How will schools be able to go back in September?

lawred2 wrote: »

We had two completely different experiences with our lads' teachers. Same school only one year apart.

One teacher doing very detailed lesson plans, daily personalised feedback and the odd recorded session for all.

The other, a weekly week list on a Monday and and as quick as could be done review on a Friday.

One neighbor sent a request for a little help with Irish (she's not natively Irish).. just a ten minute session on how to pronounce words etc... Got told in no uncertain terms that that was never happening. Told that the teacher had to prioritize her own kids and that enough time was already taken up doing the lesson plan.

These are all teachers in the one school. The response was not remotely close to uniform and seemed to be left up to the teachers themselves to decide how much they wanted to engage.

The teachers on here will tell you that is all perfectly acceptable.

Jim_Hodge wrote: »

FYP.

I would suggest *most* of the teachers on here would say that’s perfectly acceptable.

But let’s see if I’m wrong. We’ll know by the number of teachers who reply saying it’s not acceptable. I’ll be counting!

Btw, it’s zero so far ...

Mod: @teachinggal123 - quit it with the soapboxing and persistent repeated questions.

teachinggal123 wrote: »

Can you point to where I said a majority of teachers did nothing?

Certainly.


http://https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2058071593&page=23


post no 342

Teachers are claiming “most” of them are working very hard. From my experience this is simply not true. Parents experience on this thread also not supporting this.

SOME teachers are working hard. A very large majority are not, and a significant minority are doing nothing at all.

teachinggal123 wrote: »

In fairness, I should be able to reply to this.

This quote does not show me saying the vast majority of teachers are doing nothing. I very clearly say “a significant minority” are doing nothing.

It’s not fair that I am getting personally attacked without the ability to defend myself. I have started to report posts personally attacking me ... let’s see what happens.

If a large majority are not working hard and a significant minority are doing nothing with only some working hard then the overall inference is that the majority of teachers did not do their job to an appropriate standard.

As an aside I really resent that you slate teachers for not doing their job , pulling their weight etc etc and anytime posters respond to your posts you frame it as a personal attack on you. I am not personally attacking you I am responding to your own request.

I will not be engaging with you further as 1. it only pulls the thread off topic and 2. I have absolutely no time for those who pull the victim card ( not your first attempt either) when they are called on what they post.

am_zarathustra wrote: »

For the parents on here, would it be better in Secondary to have

a) Week on week off
b) Half days every day
c) Three days roughly a week

I don't have kids myself so I'm just wondering what parents think would suit best if a full return isn't possible in every school. I know this will be much trickier at Primary level and will have a larger knock-on effect of parents there!

My gut feeling would be half days but I can see the advantage of say Monday, Wednesday, Friday too

Personally I would prefer half days as children are at least in school every day and I think every day even if a half day would keep children in a routine much better than the other options. However it would be a logistical nightmare for parents if you factor in siblings in the same school allocated to different times or siblings in primary. That’s why I think we will see a full return.

Jumping in to give my 2 cents as a primary teacher.

I think primary schools will be back full time in September (I do not agree with this, but this is what will happen). Classes of 28 children (national average) will be told that social distancing doesn't matter, and each class will be within a pod. Teachers will be advised to limit contact with one another. The class teacher will be responsible for making sure children are properly washing their hands and sanitizing on a regular basis. The class teacher will be responsible for ensuring that children practice proper sneeze/coughing etiquette. The class teacher will be responsible for ensuring that children stay within their pod during yard duty (in larger schools, where there are too many classes for each to have individualized yard time). The class teacher will be responsible for sourcing additional materials to ensure children do not share resources (particularly in infant classes with Aistear etc.). The class teacher will be responsible for a myriad of other things on top of their current responsibilities. All this because the INTO will not stand up and take a hard stance for their members safety, the way the ASTI have.

If I had a choice, I would have half classes on a Thursday-Wednesday basis. The children would then be in school 2/3 days every week. Supplementary revision material could be sent home during the week off. This would allow for more in depth discussion and teaching, with a lot less time being spent daily on hand washing. It would allow for specific areas of difficulty to be targeted to a greater extent, as you will not have to manage the health and safety protocols of 28 children every minute of the day.

We, as teacher, are now going to suffer for the governments lack of investment in education over the last 10-20 years. With the largest class sizes in Europe, we cannot social distance the way others can. With a lack of investment in infrastructure, we do not have the ventilation or access to facilities that other countries do. But that as moot, as long as the children of this country have a babysitter. Make no mistake, that is what this year will be. Extra time given to 28 children hand washing 4-5 times daily, sanitizing, ringing home when children are (and they ARE) sent in sick. Curriculum and teaching time will be lost to these basics.

GazzaL wrote: »

It'd be best if they went back full-time.

Best for who?

Icantthinkof1 wrote: »

Yes they were sent home on the day the school closed with majority of their books. I collected the remainder of them a couple of weeks later (primary school)
The tone of your posts are suggestive that you don’t believe my experience?

