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Covid 19 Part XXI-27,908 in ROI (1,777 deaths) 6,647 in NI (559 deaths)(22/08)Read OP

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Comments

  • #6272
    stephenjmcd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,450 ✭✭✭✭stephenjmcd


    The Unbearables wrote: »
    Donnelly coming across very well here making a lot of sense. Stop the house parties folks you aren't helping anyone and prolonging all our misery.
    Is he yeah ?

    https://twitter.com/Philip_Ryan/status/1295830785287753729?s=19


  • #6273
    Lundstram
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,129 ✭✭✭Lundstram


    Redordeadqwwer wrote: »
    All very simple in theory but I'm sure there are a lot of issues with implementing it. Id stay at home, indoors, for 20 days no problem if i knew the old normal was at the end of it.
    Drastic indeed but can we live like this for possibly the next few years? We are 6 months in and folks are suffering - not just financially.

    Put the Gardai to actual use along the NI border.


  • #6274
    Itssoeasy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,153 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    Strumms wrote: »
    Because human nature doesn’t respect boundaries.. also, genuine question as I don’t know, can the government bring in a law that only say... applies in for example...in Co Louth that wouldn’t apply elsewhere ?

    Humans do respect boundaries when it's clear what they are but for whatever reason since the new government have come into power there seems to be a lack of clarity. There is conflicting messges including tonight.

    On the law question I genuinely have no earthly idea if they can or not.


  • #6275
    ACitizenErased
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,760 ✭✭✭✭ACitizenErased


    stephenjmcd wrote: »
    Is he yeah ?

    https://twitter.com/Philip_Ryan/status/1295830785287753729?s=19

    He can’t even get the advice right. F*ck me.


  • #6276
    hmmm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,203 ✭✭✭✭hmmm


    Masala wrote: »
    Any guidance of how to do an online meeting.... would it need an external company to organize or can it be done easily internally. A Zoom wouldn’t suit 60 people trying to diallin....
    Assuming you're not Bank of Ireland or CRH, Zoom can work very well for a small AGM. The host can mute everyone. Participants who want to ask a question can enter in the chat window or raise their hand. There's probably a thread on this somewhere on Boards already.

    There is also a webinar license for Zoom which is more one-way communication.

    People can also dial in to a Zoom meeting if they don't have access to a computer.

    I'm sure the other video conferencing technologies are similar.


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  • #6277
    landofthetree
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,464 ✭✭✭landofthetree


    caveat emptor wrote: »
    https://twitter.com/yaneerbaryam/status/1295712951207440384?s=20

    We were down to around 300 active cases at one stage.

    Now up to 2200+.

    We should have went for 0 cases.

    I suspect the UK and Ireland will end up going for a zero strategy as we face into the winter.


  • #6278
    ChikiChiki
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,949 ✭✭✭ChikiChiki


    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    And four weeks later after your 20 days, youd be in another 20 day 'hard' lockdown. Lather rinse repeat.

    I'd take a month lockdown aswell to be honest. We absolutely butchered this recovery.

    Think we specifically need to learn from the mistakes of the meat factories and direct provision. What an absolute shambles, to think Government agencies were only half arsed about doing their job correctly.

    They can give out about house parties all they want, but we are where we are because of the failure of state authorities to do what they should be doing.


  • #6279
    MickeyLeari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 917 ✭✭✭MickeyLeari


    Masala wrote: »
    Any guidance of how to do an online meeting.... would it need an external company to organize or can it be done easily internally. A Zoom wouldn’t suit 60 people trying to diallin....

    I responded with the relevant legislation and with some advice. I have been on meetings with 500 plus people from many countries on zoom. The key is to control it properly. You can get a zoom account for that number of people for 15 euro for a month with no commitment.

    I would recommend safeguards and to test the system in advance (you can offer a test the day before to participants if they wish to join). It is intuitive and easy but I would suggest the following advice:

    1. Password protect.
    2. Utilise the waiting room
    3. Request people to identify themselves clearly.
    4. Chair controls everything with auto mute.
    5. Utilise the raise flag feature.
    6. Explain how the meeting will work at the outset And be flexible in respect to any issues.


