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COVID-19: Vaccine/antidote and testing procedures Megathread [Mod Warning - Post #1]

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  • #2882
    Diarmuid
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,981 ✭✭✭Diarmuid


    Dionaibh wrote: »
    Would you call the Lancet a trustworthy source? They were forced to withdraw a bogus study on hydroxychloroquine: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/22/the-lancet-reforms-editorial-policy-after-hydroxychloroquine-covid-study-retraction

    Yes I would.

    You seem to be branding anything that does not support your blind optimism as "doom and gloom".

    You denigrate independent commentators and well respected journals and yet take word of companies treatments as gospel, with little or no critique.

    Everyone wants to be done with this pandemic, that does not justify the wildly unrealistic expectations that pass as commentary here.


  • #2883
    Diarmuid
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,981 ✭✭✭Diarmuid


    Look at the title of the poll "Will you taking the talked about rushed September vaccine?" I mean talk about unrealistic expectations.


  • #2884
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,599 ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    Gael23 wrote: »
    Doesn’t look like the HSE are capable of mass rollout of any vaccine
    https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40061852.html

    Tell the patients to contact their pharmacist instead. What we have here is a doctor upset he can't charge his patients instead of the pharmacies charging his patients.

    There is supplies of the vaccine in the country.


  • #2885
    plodder
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,796 ✭✭✭plodder


    Gael23 wrote: »
    Doesn’t look like the HSE are capable of mass rollout of any vaccine
    https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40061852.html
    I booked a shot for myself online for a couple of weeks out (late Oct). Maybe anyone who can afford the 25 euro, but might have qualified for getting it free, should just pay the few quid.


  • #2886
    Dionaibh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 734 ✭✭✭Dionaibh


    Diarmuid wrote: »
    Yes I would.

    You seem to be branding anything that does not support your blind optimism as "doom and gloom".

    You denigrate independent commentators and well respected journals and yet take word of companies treatments as gospel, with little or no critique.

    Everyone wants to be done with this pandemic, that does not justify the wildly unrealistic expectations that pass as commentary here.

    The reason I mentioned the Lancet and that bogus study is to show how a good name doesn't necessarily mean infallibility.

    No blind optimism. I just don't see how Fauci brings anything to the table apart from non-stop negativity. It's not helpful.


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  • #2887
    funnydoggy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,065 ✭✭✭funnydoggy


    Diarmuid wrote: »
    Look at the title of the poll "Will you taking the talked about rushed September vaccine?" I mean talk about unrealistic expectations.

    Should be "Will you be taking the vaccine?", tbh


  • #2888
    stephenjmcd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,444 ✭✭✭✭stephenjmcd


    Gael23 wrote: »
    Doesn’t look like the HSE are capable of mass rollout of any vaccine
    https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40061852.html

    Getting mine through pharmacist next Tuesday.
    Company has 150 doses reserved with them.

    Same time as last year for us anyway


  • #2889
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    New test research - detects the virus in 5 minutes, based on CRISPR. Work continuing on accuracy and validation of the set-up.
    Researchers have used CRISPR gene-editing technology to come up with a test that detects the pandemic coronavirus in just 5 minutes. The diagnostic doesn’t require expensive lab equipment to run and could potentially be deployed at doctor’s offices, schools, and office buildings.

    https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/10/new-test-detects-coronavirus-just-5-minutes


  • #2890
    hmmm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,203 ✭✭✭✭hmmm


    https://www.marketwatch.com/story/trumps-vaccine-czar-says-the-first-vaccine-should-be-submitted-for-emergency-authorization-around-thanksgiving-2020-10-08

    "Moncef Slaoui, an immunologist by training and a longtime pharmaceutical executive, is running the Trump administration’s Operation Warp Speed program to spur development of vaccines on the fastest ever timetable.

    While none of the four vaccine candidates to enter Phase 3 trials have publicly reported data from the mid-stage studies, Slaoui is hopeful that drug makers will file for emergency authorization with the Food and Drug Administration by late November, immunization in high-risk populations could begin this year, and that the vaccines may be more effective in clinical trials than previously assumed.

    “My expectation is really something between 80% and 90% efficacy,” he said."


