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Covid 19 Part XXX-113,332 ROI(2,282 deaths) 81,251 NI (1,384 deaths) (05/01) Read OP

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  • #5072
    CruelSummer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,324 ✭✭✭CruelSummer


    Tpcl20 wrote: »
    More tweets from journalists picking up this huge cock-up.

    https://twitter.com/PaulQuinnNews/status/1345154035477848065?s=20

    https://twitter.com/RobOHanrahan/status/1345145414786408449?s=20

    https://twitter.com/colettebrowne/status/1345142838833647616?s=20

    It doesn't matter that the government didn't know about the new strain at the start of December. It's not the reason for the rise in cases, the reopening of non-essential retail and especially the pub and restaurant sector as well as covid getting utterly out of control in schools is the cause of it.

    https://twitter.com/MartinaBroe1/status/1345102369365897217?s=20

    With all due respect, Ireland weren’t even testing what strain was here. At least the U.K. gathered the information and shared it. They’ve now done a tiny sample and decided to disregard the fact that Dublin - London is one of the busiest flight paths in the world. Not to mention numerous other U.K. flights, ferries, and entry from the North. Even Prof Nolan’s worst forecasts are outdone.
    These tweets seem more about scoring political points than facts.


  • #5073
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,690 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    hmmm wrote: »
    It was not crystal clear.

    Hospitality should not have re-opened. That would have been crystal clear.

    Its the implicit message of opening hospitality, and allowing household visits and inter County travel

    For people not paying attention as they are fatigued/not keeping up/not educated or bamboozled by the reams of data, that probably said, " its ok to do what you want"

    The nuances were lost

    I see it with my Ohs daughter in her 20s allegedly caring for her very susceptible grandmother

    Myself and the OH originally planned to meet her and his son outside Christmas day to exchange gifts

    They were too busy
    Then we suggested Stephens day, but they were too busy and suggested the 27th

    No way was I meeting them even outside after them socialising for three days so suggested Christmas Eve

    They were going to a party at 8 pm so we saw them earlier

    Neither of them either understood or analysed the messaging, in the case of his daughter who does not follow traditional media, she was probably completely ignorant

    Our messaging has always been too complex since the first set of restrictions tbh, its not targeted enough and has more ifs, buts and maybes than holes in a colander

    We've had people post on here that others thought do not meet up with more than two other households was a limit on a daily basis, not for the duration of being able to meet other households

    The UK for all their faults have a very simple message, hands, space face

    Thats where our messaging has failed. The wilful disregard that appears to have resulted though is down to people, maybe thinking they have been fine so far and taking a chance


  • #5074
    Renjit
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 949 ✭✭✭Renjit


    messin doorman wrote: »
    You know I hate to give it to the feminists (because they are mostly c**ts) but Jacinta Arden deserves some credit

    Dont let the hate get in the way of simple google searching her name's correct spelling :pac:


  • #5075
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,690 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    Goldengirl wrote: »
    With the greatest respect , that was small sample tested a week ago.
    The UK variant went from under 10% present in Kent to 67% of those testing positive in South East of England unless than a week !
    I would like to see results from Mr deGascun doing a bit more and frequent sampling at this stage ,as this just doesn't feel right .

    I'd fully agree with this 30000 people came back from the UK and we see this spike

    I suspect the variant is causing merry hell here on top of too much socialising


  • #5076
    delly
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 7,768 Mod ✭✭✭✭delly


    Interesting to see the low % of the new variant, I'm surprised tbh. Re the journalists rounding on the government is fair enough, but they were the same ones getting vox pops in late November about people wanting some bit of Christmas etc.

    I'll happily kick the government, but the general population have to take some personal responsibility. While some activities were allowed, nobody said that they were safe to do so and that they should only be done if deemed important enough. A bit like the old line about speed limits being just that, a limit and not a target.

    9 months on and I'm still in the position of not having anybody enter my home or having visited anyone else's. It's tough on my family, kids etc., but it's just the way that it has to be. My extended family all had Christmas dinner together, we had it home alone. Personal choice and personal responsibility, end of.


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  • #5077
    ImDave
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,096 ✭✭✭ImDave


    When we are hearing of average close contacts per case of six, and examples of cases with 25-30 contacts, it's a bit rich for Gov to be putting the current situation on the UK strain.

    A lot more to be investigated around this strain for sure, and data so far demonstrates higher transmission rates, but that's surely somewhat irrelevant given the high close contacts we are hearing reported?

    Theres a very strong element of using the new strain as a get out of jail card from a political perspective.