  • #6280
    hmmm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,203 ✭✭✭✭hmmm


    Itssoeasy wrote: »
    Humans do respect boundaries when it's clear what they are but for whatever reason since the new government have come into power there seems to be a lack of clarity. There is conflicting messges including tonight.
    On PT tonight it was said that the strategy was not being communicated, and it's exactly right.

    The government aren't being honest with people. It's likely we will see a vaccine, but it will be mid-2021 probably at the earliest by the time people can get it. They need to be telling people that this will last until then.

    There's a lot of people who thought this was all over, or that it will disappear in a few weeks. The 1918 pandemic kept coming back in waves for 2 years.


  • #6281
    hotmail.com
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,394 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    Until September 13th? Dublin City will be ruined.


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  • #6282
    The Unbearables
    Closed Accounts Posts: 359 ✭✭The Unbearables


    ChikiChiki wrote: »
    I'd take a month lockdown aswell to be honest. We absolutely butchered this recovery.

    Think we specifically need to learn from the mistakes of the meat factories and direct provision. What an absolute shambles, to think Government agencies were only half arsed about doing their job correctly.

    They can give out about house parties all they want, but we are where we are because of the failure of state authorities to do what they should be doing.

    You can't blame the government for everything. Take personal responsibility. Irish people seem unable or unwilling to do this.


  • #6283
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,321 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    caveat emptor wrote: »
    Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

    https://twitter.com/nntaleb/status/1235273803317551105?s=20

    Yes but if you are talking about imposing restrictions on entire populations 'better safe than sorry' and 'just in case' simply isn't good enough. How do you not see that? You cant threaten to enter people's homes based on 'absence of evidence isn't evidence of absence'.


  • #6284
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    MickeyLeari wrote: »
    [Deleted User] wrote: »

    Can you please stop misleading people on respect to the causes of the recent increase. It is not related to travel.

    https://twitter.com/BloombergAsia/status/1292927914409963523?s=20

    Of course it is.

    They have been a new reservoir of infected people
    to cause additional spread. Slowly at first and then quickly. That's how this thing works.

    How's Finland doing?

    Are they following our policy?


  • #6285
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    ChikiChiki wrote: »
    I'd take a month lockdown aswell to be honest. We absolutely butchered this recovery.

    Think we specifically need to learn from the mistakes of the meat factories and direct provision. What an absolute shambles, to think Government agencies were only half arsed about doing their job correctly.

    They can give out about house parties all they want, but we are where we are because of the failure of state authorities to do what they should be doing.

    You won't get to 0 for long. If it all. And if you did, itll return. And if it does, you're hard 20 days lockdown again, and again, and again. It's been tried, it doesn't work.

    The UK is having more flu and pneumonia deaths than covid, all while undergoing similar restrictions on life. It would seem that influenza and not covid might require more attention right now.


  • #6286
    Lundstram
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,129 ✭✭✭Lundstram


    timmy_mallet wrote: »
    And four weeks later after your 20 days, youd be in another 20 day 'hard' lockdown. Lather rinse repeat.
    No we wouldn't, did you actually read the post? The virus was imported. Quench it with a hard lockdown for 20 days - month then seal borders.

    This flip flopping bullsh1t of restrictions and local lockdowns is just kicking the can down the road. We are a long way away from a vaccine, throw in another year for each and every one of us to actually get it. Pie in the sky stuff thinking a vaccine will come soon and save us all.


  • #6287
    Limpy
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 1,105 ✭✭✭Limpy


    Lundstram wrote: »
    I'd gladly take a 20 day hard lockdown over this current nonsensical approach. Hard lockdown then close borders, tight. Give people 7 days notice to get home or stay out. No exceptions.

    You must be getting your Pup onto your bank account. No worries


  • #6288
    ChikiChiki
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,949 ✭✭✭ChikiChiki


    The Unbearables wrote: »
    You can't blame the government for everything. Take personal responsibility. Irish people seem unable or unwilling to do this.

    Where did the clusters start?

