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Covid 19 Part XXVI- 50,993 ROI (1,852 deaths) 28,040 NI (621 deaths) (19/10) Read OP

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,235 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    Looks like level 4 as media has it alright https://twitter.com/newschambers/status/1317786408229261313?s=19


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭Happydays2020


    440Hertz wrote: »
    I’d agree with that. I honestly think the Troika should have driven this back in 2008, as it’s an area that we don’t have any ability to reform and it has been an absolute smoking mess for decades.

    The only way I would see of reforming Irish health would be to bring in an external version of NPHET focused on analysis of what’s wrong with the system. It would need to be driven by a team from public health systems that actually work and would need to be given leeway to be brutally honest with the analysis.

    The last thing we need is another NPHET type structure. They are the goons who have been mismanaging the health service.

    Everyone knows what needs to be done. Slaintecare is the blue print. Just needs the political will to do it and to take on the vested interests. That also means a one tier Public health system although capacity can be bought from the private hospitals for elective and routine, with public hospitals focused much more on emergency care.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Eod100 wrote: »
    Looks like level 4 as media has it alright https://twitter.com/newschambers/status/1317786408229261313?s=19

    It needs to come with a message of "as long as it takes", no made-up guesses of x weeks and an apology for cancelling Christmas!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,235 ✭✭✭✭Eod100




  • Closed Accounts Posts: 477 ✭✭AlphaDelta1


    Jack1985 wrote: »
    Simon Harris has just said on The Week In Politics that more restrictions nationwide will be brought in tomorrow for ‘decisive action’ and that Level 3 has not worked.

    Common sense at last.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 528 ✭✭✭sterz


    So level 4. Which is really level 5.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,732 ✭✭✭✭rob316


    Why is a Mickey mouse minister briefing on restrictions?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,980 ✭✭✭s1ippy


    So Simon, the minister for Higher education who last week said college is overrated, released the news that the country would definitely be going into higher stage of lockdown. This is before the meetings that are scheduled to take place to further discuss the situation?

    They're an absolute shower of incompetent, inept and unreliable tossers. Worst government the country has ever seen, and that includes during the last crash. They will bring us to our knees in the months ahead.

    Somebody should do something.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,235 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    is_that_so wrote: »
    It needs to come with a message of "as long as it takes", no made-up guesses of x weeks and an apology for cancelling Christmas!

    I think the number of weeks is about trying to sustain measures and motivate people along mentally. If it's open ended it would be very difficult to sustain. Might have better compliance if its 3 weeks and then another 3 say. But message needs to be how well these measures are adopted by everyone ultimately decides how long they will be in place. Plus there needs to be some sort of penalty and people seen to be penalised to have an actual deterrent and incentive to follow them


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,216 ✭✭✭khalessi


    sterz wrote: »
    So level 4. Which is really level 5.


    I tought we were already on 4.1 or something


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,285 ✭✭✭giveitholly


    Common sense at last.

    So closing businesses and non essential retail is the answer to all this


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 651 ✭✭✭440Hertz


    The last thing we need is another NPHET type structure. They are the goons who have been mismanaging the health service.

    Everyone knows what needs to be done. Slaintecare is the blue print. Just needs the political will to do it and to take on the vested interests. That also means a one tier Public health system although capacity can be bought from the private hospitals for elective and routine, with public hospitals focused much more on emergency care.

    It needs a lot more than political will. We don’t seem to understand what’s wrong with the system in the first place.

    Every single political attempt to reform it in the past has failed. There have been very well intentioned people chewed up and spat out by the system.

    Also it’s managed to do things politically like have groups of people fighting over a gold plated national children’s hospital projects, throwing millions upon millions down the drain designing and redesigning it because they started the project before finalising the site selection.

    Umpteen experts from Ireland all non objectively opined ad nauseum about access and car parking and colocation. The project costs went up and up and up. Everyone was blamed, including rather unfairly the construction contractor, when the entire problem was abysmal decision making and chaotic processes.

    Meanwhile we’ve our fleet of acute hospitals struggling to even deliver normal services because they are apparently starved of funds.

    How anyone or any political parties can stand over that is beyond me and it points to a major problem and inability to see the big picture at all, which is why I would say a panel of external experts with a remit to absolutely let rip in a report is absolutely necessary.

    We are pouring money into a giant hole that we can’t even define.

    Slaintecare is useful but it needs a brutally blunt analysis of the system and options laid out before it. There’s so much wrong with the Irish healthcare system that it needs to be dealt with as a major intervention.

    We can’t afford another mess like this again. We’ve very much been caught in a storm with no roof on the house, having spent 40 years debating the design of the roof tiles and a public ground down by a lifetime of chaotic healthcare delivery who accept this as normal.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,285 ✭✭✭giveitholly


    Mr.S wrote: »
    There's a clear difference between level 4 and 5?

    Feck all really


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 528 ✭✭✭sterz


    Mr.S wrote: »
    There's a clear difference between level 4 and 5?

