Masks

Loafing Oaf · 05-08-2020 01:24PM

No: I don't care enough

Kendrick Jolly Ibex wrote: »

it is a lot of time and energy for very little gain.
That is what you are doing when you a wearing a mask.

Wearing a mask requires the investment of a lot of time and energy?

v638sg7k1a92bx · 05-08-2020 01:25PM

robinph wrote: »

What are the environmental, societal and economic costs of wearing a mask?

Re the environment, if people take their own rubbish home with them and dispose of it properly then wheres the problem? Probably more waste generated from takeaway coffee chains suspending re-usable cups usage for the last few months.

The impact on society could potentially be down to deaf people who need to lip read not being able to communicate properly, but in that case asking someone to remove their mask would be the solution, don't think it's an insurmountable task to make people aware of the need to do such things.

The economy is surely going to be doing better if more people are able to get out and about and into shops and places of work and spending money? There is also a new cottage industry of people sewing together masks for people, that on it's own isn't going to save the world economy but it does get some people who might otherwise have zero income able to earn again.

I'm not sure how the comparison btw coffee cups is relevant, people are drinking less coffee so we can offset the rubbish generated by coffee cups with the rubbish generated by wearing masks? If only it was that easy to get people to properly dispose of their litter, why has nobody ever thought of that? We already we see masks lying around, not to mention transportation, packaging, manufacturing. Why do we need to add more rubbish to the environment than we already have.

The impact on society will be social interaction btw people wearing a mask to cover their face, teachers and kids in classrooms with masks on. colleagues in offices with masks. We pick up all types social interactions from facial expressions. Sitting in a restaurant with a mask on, where does it end?

robinph · 05-08-2020 01:26PM

No: I don't care enough

...or to put it another way. Wearing a mask is a method of faking the herd immunity principle. By everyone sticking together and wearing masks, reducing the rate of infections by just a tiny amount each, that then protects those who are most at risk and saves the vast majority of the population of the herd from infection.

In the absence of a vaccine and with the need for the economy to get going again the minimal ask for the benefit of all is that you stick something over you mouth (and nose).

v638sg7k1a92bx · 05-08-2020 01:28PM

xhomelezz wrote: »

Well government finally sorted all your doubts. You have to wear one in retail from Monday. That's a simple fact. Hopefully followed and supported by nice fine on the spot, if you don't wear one.

Hopefully you're right and mandatory masks will solve the problem but if they don't and cases increase, will you change your position that wearing a mask doesn't reduce the number of cases?

is_that_so · 05-08-2020 01:31PM

No: other

robinph wrote: »

...or to put it another way. Wearing a mask is a method of faking the herd immunity principle. By everyone sticking together and wearing masks, reducing the rate of infections by just a tiny amount each, that then protects those who are most at risk and saves the vast majority of the population of the herd from infection.

In the absence of a vaccine and with the need for the economy to get going again the minimal ask for the benefit of all is that you stick something over you mouth (and nose).

I thought the idea was to stay apart?! Gotta say I find government regulations much more honest than this happy clappy stuff. Most people don't respond to it at all. Ultimately we really don't care that much about others, we just want the virus to go away.

v638sg7k1a92bx · 05-08-2020 01:31PM

robinph wrote: »

...or to put it another way. Wearing a mask is a method of faking the herd immunity principle. By everyone sticking together and wearing masks, reducing the rate of infections by just a tiny amount each, that then protects those who are most at risk and saves the vast majority of the population of the herd from infection.

In the absence of a vaccine and with the need for the economy to get going again the minimal ask for the benefit of all is that you stick something over you mouth (and nose).

But it's a pointless exercise. If the government asked you to wear a paper bag over your head an poke two eye holes would you do it because it would have the same impact?

joeguevara · 05-08-2020 01:32PM

Kendrick Jolly Ibex wrote: »

But it's a pointless exercise. If the government asked you to wear a paper bag over your head an poke two eye holes would you do it because it would have the same impact?

Stop making stuff up. Stick to facts. (I know that's difficult bearing in mind your position).

v638sg7k1a92bx · 05-08-2020 01:33PM

joeguevara wrote: »

Stop making stuff up. Stick to facts. (I know that's difficult bearing in mind your position).

If you wore a paper bag over your head and it covered your mouth, how is that different to wearing a piece of cloth over your mouth?

joeguevara · 05-08-2020 01:35PM

Kendrick Jolly Ibex wrote: »

If you wore a paper bag over your head and it covered your mouth, how is that different to wearing a piece of cloth over your mouth?