    Who the **** was supposed to checking in on the meat factories?

    Who the **** is supposed to be overseeing labour conditions in these factories?

    And why is some of this labour not paying into the Irish tax system therefore making them not entitled to our Covid schemes.

    Absolute failure by the state

    Cop onto yourself.


  • #6289
    Limpy
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 1,105 ✭✭✭Limpy


    Lundstram wrote: »
    No we wouldn't, did you actually read the post? The virus was imported. Quench it with a hard lockdown for 20 days - month then seal borders.

    This flip flopping bullsh1t of restrictions and local lockdowns is just kicking the can down the road. We are a long way away from a vaccine, throw in another year for each and every one of us to actually get it. Pie in the sky stuff thinking a vaccine will come soon and save us all.

    Why don't you and the vunerable quarentine from society. Let us keep the country afloat.


  • #6290
    Lundstram
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,129 ✭✭✭Lundstram


    Limpy wrote: »
    You must be getting your Pup onto your bank account. No worries
    Nope I've never once claimed anything off the social welfare. Worked all through this. Saved loads recently so I'd comfortably survive a month with no income.


  • #6291
    peasant
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,819 ✭✭✭✭peasant


    Here's an idea:

    While giving the guards the power to stop house parties they should also be given the powers to close any and all factories (including meat and food factories) that don't provide employment according to the guidelines and/or have an active case on the floor / in the office. Shut them right down there and then, no questions asked.
    That might incentivise the meat plants et all to get their greedy act cleaned up pronto.


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  • #6292
    theballz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,272 ✭✭✭theballz


    Where do people think we really went wrong with this?


  • #6293
    timmy_mallet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,165 ✭✭✭timmy_mallet


    Lundstram wrote: »
    No we wouldn't, did you actually read the post? The virus was imported. Quench it with a hard lockdown for 20 days - month then seal borders.

    This flip flopping bullsh1t of restrictions and local lockdowns is just kicking the can down the road. We are a long way away from a vaccine, throw in another year for each and every one of us to actually get it. Pie in the sky stuff thinking a vaccine will come soon and save us all.

    I'd argue its pie in the sky to think 0 covid globally is possible, even with a vaccine.


  • #6294
    Turkish1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 273 ✭✭Turkish1


    hmmm wrote: »
    I don't disagree with the rest of your post, but I notice this thought that fatigue is setting in from many posters.

    The virus doesn't care if we're fatigued. If our hospitals get over-run by new cases, we're in big trouble and the government will have to introduce more stringent measures - up to and including enforced lockdowns, closing businesses etc if required. There is no choice here, it will never be an option to simply let the virus cut through the country.

    It's up to all of us to do our bit while we have the opportunity. It's much better than the alternative.

    But what's the plan here - the vaccine could quite realistically be another ,12+months away (if we ever get a vaccine). Have we another year+ of this jumping in and out of full/partial lockdown/restrictions.

    At some point we need to actually learn to live with this - work from home where possible, good hygiene practices, were masks, socially distance etc.. this crap of not being able to see your friends/family members for weeks on end while you have 40,GAA/RUGBY lads hopping off each other etc..

    The whole thing is just a nonsensical and inconsistent approach. This inconsistent approach is not going to get people to row in behind it.

    I have a christening at the weekend which is generally a great family occasion. I would have c. 13adults and 8kids in my garden for food/drinks which can now not go ahead. Yet I can play a GAA match on that very same evening with 40-50 people in close contact.


  • #6295
    Turkish1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 273 ✭✭Turkish1


    peasant wrote: »
    Here's an idea:

    While giving the guards the power to stop house parties they should also be given the powers to close any and all factories (including meat and food factories) that don't provide employment according to the guidelines and/or have an active case on the floor / in the office. Shut them right down there and then, no questions asked.
    That might incentivise the meat plants et all to get their greedy act cleaned up pronto.

    Maybe give the guards the right to just come in and search your house top to bottom at the drop of a hat without any reason - just cause, why not. Sure there could be people hiding under the beds


  • #6296
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Lundstram wrote: »
    No we wouldn't, did you actually read the post? The virus was imported. Quench it with a hard lockdown for 20 days - month then seal borders.