    The messaging from NPHET and Government around mixing in December might be viewed by some as clear, others as completely unclear, but the primary issue seems to be that a huge cohort of people simply weren't listening to that messaging in the first place.


  • #5078
    messin doorman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69 ✭✭messin doorman


    Renjit wrote: »
    Dont let the hate get in the way of simple google searching her name's correct spelling :pac:

    Some tart in New Zealand. Doesn’t matter how her name is spelled. It’s a regional dialect.

    Mod: perma-banned from the forum


  • #5079
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,883 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    Stheno wrote: »
    I'd fully agree with this 30000 people came back from the UK and we see this spike

    I suspect the variant is causing merry hell here on top of too much socialising

    Yes . I would have thought that totally was the case and not the variant but have been spooked today .


  • #5080
    Goldengirl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,883 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    messin doorman wrote: »
    Some tart in New Zealand. Doesn’t matter how her name is spelled. It’s a regional dialect.

    Watch your misogyny there .


  • #5081
    messin doorman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69 ✭✭messin doorman


    Goldengirl wrote: »
    Watch your misogyny there .

    Thanks love.


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  • #5082
    ElJeffe
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 725 ✭✭✭ElJeffe


    I'm getting bad vibes about the whole vaccine roll out here tbh. I mean I get the whole we're in it together Europe vibe but sometimes you just have to look after your own best interests. I'm thinking we could have saved a lot more money in the long run just going to the source and throwing money at them not to mention having everyone vaccinated quicker. I do wonder if other European countries will do separate deals on the sly.


  • #5083
    Loafing Oaf
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,827 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    messin doorman wrote: »
    Some tart in New Zealand..

    Don't let the forum door hit you on the way out, doorman


  • #5084
    Professor Moriarty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,394 ✭✭✭✭Professor Moriarty


    messin doorman wrote: »
    Thanks love.

    Luciano would be so proud.


  • #5085
    podgeandrodge
    Site Banned Posts: 5,975 ✭✭✭podgeandrodge


    igCorcaigh wrote: »
    I had a bit of strong words with my 75+yo mother.
    She had been visiting her brother (living alone, in fairness it's hard).

    She said that's the last social visit.
    igCorcaigh wrote: »
    For now, yes.

    why though? surely of all the reasons for the support bubble this would be one? leaving him alone seems more risky tbh in other ways.


  • #5086
    MrMusician18
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,083 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    Tpcl20 wrote: »
    More tweets from journalists picking up this huge cock-up.

    https://twitter.com/PaulQuinnNews/status/1345154035477848065?s=20

    https://twitter.com/RobOHanrahan/status/1345145414786408449?s=20

    https://twitter.com/colettebrowne/status/1345142838833647616?s=20

    It doesn't matter that the government didn't know about the new strain at the start of December. It's not the reason for the rise in cases, the reopening of non-essential retail and especially the pub and restaurant sector as well as covid getting utterly out of control in schools is the cause of it.

    https://twitter.com/MartinaBroe1/status/1345102369365897217?s=20

    You are also forgetting to mention the explosion in household visits and wholesale ignoring of the public health advice.

    This is not the fault of government. It's the fault of people's individual choices.


  • #5087
    AutoTuning
    Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭AutoTuning


    I suggested a few weeks ago on a few forums that we should have cooled it dramatically for Christmas and stayed home. I was laughed out of it and/or torn apart.

    Now the same people are blaming government and everyone else. Nobody forced anyone to go mingling or to throw Xmas parties, fly in from abroad or drive all over the country or to go out to crowded shops. It was blatantly obvious there was a huge risk. This is entirely on all those who decided having a normal Christmas was far more important than anything else.

    If those figures are accurate and we’ve a major meltdown this week that’s what’s caused it.

    We are obsessed with Xmas. It was hyped and hyped and hyped and always had been. If you’re not having a magical time and clearing out half of the shops beforehand there’s something wrong with you apparently.

    You’ve people on here appealing for personal responsibility to drive the response and for the government to step back. Thats exactly what was offered and exactly what was done, yet here we are!

    We don’t take personal responsibility we have a culture of blame the authorities, blame and possibly sue the experts.

    This is a case I’ve “well I’ve had my fun and that’s all that matters.”


  • #5088
    Professor Moriarty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,394 ✭✭✭✭Professor Moriarty


    messin doorman wrote: »
    Please. I’m not worried. The dorito-eating, virgin, world of Warcraft diary wielding mods will be along in due course to apply their awesome god-like powers on mere employed, sexually active mortals like me. Who cares.

    Then what's the point?


