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Customs clamp down on counterfeit jerseys.

  • 04-09-2020 02:04PM
    #1
    Brand_New
    Closed Accounts Posts: 68 ✭✭


    I see boards have a section for an advice on buying replica football jerseys.
    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057635672&page=201

    With the clampdown by customs on such things is there any risk in ordering a replica jersey? Before it was only large ordered that were seized but now there seem to be interest in small orders.

    Is there a difference between replica and counterfeit?

    I'd like to order on but am not comfortable breaking the law.


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Comments

  • #2
    GM228
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    Brand_New wrote: »
    Is there a difference between replica and counterfeit?

    I would think there is a huge difference between replica and counterfeit.

    A replica/copy is to produce an object identical to a given object while counterfeit is to falsely produce what appears to be official or valid.

    Would probably also depend on how an item is marketed, licensing, permissions etc.


  • #3
    bobbyy gee
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,306 ✭✭✭bobbyy gee


    Customs can not check
    Each parcel. They scan it for drugs. If they opened each parcel it would take a year to deliver


  • #4
    GM228
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,922 ✭✭✭GM228


    bobbyy gee wrote: »
    Customs can not check
    Each parcel. They scan it for drugs. If they opened each parcel it would take a year to deliver

    Customs here seize millions of € worth of counterfeit goods each year.

    EU wide there is around €800M worth of counterfeit goods seized by customs per year.


  • #5
    Brand_New
    Closed Accounts Posts: 68 ✭✭Brand_New


    GM228 wrote: »

    A replica/copy is to produce an object identical to a given object while counterfeit is to falsely produce what appears to be official or valid.

    The "replica" of the Manchester United jersey on one of the sites promoted here on boards uses the official Adidas logo.
    Is that legal?

    http://www.sandycn.net/20-21-Man-United-Home-Soccer-Jersey-Shorts-p1453475.html


  • #6
    Samuel T. Cogley
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,684 ✭✭✭✭Samuel T. Cogley


    I'd say no it isn't, but it's been years since I delved into IP law.


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  • #7
    Brand_New
    Closed Accounts Posts: 68 ✭✭Brand_New


    Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »
    I'd say no it isn't, but it's been years since I delved into IP law.

    That's my understanding too.

    But at the same time I do know that boards clamps down very hard on any talk that promotes illegal activity. And the replica jersey is a very long running and very active thread (actually 2 threads as the first one reached the post limit).
    So I can't help but think am misunderstanding.


  • #8
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 38,244 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    A replica jersey is the official thing you buy in a shop.

    These sites sell counterfeits.


  • #9
    Brand_New
    Closed Accounts Posts: 68 ✭✭Brand_New


    Guy:Incognito wrote: »
    A replica jersey is the official thing you buy in a shop.

    These sites sell counterfeits.

    If that's the case why would some of the mods on boards be encouraging discussion on where to buy counterfeit goods?


  • #10
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 38,244 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    Brand_New wrote: »
    If that's the case why would some of the mods on boards be encouraging discussion on where to buy counterfeit goods?

    You'd have to ask them that.


  • #11
    Brand_New
    Closed Accounts Posts: 68 ✭✭Brand_New


    I'm unsure if there is a forum where such a question would be appropriate.


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  • #12
    Victor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,701 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    Brand_New wrote: »
    I'm unsure if there is a forum where such a question would be appropriate.
    Send a private message to the relevant moderators. If necessary, escalate to the relevant admins and then https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=1397


  • #13
    Quantum Erasure
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,614 ✭✭✭Quantum Erasure


    Ah here, 'newly regged' account, coming in telling tales, ruining it for the rest of us....


  • #14
    Carawaystick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,779 ✭✭✭Carawaystick


    Whats the legal basis for revenue taking actual tangible chattels from the owners, because they are similar to others?
    Is it a trademark or copyright infringement? What happens when the copyright expires? the estate of the owner of the tangible thing has been deprived of the use of it, and very likely the state will have destroyed it long before.
    What happens if a trademark was invalidated? Anyone can sell Big Macs because McDonalds lost the trademark. If something with a big mac logo was siezed previously for being counterfeit, who would compensate the owner for their loss?


  • #15
    Brand_New
    Closed Accounts Posts: 68 ✭✭Brand_New


    Carawaystick wrote: »
    What happens if a trademark was invalidated? Anyone can sell Big Macs because McDonalds lost the trademark. If something with a big mac logo was siezed previously for being counterfeit, who would compensate the owner for their loss?

    There was never a unique big mac logo and it was never a valid trademark. The companies(McDonald's) trademark is the golden arches.

    Adidas has a valid trademark and once the counterfeit is seized at the a point in time where it is valid then there is no issue.


    As a matter of interest some posters are now talking about paying import customs duty on these jerseys. I could see there being a legal issue if revenue we to knowingly charge people import tax on counterfeit items.


  • #16
    Silly Gilly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 128 ✭✭Silly Gilly


    Brand_New wrote: »
    There was never a unique big mac logo and it was never a valid trademark. The companies(McDonald's) trademark is the golden arches.

    Adidas has a valid trademark and once the counterfeit is seized at the a point in time where it is valid then there is no issue.


    As a matter of interest some posters are now talking about paying import customs duty on these jerseys. I could see there being a legal issue if revenue we to knowingly charge people import tax on counterfeit items.

    I see you started a thread in Help Desk about this. No surprise about the response you got. This was brought up before and another admin, who is supposedly a laywer (although I believe he got his diploma in a Christmas cracker) no less, dismissed the clear breach of copyright.

