Army and Navy

JP Liz V1 · 19-10-2020 10:35pm #1

Should the army and navy be deployed to help the Gardai during this pandemic, to keep law and order, keep to restrictions, break up large gatherings etc., Gardai need to be given more power to stop and punish the rule breakers

Would you be opposed to the army and navy helping?

C__MC · 19-10-2020 10:38pm

Surely give the army something to do
As far as I can see they do **** all in this country as it is

19-10-2020 10:38pm

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

Should the army and navy be deployed to help the Gardai during this pandemic, to keep law and order, keep to restrictions, break up large gatherings etc., Gardai need to be given more power to stop and punish the rule breakers

Would you be opposed to the army and navy helping?

I think the army have better things to do than break up afternoon tea with Mam.

Atlantic Dawn · 19-10-2020 10:39pm

I think we just need proper fines as a deterrent, currently nothing happening.

JasonStatham · 19-10-2020 10:39pm

The Gardai should be able to hand out fines.

SEPT 23 1989 · 19-10-2020 10:40pm

No

Some of the more livelier areas of Dublin would be more heavily armed and add Halloween into the mix and it would end up in a bloodbath

Harry Palmr · 19-10-2020 10:41pm

Send a gunship to Athlone I say.

ted1 · 19-10-2020 10:42pm

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

Should the army and navy be deployed to help the Gardai during this pandemic, to keep law and order, keep to restrictions, break up large gatherings etc., Gardai need to be given more power to stop and punish the rule breakers

Would you be opposed to the army and navy helping?

Army on the streets would require martial law. So no

elperello · 19-10-2020 10:43pm

C__MC wrote: »

Surely give the army something to do
As far as I can see they do **** all in this country as it is

Well you'd be wrong there for a start.

They are there are there as a back up for the civil power.

They are well trained and each and every one of them has taken an oath to protect the state.

Strange thing in Ireland people feel free to run down our military. You don't tend to see that attitude in other countries.

salamiii · 19-10-2020 10:58pm

most countries don't let troops on th st

un5byh7sqpd2x0 · 19-10-2020 10:59pm

ted1 wrote: »

Army on the streets would require martial law. So no

No it wouldn’t. You’re wrong there Ted.

salamiii wrote: »

most countries don't let troops on th st

Stop spouting nonsense

amadangomor · 19-10-2020 11:05pm

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

Should the army and navy be deployed to help the Gardai during this pandemic, to keep law and order, keep to restrictions, break up large gatherings etc., Gardai need to be given more power to stop and punish the rule breakers

Would you be opposed to the army and navy helping?

Navy

Gunship up the royal canal to stop the partying on d'Northside?

Army will help out with logistics/contract tracing etc. Not acceptable here to have military acting as police. Hek the Guards barely act as police at times.

Del2005 · 19-10-2020 11:06pm

elperello wrote: »

Well you'd be wrong there for a start.

They are there are there as a back up for the civil power.

They are well trained and each and every one of them has taken an oath to protect the state.

Strange thing in Ireland people feel free to run down our military. You don't tend to see that attitude in other countries.

Our military is a joke as we can't defend ourselves which is the purpose of having a military. Its not the soldiers or sailors fault though its our fault.

If the Gardai don't have authority to break up gatherings the army won't either.

amadangomor · 19-10-2020 11:07pm

elperello wrote: »

Well you'd be wrong there for a start.

They are there are there as a back up for the civil power.

They are well trained and each and every one of them has taken an oath to protect the state.

Strange thing in Ireland people feel free to run down our military. You don't tend to see that attitude in other countries.

Chill dude, jaysus!

ShineOn7 · 19-10-2020 11:09pm

I've been at festivals in Asia where the army help out with security and general crowd control

Apart from UN "peace missions" what the fúck does the Irish army do exactly?

elperello · 19-10-2020 11:13pm

Del2005 wrote: »

Our military is a joke as we can't defend ourselves which is the purpose of having a military. Its not the soldiers or sailors fault though its our fault.

