitions I don't think there was a 2 year wait for appointments.

.

There isn't a 2 year wait for appointments. Appointments will be made from this panel up until January 2023

SomeSayKos · 16-12-2020 6:57pm

From the circular: "It is not envisaged that appointments will be made from this competition after 31 January 2023"

MrsBean · 16-12-2020 6:57pm

Treetirty wrote: »

The information in the booklet would indicate that appointments for this competition will only begin after 2 years.

I might be incorrect on that, but for other interdepartmental competitions I don't think there was a 2 year wait for appointments.

Edit: I've went back and checked previous interdepartmental HEO competitions and I was wrong - Appointments are only taken 2 years after the competition starts.

I really think you're misinterpreting the information.

Booklet states "it is not envisaged that appointments will be made from this competition after 31 January 2023". This means that after 31 January 2023 the panel will expire, usually because a new competition will have gone live.

For example the 2019 Comp went live March 2019 and stated that appointments will not be made after April 2021. Hence opening this competition now so that there is always a panel of successful applicants to draw from.

rostalof · 16-12-2020 7:25pm

SortingYouOut wrote: »

Is this interdepartmental only? If not, the booklet doesn't advise that you must have a level 8 degree if applying through the open stream.

What open stream? There's been no mention of an open competition, or level 8 qualifications. The circular is titled,

"Interdepartmental Competition for Promotion to Higher Executive Officer (HEO) in the Civil Service".

It's been quite a few years since there was an open HEO competition. For the last good few years, the only open HEO competitions have been for specialist roles like HEO ICT.

Treetirty · 16-12-2020 7:47pm

MrsBean wrote: »

I really think you're misinterpreting the information.

Booklet states "it is not envisaged that appointments will be made from this competition after 31 January 2023". This means that after 31 January 2023 the panel will expire, usually because a new competition will have gone live.

For example the 2019 Comp went live March 2019 and stated that appointments will not be made after April 2021. Hence opening this competition now so that there is always a panel of successful applicants to draw from.

Ah, you're absolutely correct. I read it wrong and thought it meant that the panel wouldn't become active until that date which didn't make a whole pile of sense.

Thank you for that explanation!

Edit: Sorry for the innacuracies in the thread, I've deleted my posts as I don't want to be the cause of any further misinformation because of my poor comprehension!

MrsBean · 16-12-2020 7:48pm

I think it bears repeating that this competition is only for serving civil servants and you must have 2 years service under your belt to be eligible.

There are no educational requirements.

This thread is only page 1 and already has lots of inaccuracies!

rostalof · 16-12-2020 7:59pm

MrsBean wrote: »

I think it bears repeating that this competition is only for serving civil servants and you must have 2 years service under your belt to be eligible.

There are no educational requirements.

This thread is only page 1 and already has lots of inaccuracies!

Maybe the thread title can be changed to Interdepartmental HEO 2020 or something along those lines?

KaneToad · 16-12-2020 7:59pm

Why can't I find this on the publicjobs website under the list of jobs?

cvb03 · 16-12-2020 9:23pm

KaneToad wrote: »

Why can't I find this on the publicjobs website under the list of jobs?

https://www.publicjobs.ie/en/?option=com_jobsearch&view=jobdetails&cid=127370&campaignId=20267403

carnie · 16-12-2020 10:13pm

rostalof wrote: »

Maybe the thread title can be changed to Interdepartmental HEO 2020 or something along those lines?

No worries I'll update now.

Think I'll leave future notifications to the regular posters.

rostalof · 16-12-2020 10:24pm

carnie wrote: »

No worries I'll update now.

Think I'll leave future notifications to the regular posters.

Not at all, post away! There's just been a little confusion between open and interdepartmental competitions.

GooglePlus · 17-12-2020 11:15am

Anyone have previous experience in this kind of competition? How much of a step up is it from the EO tests etc?

