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2020 the battle of the septuagenarians - Trump vs Biden, Part 2

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  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,932 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    At this stage its best for Biden to forego remaining debates. He could beat Trump in every one hands down and all people will remember is them being chaos and Trump turning everyone off voting. That's what happens when you mud wrestle. Everyone gets mud on them no matter how clean they were at the start.

    Totally disagree - Biden backing out plays into Trumps hands as no matter the reasons that Biden might put forward , it will be spun by Trump as Biden being afraid or Not up to the job etc.

    The next Debate is Townhall style - Given how the townhalls they both held recently went I think that will work for Biden.

    Trump will get at least one question that he really doesn't like from the audience and if he responds to them the way he spoke last night it will damage him.

    I honestly don't think that there's any question that someone could ask Biden that would go as low a Trump did last night so I think that Biden will handle them quite well.

    It will be interesting to hear the line taken by Trump today/tomorrow when they start to get their feedback and polling data after the debate. At best, their data will tell them that it made no difference to the current standings

    I genuinely think that if anyone pulls out of the debates it'll be Trump - He'll go and hold rallies in Swing States instead , like he did in the Primary debates last time around.

    He'll claim the moderators are in the bag for Biden etc.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,366 ✭✭✭✭hynesie08


    At this stage its best for Biden to forego remaining debates. He could beat Trump in every one hands down and all people will remember is them being chaos and Trump turning everyone off voting. That's what happens when you mud wrestle. Everyone gets mud on them no matter how clean they were at the start.

    If Biden refuses to debate, he's effectively handing trump the election, he just has to do more of what he did last night, and not rise to trumps baiting. Trump proved last night that he can't handle being ignored.

    And selfishly I really want to see the town hall debate, that'll be a car crash of epic proportions.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,779 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    Quin_Dub wrote: »
    Totally disagree - Biden backing out plays into Trumps hands as no matter the reasons that Biden might put forward , it will be spun by Trump as Biden being afraid or Not up to the job etc.

    The next Debate is Townhall style - Given how the townhalls they both held recently went I think that will work for Biden.

    Trump will get at least one question that he really doesn't like from the audience and if he responds to them the way he spoke last night it will damage him.

    I honestly don't think that there's any question that someone could ask Biden that would go as low a Trump did last night so I think that Biden will handle them quite well.

    It will be interesting to hear the line taken by Trump today/tomorrow when they start to get their feedback and polling data after the debate. At best, their data will tell them that it made no difference to the current standings

    I genuinely think that if anyone pulls out of the debates it'll be Trump - He'll go and hold rallies in Swing States instead , like he did in the Primary debates last time around.

    He'll claim the moderators are in the bag for Biden etc.

    I'm thinking it's even money until the next round of polling to see if the #IMPOTUS pulls out. If he drops in the polls overall, I'd say he will. Biden doesn't have to do much in these debates (which, ffs, aren't debates at all, they're joint press conferences). It's not like the Ford/Carter debates and Ford convincing everyone he really was an idiot with what he said about Poland and the Soviet Union. We *know* the #IMPOTUS. As Biden said last night when quoting Maya Angelou, when someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time. The #IMPOTUS is exactly what he showed last night. He doesn't kid. He doesn't really joke (he's sort of an inept Don Rickles insult comedian). He's dumb, lazy and massively narcissistic.


  • Posts: 3,773 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    hynesie08 wrote: »
    The proud boys are 100% going to show up armed at the polls, and trump just gave them permission to do it.

    What are the proud boys? They seem like a pretty diverse bunch of people with no clear agenda. Gavin McInnes started them and he is not some unhinged white supremacist. He's actually a really funny guy online although every media "file photo" they always use makes him look like an evil modern day Hitler.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,887 ✭✭✭✭osarusan


    I don't get the idea that either candidate can drop out of the debates - it would do massive damage to their campaign in terms of the undecided voters. There's no way they can spin it as a positive.


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  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,932 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    What are the proud boys? They seem like a pretty diverse bunch of people with no clear agenda. Gavin McInnes started them and he is not some unhinged white supremacist. He's actually a really funny guy online although every media "file photo" they always use makes him look like an evil modern day Hitler.

    Proud Boys
    Established in the midst of the 2016 presidential election by VICE Media co-founder Gavin McInnes, the Proud Boys are self-described “western chauvinists” who adamantly deny any connection to the racist “alt-right,” insisting they are simply a fraternal group spreading an “anti-political correctness” and “anti-white guilt” agenda.

    Gavin McInnes - "Quite a funny guy online" - really?