Stick to facts and stop making stuff up. I know that's difficult for you bearing in mind your position on this matter.

robinph · 05-08-2020 01:37PM

No: I don't care enough

Kendrick Jolly Ibex wrote: »

I'm not sure how the comparison btw coffee cups is relevant, people are drinking less coffee so we can offset the rubbish generated by coffee cups with the rubbish generated by wearing masks? If only it was that easy to get people to properly dispose of their litter, why has nobody ever thought of that? We already we see masks lying around, not to mention transportation, packaging, manufacturing. Why do we need to add more rubbish to the environment than we already have.

The impact on society will be social interaction btw people wearing a mask to cover their face, teachers and kids in classrooms with masks on. colleagues in offices with masks. We pick up all types social interactions from facial expressions. Sitting in a restaurant with a mask on, where does it end?

So because people can't pick up litter and take it home with them you'd rather we didn't take a very simple precaution to stop the spread of a virus.

Which is the easier problem to solve and to police? Getting people to pick up after themselves and fine them for littering, or spot who has the virus 5 days before they show symptoms and tell them to isolate at home?

v638sg7k1a92bx · 05-08-2020 01:37PM

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Wearing a mask requires the investment of a lot of time and energy?

How much time have you spend on boards and how much energy have I spent trying to explain common sense? Father Ted explain the cows to Dougal comes to mind (I'm Father Ted and you're Dougal btw)

How much conflict and arguments and office procedures will have to changed because a handful of employees won't go back to work until masks are mandatory. A lot of people are reveling in the disruption of all this so they can drag out going back to work for a few weeks.

v638sg7k1a92bx · 05-08-2020 01:38PM

robinph wrote: »

So because people can't pick up litter and take it home with them you'd rather we didn't take a very simple precaution to stop the spread of a virus.

Which is the easier problem to solve and to police? Getting people to pick up after themselves and fine them for littering, or spot who has the virus 5 days before they show symptoms and tell them to isolate at home?

If you can solve the problem of littering that easily then I will change my position of masks.

v638sg7k1a92bx · 05-08-2020 01:40PM

joeguevara wrote: »

Stick to facts and stop making stuff up. I know that's difficult for you bearing in mind your position on this matter.

You can keep repeating the same post or copy and paste it if you want but all you're saying is "I like masks, I've spent too much time advocating masks that I cannot change my mind because I might look foolish"

Loafing Oaf · 05-08-2020 01:40PM

No: I don't care enough

Kendrick Jolly Ibex wrote: »

(I'm Father Ted and you're Dougal btw)

Everybody posting on covid forums thinks that

v638sg7k1a92bx · 05-08-2020 01:41PM

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Everybody posting on covid forums thinks that

They think you're Dougal?

robinph · 05-08-2020 01:41PM

No: I don't care enough

Kendrick Jolly Ibex wrote: »

But it's a pointless exercise. If the government asked you to wear a paper bag over your head an poke two eye holes would you do it because it would have the same impact?

If the paper bag was there for the purpose of protecting us from some new alien space ray that was trying to wipe us all out and any bare skin exposed to the sky would mean you are fried then it would probably seem like a good idea and one worth doing if you wanted to leave the house.

But that's not the case, we are just being asked to cover out mouth and nose when entering enclosed spaces and at pretty much zero impact to ourselves to do so but with a potential massive impact on reducing the spread of a deadly virus that nobody knows they have until a week too late.

weldoninhio · 05-08-2020 01:41PM

No: I will wait for the HSE to recommend

Kendrick Jolly Ibex wrote: »

If you wore a paper bag over your head and it covered your mouth, how is that different to wearing a piece of cloth over your mouth?

Valid point, it would do the exact same job.

joeguevara · 05-08-2020 01:42PM

Kendrick Jolly Ibex wrote: »

You can keep repeating the same post or copy and paste it if you want but all you're saying is "I like masks, I've spent too much time advocating masks that I cannot change my mind because I might look foolish"

I will follow expert advice when backed by facts and statistics. When that changes I will change. Write that down and put it in your pocket. Read it twice a day and hopefully you will learn from it.

v638sg7k1a92bx · 05-08-2020 01:43PM

robinph wrote: »

If the paper bag was there for the purpose of protecting us from some new alien space ray that was trying to wipe us all out and any bare skin exposed to the sky would mean you are fried then it would probably seem like a good idea and one worth doing if you wanted to leave the house.

But that's not the case, we are just being asked to cover out mouth and nose when entering enclosed spaces and at pretty much zero impact to ourselves to do so but with a potential massive impact on reducing the spread of a deadly virus that nobody knows they have until a week too late.

But it doesn't have a massive impact. Look at Spain, mandatory face masks for weeks and there has been increases in cases and communities have been shut down.

v638sg7k1a92bx · 05-08-2020 01:43PM

joeguevara wrote: »

I will follow expert advice when backed by facts and statistics. When that changes I will change. Write that down and put it in your pocket. Read it twice a day and hopefully you will learn from it.