Rikand · 17-12-2020 11:20am

Typical. 1 year and 9 months in the service. I have missed out on an internal heo comp with my department and now an interdepartmental

tgdaly · 17-12-2020 1:51pm

Rikand wrote: »

Typical. 1 year and 9 months in the service. I have missed out on an internal heo comp with my department and now an interdepartmental

I think I might be the same, won't have the 2 years until March and was really hoping this wouldn't be until then. Unless time worked in a county council counts (which I don't think it does) as I was there for 6 months before that

pew · 17-12-2020 2:01pm

I only recently got a promotion as eo but have 3.5 years under my belt. I thought I couldn't apply for it as I'm still on probation.

It's worth noting it states that you are eligible to apply if you are on probation under the condition you would have been eligible had you stayed in your previous role.

Unless I'm reading it wrong!!

"Officers on probation are not eligible to compete except where they would have been eligible has they remained in their previous grade."

caarp · 17-12-2020 2:02pm

GooglePlus wrote: »

Anyone have previous experience in this kind of competition? How much of a step up is it from the EO tests etc?

I'm wondering this too. Is it a big jump up, or similar?

GooglePlus · 17-12-2020 2:23pm

pew wrote: »

I only recently got a promotion as eo but have 3.5 years under my belt. I thought I couldn't apply for it as I'm still on probation.

It's worth noting it states that you are eligible to apply if you are on probation under the condition you would have been eligible had you stayed in your previous role.

Unless I'm reading it wrong!!

"Officers on probation are not eligible to compete except where they would have been eligible has they remained in their previous grade."

No, you're right. You're eligible, I'm in the same boat.

carnie · 17-12-2020 2:24pm

GooglePlus wrote: »

Anyone have previous experience in this kind of competition? How much of a step up is it from the EO tests etc?

It depends what elements they will use in this competition. Last time I made it to the interview stage of an Interdepartmental HEO comp I had to do a presentation before I was interviewed.

tgdaly · 17-12-2020 2:49pm

tgdaly wrote: »

I think I might be the same, won't have the 2 years until March and was really hoping this wouldn't be until then. Unless time worked in a county council counts (which I don't think it does) as I was there for 6 months before that

So I emailed PAS regarding my own query, and received the following answer :

"Given the volume of applications we are receiving, PAS is not in a position to consider or offer advice on the qualifications/eligibility of individuals unless they come under consideration. Qualifications/eligibility may not be verified by PAS until the final stage of the process."

So if PAS can't provide an answer who can I contact? I can't really apply and go through all the stages only to be told at the end I'm ineligible

yabadabado · 17-12-2020 3:02pm

tgdaly wrote: »

So I emailed PAS regarding my own query, and received the following answer :

"Given the volume of applications we are receiving, PAS is not in a position to consider or offer advice on the qualifications/eligibility of individuals unless they come under consideration. Qualifications/eligibility may not be verified by PAS until the final stage of the process."

So if PAS can't provide an answer who can I contact? I can't really apply and go through all the stages only to be told at the end I'm ineligible

If it was me I'd apply anyways,if nothing else it's good experience for again.

tgdaly · 17-12-2020 3:13pm

yabadabado wrote: »

If it was me I'd apply anyways,if nothing else it's good experience for again.

Yeah maybe so, might be worth the experience, although if I was doing well with it but know I can't get a position at the end it would be a bummer, especially if I didn't do as well the next time

Cheeseplant · 17-12-2020 3:15pm

tgdaly wrote: »

So I emailed PAS regarding my own query, and received the following answer :

"Given the volume of applications we are receiving, PAS is not in a position to consider or offer advice on the qualifications/eligibility of individuals unless they come under consideration. Qualifications/eligibility may not be verified by PAS until the final stage of the process."

So if PAS can't provide an answer who can I contact? I can't really apply and go through all the stages only to be told at the end I'm ineligible

Your eligibility is usually checked before offer. Sometimes eligibilty (internal comps) is checked before interview. You must have two yrs served by 12/01/21

From the booklet:

be serving in a permanent, temporary or acting capacity in the Civil Service in a grade below that of Higher Executive Officer or equivalent.

b) on or before the closing date of
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]12 January 2021 [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial][/FONT][/FONT]have not less than two years’ service in the Civil Service. Temporary officers and officers serving in an acting capacity in the eligible grades may compete in the competition provided they fulfil the eligibility requirements set out above. All forms of maternity leave, including extended maternity leave, constitute service for the purpose of calculating the two year service requirement in the Civil Service (see Letter to Personnel Officers dated 10 March 2009 – Extension of Probation due to Maternity Leave and Competitions for Promotion).