    Here are some quotes from Mr McInnes
    "It’s such a rape culture with these immigrants, I don’t even think these women see it as rape. They see it as just like having a teeth [sic] pulled. ‘It’s a Monday. I don’t really enjoy it,’ but that’s what you do. I wouldn’t be surprised if it doesn’t have the same trauma as it would for a middle-class white girl in the suburbs because it’s so entrenched into their culture.” — Gavin McInnes, Get Off My Lawn, June 19, 2018
    "Muslims have a problem with inbreeding. They tend to marry their first cousins…and that is a major problem here because when you have mentally damaged inbreds — which not all Muslims are, but a disproportionate number are — and you have a hate book called the Koran…you end up with a perfect recipe for mass murder." — Gavin McInnes, Get Off My Lawn, April 24, 2018
    “We brought roads and infrastructure to India and they are still using them as toilets. Our criminals built nice roads in Australia but aboriginals keep using them as a bed. The next time someone b
    about colonization, the correct response is ‘You’re welcome.’”
    —Gavin McInnes, “10 Things I like About White Guys,” Taki’s Magazine, March 2, 2017
    “Maybe the reason I’m sexist is because women are dumb. No, I’m just kidding, ladies. But you do tend to not thrive in certain areas — like writing.”
    —Gavin McInnes, The Gavin McInnes Show, June 28, 2017


    Yeah.. He's Hilarious alright..


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,624 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    What are the proud boys? They seem like a pretty diverse bunch of people with no clear agenda. Gavin McInnes started them and he is not some unhinged white supremacist. He's actually a really funny guy online although every media "file photo" they always use makes him look like an evil modern day Hitler.

    Just to annoy them I hope guys who attended LGBTQ+ pride events start referring to themselves as proud boys


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,735 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    Quin_Dub wrote: »
    Proud Boys



    Gavin McInnes - "Quite a funny guy online" - really?

    Here are some quotes from Mr McInnes










    Yeah.. He's Hilarious alright..

    Jokes, you know every time someone says something offensive it’s jokes.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,366 ✭✭✭✭hynesie08


    What are the proud boys? They seem like a pretty diverse bunch of people with no clear agenda. Gavin McInnes started them and he is not some unhinged white supremacist. He's actually a really funny guy online although every media "file photo" they always use makes him look like an evil modern day Hitler.

    They're a misogynistic hate group who are a rally away from being a militia. They're also heavily armed because seemingly they can't win a one on one fight.

    They're an incel hell's angels without the street cred, and they just got called to arms by trump.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,624 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    15 undecided voters..

    "Despite their indecisiveness, most described Trump in a negative light, including one of the participants who was leaning toward voting for the president. The voters characterized Trump as “unhinged,” “arrogant,” “forceful," a “bully,” “chaotic” and “un-American.”

    When asked to describe Biden they offered: “better than expected,” “politician,” “compassion,” “coherent,” and a “nice guy lacking vision.”

    https://www.politico.com/news/2020/09/30/undecided-voters-trump-biden-debate-423545

    Loving this quote..

    The roughly four voters who ended the night in Biden’s corner were stunned by Trump’s performance. Ruthie, a voter from Pennsylvania, described it as trying to “win an argument with a crackhead.”

    Did Donnie take that drug test?

    Funny enough when he done the exact same thing to a female candidate he was "dominant"and "strong"


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,366 ✭✭✭✭hynesie08


    breezy1985 wrote: »
    Just to annoy them I hope guys who attended LGBTQ+ pride events start referring to themselves as proud boys

    Pride boys...... Steal their logo and font but have it in the rainbow colours....... That'd be incredible.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,779 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    breezy1985 wrote: »
    By how much?
    Yep. It's still pretty marginal and all based on money staked in UK and Ireland.

    https://www.oddschecker.com/politics/us-politics/us-presidential-election-2020/winner?selectionName=donald-trump

    About the 1.65 mark average (7/11 in old English :) ) which translates into a 60% chance of winning. It was much closer to the 50% mark afew days ago. He peeked at about 65%-70% just after the George Floys incident. Before that, Trump was down as 55% chance of winning.

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,624 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    hynesie08 wrote: »
    Pride boys...... Steal their logo and font but have it in the rainbow colours....... That'd be incredible.

    Matching tight fitting t-shirts but with rainbow camo too


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,624 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    About the 1.65 mark average (7/11 in old English :) ) which translates into a 60% chance of winning. It was much closer to the 50% mark afew days ago. He peeked at about 65%-70% just after the George Floys incident. Before that, Trump was down as 55% chance of winning.

