Covid 19 Part XXV-44,159 ROI (1,830 deaths) 21,898 NI (598 deaths) (13/10) Read OP

ACitizenErased · 09-10-2020 11:38PM

I think it's worth mentioning with regards to ICU - mechanical ventilation is ridiculously traumatic for the body and for the mind. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of issues are caused by that, to be honest.

spookwoman · 09-10-2020 11:39PM

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

Its terrifying to be honest, scariest thing for me is that we really don't know what long term effects it will have on people's/kids health, saw some article a few days ago about it affecting male fertility

Saw that linked to the Jerusalem Post. Would not surprise me, if it affects the vascular system never know where else it can go or do.

political analyst · 09-10-2020 11:40PM

boggerman1 wrote: »

Where’s your evidence for blaming county finals for the surge.i heard of nothing in my county associated with a surge.typical of the anti gaa shower to blame the gaa.

Lack of social distancing.

ACitizenErased · 09-10-2020 11:41PM

I'm quite surprised David Higgins is posting these sorta charts tbh, he was a big restrictions advocate early on
https://twitter.com/higginsdavidw/status/1314696632835899394?s=20

s1ippy · 09-10-2020 11:44PM

ACitizenErased wrote: »

I think it's worth mentioning with regards to ICU - mechanical ventilation is ridiculously traumatic for the body and for the mind. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of issues are caused by that, to be honest.

Yeah once I got such a bad flu that it incapacitated me to the point that I couldn't walk for months afterwards. Oh wait no that's boll°cks

stephenjmcd · 09-10-2020 11:44PM

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

The young lad on the late late show. He ended up in ICU and has nerve damage from either being in ICU or from covid, they weren't sure. He can't walk. Was on a ventilator for 12 days. He has other lasting affects as well, can't smell or taste. He's only 17. They didn't mention other family members having symptoms (though in my opinion, if they were living with him, they must have been asymptomatic).

I don't know what's more scary, his horrific story or how the rest of his family were ok. This is one weird virus and how it affects people differently.

Watched that, awful story and best wishes to him.

One thing that stood out to me was, they never contacted the GP until he was in a bad way, no covid test until in hosptial and he said himself it was brushed off when at home and then we'll see how you are tomorrow(which was said for a few days). We've all been told contact GP ASAP and to not brush it off.

I'm not saying it would have made any difference, thats a complete unknown, but for me its also is a story on how not to deal with initial symptoms while also being an educational story also about covid in general.

Ha Long Bay · 09-10-2020 11:48PM

ACitizenErased wrote: »

I think it's worth mentioning with regards to ICU - mechanical ventilation is ridiculously traumatic for the body and for the mind. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of issues are caused by that, to be honest.

What would you suggest instead of Intubation?

Wolf359f · 09-10-2020 11:48PM

ACitizenErased wrote: »

I'm quite surprised David Higgins is posting these sorta charts tbh, he was a big restrictions advocate early on
https://twitter.com/higginsdavidw/status/1314696632835899394?s=20

We're only starting this 2nd wave as such. I'd love to see an comparison of a country further along on their second wave who have roughly the same positivity rate as ourselves. You can then see how new cases translate to admissions in hospital. We all know the first wave caught most countries off guard.

You also have to remember, first wave we practically emptied hospitals, this wave we can't do that again, so all that headroom he mentions, isn't headroom.... it's patients for all other illnesses.

ACitizenErased · 09-10-2020 11:50PM

john4321 wrote: »

What would you suggest instead of Intubation?

There isn't an alternative?
Doctors make it quite clear that intubation is last resort, due to the traumatic nature of it. I'm not trying to argue for or against anything, it's literally a fact.

Necro · 09-10-2020 11:52PM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Watched that, awful story and best wishes to him.

One thing that stood out to me was, they never contacted the GP until he was in a bad way, no covid test until in hosptial and he said himself it was brushed off when at home and then we'll see how you are tomorrow(which was said for a few days). We've all been told contact GP ASAP and to not brush it off.

I'm not saying it would have made any difference, thats a complete unknown, but for me its also is a story on how not to deal with initial symptoms while also being an educational story also about covid in general.

