Covid 19 Part XXX-113,332 ROI(2,282 deaths) 81,251 NI (1,384 deaths) (05/01) Read OP

Colm Burke on Part Kenny just there threw whole country under the bus. Blamed everyone for the case numbers and said government not responsible essentially.

namloc1980 wrote: »

Colm Burke on Part Kenny just there threw whole country under the bus. Blamed everyone for the case numbers and said government not responsible essentially.

2020's "we all partied"

seamus wrote: »

That's if we assume 20k tests.

If they've scaled back they may only be doing 10,000 tests a day.

We'll know later on.

In terms of the massive regional issues, it's pretty simple; when you have an exodus of people from Dublin and London out to the regions to meet up with their parents, cousins and mates from school, then you're going to see numbers explode.

Dublin by contrast has seen less impact from this surge, because nothing has really changed there.

Dublin people's fault?

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I will stick my neck out and maybe get roasted but we were almost encouraged to have a normal Christmas. Three households could mix , travel where you want to and then we wil deal with it after Christmas .Some people thought 3 household was target to accomplish

Varadker & Holohan saying we have the lowest infection rates in Europe any chance they got also done us no favours

MD1990 wrote: »

Varadker & Holohan saying we have the lowest infection rates in Europe any chance they got also done us no favours

We had the lowest infection rate and had a grip on it and they blew it by opening retail before Christmas .This encouraged crowds and mixing and then decided to blow it even more by allowing all those people have dinner all together huddled over a table

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I will stick my neck out and maybe get roasted but we were almost encouraged to have a normal Christmas. Three households could mix , travel where you want to and then we wil deal with it after Christmas .Some people thought 3 household was target to accomplish

Yep, should have encouraged people to stay in their immediate family bubble and only people living on their own to host or be a guest.

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I will stick my neck out and maybe get roasted but we were almost encouraged to have a normal Christmas. Three households could mix , travel where you want to and then we wil deal with it after Christmas .Some people thought 3 household was target to accomplish

We needed the vat income from the spending splurge to keep the lights on and the PUP payments etc. covered.

lawred2 wrote: »

Dublin people's fault?

I'm not assigning blame in that regard, just saying that if there's any query over why the regional numbers seem so high, it's because there was such an enormous movement of people out of population centres.

Hindsight is 20:20, but the travel ban should have remained in place and people told to stay in their county over Xmas. Would probably have fallen on deaf ears, but would have been worth a shot.

AdamD wrote: »

Perhaps having strict restrictions and not even contemplating alternative, safer social outlets such as outdoor meeting (all was banned in Dublin from October onwards), creates a pent up need for socialising which leads to the explosion in December.

I don't buy it. Outdoor meeting was permitted in December, but we didn't see the parks flooded with people meeting up responsibly. At the start of December there were loads of articles about meeting outdoors instead of indoors, articles suggesting that Grandad sits beside the open window at Xmas dinner, and people mocked it.

Other countries across Europe which had less restrictive regimes than us, saw a massive surge in Xmas-related infections too. This wasn't "pent-up" socialising demand. It was Xmas. And people's dogged insistence on celebrating it despite the lessons of the last 9 months.

AdamD wrote: »

Perhaps having strict restrictions and not even contemplating alternative, safer social outlets such as outdoor meeting (all was banned in Dublin from October onwards), creates a pent up need for socialising which leads to the explosion in December.

I really don't think a pent up need for socialising is actually a real thing tbh, other than offering a justification for those who went bananas.
If I'm used to meeting someone every saturday and we can't do it for a few weeks, I don't feel the need to meet them 3 times when things open up. I totally accept it wasn't everyone and plenty of people will have caught covid through sheer bad luck or maybe had just one interaction they thought was safe.

The narrative all along should never have been "to save Christmas" because too many people took that to mean "to do exactly like we've always done at Christmas". That then developed into "sure we're going into lockdown in January anyway, might as well hit it hard now when we can".

ixoy wrote: »

I really don't think it was retail that caused it - far more likely people meeting up in restaurants / pubs where there'd be no social distancing possible and no masks either.


