2020 the battle of the septuagenarians - Trump vs Biden, Part 2

hotmail.com · 29-09-2020 5:23pm

eire4 wrote: »

If voter turnout even hit 60% that would be stunning given the typically pathetic voter turnout in the US. Voter turnout is more likely in the mid 50's. In 2016 it was 55.5%. The last time voter turnout got to 60% was in 1968 when it was 60.7%.

The pathetic turnouts doesn't chime with the supposed anger etc that elements of the media and posters here want to portray.

MeMen2_MoRi_ · 29-09-2020 5:23pm

hotmail.com wrote: »

I'd be shocked if turnout surpasses 60%. Interest among Americans in politics is evidently quite low.

Only been above 60% 4 times since 1920, just over 55% in 16..

I'm hopeful it goes past the 60 mark.

Leroy42 · 29-09-2020 5:23pm

DraftDodger wrote: »

Biden is an incredibly weak candidate. You'll never get the never trumpers on here to admit that but we all know deep down they realise that also.

Hold on. In 2016 we had a very strong, capable and experienced candidate, but apparently, she was too elitist and part of the DC establishment.

We had Obama, which GoP love to tell everyone was too much style over substance and never actually got anything done.

So what exactly is it that you what in a candidate? IN a country that is as divided as the US, where middle ground is almost seen as giving up, and nuance is gone out the window.

Sanders? AOC type? Warren? Lets be honest, none of them had a snowballs chance in hell of getting near the WH.

It is easy to say that Biden is terrible, although there are very few actually facts used to back it up.

Foxtrol · 29-09-2020 5:28pm

Quin_Dub wrote: »

Indeed - I think everyone here will stipulate to that , but to quote Donald J Trump himself - "It is what it is"

So - Given that the choices are fixed and set , and you have to pick one , what now?

To continue the analogy from above , given the available options (which we have stipulated to , are crap) , you now only have 3 choices - Drink Bleach , Eat a mediocre Steak or starve by not making a decision.

What's it going to be?

There isn't a starve option though. If you don't eat the steak you get the bleach.

These comments of people not liking or believing in either and doing their own thing is selfish, childish, idealistic nonsense. Those that sat out or voted 3rd party because Bernie lost has led to a supreme court packed with young conservatives, a Muslim bans, kids in cages etc etc. It isn't even the case of them 'choosing to starve' it is them choosing to make others drink bleach because they cant see past their own ideologies.

eire4 · 29-09-2020 5:29pm

hotmail.com wrote: »

The pathetic turnouts doesn't chime with the supposed anger etc that elements of the media and posters here want to portray.

No it doesn't but another pathetic turnout will be the outcome IMHO. A large chunk of Americans have simply given up as their system is so broken and corrupt. It is not like either party is going to legislate in the best interests of the vast majority of Americans. So why should they bother. Rightly or wrongly I get why many would feel that way and not vote as there are no viable alternatives to the duopoly on power in DC.

namloc1980 · 29-09-2020 5:29pm

Interesting to see latest poll from North Dakota (hardcore Republican state) has Trump with a 19% lead over Biden as you'd expect. However Trump won ND by 36% in 2016. Even for a poll a 17 point swing is huge and well outside any margin of error. Signals even in the red heartland people are not all in on Trump as they were in 2016.

eire4 · 29-09-2020 5:30pm

MeMen2_MoRi_ wrote: »

Only been above 60% 4 times since 1920, just over 55% in 16..

I'm hopeful it goes past the 60 mark.

I highly doubt it will.

WrenBoy · 29-09-2020 5:31pm

Leroy42 wrote: »

Hold on. In 2016 we had a very strong, capable and experienced candidate, but apparently, she was too elitist and part of the DC establishment.

We had Obama, which GoP love to tell everyone was too much style over substance and never actually got anything done.

So what exactly is it that you what in a candidate? IN a country that is as divided as the US, where middle ground is almost seen as giving up, and nuance is gone out the window.

Sanders? AOC type? Warren? Lets be honest, none of them had a snowballs chance in hell of getting near the WH.

It is easy to say that Biden is terrible, although there are very few actually facts used to back it up.

I was impressed with Tulsi Gabbard, I thought she would have been a great candidate from what I saw of her.

Foxtrol · 29-09-2020 5:32pm

DraftDodger wrote: »

Biden is an incredibly weak candidate. You'll never get the never trumpers on here to admit that but we all know deep down they realise that also.

An 'incredibly weak' candidate that steamrolled everyone that ran against him in the primaries

hotmail.com · 29-09-2020 5:32pm

Virgin Media and other media outlets have labelled the debates as the "real start of the election campaign".

I think they've been using that line since last January.