If the Gardai don't have authority to break up gatherings the army won't either.

Bit strong calling it a joke because it can't fulfill your own very narrow definition of the purpose of a military.

Fair enough that you are not blaming the men and women in our services for the deficiencies which exist.

Legal authority is essential.

elperello · 19-10-2020 11:15pm

amadangomor wrote: »

Chill dude, jaysus!

Quite chilled thanks.

JP Liz V1 · 19-10-2020 11:24pm

Spain used their army to enforce lockdown

SouthWesterly · 19-10-2020 11:47pm

amadangomor wrote: »

Navy Gunship up the royal canal to stop the partying on d'Northside?

Army will help out with logistics/contract tracing etc. Not acceptable here to have military acting as police. Hek the Guards barely act as police at times.

We've already had gunships on the liffey. Didn't turn out so well for the locals

smck321 · 20-10-2020 12:27am

C__MC wrote: »

Surely give the army something to do
As far as I can see they do **** all in this country as it is

Would you prefer they have a nice war to keep them busy?

Pauliedragon · 20-10-2020 12:48am

Heard of a woman in Cork who needed a test but had no way to get there. Apparantly the army came and brought her. Not sure if that's happening often or not.

Jim2007 · 20-10-2020 2:20am

ShineOn7 wrote: »

Apart from UN "peace missions" what the fúck does the Irish army do exactly?

Beyond training and preparation one would hope nothing. It like insurance you hope you won’t need it and you know its too late to try and get cover once everything goes pear shaped.

ShineOn7 · 20-10-2020 2:25am

Jim2007 wrote: »

Beyond training and preparation one would hope nothing. It like insurance you hope you won’t need it and you know its too late to try and get cover once everything goes pear shaped.

Ireland have been a neutral country for decades and decades though

Put the Army to some use or do away with them altogether. They're just window dressing ffs

Strumms · 20-10-2020 2:26am

Army has the JTF (Joint Task Force) set up in McKee barracks, specifically as a result of Covid, to help with covid.

https://www.military.ie/en/who-we-are/army/covid-19-joint-task-force-jtf-/

Doing plenty, a friend of mine is based there all be it I’ve had no elaboration on the details of what’s happening but this link provides info.

Strumms · 20-10-2020 2:31am

ShineOn7 wrote: »

Ireland have been a neutral country for decades and decades though

Put the Army to some use or do away with them altogether. They're just window dressing ffs

Army as in covid and other big challenges in the state acts as an atcp (aid to civil power). You hope you don’t need them but when you do ‘like now’ you’ll be sure glad they are there.

I don’t think or at least I’ve never heard of a country of substance with no army.

Jim2007 · 20-10-2020 2:31am

Del2005 wrote: »

Our military is a joke as we can't defend ourselves which is the purpose of having a military.

Really, you clearly don’t understand stand the defense strategy then - it has never been to fight a conventional battle. Otherwise we’d be spending more on defense and conscription would be typically at 18 like in other countries.

20-10-2020 2:42am

Jim2007 wrote: »

Really, you clearly don’t understand stand the defense strategy.

Wait wait wait...... There is an official strategy of some type?

Jim2007 · 20-10-2020 2:53am

ShineOn7 wrote: »

Ireland have been a neutral country for decades and decades though [/QOUTE]

Ireland is not a neutral country, it’s government has a policy of neutrality which means it can be easily changed by the government of the day.

Put the Army to some use or do away with them altogether. They're just window dressing ffs

Ireland is part of the Nordic Battlegroups and the army is part of our commitment to the EU. And under the mutual assistance clauses of the treaty Irish troops have been used to beef up/replace French overseas troops in the past.