Well NPHET did actively encourage people not to meet too many others. There's no real concept of a family bubble except as a support mechanism but I do think it should have been tried a bit better.

I limited my own interactions to immediate family on both sides and they limited it to effectively similar very low numbers (having small families was a big help).

I have heard the term, but I think it crept in here from UK references. I don't remember seeing any public promotion graphic or explanation of what a 'bubble' is. In an info vacuum, people make up their own definitions.

Was a 'bubble' a recommended thing in this country? It's like the tracker mortgage thing, everyone heard of it but no one knew how they worked (not even the banks)

Definitely there was a lot of mixing and partying that was not needed. The hairdressers and nail bars were packed full when I drove by, I remember thinking they’re obviously going out if they’re getting hair and nails done.

Retail I can understand opening but hospitality was ridiculous. Anyways, those who went out eating, drinking and being Merry did nothing wrong in terms of what was allowed, whether they should have is a different question. But, we will all pay the price now for them.

Ger Roe wrote: »

Was a 'bubble' a recommended thing in this country? It's like the tracker mortgage thing, everyone heard of it but no one knew how they worked (not even the banks)

Back in October the advice included a reference to allowing a single-person household to mix with one other household for essential support/care purposes.

Very quickly commentators started calling this a "support bubble". This phrase became part of the official government advice. But then it all got confused with the UK bubble concept, and people started arbitrarily mixing multi-person households and calling them bubbles.

The government is to blame for allowing hospitality to open and not putting out a stronger message about staying safe.
The hospitality industry are to blame for taking the piss and not honouring the restrictions
The public are to blame for taking the piss and ignoring the fact that we are still in the middle of a massive pandemic.

A someone who didn't go to a restaurant over Xmas and went into one other household on one day, of course *I* feel annoyed that this **** has gone on. But I can see from what's going on around me, that hundreds of thousands of people were poised to ignore whatever restrictions were in place; they were going to go and meet up with loads of people come hell or high water.

I agree with this to a certain extent. There was definitely pent up demand for socialising in Dublin. Remember all our cafes and restaurants closed to indoor dining since the start of October. However, I don't think the current infection rates are as a result of people breaking the restrictions. I think it's as a result of nearly everyone taking advantage of the four week window to go to a restaurant or meet up with family and friends.

The weather is so miserable in Ireland in winter that it's difficult to say "Oh just meet your friends for a walk in the park". It's difficult if it's cold and raining, or if it's dark. Everyone knew that restaurants and cafes would close again in January. Everyone knew it. So even those who might not have bothered going out over those four weeks thought - "well I had better take advantage now because they might be closed for the rest of the winter". If 4 million people are going out and meeting friends once or twice over the course of those four weeks, of course the virus is going to be rampant.

And I saw it in town. The Ivy was packed on a Wednesday afternoon at 3.45pm. Not lunch time, not dinner time, yet every table was full. Later that evening every cafe and restaurant off Grafton St was full - even the outdoor seating was full despite the baltic temperatures.

The Government made a mistake. They thought that the fear of infection would keep a number of diners away, but it didn't. Everyone restaurant was booked out for nearly the whole of December. Every cafe I went into in our suburb was 80% full at all times of the day. People didn't "go mad". The vast majority acted within the restrictions, it's just that way way more people went out visiting friends and family and going to restaurants than the government had anticipated. NPHET knew it but have been barking on about "very concerning figures" and "the next two weeks are crucial" that everyone had stopped listening.

That being said - I head some isolated stories of restaurants breaking restrictions. My friend managed to book a table for ten in one well known Dublin restaurant after some pleading. I didn't attend, but that was more to do with work than judgement. I know some people had home visitors before the 18 December - play dates and the like. But I think it was more to do with more people going to the limit of the restrictions than out-and-out flouting of them. That's on the government's head.