Schools closed until February? (part 3)

JimmyVik · 29-10-2020 03:31PM

meeeeh wrote: »

Then why complain?

Do you think perhaps you've lost the plot altogether at this point meeeeh.
I think that happened weeks ago.
But carry on. Its entertaining if nothing else

eagle eye · 29-10-2020 03:34PM

meeeeh wrote:

You know exactly what it was about. Merkel said they are not closing schools yesterday. Apparently you have the facts which prove her wrong. Surely you wouldn't want her to mistakenly think that the schools will stay open.

I think Boggles lives in and is discussing Ireland just like me.

You must have gotten your wires crossed and thought this thread was about Germany.

meeeeh · 29-10-2020 03:37PM

Boggles wrote: »

Well I could send her the link that informed me they closed schools or I could quote you if you don't mind?

You can if you think I was saying that it was a national policy not a few exceptions like in Ireland.

jrosen · 29-10-2020 03:38PM

Boggles wrote: »

Or those where there is a limited amount allowed in at one time, or mask usage is mandatory, people working outside, or in places where serial testing of literally everyone is carried out every 2 weeks.

To be honest I'd struggle to think of a place that doesn't have more stringent health and safety than a school.

Its not comparing like with like.

Each and every place of work has to do what they can within their 4 walls. It was always going to vary.

My dentist is still seeing the same number of patients, no masks and no serial testing.
In my line of work we have no serial testing, no reduction in number of people and while yes masks are mandatory to cross the door it's not always possible for the masks to remain on.

I do think the testing and tracing needs to be stepped up and I do think it needs to be done as a matter of priority in school settings. But I would argue that there are many other people who face the risk of covid in their every day job.

wirelessdude01 · 29-10-2020 03:39PM

khalessi wrote: »

Damn those teachers and their pesky demands. If it wasn't for those pesky teachers, we could just ignore what is going on with the education sector and the HSE. We could ignore that the guidelines issued by the Dept of Education were incorrect at time of publication. We could ignore that the covid app has been updated for healthcare and education sectors to pause during the working day. We could ignore the disparity in case numbers and HSE case numbers. We could ignore what is considered a close contact in other sectors is not considered a close contact in education. Those pesky teachers and their demands.

It makes me laugh that you think it unreasonable to ask for a safe working environment which is also then safe for children. Also interesting that people who disagree with you are considered to be circling the wagons. It couldnt be they have more experience and knowledge of the education sector than yourself.

Easy to ignore when you aren't even here.

meeeeh · 29-10-2020 03:40PM

eagle eye wrote: »

I think Boggles lives in and is discussing Ireland just like me.

You must have gotten your wires crossed and thought this thread was about Germany.

I think Boggles knows exactly what it was about but yes I will agree with you Boggles hasn't got a clue what is going on in Germany but that still didn't stop them commenting.

Boggles · 29-10-2020 03:42PM

jrosen wrote: »

But I would argue that there are many other people who face the risk of covid in their every day job.

I wouldn't disagree with that, but that wasn't your argument.

You stated teachers were at no more a risk than the rest of society.

Even the logic you just posted disagrees with your own statement.

wirelessdude01 · 29-10-2020 03:42PM

facehugger99 wrote: »

Agreed - it's almost as if the risk of serious illness as a result of Covid has been grossly exaggerated - now that couldn't be right, could it?

#coviddenyer

Boggles · 29-10-2020 03:46PM

meeeeh wrote: »

I think Boggles knows exactly what it was about but yes I will agree with you Boggles hasn't got a clue what is going on in Germany but that still didn't stop them commenting.

You do realize you are arguing with yourself, not me?

meeeeh wrote: »

France and Germany are both leaving schools open. Especially Germans must really know nothing about Corona since they are not listening to your expert opinion.

meeeeh wrote: »

Actually as far as I know there were closures of some schools in Bavaria

Again, we will live it there TBH.

facehugger99 · 29-10-2020 03:54PM

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

Great covid isn't real, its just the flu, we've done full circle, well done

I know which one I'd rather catch and it ain't the flu.

Boggles · 29-10-2020 03:57PM

facehugger99 wrote: »

I know which one I'd rather catch and it ain't the flu.