Quin_Dub · 29-09-2020 5:36pm

WrenBoy wrote: »

I was impressed with Tulsi Gabbard, I thought she would have been a great candidate from what I saw of her.

What specifically impresses people about Tulsi Gabbard?

What abilities and skills does Tulsi Gabbard have that would secure her victories in Michigan , Wisconsin and Pennsylvania?

Abilities and skills that clearly didn't impress virtually ANY Democratic primary voters?

eire4 · 29-09-2020 5:37pm

Leroy42 wrote: »

Hold on. In 2016 we had a very strong, capable and experienced candidate, but apparently, she was too elitist and part of the DC establishment.

We had Obama, which GoP love to tell everyone was too much style over substance and never actually got anything done.

So what exactly is it that you what in a candidate? IN a country that is as divided as the US, where middle ground is almost seen as giving up, and nuance is gone out the window.

Sanders? AOC type? Warren? Lets be honest, none of them had a snowballs chance in hell of getting near the WH.

It is easy to say that Biden is terrible, although there are very few actually facts used to back it up.

Close to half of the country does not vote on a regular basis. If either party actually enacted policies that would genuinely benefit the best economic interests of the vast majority of Americans maybe a good chunk of those non voters would change their minds and vote.

The fact is neither party cares about legislating in the best interests of Americans and that is not going to change as long as DC is so bought and paid for by wealthy individuals and major corporations. Hence you get the kind of dreadful to at best mediocre candidates the US gets not just in this election but on a consistent basis.

Foxtrol · 29-09-2020 5:38pm

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

If I were an American I would starve on the principle that I would be embarrassed to be in any way responsible for either being in power.

As an Irishman, my main interest is watching the Biden fans trying to pretend because Trump is worse, that biden is somehow not abysmal in his own right,

It Trumps wins, it would be hilarious in a warped way, if only to see the back peddling and the excuses coming out and of course the crying.

If Biden gets in then his inability will come to the fore and that too will be hilarious in a warped way also.

As a neutral I find the whole thing sort of fascinating and more entertaining than the sh1t shows that currently are on tv.

The bold shows you don't understand how elections work. If you don't partake or choose to throw away your vote, you are responsible for the person that is elected.

As far as Biden's 'inability' coming to the fore, if he puts qualified, competent, non-corrupt people in charge of departments and sits there and does nothing else it'll be a massive improvement on Trump.

eire4 · 29-09-2020 5:42pm

Quin_Dub wrote: »

What specifically impresses people about Tulsi Gabbard?

What abilities and skills does Tulsi Gabbard have that would secure her victories in Michigan , Wisconsin and Pennsylvania?

Abilities and skills that clearly didn't impress virtually ANY Democratic primary voters?

Nothing impresses me about Gabbard. But only 23% was the national voter turnout for the primaries this year so hardly anything to write home about for any candidate.

Foxtrol · 29-09-2020 5:43pm

eire4 wrote: »

Close to half of the country does not vote on a regular basis. If either party actually enacted policies that would genuinely benefit the best economic interests of the vast majority of Americans maybe a good chunk of those non voters would change their minds and vote.

The fact is neither party cares about legislating in the best interests of Americans and that is not going to change as long as DC is so bought and paid for by wealthy individuals and major corporations. Hence you get the kind of dreadful to at best mediocre candidates the US gets not just in this election but on a consistent basis.

Sounds like the crap Bernie came out with during both his failed primaries. It is pure wishful thinking.

The bigger thing to get more people to vote would be to make it easier (e.g., not having to wait for hours in lines) but the GOP does everything it can to make it harder.

eire4 · 29-09-2020 5:46pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

The bold shows you don't understand how elections work. If you don't partake or choose to throw away your vote, you are responsible for the person that is elected.

As far as Biden's 'inability' coming to the fore, if he puts qualified, competent, non-corrupt people in charge of departments and sits there and does nothing else it'll be a massive improvement on Trump.

To be fair in the US their system is utterly corrupt and dysfunctional so I can easily see why roughly half of them don't bother to vote as why bother the system is corrupt and has no interest in them and there are no viable alternatives to the current endless cycle from the 2 corrupt establishment parties.

Totally agree with your second paragraph. Sadly that is how low the bar is in the US currently.

namloc1980 · 29-09-2020 5:51pm

eire4 wrote: »

To be fair in the US their system is utterly corrupt and dysfunctional so I can easily see why roughly half of them don't bother to vote as why bother the system is corrupt and has no interest in them and there are no viable alternatives to the current endless cycle from the 2 corrupt establishment parties.

Totally agree with your second paragraph. Sadly that is how low the bar is in the US currently.