    This flip flopping bullsh1t of restrictions and local lockdowns is just kicking the can down the road. We are a long way away from a vaccine, throw in another year for each and every one of us to actually get it. Pie in the sky stuff thinking a vaccine will come soon and save us all.

    https://twitter.com/BloombergAsia/status/1292927914409963523?s=20

    Someone with the same opinion.

    Does the government think we can SD for 2 years?

    Another lockdown and hopefully the penny will drop with govt/health officials our border controls were the problem and they will apologise to us for squandering our good position in June.


  • #6297
    caveat emptor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,134 ✭✭✭caveat emptor


    caveat emptor wrote: »
    Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

    https://twitter.com/nntaleb/status/1235273803317551105?s=20
    CalamariFritti wrote: »
    Yes but if you are talking about imposing restrictions on entire populations 'better safe than sorry' and 'just in case' simply isn't good enough. How do you not see that? You cant threaten to enter people's homes based on 'absence of evidence isn't evidence of absence'.

    Another nice strawman. Going into people's home without a warrant is unconstitutional as anyone would know.

    But I digress. We are talking about evidence that the virus is not "travel related".

    Feel free to answer the questions or bring up a totally unrelated point.
    • How the fvck did it get here?
    • Why did I stay at home for best part of two months
    • Why weren't people arriving checked for the virus after our healthcare system
      struggled to deal with those who already contracted it?

    See you this time next year for the same conversation.


  • #6298
    Itssoeasy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,153 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    hmmm wrote: »
    On PT tonight it was said that the strategy was not being communicated, and it's exactly right.

    The government aren't being honest with people. It's likely we will see a vaccine, but it will be mid-2021 probably at the earliest by the time people can get it. They need to be telling people that this will last until then.

    There's a lot of people who thought this was all over, or that it will disappear in a few weeks. The 1918 pandemic kept coming back in waves for 2 years.

    It's been communicated but in a way that's become less clear and again I don't know why that is. It's not good to see journalists on twitter tweeting about being able to do X but not Y and not understanding it and taking about contradictions. Confusion isn't good.

    I think people want to feel there is light at the end of the tunnel and there was and the vast majority of people in this country were(and still are) adhering to the guidelines and also using their own judgement on whether they felt safe or not to go places and do things and I'm sorry but how was the meat factories outbreak allowed to happen when we had been doing so well ? That's what is bugging me because as a country we stepped up and did and are doing our bit. Anyway that's it for me tonight.


  • #6299
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,690 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    theballz wrote: »
    Where do people think we really went wrong with this?

    keeping borders open
    Not protecting nursing homes
    No enforced quarantine


  • #6300
    coastwatch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 909 ✭✭✭coastwatch


    Lundstram wrote: »
    I'd gladly take a 20 day hard lockdown over this current nonsensical approach. Hard lockdown then close borders, tight. Give people 7 days notice to get home or stay out. No exceptions.

    Would you be happy with that 20 day lockdown every 3, 6, 9 months to reset to zero?
    Thats what it would take.
    I think a more viable option is acceptance of the new normal, with long term restrictions and changes to individual behaviors, in addition to a "whack a mole" approach to surpressing outbreaks.


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  • #6301
    WoollyRedHat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,462 ✭✭✭✭WoollyRedHat


    hmmm wrote: »
    Assuming you're not Bank of Ireland or CRH, Zoom can work very well for a small AGM. The host can mute everyone. Participants who want to ask a question can enter in the chat window or raise their hand. There's probably a thread on this somewhere on Boards already.

    There is also a webinar license for Zoom which is more one-way communication.

    People can also dial in to a Zoom meeting if they don't have access to a computer.

    I'm sure the other video conferencing technologies are similar.

    I would advise against use of Zoom if you're discussing anything of a sensitive nature from speaking to people involved in industry. Most of the big private companies are using likes of Teams. A lot of Public Sector organisations/ departments are using Zoom, surprise surprise.


This discussion has been closed.
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