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=108842717

    It is just another example of the jokeshop that this site has become under the current administration. Hardly surprising when they are tolerating racists, misogynists, and various alt-right loons that they'd have no issue with a little IP infringment. Woe betide though if you try to advertise your business where it might hurt Boards' bottom line.

    I suggest that if you want to bring this further that you report it to the Premier League. They dont take kindly to their intellectual property being abused. Watch Boards **** themselvelves when the legal letters start arriving!

    https://www.premierleague.com/legal/anti-counterfeiting-programme

    info@backfour.co.uk

    I'll be firing off an email there myself just to spite those equivocating clowns Beasty and hullaballoo.


  • #17
    con747
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,293 ✭✭✭con747


    The replica jerseys are licensed, the counterfeit ones are counterfeit. That is why it is allowed on Boards
    "The main difference between jerseys is that replica jerseys are intended to be made for fans to wear off-field while authentic jerseys are a player issue style, meaning that the authentic football jerseys are the ones that the players actually wear on pitch"

    Don't expect anything from life, just be grateful to be alive.



  • #18
    Quantum Erasure
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,614 ✭✭✭Quantum Erasure


    Are these counterfeit replica, or counterfeit authentic we're talking about? (or authentic replica counterfeit authentic...?)


  • #19
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,486 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    Carawaystick wrote: »
    Whats the legal basis for revenue taking actual tangible chattels from the owners, because they are similar to others? . . .
    Don't quote me, but I think it's Council Regulation 608/2013. The answer to some of the other questions you ask may be in there too.


  • #20
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    From experience, i have found that there is never any issue with getting jerseys in from abroad. i can imagine the volume of light garments is so high, that it would be logistically impossible to check them all. If you order something bulky alright such as Shoes, boots or Runners, you will more than likely have them confiscated.


  • #21
    con747
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,293 ✭✭✭con747


    Quantum Erasure wrote: »
    Are these counterfeit replica, or counterfeit authentic we're talking about? (or authentic replica counterfeit authentic...?)

    There are only three types, Authentic = Players wear while playing. Replica = fans buy to wear (wishing they were playing). Counterfeit = made in a sweat factory somewhere unlicensed unlike the first two.

    Don't expect anything from life, just be grateful to be alive.



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  • #22
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,486 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    con747 wrote: »
    There are only three types, Authentic = Players wear while playing. Replica = fans buy to wear (wishing they were playing). Counterfeit = made in a sweat factory somewhere unlicensed unlike the first two.
    All three types are likely made in a sweat factory. It's the licensing that's the key issue, not the labour conditions.


  • #23
    Brand_New
    Closed Accounts Posts: 68 ✭✭Brand_New


    Do you think that boards helping to facilitate the import of these unlicensed jerseys could cause legal issues for the websites parent company?


  • #24
    con747
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,293 ✭✭✭con747


    Peregrinus wrote: »
    All three types are likely made in a sweat factory. It's the licensing that's the key issue, not the labour conditions.

    Much less chance of a licensed version being made in a sweat factory though.

    Don't expect anything from life, just be grateful to be alive.



  • #25
    Brand_New
    Closed Accounts Posts: 68 ✭✭Brand_New


    con747 wrote: »
    Much less chance of a licensed version being made in a sweat factory though.

    Does that make a difference from a legal point of view?

    What exactly is the legal definition of a sweat factory?
    And is it illegal to import good into Ireland from one?


  • #26
    con747
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,293 ✭✭✭con747


    Brand_New wrote: »
    Does that make a difference from a legal point of view?

    What exactly is the legal definition of a sweat factory?
    And is it illegal to import good into Ireland from one?

    Consult a solicitor.:)

    Don't expect anything from life, just be grateful to be alive.



  • #27
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,486 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    Brand_New wrote: »
    Do you think that boards helping to facilitate the import of these unlicensed jerseys could cause legal issues for the websites parent company?
    Dunno, but I imagine the company has taken advice on that issue.

    My gut feeling is that the risk is not great. It's not (so far as I know) a crime for me to import goods whose manufacture would have required a license but wasn't licensed. The risk I fact is not arrest, charge, conviction, penalty, but simply confiscation of the goods concerned. And if it's not a crime for me to import the goods, I struggle to think that those whose services were engaged in the process - couriers, packaging companies, advertising channels, etc - were committing crimes.

    And, if it were a crime to import the goods or to provide ancillary services, I think you'd have the problem of proving that the importer/service provider knew that the goods concerned (a) needed to be licensed, and (b) werent.


  • #28
    wonski
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,685 ✭✭✭✭wonski


    It is funny actually when they ban people for admitting not paying motor tax or things like that, yet let this counterfeit fest to continue :)

    Of course these are counterfeit as ....

    Similarly you can't provide a link to unlicensed Premier league match stream, but can discuss how to order 12 pounds or whatever "replica" Jersey from same league...


  • #29
    con747
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,293 ✭✭✭con747


    It appears the OP is stirring the proverbial, https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=114547481

    Don't expect anything from life, just be grateful to be alive.



  • #30
    Brand_New
    Closed Accounts Posts: 68 ✭✭Brand_New


    con747 wrote: »
    It appears the OP is stirring the proverbial, https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=114547481

    I was advised in this thread to make that post.


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  • #31
    con747
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,293 ✭✭✭con747


    Brand_New wrote: »
    I was advised in this thread to make that post.

    Leave you to it so.:pac:

    Don't expect anything from life, just be grateful to be alive.



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