Cycling on paths and other cycling issues (updated title)

ewc78 · 21-07-2020 12:40PM

TaurenDruid wrote: »

https://twitter.com/_youhadonejob1/status/1284563453462618113

"At the end of the day, nobody was hurt."

Reminds me of this guy

https://youtu.be/PxkPNykaMA0

Spook_ie · 21-07-2020 12:53PM

07Lapierre wrote: »

The point is cars do rollover and head injuries are much more common in car accidents than bike accidents. (It was previously stated that motorists don’t need helmets because they have seat belts/ airbags etc.)

Good to see you advocating ridding the world of "standard" bicycles and pushing for these

https://www.goodnewsnetwork.org/bicycle-with-roll-cage-could-save-your-life-in-a-car-crash/

Imagine the number of cyclist deaths and injuries we could save, even more with wearing helmets

TaurenDruid · 21-07-2020 12:53PM

ewc78 wrote: »

Reminds me of this guy
https://youtu.be/PxkPNykaMA0

Maybe if the traffic light had been wearing hi viz the cyclist might have noticed it?

SeanW · 21-07-2020 01:03PM

07Lapierre wrote: »

The point is cars do rollover and head injuries are much more common in car accidents than bike accidents. (It was previously stated that motorists don’t need helmets because they have seat belts/ airbags etc.)

More common than is not the same as common.

I doubt it's common at all for a motorist to suffer a head injury where the car's structural design, a seat belt and airbag are literally of no use whatsoever but a little plastic helmet would have made all the difference? In fact, I'd suggest it's rare.

Thargor wrote: »

Well said, imagine taking pleasure from reading a story about an old man getting knocked down and killed then gleefully reposting it in this thread to make some idiotic anti-cycling point? Sad...

Umm ... have you read literally any of this thread? Cyclists using other people's misfortune to push an anti-motorist agenda has been pretty much S.O.P.

But hey, I'm sure if Andy had his way and motorists had to get out of their cars to push "beg" buttons at every junction, the cyclist might have looked where he was going and not killed the pedestrian. :rolleyes:

07Lapierre · 21-07-2020 01:14PM

Spook_ie wrote: »

Good to see you advocating ridding the world of "standard" bicycles and pushing for these

https://www.goodnewsnetwork.org/bicycle-with-roll-cage-could-save-your-life-in-a-car-crash/

Imagine the number of cyclist deaths and injuries we could save, even more with wearing helmets

Yeah. That’s exactly what I’m pushing for

07Lapierre · 21-07-2020 01:18PM

SeanW wrote: »

More common than is not the same as common.

I doubt it's common at all for a motorist to suffer a head injury where the car's structural design, a seat belt and airbag are literally of no use whatsoever but a little plastic helmet would have made all the difference? In fact, I'd suggest it's rare.

Umm ... have you read literally any of this thread? Cyclists using other people's misfortune to push an anti-motorist agenda has been pretty much S.O.P.

But hey, I'm sure if Andy had his way and motorists had to get out of their cars to push "beg" buttons at every junction, the cyclist might have looked where he was going and not killed the pedestrian. :rolleyes:

Agree plastic hats are not very effective, yet the RSA and Co. Keep pedalling this ****e to cyclists. Go figure eh?

You doubt head injuries are common in car accidents? Really?

SeanW · 21-07-2020 01:29PM

07Lapierre wrote: »

Agree plastic hats are not very effective, yet the RSA and Co. Keep pedalling this ****e to cyclists. Go figure eh?

It's a suggestion, you're free to ignore it. But as a cyclist, you have less protection than a motorist in the event of an accident. That's just a fact.

You doubt head injuries are common in car accidents? Really?

Never said that, rather than modern cars are structurally designed to protect their occupants in case of a crash (things like crumple zones), have seat belts and (for the driver and front seat passenger) airbags.

If all of those fail, then a little helmet isn't likely to make any difference. A helmet is just for if you don't have anything else to protect you.

07Lapierre · 21-07-2020 01:35PM

SeanW wrote: »

It's a suggestion, you're free to ignore it. But as a cyclist, you have less protection than a motorist in the event of an accident. That's just a fact.

Never said that, rather than modern cars are structurally designed to protect their occupants in case of a crash (things like crumple zones), have seat belts and (for the driver and front seat passenger) airbags.

If all of those fail, then a little helmet isn't likely to make any difference. A helmet is just for if you don't have anything else to protect you.

That's very true. if a car driver hits a cyclists, the car driver and passengers will be fine. the cyclist on the other hand... well the plastic hat is better than nothing right?

meeeeh · 21-07-2020 01:43PM

07Lapierre wrote: »

That's very true. if a car driver hits a cyclists, the car driver and passengers will be fine. the cyclist on the other hand... we'll the plastic hat is better than nothing right?

And exactly the same if cyclist hits a car. In general (but not always) the cyclists will be worse off. I don't overly care if adults (who are not close to me) don't wear seat belts when driving or helmets when cycling. It won't be me feeding them with the spoon for the rest of their lives. However I find it absolutely despicable when children are not protected properly.

07Lapierre · 21-07-2020 01:46PM

meeeeh wrote: »

And exactly the same if cyclist hits a car. In general (but not always) the cyclists will be worse off. .

Agreed... So its better the two never meet and we all agree that helmets are useless for Motorists and cyclists? Finally something we all agree on!

meeeeh · 21-07-2020 01:50PM

07Lapierre wrote: »

Agreed... So its better the two never meet and we all agree that helmets are useless for Motorists and cyclists? Finally something we all agree on!