    Cool thanks I hadn't really been checking the betting throughout this. I'm not really into betting so when you said "odds dropped" I was worried that meant less chance of Biden winning not the other way round


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,068 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    breezy1985 wrote: »
    Matching tight fitting t-shirts but with rainbow camo too

    Probably already have them, they are pro Gay rights.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,166 ✭✭✭The Rooster


    breezy1985 wrote: »
    Cool thanks I hadn't really been checking the betting throughout this. I'm not really into betting so when you said "odds dropped" I was worried that meant less chance of Biden winning not the other way round

    It means that in the UK, more money has been placed on Biden than on Trump over the last 24 hours.
    If someone decided to put £1 million quid on Trump this afternoon, his odds would come in. Wouldn't mean he'd have more or less chance of winning.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,368 ✭✭✭✭Arghus


    I thought Trump came out of the blocks quite well. Now, obviously, nothing he said was actually true, but his relentless jabber seemed to have Biden rattled and he looked tired and old in those first 10-15 minutes. I feared an epic collapse by Biden. He managed to rescue it as the debate went on. He's far from inspiring, it's hard to know what he really stands for and his gaffes are not great: he does look and talk like a man who is nearly 80.

    But, Trump, is just a horrible being. Endless windbaggery, constant interruption, zero actual substance, blatant lies - just awful. How anyone, right or left, Republican or Democrat, could vote for that is truly beyond me. It never stops being shocking that he's the President. Surely, enough is enough. What a horrible, horrible man.

    In short: Trump would be absolutely annihilated by a younger fresher candidate, but, he's so bad that Biden - for all his flaws - probably will do it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,963 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    Quin_Dub wrote:
    So , whilst neither side could confidently call last night a win , in terms of delivering on the Debate "table stakes" I think Biden did far better.
    I agree, three draws is a win for Biden. He just needs to not lose ground to win.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,779 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    It means that in the UK, more money has been placed on Biden than on Trump over the last 24 hours.
    If someone decided to put £1 million quid on Trump this afternoon, his odds would come in. Wouldn't mean he'd have more or less chance of winning.

    That's not how it works - if it was, bookie's wouldn't stay in busimess long.

    Other factors are taken into account.

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • Posts: 3,773 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Quin_Dub wrote: »
    Proud Boys



    Gavin McInnes - "Quite a funny guy online" - really?

    Here are some quotes from Mr McInnes










    Yeah.. He's Hilarious alright..


    I think if you ever watch his videos it's pretty clear he's mostly having a laugh. He is not anywhere in the same universe as Richard Spencer though, despite the smears from the media.

    He is non-PC but he is not HATING any particular group.


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  • Posts: 3,773 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    hynesie08 wrote: »
    Pride boys...... Steal their logo and font but have it in the rainbow colours....... That'd be incredible.

    I wish the left would be more creative like your suggestion.

    That's a much better reaction than suppression and censorship.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,779 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    breezy1985 wrote: »
    Cool thanks I hadn't really been checking the betting throughout this. I'm not really into betting so when you said "odds dropped" I was worried that meant less chance of Biden winning not the other way round

    Odds dropping means getting closer to a certainty. Bides odds dropped from 1.90 to abotu 1.65 (1.00 is dead certainty, 2.00 is a 50/50 chance).
    Odds lenghtening or drfiting means less likely to happen.

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,963 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    The VP candidate debates men nothing although it'll be interesting to see if Pence is willing to get down and dirty and drag up Harris' affair with Willie Brown.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,166 ✭✭✭The Rooster


    That's not how it works - if it was, bookie's wouldn't stay in busimess long.

    Other factors are taken into account.

    I know exactly how it works, and 100% stand over my previous post.
    The few people who are interested in such things can google it to see who's right regarding fluctuations in such markets.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,465 ✭✭✭1800_Ladladlad


    The main thing that got on my tits was Wallace trying to get Trump to condemn the Proud Boys specifically, and as much as people want them to be, they are not white supremacists. Biden stating antifa is not an organisation but an idea was just delusional. Biden had the chance to disavow Antifa and distance himself from them and he just couldn’t do it, instead stating he doesn’t condemn violence. He was directly asked to condemn Antifa rioters actually. Trump should have questioned why Obama and Biden failed to declare the KKK as terrorist org in their 8 years in office? Was it because it was founded by democrats or of its Democrat founding?