  • #5089
    Bananaleaf
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,923 ✭✭✭Bananaleaf


    AutoTuning wrote: »
    I suggested a few weeks ago on a few forums that we should have cooled it dramatically for Christmas and stayed home. I was laughed out of it and/or torn apart.

    Now the same people are blaming government and everyone else. Nobody forced anyone to go mingling or to throw Xmas parties, fly in from abroad or drive all over the country or to go out to crowded shops. It was blatantly obvious there was a huge risk. This is entirely in all those who decided having a normal Christmas was far more important than anything else.

    If those figures are accurate and we’ve a major meltdown this week that’s what’s caused it.

    We are obsessed with Xmas. It was hyped and hyped and hyped and always had been. If you’re not having a magical time and clearing out half of the shops beforehand there’s something wrong with you apparently.

    You’ve people on here appealing for personal responsibility to drive the response and for the government to step back. Thats exactly what was offered and exactly what was done, yet here we are!

    We don’t take personal responsibility we have a culture of blame the authorities, blame and possibly sue the experts.

    This is a case I’ve “well I’ve had my fun and that’s all that matters.”

    Not excusing the actions of those who did go out shopping, eating, drinking, socialising. Of course they shouldn't have.

    But ... it wasn't just you who knew this was going to happen. The government knew too and yet they opened it all up.

    That, to me, is f**king scandalous


  • #5090
    Polar101
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,038 ✭✭✭Polar101


    delly wrote: »
    Interesting to see the low % of the new variant, I'm surprised tbh. Re the journalists rounding on the government is fair enough, but they were the same ones getting vox pops in late November about people wanting some bit of Christmas etc.

    Sounds like about 4 different scenarios are possible..

    1) The new variant isn't a thing here - cases have gone up because things opened up for December
    2) The new variant is coming, which would mean even more cases = bad
    3) They aren't testing enough to find the new variant, and it's already here in significant numbers
    4) Restrictions kicked in before the new variant made a big impact.


  • #5091
    Tpcl20
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 293 ✭✭Tpcl20


    Wow the government spin has really done a number on posters here, wanting to blame everyone who was just doing what was permitted.

    What the government permitted was too much.

    The variant notwithstanding, the government did not listen to NPHET. The variant is spreading here too, and that certainly won't help in coming months. But Nolan is categorically saying that it is not the primary cause of the current surge. He models the data. The data shows the facts. When we have more data, we will be able to make further determinations about the virus. Current data shows that the variant is not the cause of the surge.


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  • #5092
    khalessi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,216 ✭✭✭khalessi


    Tpcl20 wrote: »
    Wow the government spin has really done a number on posters here, wanting to blame everyone who was just doing what was permitted.

    What the government permitted was too much.

    The variant notwithstanding, the government did not listen to NPHET. The variant is spreading here too, and that certainly won't help in coming months. But Nolan is categorically saying that it is not the primary cause of the current surge. He models the data. The data shows the facts. When we have more data, we will be able to make further determinations about the virus. Current data shows that the variant is not the cause of the surge.

    There is permitted and there is going overboard. A lot of people went overboard


  • #5093
    Professor Moriarty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,394 ✭✭✭✭Professor Moriarty


    Tpcl20 wrote: »
    Wow the government spin has really done a number on posters here, wanting to blame everyone who was just doing what was permitted.

    What the government permitted was too much.

    The variant notwithstanding, the government did not listen to NPHET. The variant is spreading here too, and that certainly won't help in coming months. But Nolan is categorically saying that it is not the primary cause of the current surge. He models the data. The data shows the facts. When we have more data, we will be able to make further determinations about the virus. Current data shows that the variant is not the cause of the surge.

    If everybody had adhered to the guidelines we wouldn't be where we are today.


  • #5094
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,690 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    Bananaleaf wrote: »
    Not excusing the actions of those who did go out shopping, eating, drinking, socialising. Of course they shouldn't have.

    But ... it wasn't just you who knew this was going to happen. The government knew too and yet they opened it all up.

    That, to me, is f**king scandalous

    In their defence, and I'm setting a low bar here, I think they tried to be all things to all people

    I live with my OH and we rarely socialise in a pub with others, so going for a meal makes a nice break from working from home and cooking dinner

    I'm also one of a family of ten siblings visiting after months would have been nice

    My oh has two children in their 20s who normally come over for a couple of days at Christmas and eat themselves silly

    The only one of those three we did this year was go for meals

    People appear to have completely disregarded the guidelines for multiple reasons


  • #5095
    snowgal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,826 ✭✭✭snowgal


    AutoTuning wrote: »
    I suggested a few weeks ago on a few forums that we should have cooled it dramatically for Christmas and stayed home. I was laughed out of it and/or torn apart.