Doctors differ and patients die. I consider the opinion of experts, many of whom disagree including WHO and CDC up to 3 months ago and I make my own decisions. I don't blindly follow what I'm told.

joeguevara · 05-08-2020 01:44PM

Kendrick Jolly Ibex wrote: »

Doctors differ and patients die

Your not a doctor. What you say will mean more patients die. Thanks for finally accepting it.

robinph · 05-08-2020 01:47PM

No: I don't care enough

Kendrick Jolly Ibex wrote: »

If you can solve the problem of littering that easily then I will change my position of masks.

Well 250,000 people were fined for littering in the UK in 2018.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/aug/17/private-firms-issue-86-of-councils-250000-fines-for-dropping-litter

How many people are you able to spot as having Covid19 before they have symptoms?

odyssey06 · 05-08-2020 01:47PM

Kendrick Jolly Ibex wrote: »

But it's a pointless exercise. If the government asked you to wear a paper bag over your head an poke two eye holes would you do it because it would have the same impact?

If you are building a straw man you need to do this or the straw brain falls out of the straw man's head.

Meanwhile, back in the real world, the government have not asked us to do this but instead are asking us to take the steps recommended by health bodies such as the CDC and our own NPHET and wear masks and face coverings to limit risks of transmission of covid-19 when in enclosed public places.

John O.Groats · 05-08-2020 01:49PM

Yes: surgical

GT89 wrote: »

It's not the Irish govt. it's a globalist agenda coming rich and powerful people like George Soros and Bill Gates which the Irish govt. are just puppet on a string for

What evidence do you have for this claim ?

joeguevara · 05-08-2020 01:51PM

Kendrick Jolly Ibex wrote: »

Doctors differ and patients die. I consider the opinion of experts, many of whom disagree including WHO and CDC up to 3 months ago and I make my own decisions. I don't blindly follow what I'm told.

Nice ninja edits. Ok, so show me the opinion of experts and why the new evidence that shows that they are wrong is incorrect. People will respect you more if you try and back yourself up.

Loafing Oaf · 05-08-2020 01:52PM

No: I don't care enough

John O.Groats wrote: »

What evidence do you have for this claim ?

The incontrovertible kind, provided by THE VOICES IN HIS HEAD

odyssey06 · 05-08-2020 01:53PM

Kendrick Jolly Ibex wrote: »

Doctors differ and patients die. I consider the opinion of experts, many of whom disagree including WHO and CDC up to 3 months ago and I make my own decisions. I don't blindly follow what I'm told.

When you are driving a car do you only drive looking in the rear view mirror?
That makes as much sense as this.

And more patients would die if doctors didn't respond and learn from the data and improve and progress their approach.

You obviously aren't considering the opinion of experts with this ridiculous 'argument'.
Closing your mind off to new evidence is a declaration of ignorance.
Locking in your response based on outdated information is a declaration of ignorance.

One of the capabilities of experts is to accumulate and process new data and update their understanding of a problem based on that.

xhomelezz · 05-08-2020 01:54PM

Yes: valved

Kendrick Jolly Ibex wrote: »

Hopefully you're right and mandatory masks will solve the problem but if they don't and cases increase, will you change your position that wearing a mask doesn't reduce the number of cases?

Nope I won't change my position on wearing masks, they proven to limit spread of infections right at the source, which is mouth and nose. If the cases will keep increasing significantly, the problem will be somewhere else.

joeguevara · 05-08-2020 01:54PM

odyssey06 wrote: »

When you are driving a car do you only drive looking in the rear view mirror?
That makes as much sense as this.

And more patients would die if doctors didn't respond and learn from the data and improve and progress their approach.

You obviously aren't considering the opinion of experts with this ridiculous 'argument'.
Closing your mind off to new evidence is a declaration of ignorance.
Locking in your response based on outdated information is a declaration of ignorance.

One of the capabilities of experts is to accumulate and process new data and update their understanding of a problem based on that.

HOLD ON A SECOND - ARE YOU SAYING I SHOULDN'T BE USING LEECHES AND BLOODLETTING?

EagererBeaver · 05-08-2020 01:55PM

Yes: homemade

Kendrick Jolly Ibex wrote: »

But it doesn't have a massive impact. Look at Spain, mandatory face masks for weeks and there has been increases in cases and communities have been shut down.

The mandatory mask wearing in Spain came in AS A RESULT of the number of cases increasing. Their introduction and mandatory status is down to each autonomous community too, so it's not true to say it's been the case for weeks "in Spain".

Masks

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