Opening of "No-Food" pubs pushed out again

IAMAMORON · 15-12-2020 07:14PM

hynesie08 wrote: »

I mostly agree, but I can't see the magic day when the bells of Christchurch ring and we all meet on o connell St and hug...... I think it'll very much be a slowly phased reduction in restrictions, and while I'd love to see "we're vaccinating group x, so food pubs only need 1m and pint pubs can open with time limit and distance restrictions" I think we'll be at least be at 25% vaccination before anything extra is lifted....

It is not just the pubs they need opening, the airports also and the country as a whole.

Once the HSE and the elderly get their jabs it will rollout quick enough. It is more cost efficient to vaccinate everyone than fork out 350 a week. Believe.

I reckon we are back drinking by Paddy's day. Flights too.

hynesie08 · 15-12-2020 07:19PM

IAMAMORON wrote: »

It is not just the pubs they need opening, the airports also and the country as a whole.

Once the HSE and the elderly get their jabs it will rollout quick enough. It is more cost efficient to vaccinate everyone than fork out 350 a week. Believe.

I reckon we are back drinking by Paddy's day. Flights too.

I hope you're right, but I don't think you are....

Necro · 15-12-2020 07:41PM

IAMAMORON wrote: »

It is not just the pubs they need opening, the airports also and the country as a whole.

Once the HSE and the elderly get their jabs it will rollout quick enough. It is more cost efficient to vaccinate everyone than fork out 350 a week. Believe.

I reckon we are back drinking by Paddy's day. Flights too.

Probably for another thread but the main stumbling block will likely be supply in the first few months. I am hopeful of a normal summer though.

IAMAMORON · 15-12-2020 07:54PM

Necro wrote: »

Probably for another thread but the main stumbling block will likely be supply in the first few months. I am hopeful of a normal summer though.

Fair point... and I think we can ( or should ) also factor in the " Irishness " of how things roll out. Lets be honest, we are not best known for our efficiency?

But the way I see it once health workers, the elderly and the vulnerable get their jabs I cannot see why restrictions don't start getting lifted?

The question should be what is the population of people over 70 + healthcare workers + vulnerable persons? That is basically the break even point from a safety point of view?

hynesie08 · 15-12-2020 07:58PM

IAMAMORON wrote: »

Fair point... and I think we can ( or should ) also factor in the " Irishness " of how things roll out. Lets be honest, we are not best known for our efficiency?

But the way I see it once health workers, the elderly and the vulnerable get their jabs I cannot see why restrictions don't start getting lifted?

The question should be what is the population of people over 70 + healthcare workers + vulnerable persons? That is basically the break even point from a safety point of view?

I actually have more faith in the "Irishness" than anything else, I really don't think we'll stick the vaccine in the boot of the Dublin/galway gobus. If worst comes to worst I absolutely see the army pulling rank and organising the transport, set up and possibly even the injections........

Necro · 15-12-2020 08:00PM

IAMAMORON wrote: »

Fair point... and I think we can ( or should ) also factor in the " Irishness " of how things roll out. Lets be honest, we are not best known for our efficiency?

But the way I see it once health workers, the elderly and the vulnerable get their jabs I cannot see why restrictions don't start getting lifted?

The question should be what is the population of people over 70 + healthcare workers + vulnerable persons? That is basically the break even point from a safety point of view?

Yes, theoretically once the high risk people are vaccinated we should hopefully see a roll back.

Lookit we're all bracing ourselves for probably level 5 again in January anyways.

The plan today is hopeful, but I think a little more patience and we'll get over the line.

Hopefully they get through the first group if not the first two by end of Jan and they can drop us back to level 3, then roll back further as more supply becomes available and indeed more people are vaccinated.

It's killing me personally, none of the pubs where I live serve food so will be a very dry Christmas

(I don't drink much at home because of the kids)

Necro · 15-12-2020 08:01PM

hynesie08 wrote: »

I actually have more faith in the "Irishness" than anything else, I really don't think we'll stick the vaccine in the boot of the Dublin/galway gobus. If worst comes to worst I absolutely see the army pulling rank and organising the transport, set up and possibly even the injections........