I know what you're saying here alright, but in the early days I think a lot of people would be passing it off like that.

When I rang the doc and described my symptoms he reckoned all I would need was bedrest for a few days, he was fairly confident it wasn't Covid and he wanted me tested just to be sure. Turns out he was wrong, but that's not his fault as I don't think phonecall diagnoses work personally.

Back when the testing capacity was in it's infancy, my wife had similar symptoms to me including a fever. They wouldn't refer her for testing, just advised her to self isolate. Now it turns out she didn't have it at the time, we had the antibody test done in June and got results as negative in August.

I'd say if they had contacted the GP with early onset symptoms in March they would have advised them to self-isolate and call back if they worsened. It was a very very tight criteria for testing for the first month or so.

spookwoman · 09-10-2020 11:53PM

https://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/health-topics/ventilatorventilator-support

What Are the Risks of Being on a Ventilator?- Ventilator/Ventilator Support
Infections
One of the most serious and common risks of being on a ventilator is developing pneumonia. The breathing tube makes it hard for you to cough. Coughing helps clear your airways of germs that can cause infections. The breathing tube that is put into your airway can allow bacteria and viruses to enter your lungs and, as a result, cause pneumonia.

Pneumonia is a major concern because people who need to be placed on ventilators are often already very sick. Pneumonia may make it harder to treat your other disease or condition. You may need special antibiotics, as the bacteria that caused your pneumonia could be resistant to standard antibiotics.

Another risk of being on a ventilator is a sinus infection. This type of infection is more common in people who have endotracheal tubes. Sinus infections are treated with antibiotics.

Other risks
Being placed on a ventilator can raise your risk for other problems, such as:

Atelectasis, a condition in which your lung or parts of it do not expand fully. This causes the air sacs to collapse, and reduces the amount of oxygen that reaches your blood.

Blood clots and skin breakdown. When using a ventilator, you may need to stay in bed or use a wheelchair. Staying in one position for long periods can raise your risk of blood clots, serious wounds on your skin called bedsores, and infections.

Fluid buildup in the air sacs inside your lungs, which are usually filled with air. This is called pulmonary edema.

Lung damage. Pushing too much air into your lungs or using too much pressure can harm your lungs. Too much oxygen can also damage your lungs. Babies put on a ventilator, especially premature infants, may be at a higher risk of lung damage from excess oxygen therapy and lung infections in childhood and adulthood.

Muscle weakness. Using a ventilator decreases the work your diaphragm and other breathing muscles have to do, so they can become weak.
This may lead to some problems and delays in being taken off the machine.

Pneumothorax. This is a condition that develops when air leaks out of your lungs and into the space between the lungs and the chest wall, and sometimes into the muscles and tissues of your chest wall and neck. This leakage can cause pain and shortness of breath. It may cause one or both lungs to collapse. The air that enters the chest could also put pressure on your heart, resulting in a life-threatening situation that would require immediate placement of a tube in your chest to drain the air and decrease the pressure on your heart.

Vocal cord damage. The breathing tube can damage your vocal cords, which could affect the passage of air into the lungs, especially in young children with smaller airways. Tell your doctor if you experience hoarseness or have trouble speaking or breathing after your breathing tube is removed.

Wolf359f · 09-10-2020 11:55PM

ACitizenErased wrote: »

There isn't an alternative?
Doctors make it quite clear that intubation is last resort, due to the traumatic nature of it. I'm not trying to argue for or against anything, it's literally a fact.

After watch the show The Fall, I can see just how traumatic it can be.
Watching that scene during this pandemic..... is not a good idea.

Ha Long Bay · 09-10-2020 11:57PM

ACitizenErased wrote: »

There isn't an alternative?
Doctors make it quite clear that intubation is last resort, due to the traumatic nature of it. I'm not trying to argue for or against anything, it's literally a fact.

What was the point of the post then?

ACitizenErased wrote: »

I think it's worth mentioning with regards to ICU - mechanical ventilation is ridiculously traumatic for the body and for the mind. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of issues are caused by that, to be honest.