Oglaigh84 · 20-10-2020 5:25am

ted1 wrote: »

Army on the streets would require martial law. So no

No it wouldnt

Oglaigh84 · 20-10-2020 5:27am

SouthWesterly wrote: »

We've already had gunships on the liffey. Didn't turn out so well for the locals

You dont get down to the liffey often do you? There is constantly warships docked there, ours and other countrys.... Including , shock horror, royal navy ships

20-10-2020 5:36am

ted1 wrote: »

Army on the streets would require martial law. So no

No such thing in Ireland as martial law despite what wikipedia claims. It's constitutional barred in it's true form save for actual invasion and even then it's hot real martial law.

20-10-2020 5:40am

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

Spain used their army to enforce lockdown

No, they didn't. The used the police. The Spanish military did not act against the Spanish population.

ShineOn7 wrote: »

Ireland have been a neutral country for decades and decades though

Put the Army to some use or do away with them altogether. They're just window dressing ffs

Except we aren't. Neutrality isn't something to just claim and that's it. We declared neutrality in world war 2 and have a policy of non intervention in other nations internal conflicts.

Countries adopt a policy of neutrality on a case by case basis and it certainly isn't some magic spell that means we are somehow immune from invasion

ShineOn7 wrote: »

I've been at festivals in Asia where the army help out with security and general crowd control

Apart from UN "peace missions" what the fúck does the Irish army do exactly?

Well considering it's a defence force to protect against invasion, what exactly do you want them to do? Would you like us to be invaded? Do you wake up each morning and think 'damn, another invasion free day. Those soldiers playing cards again'? Cause most people don't actually want to see soldiers shooting each other on the streets.

What does any military do on home soil? Train and prepare for invasion. Oh, except in Asia of course, that bastian of democracy and human rights.

Just what exactly is the Irish need to run down the military and police? I just don't get the need or desire to run someone down like this. To don't see soldiers pointing at shop assistants and slagging them off.

suicide_circus · 20-10-2020 7:00am

elperello wrote: »

Well you'd be wrong there for a start.

They are there are there as a back up for the civil power.

They are well trained and each and every one of them has taken an oath to protect the state.

Strange thing in Ireland people feel free to run down our military. You don't tend to see that attitude in other countries.

Probably because they so rarely seen

irbx · 20-10-2020 7:06am

Just to add been at covid test Centre in Limerick. The swabbing was been done by army personal. In past have seen them out with flood defence etc.

CIARAN_BOYLE · 20-10-2020 7:20am

If the civil authority request aid from the armed forces I would hope that the army would be able to assist.

The Gardai should be asked to do something related to enforcement before they call the army though.

davetherave · 20-10-2020 7:27am

Pauliedragon wrote: »

Heard of a woman in Cork who needed a test but had no way to get there. Apparantly the army came and brought her. Not sure if that's happening often or not.

It does at the Aviva testing centre as well. Provide a transport service for those who do not have their own transport or anyone to bring them to the testing centre.

davetherave · 20-10-2020 7:33am

Del2005 wrote: »

Our military is a joke as we can't defend ourselves which is the purpose of having a military.

Since the formation of the Defence Forces in 1924 how many times has Ireland been invaded and how many wars have we lost?

amadangomor · 20-10-2020 7:37am

ShineOn7 wrote: »

I've been at festivals in Asia where the army help out with security and general crowd control

Apart from UN "peace missions" what the fúck does the Irish army do exactly?

Believe me it's a good thing that that we do not use the army for policing. It is a dangerous precedent.

Oglaigh84 · 20-10-2020 7:52am

amadangomor wrote: »

Believe me it's a good thing that that we do not use the army for policing. It is a dangerous precedent.

Belgium, france, italy etc etc all have had soldiers deployed on the streets for years, long before covid. What exactly do you think will happen if ours is deployed in a similar fashion?

galway_cowboy · 20-10-2020 8:03am

I'm sure the army lads are salivating at the thought of overtime and extra payouts. Nah, we waste enough money on them as is.