    Trump didn't "refuse" to denounce white supremacy, as much of the media and social media is now propagating.There has been months of continuous Antifa and BLMs violence, undeniable hoards of evidence to prove this, but still, its white supremacy. He has condemned white supremacists on multiple occasions. The MSM fail to portray this, nor will perpetual anti Trump people accept it. He signed an executive order naming the KKK a terrorist organisation https://nypost.com/2020/09/25/trump-to-designate-kkk-antifa-as-terrorist-groups-in-black-empowerment-plan/amp/ . There aren't many stronger condemnations of white supremacists than that. But Trump could say it 1,000,00 times on prime time tv and the people who don't like him would want 1,000,001.

    How many white supremacists do you see burning buildings, rioting, attacking and killing people in the street? It isn’t “white supremacists" ruining cities and killing people. It’s Antifa and BLM.. We have seen weeks of footage showing their anarchy and racist Ideologies but yet Trump is demanded to disavow Proud Boys? What have the PB set fires to. What homes have they destroyed? What black businesses have they destroyed or burned down? What stores have they looted? Where is the evidence of this to match the extensive video evidence of the chaos in the states, as result of BLM and antifa, which shows Proud boys doing the same. And yet we have a member of the PB who was murdered in a co-ordinated assassination by a self confessed member of antifa….. A cold blooded murder. The current leader the Proud Boys is Enrique Tarrio who is missed race. A half black, half Cuban guy lad and the democrats/wallace call it a white supremacist group? TBH I don’t know why Trump said he was “willing to do that” when he was asked to condemn white supremacy as if he hasn’t done it before, that was strange. When he shifted it to antifa because he knew Wallace wasn’t going to push Biden on antifa what so ever, I don’t blame him for doing this as Trump wasn’t only debating Biden.

    A person who has the ability to remain neutral should only moderate debates. The US viewer wasn’t even a secondary concern to wallace. Biased media from either side should not have any role in debates in the future. Trump is asked about NY Times story and Biden gets a pass on his own aswell as Hunter. Every time Biden was getting pummelled, Chris shielded him hard. Debated on bidders behalf. Wallace laughing along with Biden also was not a good look. Biden went unchallenged by Wallace on numerous occasions. Allowing Biden to not answering questions or follow up. This is supposed to be a “conservative” mod. Wallace Pushed the “fine people” narrative, and tried working it in when footage shows Trump clarifying what he said but as usual its taken out of context completely to fit the lefts narrative. What was with “community policing”? Is that the democrats round about way of stating defund the police?

    And of course Biden used the cameras to his advantage, the numerous scripted, grand standing plea's looking into the camera to talk to the viewers as if they haven’t got a clue. Like he does with black people. When Biden said Trump is the worst President America has ever had, I couldn’t help but facepalm. I would have though the presidents that ok'd slavery maybe? no?

    Does Biden think people are that gullible to believe this? “We left him a booming economy. And he caused the recession.” The Obama administration did not leave the economy booming and I think he forgets we are in the middle of a Global pandemic.

    Even tho it was a bit of a sh**T show, this was the highlight for me:
    https://twitter.com/M2Madness/status/1311132315163258888


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,981 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    The main thing that got on my tits was Wallace trying to get Trump to condemn the Proud Boys specifically

    He didn't. He said White Supremacists. It was Biden who said "Proud Boys" when Trump was asking who specifically Wallace wanted him to condemn.

    https://twitter.com/axios/status/1311127476391772160?s=20


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,465 ✭✭✭1800_Ladladlad


    Penn wrote: »
    He didn't. He said White Supremacists. It was Biden who said "Proud Boys" when Trump was asking who specifically Wallace wanted him to condemn.

    https://twitter.com/axios/status/1311127476391772160?s=20

    Yeah I mixed that up cheers. Trump saying stand back and stand by was moronic!!!!


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,404 ✭✭✭Justin Credible Darts


    Well that debate only served to reinforce my opinion neither of those clowns are fit to be president,

    sadly one of them is getting the job.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,624 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    I wish the left would be more creative like your suggestion.

    That's a much better reaction than suppression and censorship.

    I imagine you would be a fan. Being a bear and all


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,683 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Yeah I mixed that up cheers. Trump saying stand back and stand by was moronic!!!!

    It wasn't moronic it's the agenda. He wants civil unrest. He think it helps him. He wants people to rush the polls and harass voters and trained poll watchers and poll workers.

    And the Proud Boys heard him. They're all over the internet fapping themselves that they have a new commander.

    Biden was honestly doing well just to keep his train of thought over constant interruptions. Trump was clearly preying on his speech impediment.


This discussion has been closed.
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