I had the exact same experience. One email sent on a monday morning listing the topics to be covered and the pages in the books to be done. We were asked not to send completed work back to the teachers. No worksheets prepared, teaching notes, videos etc sent to help us parents etc. - we were just given the page numbers to be completed in the books. Parents were asked to collect the books from the school at the end of March. I would estimate the email took about half an hour of the teachers time per week.

thenetherrealm wrote: »

Jumping in to give my 2 cents as a primary teacher.

I think primary schools will be back full time in September (I do not agree with this, but this is what will happen). Classes of 28 children (national average) will be told that social distancing doesn't matter, and each class will be within a pod. Teachers will be advised to limit contact with one another. The class teacher will be responsible for making sure children are properly washing their hands and sanitizing on a regular basis. The class teacher will be responsible for ensuring that children practice proper sneeze/coughing etiquette. The class teacher will be responsible for ensuring that children stay within their pod during yard duty (in larger schools, where there are too many classes for each to have individualized yard time). The class teacher will be responsible for sourcing additional materials to ensure children do not share resources (particularly in infant classes with Aistear etc.). The class teacher will be responsible for a myriad of other things on top of their current responsibilities. All this because the INTO will not stand up and take a hard stance for their members safety, the way the ASTI have.

If I had a choice, I would have half classes on a Thursday-Wednesday basis. The children would then be in school 2/3 days every week. Supplementary revision material could be sent home during the week off. This would allow for more in depth discussion and teaching, with a lot less time being spent daily on hand washing. It would allow for specific areas of difficulty to be targeted to a greater extent, as you will not have to manage the health and safety protocols of 28 children every minute of the day.

We, as teacher, are now going to suffer for the governments lack of investment in education over the last 10-20 years. With the largest class sizes in Europe, we cannot social distance the way others can. With a lack of investment in infrastructure, we do not have the ventilation or access to facilities that other countries do. But that as moot, as long as the children of this country have a babysitter. Make no mistake, that is what this year will be. Extra time given to 28 children hand washing 4-5 times daily, sanitizing, ringing home when children are (and they ARE) sent in sick. Curriculum and teaching time will be lost to these basics.

In all fairness we are in difficult times and many workers in retail and hospitals and hospitality , in hairdressers etc have extra work . The cleaning and organisation in shops and small businesses has increased for employees . It is an abnormal time so we must all pull together

thenetherrealm wrote: »

I know, I am just saying it will take away from teaching time. A hairdresser asking one client to sanitize their hands coming in is different to a teacher lining 28 6 year old children a minimum of 6 times a day (morning, before they eat small break, after small yard, before they eat big break, after big yard, before they go home) to ensure they have all sanitized will take a substantial amount of time. Add to that each time they go to the bathroom, and it will take even more time.



I just think, if we are looking at it educationally, week on week off would be the best option. However, education is not what the government is concerned about. Aesthetics and (inter)national appeal is what matters to them most.

I understand , but so be it . In difficult times some things have to give .

thenetherrealm wrote: »

I disagree. The education of our children should not have to give.

Half classes, more specialized teaching, revision materials for the week off.

Not full classes for parental convenience, increased and unnecessary safety risks for teachers, SNAs, children and parents, and less education due to the ridiculous amount of sanitizing.


This is my opinion. As I said previously, the government will go with full classes for national and international appeal. I just disagree with it.

Of course education should not have to give but these are not ordinary times . We have to work with what we have right now .
Elective surgery should not have to give either but unfortunately it did due to circumstances

Icantthinkof1 wrote: »

I really hope full size classes don’t return for full days in September
I would much prefer smaller class sizes even if it meant they lose out on some days in school and return on a part time basis as something is better than nothing.
I don’t agree with the comment that schools are used as a babysitting service as a lot of parents who work during the weekdays don’t just clock off at 2/3pm they usually have a childminder employed to drop and collect their children to& from school

Many more rely on after schools in child care facilities that also have issues with full opening and are geared up for that purpose, not minding children for full days.

Jim_Hodge wrote: »

Many more rely on after schools in child care facilities that also have issues with full opening and are geared up for that purpose, not minding children for full days.

That’s true I forgot about the after-schools service; that’s a minefield in itself as it consists of the mixing of all classes& even different schools

lulublue22 wrote: »

Fair enough but that is not how the narrative around returning to school is framed. It’s framed in terms of preventing educational disadvantage. The amount of time in primary that will need to be given over to sanitisation and respiratory etiquette daily will be significant. Every day five days a week - it will have a significant impact on curriculum delivery. If the gov where serious about preventing educational disadvantage they would be looking at ways of maximising teaching time and diminishing sanitation. Less children in a pod at the one time would mean less time spent sanitising. There is a big difference in organising 15 children to organising 30 children. Children may be physically spending less time in the building but maximising access to the curriculum.

I understand , i too would wish that everything was as before but its not . What do you suggest that would make it easier and yet have children in the classroom ?
Having them in half a week will be extremely difficult to organise in my opinion
Teachers in the classroom all week with no childcare for their own kids . Parents juggling work and school . Siblings in on different days maybe . It would be very difficult all round for both parents and for teachers