Jaysus, it's been downgraded from 'it's just a flu' to 'it's not even a flu'.

Again I am reminded of Herman Cain.

God bless him.

irishblessing · 29-10-2020 04:00PM

facehugger99 wrote: »

Of course not - the constant harping about 'risk' is nothing more than a cynical, quasi-justification for a money-grab of taxpayers funds at a time when we are borrowing more than a billion a month.

Shame on teachers!

No, shame on you for your uempathetic, anti-science, troll-emulating boloney.

vid36 · 29-10-2020 04:03PM

Hospitals badly overcrowded in the north, some have to ration oxygen and the executive think it is a good idea to reopen school. We will soon have a very tragic situation there.

wirelessdude01 · 29-10-2020 04:32PM

I see 15% of teachers have had Covid related leave so far. Didn't realise it was that high.

meeeeh · 29-10-2020 04:46PM

Boggles wrote: »

You do realize you are arguing with yourself, not me?

Again, we will live it there Tbh.

You took my posts out of context as reply to your claim Germany are closing schools at incidencerate over 200. I will let you twist things your way. We both know it's disingenuous and we both know schools in France and Germany will stay open with few regional exceptions as in Ireland.

Anyway in other news it was confirmed schools are back on Monday as they were before.

Smacruairi · 29-10-2020 04:50PM

meeeeh wrote: »

You took my posts out of context as reply to your claim Germany are closing schools at incidencerate over 200. I will let you twist things your way. We both know it's disingenuous and we both know schools in France and Germany will stay open with few regional exceptions as in Ireland.

Anyway in other news it was confirmed schools are back on Monday as they were before.

Sorry, where are the few regional exceptions in Ireland? Seeing as you think you're being taken out of context (hint, you're not).

meeeeh · 29-10-2020 05:02PM

Smacruairi wrote: »

Sorry, where are the few regional exceptions in Ireland? Seeing as you think you're being taken out of context (hint, you're not).

Actually I am. There were couple of completely local circuit breakers (around 100k people) and I suspect some schools in Berlin or similar had to close. If that for indicates national policy of school closures then please you can email Merkel too because she seems to think they are not closing schools. Silly Merkel.

Smacruairi · 29-10-2020 05:05PM

meeeeh wrote: »

Actually I am. There were couple of completely local circuit breakers (around 100k people) and I suspect some schools in Berlin or similar had to close. If that for indicates national policy of school closures then please you can email Merkel too because she seems to think they are not closing schools. Silly Merkel.

Nah I'll save the email, I just asked your where the few regional exceptions are in Ireland as you claimed? Because you're claiming 100k or so circuit breakers happened in Germany. That is a fairly big decision to take, wouldn't you agree.

We are on our highest level of "circuit breakers" and that has not happened at all.

But if I'm emailing Germany I'll ask them how their teachers enjoy lunch in the rain as you suggest and I'll get back to you.

Purplewaters · 29-10-2020 05:13PM

Anyone notice this. If nurses speak out about conditions, they're brave and listened to. Many could be working with zero covid cases on an eye ward for example. Still heroes. Teachers are working in schools where 10 percent of primary have had cases and children are still wearing no masks even though in most countries they are and, and 40 percent of secondary schools have cases. To some people teachers will always be whingers. The fact is any work from home done was pointless because the view from the public is we all had the whole time off. Now there is a huge portion of the population sitting at home earning as much as they did before for actually not working at all, and rightly so as its not their choice. I think this countries attitudes towards teachers is an absolute disgrace. Regarding health care a huge portion of a hospital staff have no contact whatsoever with covid, get full ppe and their patients are tested. Dentists work in a far riskier role and they will never get a clap out the window. The last point I'll make is this. Every job, has the right, to fight for health and safety in their workplace. Every parent has a right to ask for it in their schools so their child doesn't get covid and bring it home. The Irish publics disgraceful attitude (majority but not all) is the reason the dept of ed has gotten away with squashing in all kids into non distanced classrooms in such an unsafe manner and not even counting most kids in classroom as contacts. Don't blame the teachers as all they get is venom when they try to fight for health and safety of them and the kids in school.

wirelessdude01 · 29-10-2020 05:20PM

Purplewaters wrote: »