Especially if you are in a solid Democratic or Republican state your vote is almost worthless in a presidential election. Candidates don't bother campaigning or advertising in most states and it's almost always the same 10 or so swing states that get the vast majority of the advertising and campaigning effort. Weird system in that context - candidates can pretty much ignore large parts of the country and still be in with strong chances of winning.

eire4 · 29-09-2020 5:51pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

Sounds like the crap Bernie came out with during both his failed primaries. It is pure wishful thinking.

The bigger thing to get more people to vote would be to make it easier (e.g., not having to wait for hours in lines) but the GOP does everything it can to make it harder.

Ahh yes legislating in the best economic interest of the vast majority of Americans is "crap" to quote yourself. What a terrible idea doing what is best economically for most people rather then just looking after the wealthy and big business and at best doing little to nothing for the rest or worse actively screwing them.

Totally agree making voting easier should be done in the US such as say making election day a federal holiday, automatic voter registration upon reaching voting age etc. This would be the right thing to do no question.

eire4 · 29-09-2020 5:53pm

namloc1980 wrote: »

Especially if you are in a solid Democratic or Republican state your vote is almost worthless in a presidential election. Candidates don't bother campaigning or advertising in most states and it's almost always the same 10 or so swing states that get the vast majority of the advertising and campaigning effort. Weird system in that context - candidates can pretty much ignore large parts of the country and still be in with strong chances of winning.

No question your right there. Crazy system which makes a persons vote more relevant and important or less so depending on where that person lives.

Foxtrol · 29-09-2020 6:01pm

Best description of what I've seen coming out of Fox News the last few days. Trying to hedge their bets between Biden may barely be able to stay awake and already giving excuses as to why he might perform well.

https://twitter.com/ditzkoff/status/1310971669280952331?s=20

da_miser · 29-09-2020 6:03pm

Joe must be having a bad day if he wont agree to something as simple as a ear piece check.
Could it be we will have car crash TV in a few hours?
https://twitter.com/ebonybowden/status/1310975414878248961

Cody montana · 29-09-2020 6:04pm

The debate is on at 2am.
Pass.

Cody montana · 29-09-2020 6:05pm

da_miser wrote: »

Joe must be having a bad day if he wont agree to something as simple as a ear piece check.
Could it be we will have car crash TV in a few hours?
https://twitter.com/ebonybowden/status/1310975414878248961

Why would he agree to that nonsense?

Timberrrrrrrr · 29-09-2020 6:07pm

da_miser wrote: »

Joe must be having a bad day if he wont agree to something as simple as a ear piece check.
Could it be we will have car crash TV in a few hours?
https://twitter.com/ebonybowden/status/1310975414878248961

Why should he debase himself like that? Will Trump agree to go through the same checks?

gmisk · 29-09-2020 6:10pm

da_miser wrote: »

Joe must be having a bad day if he wont agree to something as simple as a ear piece check.
Could it be we will have car crash TV in a few hours?
https://twitter.com/ebonybowden/status/1310975414878248961

Zero evidence...and her twitter is very pro Trump...nope not buying it

mcmoustache · 29-09-2020 6:18pm

gmisk wrote: »

Zero evidence...and her twitter is very pro Trump...nope not buying it

To be fair, it was originally from FOX who got it from someone familiar with the negotiations.

osarusan · 29-09-2020 6:25pm

Could we be in for something like this?

Foxtrol · 29-09-2020 6:37pm

eire4 wrote: »

Ahh yes legislating in the best economic interest of the vast majority of Americans is "crap" to quote yourself. What a terrible idea doing what is best economically for most people rather then just looking after the wealthy and big business and at best doing little to nothing for the rest or worse actively screwing them.

Totally agree making voting easier should be done in the US such as say making election day a federal holiday, automatic voter registration upon reaching voting age etc. This would be the right thing to do no question.

No, the 'crap' is believing that these new voters will magically appear out of thin air. There is no evidence of this on a national level in the US, hence why Bernie lost twice. Another example is how most GOP voters vote against nearly every area of their own self interests.

Obamacare, for all its faults and not going far enough, was in the best interests of the vast majority of Americans, yet the Democrats were slaughtered for it at the polls.

namloc1980 · 29-09-2020 6:37pm

Jesus the mud is flying already

.

29-09-2020 6:43pm

da_miser wrote: »

Joe must be having a bad day if he wont agree to something as simple as a ear piece check.
Could it be we will have car crash TV in a few hours?
https://twitter.com/ebonybowden/status/1310975414878248961

The NY Post are basically the US equivalent of The Sun but good to see you're getting the conspiracies ready early..

2020 the battle of the septuagenarians - Trump vs Biden, Part 2

Comments