tgdaly · 17-12-2020 3:41pm

Cheeseplant wrote: »

Your eligibility is usually checked before offer. Sometimes eligibilty (internal comps) is checked before interview. You must have two yrs served by 12/01/21

From the booklet:

be serving in a permanent, temporary or acting capacity in the Civil Service in a grade below that of Higher Executive Officer or equivalent.

b) on or before the closing date of
[FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial]12 January 2021 [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Arial,Arial][FONT=Arial,Arial][/FONT][/FONT]have not less than two years’ service in the Civil Service. Temporary officers and officers serving in an acting capacity in the eligible grades may compete in the competition provided they fulfil the eligibility requirements set out above. All forms of maternity leave, including extended maternity leave, constitute service for the purpose of calculating the two year service requirement in the Civil Service (see Letter to Personnel Officers dated 10 March 2009 – Extension of Probation due to Maternity Leave and Competitions for Promotion).

Yes but my query was whether they were counting time served in a local authority towards the 2 years, I won't have the 2 years before Jan 12th, I'd certainly have it before an offer was made as I'm 2 years in March in government departments, I'll only be 22 months in January but I did 7 months in a LA before that. I've emailed HR in DPER so hopefully they can clarify

gordongekko · 17-12-2020 7:05pm

tgdaly wrote: »

Yes but my query was whether they were counting time served in a local authority towards the 2 years, I won't have the 2 years before Jan 12th, I'd certainly have it before an offer was made as I'm 2 years in March in government departments, I'll only be 22 months in January but I did 7 months in a LA before that. I've emailed HR in DPER so hopefully they can clarify

As far as I know that's public service not civil service so doesn't count. But I hope you get a reply as I'm not 100% sure

SortingYouOut · 17-12-2020 7:56pm

carnie wrote: »

It depends what elements they will use in this competition. Last time I made it to the interview stage of an Interdepartmental HEO comp I had to do a presentation before I was interviewed.

Did they give you the material to present or was that up to you? Will all be done remotely this time around so god knows what way it'll go down.

tgdaly · 17-12-2020 8:28pm

gordongekko wrote: »

As far as I know that's public service not civil service so doesn't count. But I hope you get a reply as I'm not 100% sure

Yeah I'm fairly sure you're right but would be good to find out for definite so I don't miss out. But I'm quite confident I'll have to wait for the next one, might be a small chance of a comp in my department this year so will keep my fingers crossed for that

whampiri · 18-12-2020 10:02am

GooglePlus wrote: »

Anyone have previous experience in this kind of competition? How much of a step up is it from the EO tests etc?

HEO is a huge step up. You go from managing a small team to potentially managing an entire office and more than that, being responsible for everything that happens in the office. In addition to that, you move from "doing" to compliance and reporting. You'll have input into decisions which may affect the entire organisation. You need to consider the big picture and not just you and your team when making plans, risk registers etc.

Everyone always thinks that the next grade up is easy and worth it. With HEO, if you're not willing to go the extra bit or think that it's a job you can swan about in, save yourself a lot of angst and hassle, and give it a skip.

If on the other hand you like being challenged, managing projects and teams, dealing with stakeholders and are happy to work hard, then go for it! Its massively rewarding, both from a self development and financial point of view.

I suggest looking at the HEOs in another Dept and see what it is that they do. The reason I suggest another Dept is so that you don't make assumptions.

In relation to the tests, they're similar but definitely more difficult.

Hippo · 23-12-2020 11:29am

whampiri wrote: »

HEO is a huge step up. You go from managing a small team to potentially managing an entire office and more than that, being responsible for everything that happens in the office. In addition to that, you move from "doing" to compliance and reporting. You'll have input into decisions which may affect the entire organisation. You need to consider the big picture and not just you and your team when making plans, risk registers etc.