Anyone notice this. If nurses speak out about conditions, they're brave and listened to. Many could be working with zero covid cases on an eye ward for example. Still heroes. Teachers are working in schools where 10 percent of primary have had cases and children are still wearing no masks even though in most countries they are and, and 40 percent of secondary schools have cases. To some people teachers will always be whingers. The fact is any work from home done was pointless because the view from the public is we all had the whole time off. Now there is a huge portion of the population sitting at home earning as much as they did before for actually not working at all, and rightly so as its not their choice. I think this countries attitudes towards teachers is an absolute disgrace. Regarding health care a huge portion of a hospital staff have no contact whatsoever with covid, get full ppe and their patients are tested. Dentists work in a far riskier role and they will never get a clap out the window. The last point I'll make is this. Every job, has the right, to fight for health and safety in their workplace. Every parent has a right to ask for it in their schools so their child doesn't get covid and bring it home. The Irish publics disgraceful attitude (majority but not all) is the reason the dept of ed has gotten away with squashing in all kids into non distanced classrooms in such an unsafe manner and not even counting most kids in classroom as contacts. Don't blame the teachers as all they get is venom when they try to fight for health and safety of them and the kids in school.

And when there is a cluster in a classroom, guess who gets the blame?

We've seen it on here, ohh the teacher didn't do this, didn't do that. No cognisance given to the pure sh!te guidelines we are meant to be implementing. Pods are a load of crap. Social distancing in schools doesn't really exist.

eagle eye · 29-10-2020 05:28PM

meeeeh wrote:

Actually I am. There were couple of completely local circuit breakers (around 100k people) and I suspect some schools in Berlin or similar had to close. If that for indicates national policy of school closures then please you can email Merkel too because she seems to think they are not closing schools. Silly Merkel.

Merkel doesn't make decision on schools for all of Germany. As far as I'm aware all states have authority over education.

Purplewaters · 29-10-2020 05:31PM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

And when there is a cluster in a classroom, guess who gets the blame?

We've seen it on here, ohh the teacher didn't do this, didn't do that. No cognisance given to the pure sh!te guidelines we are meant to be implementing. Pods are a load of crap. Social distancing in schools doesn't really exist.

Once Martin can smirk away on tv and get the credit saying things like education is essential he's happy. He couldn't care less about how safe any child or staff member is. They are not counting the whole class as contacts and they should. In my view this is a disgrace. If they wanted to not count all students in a class as contacts they needed to put a. 2m distance between everyone and b. everyone in masks. Even then it would be wrong most likely given the length of the school day.

eagle eye · 29-10-2020 06:01PM

Just on the French schools, I just seen all kids of 6 years and older have to wear masks in school.

jrosen · 29-10-2020 06:05PM

It was never possible to have a 2m distance. Everyone knew it. Parents (many teachers are also parents) still sent their kids to school and will continue to do so knowing the 2m distance isn't possible. We all assess the risk.

As I said I support the calls for PPE, I support the need for tracing to be adequate and also for testing to be expedited.

Perhaps masks need to be brought in for younger kids

thomasdylan · 29-10-2020 06:08PM

Purplewaters wrote: »

Regarding health care a huge portion of a hospital staff have no contact whatsoever with covid

What is this based on?

A quarter of Covid infections in Ireland have been in healthcare workers.

A fifth of staff in Tallaght Hospital had positive antibodies to Covid in the recent study there. That's staff across all departments, those with direct and less direct patient contact.

Icyseanfitz · 29-10-2020 06:29PM

So i assume we are all back Monday under the illusion of regional support teams, and the continuing pretense that cases are far far less than what they actually are, on top of the same shoddy definition of close contact with contact tracing etc. Never mind a remote reduced number approach, thats a ****ing unobtainable fairytale at this stage

Depressing isn't the word

Ps and now zero faith in any of our bloody sanatising product in school either.

combat14 · 29-10-2020 06:34PM

The saga continues ..

Schools told to stop using more sanitising products

The list of items contains more than 50 products supplied to schools by nine different companies

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/1029/1174742-schools-covid-19/

irishblessing · 29-10-2020 06:56PM

combat14 wrote: »

The saga continues ..