  • #2891
    Dionaibh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 734 ✭✭✭Dionaibh


    hmmm wrote: »
    https://www.marketwatch.com/story/trumps-vaccine-czar-says-the-first-vaccine-should-be-submitted-for-emergency-authorization-around-thanksgiving-2020-10-08

    "Moncef Slaoui, an immunologist by training and a longtime pharmaceutical executive, is running the Trump administration’s Operation Warp Speed program to spur development of vaccines on the fastest ever timetable.

    While none of the four vaccine candidates to enter Phase 3 trials have publicly reported data from the mid-stage studies, Slaoui is hopeful that drug makers will file for emergency authorization with the Food and Drug Administration by late November, immunization in high-risk populations could begin this year, and that the vaccines may be more effective in clinical trials than previously assumed.

    “My expectation is really something between 80% and 90% efficacy,” he said."

    Thanks for that. I posted a link to another article in which Moncef Slaoui was interviewed. I expect a celebrity scientist to come along soon to say it'll be 8% efficacy. Good news isn't allowed.


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  • #2892
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    Have we ever created a vaccine for a virus with a 95%+ survival rate?


  • #2893
    Dionaibh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 734 ✭✭✭Dionaibh


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    Have we ever created a vaccine for a virus with a 95%+ survival rate?

    We haven't, but we need one for this 99.9% survival rate one. We also need health passports, health apps, and masks.


  • #2894
    Hmmzis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,004 ✭✭✭Hmmzis


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    Have we ever created a vaccine for a virus with a 95%+ survival rate?

    Yes, lots.


  • #2895
    Sconsey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,611 ✭✭✭Sconsey


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    Have we ever created a vaccine for a virus with a 95%+ survival rate?

    Took 20 seconds to Google measles and see that the death rate in the US is 0.2%..(so 99.8% survival rate). Probably the most well known disease we vaccinate for.


  • #2896
    charlie14
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,591 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Dionaibh wrote: »
    One reads of people dying in car crashes being classified as a Covid death. It's ridiculous.

    Italy and Spain are particular cases. Apart from a couple of months early on in the year there would be no sign of a pandemic were it not for the media and social media. A Spanish doctor was interviewed a couple of months ago and said that it was media hysteria that was driving the alleged second wave. He and his colleagues hadn't even noticed.

    I disagree re Ireland. I don't think people would have noticed, just as people don't notice bad flu years. Ivor Cummins shows how there was a couple of months of spread and that it has been over since around May. It's now a casedemic.


    Just to be sure we are talking about the same Ivor Cummins.
    Is he the same Ivor Cummins a biochemical engineer that has been running scared for months now from fact checks of his posts by Dr. Dominic Pimenta a cardiology registrar ?


    With first the U.S.A. being a "particular case", and now after your suggestion we move to Europe Italy and Spain are also "particular cases", we have moved on to a the musings of, imo, a rather dodgy nutritionist whose musings do not stand up to fact checks, anonymous people dying in car crashes, and a Spanish doctor who hasn`t noticed that in the past week alone Spain has recorder 51,134 new Covid-19 cases and 981 deaths.
    I`m getting the distinct feeling that what you read involves skipping over a great deal of verifiable facts while searching find dodgy and anonymous musings that suit your narrative.


  • #2897
    Stark
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,180 ✭✭✭✭Stark


    charlie14 wrote: »
    Just to be sure we are talking about the same Ivor Cummins.
    Is he the same Ivor Cummins a biochemical engineer that has been running scared for months now from fact checks of his posts by Dr. Dominic Pimenta a cardiology registrar ?

    From his bio, he graduated from chemical engineering in 1990 then worked various corporate jobs in most of the time since before discovering there was money to be made in nutritional quackery in the last 4 - 5 years.

    Not exactly someone I'd be trusting over people who've spent their careers specialising in public health and epidemiology.


  • #2898
    mohawk
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,787 ✭✭✭mohawk


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    Have we ever created a vaccine for a virus with a 95%+ survival rate?

    It’s not all about survival for some diseases such as measles, rubella and mumps. You can be left will long term complications such as hearing loss, infertility, permanent brain damage etc.


  • #2899
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    Makes sense


  • #2900
    charlie14
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,591 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Dionaibh wrote: »
    All three would put years on you. But Fauci is particularly bad. Whenever there's any bit of good news out pops that guy with his doom and negativity.