I wish even half of this was true of my dept :pac:

Connected99 · 27-12-2020 11:50pm

Hippo wrote: »

I wish even half of this was true of my dept :pac:

I agree Hippo
Same here...

hellr · 29-12-2020 12:16am

Hi does anybody know what the tests we have to do on the 5th feb are?

rostalof · 29-12-2020 12:31am

hellr wrote: »

Hi does anybody know what the tests we have to do on the 5th feb are?

What tests? The closing date for applications hasn't passed yet?

Edit - I looked at the info booklet again. It says that applicants should receive a link to the online assessment tests by the 5th of February. Normally you have a week or so to do the assessment tests, most likely the standard numerical, verbal and situational assessments for these competitions.

caarp · 29-12-2020 1:05pm

Would any one have any experience doing the situational tests before? I did the all of the tests for EO open in 2017 and while I did well on the Maths and English, I also passed the situational assessment but not by much. When answering these situations, are you supposed to answer like you are already a HEO? I have no idea what they are looking for it seems...

Moghead · 06-01-2021 3:01pm

Just filling in the application form for this, there are only 4 competencies to be completed? I thought it would be 6?

Edit: sorry just read the circular, there are only 4

rostalof · 06-01-2021 3:05pm

Moghead wrote: »

Just filling in the application form for this, there are only 4 competencies to be completed? I thought it would be 6?

Edit: sorry just read the circular, there are only 4

I thought the same, there used to be 6. Did they always ask for 'high level examples' for them?

Breezer25 · 06-01-2021 3:26pm

Moghead wrote: »

Just filling in the application form for this, there are only 4 competencies to be completed? I thought it would be 6?

Edit: sorry just read the circular, there are only 4

Even though there are only 4, it's still taken me days to complete the form and ensure I am happy with my examples.

carnie · 06-01-2021 5:27pm

The 300 word count is a pain in the botty

pew · 06-01-2021 7:34pm

carnie wrote: »

The 300 word count is a pain in the botty

I'm trying to cut down my word count and it's an utter pain. Have 2 of them done but delivery of results is giving me a migraine so badly

mj90 · 06-01-2021 7:49pm

Has anyone filled in the Supplementary Information section? If so, what type of information have you included?

the explorer · 10-01-2021 2:21am

I see the Annual leave for this is 29 days to start off. was it always this, I thought I saw somewhere before that it was 25 days, similar to AO.

Dublintigger · 10-01-2021 3:43pm

rostalof wrote: »

Not at all, post away! There's just been a little confusion between open and interdepartmental competitions.

For clarity, what is the difference between Interdepartmental and departmental competition?
I think I'm missing something here.

Dublintigger · 10-01-2021 3:47pm

pew wrote: »

I'm trying to cut down my word count and it's an utter pain. Have 2 of them done but delivery of results is giving me a migraine so badly

I had the same problem - I was given the advice of using the Star format.
Try breaking it down to
S - the situation
T - the task
A - the action
R - the result.
It's still difficult but this helps.

Dublintigger · 10-01-2021 3:49pm

caarp wrote: »

Would any one have any experience doing the situational tests before? I did the all of the tests for EO open in 2017 and while I did well on the Maths and English, I also passed the situational assessment but not by much. When answering these situations, are you supposed to answer like you are already a HEO? I have no idea what they are looking for it seems...

Are there any any example tests we can practice on?

Rcfp · 10-01-2021 4:28pm

Agreed. Absolutely the worst part of the stage!!!

pew · 10-01-2021 4:41pm

Dublintigger wrote: »

I had the same problem - I was given the advice of using the Star format.
Try breaking it down to
S - the situation
T - the task
A - the action
R - the result.
It's still difficult but this helps.

I'm already doing this technique I applied for an internal one not so long ago and the word count was 400 so trying to cut down the word count on those ones because they are great examples!

Thanks though!!!

caarp · 10-01-2021 7:55pm

Dublintigger wrote: »

Are there any any example tests we can practice on?

In previous competitions, they usually provide a link to do a practice but sometimes, the practice is a once off, so once it's done, you can't go back and do them again. Plus, often they won't explain why your answer is wrong.

Interdepartmental Higher Executive Officer 2020 - (Serving Civil Servants ONLY)

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