They're already involved in the mobile test centres so I see no reason why they wouldn't be deployed to the major mass vaccination centres too

hynesie08 · 15-12-2020 08:11PM

Necro wrote: »

They're already involved in the mobile test centres so I see no reason why they wouldn't be deployed to the major mass vaccination centres too

They're the boys you don't know about until you know about them, and if Donnelly drags his feet (which I don't think he will) we'll very quickly know about them..........

Ray Donovan · 15-12-2020 09:16PM

IAMAMORON wrote: »

It is not just the pubs they need opening, the airports also and the country as a whole.

Once the HSE and the elderly get their jabs it will rollout quick enough. It is more cost efficient to vaccinate everyone than fork out 350 a week. Believe.

I reckon we are back drinking by Paddy's day. Flights too.

But will we be drinking at the bar? Sitting at a table practically asking permission if you can go to the toilet is a waste of time. Basically when will pubs be back to the way they were in February 2019?

Zebra3 · 15-12-2020 09:47PM

Ray Donovan wrote: »

But will we be drinking at the bar? Sitting at a table practically asking permission if you can go to the toilet is a waste of time. Basically when will pubs be back to the way they were in February 2019?

An bhfuil cead agam.....

PommieBast · 16-12-2020 02:01AM

Ray Donovan wrote: »

Basically when will pubs be back to the way they were in February 2019?

It is a matter of "if" because most pubs will be in receivership by the time "when" comes about.

Neowise · 16-12-2020 03:35AM

PommieBast wrote: »

It is a matter of "if" because most pubs will be in receivership by the time "when" comes about.

I think in this pandemic age, we need more pubs.

Every pub I try to book is full. There is not enough pubs to service demand at this moment in time.

It seems stupid to have pubs closed, when there is not enough available at the moment to service the demand, while keeping all social distancing rules.

I know for a fact, that on a thursday, i am not able to book a table in my local pub/gastropub/resturtant for a saturday night drink, because it is fully booked out, and it takes a deposit against my credit card if i do make a reservation, which i got on a tuesday, as its less busy. the deposit was refunded after i paid for my drinks/meals.

There is more demand than available place at the weekend currently, and i think non food pubs could service that demand, in just as safe and socaily distant maner as food pubs are currently doing.

Non food pubs are not asking to open like its 2019, they understand there is a pandemic, just as well as eveybody else, and so does their customers.

If a customers believes that a premises is risking their health, then they will not frequent that premises.

Normal best business practices will close crappy pubs who don't adhere to the necessary social distancing pratices. If customers frequent unsafe joints, they may get sick, so why frequent them, when there is other places that values your life.

Strumms · 16-12-2020 03:53AM

People after consuming alcohol don’t have the ability to risk asses, don’t have the ability after alcohol to complete and maintain good, proper and safe judgements... alcohol isn’t Guinness, Bacardi, Powers, a White Russian, it is a chemical, a psychotropic drug and is a chemical substance that changes nervous system function and results in a change to maintain good judgement , mood, proper consciousness, cognition, and often behavior.... it doesn’t mix with covid unfortunately.

beggars_bush · 16-12-2020 07:47AM

IAMAMORON wrote: »

It is not just the pubs they need opening, the airports also and the country as a whole.

Once the HSE and the elderly get their jabs it will rollout quick enough. It is more cost efficient to vaccinate everyone than fork out 350 a week. Believe.

I reckon we are back drinking by Paddy's day. Flights too.

That's not going to happen

IAMAMORON · 16-12-2020 11:40AM

beggars_bush wrote: »

That's not going to happen

I don't honestly know the timescale, but it is going to happen. Once health care workers are inoculated you will see outbreaks dramatically decrease and as the elderly inoculation program gets rolled out you will see less and less infected persons having to attend hospital.

SARS 1 basically vanished within 24 months of it's initial outbreak.

If they start inoculating in the new year I reckon they have jabbed all the necessary by the end of February? Granted we are talking about the HSE here, but if we assume they can get their act together for 2 months, they have been great so far in fairness to them.