    I made a point in another post about how we in the West have to put up with non-stop hysteria, doomsday scenarios, and celebrity scientists with a different opinion every other day. Another one this morning with a Spanish doctor saying masks will be required for two years. I asked a Brazilian friend of mine what things are like there and she said people are out and about, going to restaurants, dancing in the street, beaches are packed etc. No hysteria. The culture outside of the West is very different. Life is more simple and people appreciate that there are more important things in life than work, hysteria, social media, celebrity scientists. So that's why I have consistently recommended that people emigrate, if they can.


    Your Brazilian friend either does not come from Amazonas, or is unaware of the situation there.
    On September 21st. a research report s published on medRvix that claimed herd immunity had been achieved in Manaus, capital city of the state of Amazonas with a population consisting of 2.2 million of the states total population of 3.8 million.
    September 25th. all bars, restaurants and beaches closed due to a large increase in Covid-19 cases.


  • #2901
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Gael23 wrote: »
    Doesn’t look like the HSE are capable of mass rollout of any vaccine
    https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40061852.html
    It's not their fault, it is delayed deliveries of the vaccine.


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  • #2902
    Dionaibh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 734 ✭✭✭Dionaibh


    charlie14 wrote: »
    Your Brazilian friend either does not come from Amazonas, or is unaware of the situation there.
    On September 21st. a research report s published on medRvix that claimed herd immunity had been achieved in Manaus, capital city of the state of Amazonas with a population consisting of 2.2 million of the states total population of 3.8 million.
    September 25th. all bars, restaurants and beaches closed due to a large increase in Covid-19 cases.

    That's strange. I didn't know that. Rolling lockdowns.


  • #2903
    Dionaibh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 734 ✭✭✭Dionaibh


    Stark wrote: »
    From his bio, he graduated from chemical engineering in 1990 then worked various corporate jobs in most of the time since before discovering there was money to be made in nutritional quackery in the last 4 - 5 years.

    Not exactly someone I'd be trusting over people who've spent their careers specialising in public health and epidemiology.

    You mean people like Neil Ferguson and his amazing models?


  • #2904
    Dionaibh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 734 ✭✭✭Dionaibh


    charlie14 wrote: »
    Just to be sure we are talking about the same Ivor Cummins.
    Is he the same Ivor Cummins a biochemical engineer that has been running scared for months now from fact checks of his posts by Dr. Dominic Pimenta a cardiology registrar ?


    With first the U.S.A. being a "particular case", and now after your suggestion we move to Europe Italy and Spain are also "particular cases", we have moved on to a the musings of, imo, a rather dodgy nutritionist whose musings do not stand up to fact checks, anonymous people dying in car crashes, and a Spanish doctor who hasn`t noticed that in the past week alone Spain has recorder 51,134 new Covid-19 cases and 981 deaths.
    I`m getting the distinct feeling that what you read involves skipping over a great deal of verifiable facts while searching find dodgy and anonymous musings that suit your narrative.

    Sorry, I meant that everything is political in the US, so the numbers can't really be trusted because of State politics. Doesn't help that it's election year.

    But Spain and Italy are unique in so far as it's common for grandparents to live at home (more so in Italy than in Spain).

    A lady who died in Tennessee six months ago managed to test positive for COVID-19 a few weeks ago. I've never heard of a test that can diagnose a dead person as being positive.


  • #2905
    charlie14
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,591 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Dionaibh wrote: »
    That's strange. I didn't know that. Rolling lockdowns.


    What I find strange is that people post "facts" on social media platforms based on nothing other than "he said she said" when even the most basic research would show them what the actual facts are.


    I do not find it the slightest bit strange that a claim of acquired herd immunity was debunked.
    Sweden whose laisseze-faire strategy was the pursuit of the same had antibody test results that nationally were no better than Spain or France who used lockdown, and were actually worse for both Spain and Italy`s epicenters than theirs for Stockholm.
    In case you are interested there have been 4,168 new confirmed cases in Sweden since the 2nd of this month.


  • #2906
    Dionaibh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 734 ✭✭✭Dionaibh


    charlie14 wrote: »
    What I find strange is that people post "facts" on social media platforms based on nothing other than "he said she said" when even the most basic research would show them what the actual facts are.