Let's have the Gardai continue with civil affairs and have the Tayto commandos stay where they are, "training" or whatever else is supposedly on the agenda.

stephenjmcd · 20-10-2020 8:07am

Oglaigh84 wrote: »

Belgium, france, italy etc etc all have had soldiers deployed on the streets for years, long before covid. What exactly do you think will happen if ours is deployed in a similar fashion?

Difference is the examples you've given are deployed on anti terror operations and not general policing, fully kitted out and armed. Theres a bit of a difference.

Garda commissioner previously stated they didn't require assistance and wouldn't go down that route

JacksonHeightsOwn · 20-10-2020 8:07am

I wouldnt be at all for our army walking the streets, but it is true, I've been to Belgium and they do be walking around, rifles in hand.

Would it not be more practical to redeploy them to track and trace though?

Unlike other public servants, they follow a hierarchy and in layman's terms, have to do what their told. So you wouldn't get your usual public servants moaning about being moved around or some other useless rubbish. They'd just get on with the job.

20-10-2020 8:13am

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

Should the army and navy be deployed to help the Gardai during this pandemic, to keep law and order, keep to restrictions, break up large gatherings etc., Gardai need to be given more power to stop and punish the rule breakers

Would you be opposed to the army and navy helping?

In the absence of a military threat or breakdown of civil society, the military should only be employed within the borders of its own country to provide logistical, organisational and other support functions. Using the military for the enforcement of civilian laws and regulations should only ever be a last resort

galway_cowboy · 20-10-2020 8:41am

chrisbonnie wrote: »

Would it not be more practical to redeploy them to track and trace though?

I would seriously question the... clerical abilities of your average soldier. Let's leave such important stuff to the PS who know how to work systems like that.

I don't know why we're so keen to shoehorn the army somewhere. Keep them at their barracks where they'll cause the least harm.

stephenjmcd · 20-10-2020 8:54am

galway_cowboy wrote: »

I would seriously question the... clerical abilities of your average soldier. Let's leave such important stuff to the PS who know how to work systems like that.

I don't know why we're so keen to shoehorn the army somewhere. Keep them at their barracks where they'll cause the least harm.

The army were deployed to contract tracing at the very start and from speaking to someone who works in a contact tracing centre she said the army are by far the best at it.

They're disciplined and once given a job to do absolutely fly through it.

CalamariFritti · 20-10-2020 8:58am

So we have a situation now where parts of the population cry out to be controlled by the army. Any orwellians wet dream.

Oglaigh84 · 20-10-2020 9:03am

CalamariFritti wrote: »

So we have a situation now where parts of the population cry out to be controlled by the army. Any orwellians wet dream.

Having the military support the civil agencies does not equal control by the army, get a grip

Signore Fancy Pants · 20-10-2020 9:07am

galway_cowboy wrote: »

I'm sure the army lads are salivating at the thought of overtime and extra payouts. Nah, we waste enough money on them as is.

Let's have the Gardai continue with civil affairs and have the Tayto commandos stay where they are, "training" or whatever else is supposedly on the agenda.

Yeah, they will be rubbing their hands together for an extra €18 for a 24hr shift. Its coming up to Christmas like, more duties please. Its even less for ATCA/ATCP duties.

"Tayto Commandos", I like that one :pac:

galway_cowboy · 20-10-2020 9:10am

Signore Fancy Pants wrote: »

"Tayto Commandos", I like that one :pac:

Our school was near a bank, so back then you had the cash machine escorts. The lads would be tucking into their crisps of choice on patrol, hence our schoolyard nick name.

I see sheep · 20-10-2020 9:13am

Of course I'd be opposed, I'd tell them to f-off if they tried to tell me what to do, they're not the police.

Signore Fancy Pants · 20-10-2020 9:20am

galway_cowboy wrote: »

Our school was near a bank, so back then you had the cash machine escorts. The lads would be tucking into their crisps of choice on patrol, hence our schoolyard nick name.

Damn straight. Eating kept you awake on cash escorts as you'd be in work about 0330.

Jaysis I dont miss cash escorts at all!

Army and Navy

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