It also goes to show how much of a political hot potato the HSE and the health service is in general. How often do you see some dour journalist, whining lyrical outside some hospital in the midlands in early January, about people on trollies suffering from the flu? This gets linked into countless newspaper articles and opposition TD's wailing on about, " a holy disgrace". At least the Covid Vaccine rollout should save us from this annual tut tut.

Neowise · 16-12-2020 12:13PM

Strumms wrote: »

People after consuming alcohol don’t have the ability to risk asses, don’t have the ability after alcohol to complete and maintain good, proper and safe judgements... alcohol isn’t Guinness, Bacardi, Powers, a White Russian, it is a chemical, a psychotropic drug and is a chemical substance that changes nervous system function and results in a change to maintain good judgement , mood, proper consciousness, cognition, and often behavior.... it doesn’t mix with covid unfortunately.

This is absolute tripe.

I could agree to [some people after consuming significant quantities of alcohol may have a lesser ability to assess risks correctly] but as you have wrote it, it is simply untrue, and wrong.

Dub81 · 16-12-2020 12:50PM

Strumms wrote: »

People after consuming alcohol don’t have the ability to risk asses, don’t have the ability after alcohol to complete and maintain good, proper and safe judgements... alcohol isn’t Guinness, Bacardi, Powers, a White Russian, it is a chemical, a psychotropic drug and is a chemical substance that changes nervous system function and results in a change to maintain good judgement , mood, proper consciousness, cognition, and often behavior.... it doesn’t mix with covid unfortunately.

what a bizzare statement

boombang · 16-12-2020 01:15PM

Dub81 wrote: »

what a bizzare statement

Totally logical statement that accords with my knowledge, experience and enjoyment of alcohol.

It also corresponds with my experience of a locked man coming up and embracing the others at my table at a restaurant this summer. People with booze on board don't make the same decisions as when sober and this matters when there's an infectious disease going around.

I wonder do the gargle mongers on this thread even believe COVID is real.

HeidiHeidi · 16-12-2020 01:16PM

Neowise wrote: »

This is absolute tripe.

I could agree to [some people after consuming significant quantities of alcohol may have a lesser ability to assess risks correctly] but as you have wrote it, it is simply untrue, and wrong.

Dub81 wrote: »

what a bizzare statement

Spot on IMO.

Anyone who thinks alcohol doesn't affect your judgement and ability to make quality decisions is deluded.

Neowise · 16-12-2020 01:28PM

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

Spot on IMO.

Anyone who thinks alcohol doesn't affect your judgement and ability to make quality decisions is deluded.

Affect judgement and affects ability to make quality decisions is not the same as, unable to asses risks.

If 100 people were given one unit of alcohol, and asked to attempt to either juggle tennis balls or razor sharp swords, how many of them one hundred people would be attempting to juggle the swords. There was zero attempt to consider the majority of people who drink in moderation and only zoomed in on the minority that abuse alcohol.

Geuze · 16-12-2020 01:56PM

IAMAMORON wrote: »

I don't honestly know the timescale, but it is going to happen. Once health care workers are inoculated you will see outbreaks dramatically decrease

Are you assuming here that the vaccine prevents transmission?

I don't think that is being claimed.

The vaccine maker and regulators do not claim that the vaccine prevents transmission.

average_runner · 16-12-2020 02:04PM

Neowise wrote: »

Affect judgement and affects ability to make quality decisions is not the same as, unable to asses risks.

If 100 people were given one unit of alcohol, and asked to attempt to either juggle tennis balls or razor sharp swords, how many of them one hundred people would be attempting to juggle the swords. There was zero attempt to consider the majority of people who drink in moderation and only zoomed in on the minority that abuse alcohol.

Some can handle it better than others, but if you walk out on to the streets at 3am when things were rocking, you see how we behave. Hugs all around, people hanging out of each other etc. Alot of people become more friendlier when drinking

Neowise · 16-12-2020 03:08PM

average_runner wrote: »

Some can handle it better than others, but if you walk out on to the streets at 3am when things were rocking, you see how we behave. Hugs all around, people hanging out of each other etc. Alot of people become more friendlier when drinking

But the law says they need to be empty by 11pm, so why would people be leaving at 3am?