    I do not find it the slightest bit strange that a claim of acquired herd immunity was debunked.
    Sweden whose laisseze-faire strategy was the pursuit of the same had antibody test results that nationally were no better than Spain or France who used lockdown, and were actually worse for both Spain and Italy`s epicenters than theirs for Stockholm.
    In case you are interested there have been 4,168 new confirmed cases in Sweden since the 2nd of this month.

    But my friend wasn't talking about that particular place in Brazil. She said beaches are packed in Rio and that people are enjoying themselves dancing and having a good time. Give me that any day over the moribund countries in the West. And before anyone says "go there then if you love it that much", that is my plan.

    Cases are irrelevant. It's hospitalisations that count. Spain and France have been destroyed. The psychological damage of masks everywhere may never be overcome.


  • #2907
    charlie14
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,591 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Dionaibh wrote: »
    Sorry, I meant that everything is political in the US, so the numbers can't really be trusted because of State politics. Doesn't help that it's election year.

    But Spain and Italy are unique in so far as it's common for grandparents to live at home (more so in Italy than in Spain).

    A lady who died in Tennessee six months ago managed to test positive for COVID-19 a few weeks ago. I've never heard of a test that can diagnose a dead person as being positive.


    I have shown you how incorrect you were on the U.S.A.that nobody would know we had a pandemic if it was not for social media

    I have followed you at your request to Europe and shown you how wrong you have been there on the same.
    I have even shown you how incorrect your assumptions were on Brazil from your conversation with one Brazilian.
    Am I now expected to now waste my time following you too God only knows where on the basis of one woman where a test center got the address wrong for one person out of 7.8 million U.S.A positive test results,


  • #2908
    Gael23
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,151 ✭✭✭✭Gael23


    I don’t like how quiet Oxford/AZ have been


  • #2909
    charlie14
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,591 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Dionaibh wrote: »
    But my friend wasn't talking about that particular place in Brazil. She said beaches are packed in Rio and that people are enjoying themselves dancing and having a good time. Give me that any day over the moribund countries in the West. And before anyone says "go there then if you love it that much", that is my plan.

    Cases are irrelevant. It's hospitalisations that count. Spain and France have been destroyed. The psychological damage of masks everywhere may never be overcome.


    Good lad. Just keep ignoring the statistics on the ratios of deaths to confirmed cases and off you go to Brazil which has had 1.45 million deaths from 48.5 million cases. The worlds third largest case loads behind India and the U.S.

    I hope the psychological damage you will have to undergo wearing a face mask to get you there does not scar you for life.

    Before you do so though, it might be an idea to check out the actual rise in cases for your Shangri-La Rio de Janeiro, rather than go on the word of some randomer whose knowledge so far from one of your previous posts has been shown to be sketchy.


  • #2910
    Diarmuid
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,981 ✭✭✭Diarmuid


    charlie14 wrote: »
    I hope the psychological damage you will have to undergo wearing a face mask to get you there does not scar you for life..

    I don't know if I would be going to Brazil, but I have been to both France and Italy since Covid has kicked off. There's a massive difference between the attitudes in Ireland vs France and Italy. We have an unhealthy obsession with Covid, and with the daily numbers and press conference. I don't see any let up in Ireland for the next 6 to 12 months. To pretend that this isn't going to have a negative impact on people is somewhere between disingenuous and willfully ignorant.


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  • #2911
    Dionaibh
    Closed Accounts Posts: 734 ✭✭✭Dionaibh


    charlie14 wrote: »
    Good lad. Just keep ignoring the statistics on the ratios of deaths to confirmed cases and off you go to Brazil which has had 1.45 million deaths from 48.5 million cases. The worlds third largest case loads behind India and the U.S.

    I hope the psychological damage you will have to undergo wearing a face mask to get you there does not scar you for life.

    Before you do so though, it might be an idea to check out the actual rise in cases for your Shangri-La Rio de Janeiro, rather than go on the word of some randomer whose knowledge so far from one of your previous posts has been shown to be sketchy.

    Thanks for the statistics. I'm not ignoring them. But I think one has to take into account population size, population health, and living conditions.

    All I wrote was that my friend said people were having fun, going to the beach, and enjoying themselves. Really what I was trying to do was compare attitudes in the West with attitudes outside of the West. In Ireland there was uproar over young people enjoying themselves in Galway (I think) recently. I'm just comparing the difference in attitude.


This discussion has been closed.
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