What is worth mentioning if its a last resort? Just don't understand the post and what point you are trying to make.

manofwisdom · 09-10-2020 11:58PM

Wolf359f wrote: »

We're only starting this 2nd wave as such. I'd love to see an comparison of a country further along on their second wave who have roughly the same positivity rate as ourselves. You can then see how new cases translate to admissions in hospital. We all know the first wave caught most countries off guard.

You also have to remember, first wave we practically emptied hospitals, this wave we can't do that again, so all that headroom he mentions, isn't headroom.... it's patients for all other illnesses.

Hardly just starting when it has been rising cases since mid August. Why did they empty out back then, was the people sick from other illnesses not really sick at all?

ACitizenErased · 10-10-2020 12:00AM

john4321 wrote: »

What was the point of the post then?

What is worth mentioning if its a last resort? Just don't understand the post and what point you are trying to make.

Someone posted about a person who had lasting effects after being on a ventilator in ICU... and I posted that ventilation is often highly traumatic?

Spanish Eyes · 10-10-2020 12:04AM

Jaysus let's be a bit positive and take note of those who were tested positive but are ok and so on.

It's the only way to get through this. There will always be those who do not do well, sorry for that. But the majority seem to be OK with it if you know what I mean.

I don't know anymore and am just ploughing through best I can. Like most of us I reckon.

Wolf359f · 10-10-2020 12:04AM

manofwisdom wrote: »

Hardly just starting when it has been rising cases since mid August. Why did they empty out back then, was the people sick from other illnesses not really sick at all?

You don't empty the hospitals over 2 months before hand, that's just reckless.
Especially with ~50 cases a day in August, assuming you mean 'back then' as August?
If you mean March, we didn't know what to expect, what was coming down the line. For the post part elective surgery back then was cancelled and a lot of people with minor ailments didn't attend A&E etc...

We know a lot more about Covid now and with much better testing can plan ahead a little better.

Ha Long Bay · 10-10-2020 12:08AM

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Someone posted about a person who had lasting effects after being on a ventilator in ICU... and I posted that ventilation is often highly traumatic?

I didn't see that post you didn't quote it in your original post.

As you said being intubated is a last resort so having lasting effects even though not ideal or wanted is much better than the other outcome.

polesheep · 10-10-2020 12:08AM

Irish Steve wrote: »

Really?

My parents are 90 and 95, and another close family member is also 90, so I'd kind of like to be able to get to that sort of age as well, so keeping away from Covid is pretty high on my agenda right now.

Right now I am sick to the back teeth of the "feck ye and yer rules" brigade who seem to think that this pandemic is a joke.

Level 4 or 5 won't make that much difference to the spread of this virus, a much more effective solution would be a curfew from 2100 to 0500, and some teeth to the rules with sanction for those who think the rules don't apply to them.

So, because you want to live to be 95 you want a curfew on everyone else? You are as selfish as the "Feck ye and your rules brigade". You would do well to remember that there are 7.8 billion people on this planet and you are just one of them.

bb1234567 · 10-10-2020 12:11AM

polesheep wrote: »

So, because you want to live to be 95 you want a curfew on everyone else? You are as selfish as the "Feck ye and your rules brigade". You would do well to remember that there are 9 billion people on this planet and you are just one of them.

FWIW, 7.8 billion :eek:

At least he's not asking 9 billion people to obey curfew

polesheep · 10-10-2020 12:12AM

bb1234567 wrote: »

FWIW, 7.8 billion :eek:

At least he's not asking 9 billion people to obey curfew

Thank you. I gave up counting at 7.6 and rounded up.:D

Icyseanfitz · 10-10-2020 12:16AM

polesheep wrote: »

So, because you want to live to be 95 you want a curfew on everyone else? You are as selfish as the "Feck ye and your rules brigade". You would do well to remember that there are 7.8 billion people on this planet and you are just one of them.

So he is selfish for wanting to live to an old age safely

Psychedelic Hedgehog · 10-10-2020 12:16AM

polesheep wrote: »

So, because you want to live to be 95 you want a curfew on everyone else? You are as selfish as the "Feck ye and your rules brigade". You would do well to remember that there are 7.8 billion people on this planet and you are just one of them.