SAMTALK · 16-12-2020 04:24PM

Neowise wrote: »

Affect judgement and affects ability to make quality decisions is not the same as, unable to asses risks.

If 100 people were given one unit of alcohol, and asked to attempt to either juggle tennis balls or razor sharp swords, how many of them one hundred people would be attempting to juggle the swords. There was zero attempt to consider the majority of people who drink in moderation and only zoomed in on the minority that abuse alcohol.

But you can't drive after having a drink, Why ?

Anyone who thinks they will carry on 100 % the same as pre drinks is deluded. Of course people will not assess risks the same way

Bunny Colvin · 16-12-2020 04:28PM

Neowise wrote: »

Affect judgement and affects ability to make quality decisions is not the same as, unable to asses risks.

If 100 people were given one unit of alcohol, and asked to attempt to either juggle tennis balls or razor sharp swords, how many of them one hundred people would be attempting to juggle the swords. There was zero attempt to consider the majority of people who drink in moderation and only zoomed in on the minority that abuse alcohol.

I'd say the majority of people that drink abuse alcohol in some way or another. I don't know many people who calculate their alcoholic units on a night out.

Dub81 · 16-12-2020 04:32PM

boombang wrote: »

Totally logical statement that accords with my knowledge, experience and enjoyment of alcohol.

It also corresponds with my experience of a locked man coming up and embracing the others at my table at a restaurant this summer. People with booze on board dont make the decisions and this matters when there's an infectious disease going around.

I wonder do the gargle mongers on this thread even believe COVID is real.

Theres a sweeping generalisation if i ever seen one, who are you to make such sweeping statements about people who consume alcohol, you dont think that people cant go out and have a few drinks without going around hugging and slobbering over people, by your logic any "gargle mongers" as you refer to them are a slobbering mess incapable of having a few drinks and a laugh.

The mind boggles :eek:

boombang · 16-12-2020 04:50PM

Dub81 wrote: »

Theres a sweeping generalisation if i ever seen one, who are you to make such sweeping statements about people who consume alcohol, you dont think that people cant go out and have a few drinks without going around hugging and slobbering over people, by your logic any "gargle mongers" as you refer to them are a slobbering mess incapable of having a few drinks and a laugh.

The mind boggles :eek:

The mind does indeed boggle.

There's clearly going to be a spectrum from quiet aul' lads not infecting anybody to pissheads hugging and jumping all over each other. It's hard to find workable rules that permits the former without the latter emerging. I've seen the latter with my own eyes the summer months. Without controls I believe many would be back to business as usual and Ireland would not be the COVID success story that it is relative to other countries.

Anyway, I don't know why I keep posting here. Most of you still want to believe that we should fling the doors open and everyone should enjoy a jar and not worry about the consequences.

PommieBast · 16-12-2020 06:26PM

IAMAMORON wrote: »

If they start inoculating in the new year I reckon they have jabbed all the necessary by the end of February? Granted we are talking about the HSE here, but if we assume they can get their act together for 2 months, they have been great so far in fairness to them.

Cue the arguments over who constitutes the necessary. There will be someone in position of influence pushing for whats amount to an everyone jabbed policy.

jippo nolan · 16-12-2020 06:33PM

Strumms wrote: »

People after consuming alcohol don’t have the ability to risk asses, don’t have the ability after alcohol to complete and maintain good, proper and safe judgements... alcohol isn’t Guinness, Bacardi, Powers, a White Russian, it is a chemical, a psychotropic drug and is a chemical substance that changes nervous system function and results in a change to maintain good judgement , mood, proper consciousness, cognition, and often behavior.... it doesn’t mix with covid unfortunately.

Speak for yourself, are you not able for it?

saabsaab · 16-12-2020 06:33PM

Roll out the jabs. The Defence forces should be involved with field hospitals around the country.

Opening of "No-Food" pubs pushed out again

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