    Now the same people are blaming government and everyone else. Nobody forced anyone to go mingling or to throw Xmas parties, fly in from abroad or drive all over the country or to go out to crowded shops. It was blatantly obvious there was a huge risk. This is entirely on all those who decided having a normal Christmas was far more important than anything else.

    If those figures are accurate and we’ve a major meltdown this week that’s what’s caused it.

    We are obsessed with Xmas. It was hyped and hyped and hyped and always had been. If you’re not having a magical time and clearing out half of the shops beforehand there’s something wrong with you apparently.

    You’ve people on here appealing for personal responsibility to drive the response and for the government to step back. Thats exactly what was offered and exactly what was done, yet here we are!

    We don’t take personal responsibility we have a culture of blame the authorities, blame and possibly sue the experts.

    This is a case I’ve “well I’ve had my fun and that’s all that matters.”

    Ah please. You and half the thread thought that in fairness.....sorry but these I told ye so posts are annoying.. those of us who knew did what we could.... and others didn’t.. and here we are still....


  • #5096
    AutoTuning
    Closed Accounts Posts: 423 ✭✭AutoTuning


    You’re fully permitted to stick your fingers into a light bulb holder, clean your lawnmower out with your hand or do countless dangerous things. There isn’t Garda or a health and safety person going to appear to stop you any more than someone’s going to shut down your Xmas party or anything else.

    You’ve endless argument on here and worse elsewhere that the government lockdowns were far too extreme and that people should be allowed to just make their own judgement.

    Well they did exactly that!

    The information was fully there from public health, media, government, locally, nationally and internationally.

    We don’t accept that heavy handed policing is something that we are prepared to do. We don’t even have the resources to do it. Yet we are also not prepared to take personal responsibility or really work as a community to deal with this.

    The vaccines are going to take months. We don’t have many choices here.


  • #5097
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,690 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    Tpcl20 wrote: »
    Wow the government spin has really done a number on posters here, wanting to blame everyone who was just doing what was permitted.

    What the government permitted was too much.

    The variant notwithstanding, the government did not listen to NPHET. The variant is spreading here too, and that certainly won't help in coming months. But Nolan is categorically saying that it is not the primary cause of the current surge. He models the data. The data shows the facts. When we have more data, we will be able to make further determinations about the virus. Current data shows that the variant is not the cause of the surge.

    Nope anecdotal stories of 30 close contacts is beyond stupid

    People caused this


  • #5098
    Loafing Oaf
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,827 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    Tpcl20 wrote: »
    Wow the government spin has really done a number on posters here, wanting to blame everyone who was just doing what was permitted.

    What the government permitted was too much.

    The variant notwithstanding, the government did not listen to NPHET. The variant is spreading here too, and that certainly won't help in coming months. But Nolan is categorically saying that it is not the primary cause of the current surge. He models the data. The data shows the facts. When we have more data, we will be able to make further determinations about the virus. Current data shows that the variant is not the cause of the surge.

    You're 'permitted' to drink ten litres of cola per day. Should you blame the government if you do that and all your teeth fall out?


  • #5099
    Tpcl20
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 293 ✭✭Tpcl20


    Well if Philip Nolan, the person who models the data and extrapolates the causes that are driving spread, isn't going to convince you when he says the UK variant isn't the main issue then I'm hardly going to inspire you.


  • #5100
    TonyMaloney
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,150 ✭✭✭TonyMaloney


    Professor Moriarty wrote: »
    If everybody had adhered to the guidelines we wouldn't be where we are today.

    The guidelines were stay at home, go to the pub, go to restaurants, go shopping, don't use public transport but obviously you can if you like.

    And we did all that a lot


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  • #5101
    Wolf359f
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,399 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    ElJeffe wrote: »
    I'm getting bad vibes about the whole vaccine roll out here tbh. I mean I get the whole we're in it together Europe vibe but sometimes you just have to look after your own best interests. I'm thinking we could have saved a lot more money in the long run just going to the source and throwing money at them not to mention having everyone vaccinated quicker. I do wonder if other European countries will do separate deals on the sly.

    Then we become a little fish in a very large pond, trying to outbid other countries 10x our size. Pfizer was using new technology, nobody knew how the results would be, Moderna I believe never brought a vaccine to market. These are the top 2 or the first 2 to be approved. So without knowing the results of phase 3 trials, you would need to be throwing a tonne of money at a lot of manufacturers.
    I can literally hear people complain about government wasting money on millions of doses of a vaccine which turned out to be worthless.


This discussion has been closed.
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