Well, sir, if you live to be 90, I would imagine you'd raise an eyebrow if another pandemic comes along and younger generations consider you expendable.

polesheep · 10-10-2020 12:18AM

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

So he is selfish for wanting to live to an old age safely

No, but selfish for wanting a curfew on others. Why should other people be denied the right to live their lives due to a curfew just so that one person can live to be 95 years old? May he live to be 95, or even older, but not at the expense of others. That's akin to vampirism.

polesheep · 10-10-2020 12:19AM

Psychedelic Hedgehog wrote: »

Well, sir, if you live to be 90, I would imagine you'd raise an eyebrow if another pandemic comes along and younger generations consider you expendable.

No one is expendable.

Icyseanfitz · 10-10-2020 12:22AM

polesheep wrote: »

No one is expendable.

You say that but it seems you think older people are so that young people can live a normal life, in un normal times. People need to just do their bloody best to protect each other for a few months until vaccines start coming.

Irish Steve · 10-10-2020 12:35AM

polesheep wrote: »

So, because you want to live to be 95 you want a curfew on everyone else? You are as selfish as the "Feck ye and your rules brigade". You would do well to remember that there are 7.8 billion people on this planet and you are just one of them.

I don't want the curfew because I want to live to a good age, I want the curfew in areas OF IRELAND where Covid is out of control to ensure that a large number of people in that area don't get covid as a result of the selfish ignorance of a significant number of people who have demonstrated a complete lack of social conscience.

And, unless I missed something, the population of Ireland the last time I looked was close to 5 million, so YOU can feck off with your 7.8 Billion numbers, what other countries choose to do to manage Covid in their countries is not something I can influence.

A large number of infected people has the potential to overwhelm our limited and already stretched health service, so we ALL have to do whatever it takes to prevent that from happening for the sake of the people that work there, and the people who may well die unnecessarily because the system is overloaded.

As a significant minority have demonstrated that they are not prepared to have a social conscience for the sake of others, the only remaining option is to make sure that they conform by imposing the necessary restrictions across the board.

I don't need to repeat the sorts of behaviour that are causing clusters, anyone that's read the mountain of posts in this thread alone is well aware of the areas that are causing problems.

manofwisdom · 10-10-2020 12:41AM

Wolf359f wrote: »

You don't empty the hospitals over 2 months before hand, that's just reckless.
Especially with ~50 cases a day in August, assuming you mean 'back then' as August?
If you mean March, we didn't know what to expect, what was coming down the line. For the post part elective surgery back then was cancelled and a lot of people with minor ailments didn't attend A&E etc...

We know a lot more about Covid now and with much better testing can plan ahead a little better.

On hospitals the question was why they emptied so quickly in March. To make room in the weeks ahead simliar cancellations will have to be repeated it seems.

In July we had i think 67 weekly cases then after that cases started to rise once more and by the end of August we had close to 1000 weekly cases. From that rise we now find ourselves with simliar weekly reported caseloads as April.

drunkmonkey · 10-10-2020 12:48AM

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

People need to just do their bloody best to protect each other for a few months until vaccines start coming.

It's not going to be a few months, certainly years before we know the long term effects so the majority of people are satisfied it's safe to take a vaccine.
It's one thing testing a vaccine on 30,000 volunteers, rolling it out from multiple manufacturers for 7.7 Billion people is whole different ball game. Covid will be here for a long time, normal life needs to resume for the people that want it to as soon as possible.

Non solum non ambulabit · 10-10-2020 12:49AM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Jaysus let's be a bit positive and take note of those who were tested positive but are ok and so on.

It's the only way to get through this. There will always be those who do not do well, sorry for that. But the majority seem to be OK with it if you know what I mean.

I don't know anymore and am just ploughing through best I can. Like most of us I reckon.

750m people have contracted this virus. There will be rare horror stories as with every virus. It's just we are all 100% focused on this one.

Covid 19 Part XXV-44,159 ROI (1,830 deaths) 21,898 NI (598 deaths) (13/10) Read OP

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