    There really isn’t. Non-essential retail closes under level 4. So it’s as crippling as level 5.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 742 ✭✭✭TTLF
    save the trouble and jazz it up


    cant wait for the public outcry when they announce "yeah but school WILL be staying open btw" tomorrow after the meeting

    :rolleyes: I can imagine it now


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 657 ✭✭✭I Am The Law


    s1ippy wrote: »
    So Simon, the minister for Higher education who last week said college is overrated, released the news that the country would definitely be going into higher stage of lockdown. This is before the meetings that are scheduled to take place to further discuss the situation?

    They're an absolute shower of incompetent, inept and unreliable tossers. Worst government the country has ever seen, and that includes during the last crash. They will bring us to our knees in the months ahead.

    Somebody should do something.

    Well it's actually the same government with 50% extra tossers.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,711 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Common sense at last.

    Common sense and Simon Harris don't belong in the same sentence.
    This is the guy who was Minister for health at the start of this thing where we let in Italian rugby fans, let people off to Cheltenham and other major sporting events and told skiers they didn't need to self-isolate when they got back. And let's not forget the children's hospital fiasco.

    Anyways probably doesn't make him any worse than the current minister for health or his party leader or Martin.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,756 ✭✭✭Pretzill


    I'm wondering are they going to scrap this Level nonsense and just bring in restrictions that are clear and give us a way through and out the otherside...They really have a lot to do to garner public confidence whatever they decide.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 625 ✭✭✭Jenna James


    Is it likely midnight tomorrow then?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,139 ✭✭✭✭niallo27


    Mr.S wrote: »
    There's a clear difference between level 4 and 5?

    Like what, what do you regard as clear differences. Half a million out of work, that's the only difference worth anything.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,010 ✭✭✭GooglePlus


    Pretzill wrote: »
    I'm wondering are they going to scrap this Level nonsense and just bring in restrictions that are clear and give us a way through and out the otherside...They really have a lot to do to garner public confidence whatever they decide.

    We need a framework to bring about a roadmap to recovery and finally build back better.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,551 ✭✭✭✭Busi_Girl08


    Is it likely midnight tomorrow then?

    I would hope from midnight Tuesay at least to give businesses a chance to prepare for closure etc.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Eod100 wrote: »
    I think the number of weeks is about trying to sustain measures and motivate people along mentally. If it's open ended it would be very difficult to sustain. Might have better compliance if its 3 weeks and then another 3 say. But message needs to be how well these measures are adopted by everyone ultimately decides how long they will be in place. Plus there needs to be some sort of penalty and people seen to be penalised to have an actual deterrent and incentive to follow them
    Well, it gives false hope to people when we know from experience that it's just not a real number. Joking aside, they need to own up about Christmas now, that it will be very different and very restricted and there's no point promising otherwise or that they can save it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,512 ✭✭✭harr


    No major difference between 4 and 5 .. all non essential retail will close . Only difference for me anyway is the 5k rule . Under level 4 have to stay in own county in level 5 only allowed 5k from your house which is a pain in bollix


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 443 ✭✭Kh1993


    Common sense at last.

    So 4 days to decide level 3 hasn’t worked with the added visits restrictions

    I’m sure that’s not best practice.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,711 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Pretzill wrote:
    I'm wondering are they going to scrap this Level nonsense and just bring in restrictions that are clear and give us a way through and out the otherside...They really have a lot to do to garner public confidence whatever they decide.
    It only has to be a surprise mole message.
    Something like that we are looking to a very bleak future without major changes. There is a danger that Christmas could be a miserable time. We are going for a major lockdown in the hope we can flatten the curve before Christmas.

    They need to close the schools as part of this. We need to eliminate all potential avenues of transmission that we can.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 528 ✭✭✭sterz


    Mr.S wrote: »
    And you know...staying within 5km of your home. Pretty big difference.

    Ha, as if you have to abide by that advice. For what it’s worth I did and I will, but closing these businesses is clearly the bigger issue here.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Pretzill wrote: »
    I'm wondering are they going to scrap this Level nonsense and just bring in restrictions that are clear and give us a way through and out the otherside...They really have a lot to do to garner public confidence whatever they decide.
    The only way we are going through is with restrictions, severe or otherwise. I wouldn't bank on the public confidence though, grudging acceptance is the best that can be hoped for.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 547 ✭✭✭RugbyLad11


    Common sense at last.

    Why?

    What is the difference between our current level and level 5?

    It's that non essential shops must close but we already have a rule that people must wear masks inside shops so I don't see how closing non essential shops is going to make a difference


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,076 ✭✭✭Artane2002


    TTLF wrote: »
    cant wait for the public outcry when they announce "yeah but school WILL be staying open btw" tomorrow after the meeting

    :rolleyes: I can imagine it now

    capacity on public transport being reduced to 25% will be problematic for students if they do go to level 4/5. hopefully some common sense is shown by the government but we've seen that they lack common sense so I'm not holding my breath.


This discussion has been closed.
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