Schools told to stop using more sanitising products

The list of items contains more than 50 products supplied to schools by nine different companies

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/1029/1174742-schools-covid-19/

J.F.C. :mad:

Jizique · 29-10-2020 06:58PM

thomasdylan wrote: »

What is this based on?

A quarter of Covid infections in Ireland have been in healthcare workers.

A fifth of staff in Tallaght Hospital had positive antibodies to Covid in the recent study there. That's staff across all departments, those with direct and less direct patient contact.

Does that suggest that they didn’t even know?

downthemiddle · 29-10-2020 07:11PM

combat14 wrote: »

The saga continues ..

Schools told to stop using more sanitising products

The list of items contains more than 50 products supplied to schools by nine different companies

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/1029/1174742-schools-covid-19/

The email in full

Dear Principal

I apologise for the timing of this email, and for the need to intrude on your mid-term break.

I am writing to you with further important information about the Department of Education PPE product framework and the action you may need to take.

Following the Department of Agriculture, Food and Marine instruction to cease the use of all ViraPro products on Friday 23 October, the Department of Education immediately commenced a review of biocidal products included in the Education Sector PPE Procurement Agreement.

The results of this review now confirm that schools should discontinue the use of certain products and purchase alternative supplies.

Please note that the Department does not have any evidence that these products are unsafe. The Department is taking 43 biocidal and 9 other products off the approved list for schools because it has not been possible to satisfactorily confirm their registration status as part of the review.

The categories of products impacted are:

· Wipes

· Handsoap

· Hand sanitiser and hand sanitiser refills

· Detergent.

Any school that is using products listed on the attached LIST A should now discontinue the use of these products and should store them securely pending contact from the supplier to arrange for their collection.

The attachments to this letter are two lists of products:

Word file called “Removed Product List 29 October 2020” - Products that have been removed from the agreement.

Excel file called “Approved Product List 29 October 2020” - Products that are remaining on the agreement or are new products. Schools can order replacement supplies from this list.

What to do next

If your school has stocks of the products on the “removed” list, whether purchased through the agreement or purchased locally, please discontinue using them and store them safely pending collection by the supplier.

Schools impacted will be provided with funding to source new supplies. The Department of Education has issued an updated excel file called Approved Product List 29 October 2020 which contains all the approved products on the agreement effective today with all relevant pricing information.

The Department has sourced additional products from approved suppliers to ensure sufficient supply.

Schools seeking new product to replace stock should contact any of the suppliers on the approved product list directly to process orders. The Department is putting in place supports in conjunction with the suppliers to provide stock to schools in time for Monday 2 November.

Schools that have engaged with suppliers but still have any difficulty sourcing an alternative supply can contact the Department’s Covid-19 helpline or email address. The Schools Covid-19 helpline on 057 9324461 will be open until 8.30pm on Thursday and from 8am on Friday until 8pm and from 10am to 5pm Saturday and Sunday. The email address is covid19_alert@education.gov.ie . Emails will be monitored and replied to over the weekend also.

Any school that is impacted by this will be provided with funding for an Aide for two days to assist with dealing with these issues. The funding for the aide and additional funding for schools impacted will issue as soon as possible. The daily rate payable is €143.32. Schools can decide themselves who they wish to employ to help with this work.

Information on the review process undertaken

The review of products on the Education Sector PPE Procurement Agreement has been undertaken in consultation with the regulator responsible for these products, the Department of Agriculture, Food and Marine. Only biocidal products listed on the Department of Agriculture, Food and Marine biocide product register (regulation 20 of SI 427 / 2013) are registered for sale and use in Ireland.

As part of the procurement process for the Education Sector PPE Procurement Agreement in June and July, suppliers were required to confirm that their products were compliant with the regulations and provide documentation, were to provide information on their current live product range rather than future releases and to give examples of contracts in the last two years which included supply to the Irish public sector.

The Department of Education is taking these products off the approved list for schools because it has not been possible to satisfactorily confirm their registration status as part of the review. The Department of Agriculture, Food and Marine is engaging directly with the suppliers concerned regarding the status of these products.

Once again, I apologise for disturbing your break and thank you for your continued efforts.

Yours faithfully

Schools closed until February? (part 3)

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