As I said I don't overly care as it won't be me wiping the drool and whatever else.

I always wear helmet, not because I think it's always needed but because I want kids to always wear it.

Casey78 · 21-07-2020 01:52PM

But cyclists acting the dick are of no danger to anyone I thought?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/road.cc/content/news/268501-cyclist-court-accused-dangerous-cycling-following-pedestrians-death%3famp

07Lapierre · 21-07-2020 01:58PM

meeeeh wrote: »

As I said I don't overly care as it won't be me wiping the drool and whatever else.

I always wear helmet, not because I think it's always needed but because I want kids to always wear it.

You want kids to wear a plastic hat that you agree is useless?

shootermacg · 21-07-2020 01:59PM

Casey78 wrote: »

But cyclists acting the dick are of no danger to anyone I thought?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/road.cc/content/news/268501-cyclist-court-accused-dangerous-cycling-following-pedestrians-death%3famp

Wow, lets make joggers our next target, god knows they're also the same amount of pest!

SeanW · 21-07-2020 02:01PM

07Lapierre wrote: »

That's very true. if a car driver hits a cyclists, the car driver and passengers will be fine. the cyclist on the other hand... well the plastic hat is better than nothing right?

Well, accidents involving cyclist have a variety of causes.

Sometimes, as you suggest, accidents are caused by motorists negligently hitting cyclists.

It's also likely that in some cases the cyclist precipitated a collision with a motorist, either by crashing into a car or by disobeying a traffic control (e.g. running a red light) and causing a driver to crash into them.
And of course, we have cases where cyclists crash into stationary objects like parked cars, lamp posts etc.

Collision culpability varies, hence we have things like seat belts and helmets to protect the user in any circumstance. I actually don't care about the legalities of helmets, seat belts etc. I wear a seat belt when I'm driving because it makes sense, regardless of the law. I understand that I might get into an accident that's not my fault. Likewise, I suspect helmets help the cyclist in the case of a low-speed collision. If you don't want to wear a helmet, fine, just as long as you don't complain if you get avoidably hurt.

meeeeh · 21-07-2020 02:04PM

07Lapierre wrote: »

You want kids to wear a plastic hat that you agree is useless?

I didn't say it's useless. You said that and I'm not going to argue with someone whose actions won't affect me. Yes I insist my kids wear helmet when cycling. I try not to be neglectful parent.

ewc78 · 21-07-2020 02:08PM

shootermacg wrote: »

Wow, lets make joggers our next target, god knows they're also the same amount of pest!

Joggers are a pest, especially for us runners..

meeeeh · 21-07-2020 02:11PM

Don't start me on the walkers blocking the path.

07Lapierre · 21-07-2020 02:12PM

meeeeh wrote: »

I didn't say it's useless. You said that and I'm not going to argue with someone whose actions won't affect me. Yes I insist my kids wear helmet when cycling. I try not to be neglectful parent.

WARNING: You may get upset if you read this..

https://bicycledutch.wordpress.com/2015/05/19/cycling-with-babies-and-toddlers/

ewc78 · 21-07-2020 02:15PM

meeeeh wrote: »

Don't start me on the walkers blocking the path.

Especially those with dogs!!

07Lapierre · 21-07-2020 02:16PM

SeanW wrote: »

I wear a seat belt when I'm driving because it makes sense, regardless of the law.

Would you wear a seat belt driving this?

https://www.mascus.ie/agriculture/used-other-agricultural-machines/e-z-go-dark-blue-electric-golf-cart-st6568/j7adg8hd.html

SeanW · 21-07-2020 02:21PM

Umm ... that's a golf cart ... for use on golf courses ... at relatively low speeds ...

meeeeh · 21-07-2020 02:23PM

07Lapierre wrote: »

WARNING: You may get upset if you read this..

https://bicycledutch.wordpress.com/2015/05/19/cycling-with-babies-and-toddlers/

I didn't see one picture of kids actually cycling in your link. I don't know about you but I sincerely hope my bike control, awareness and knowledge of road rules is better than that of my kids. Anyway in quite a few countries in Europe helmets are mandatory for kids under 14 or 15. Maybe they are all morons and someone who posts a few links from twitter every so often knows better.

SeanW · 21-07-2020 02:27PM

07Lapierre wrote: »

WARNING: You may get upset if you read this..

https://bicycledutch.wordpress.com/2015/05/19/cycling-with-babies-and-toddlers/

This may go some way to explaining why the Netherlands does worse than Ireland in terms of some road safety measures:
Worse road fatality statistics per 100,000 population (2.9 vs. 3.8) and per billion vehicle kilometres driven (3.8 vs. 4.7)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate

07Lapierre · 21-07-2020 02:47PM

SeanW wrote: »

Umm ... that's a golf cart ... for use on golf courses ... at relatively low speeds ...

Exactly.. which might explain why it doesn't have air bags/crumple zones etc. etc.

SeanW · 21-07-2020 02:54PM

I'd imagine that a cyclist can go faster than a golf cart. Plus, bicycles are not limited to golf courses. Besides, that pokey little frame does provide the occupant with some protection.

Spook_ie · 21-07-2020 03:01PM

07Lapierre wrote: »

That's very true. if a car driver hits a cyclists, the car driver and passengers will be fine. the cyclist on the other hand... well the plastic hat is better than nothing right?

Well that depends, in minor collisions, where you get knocked off the bike then a helmet probably will save you more serious head injuries, in a 120kph accident (say on the motorway where we know cyclists aren't supposed to be, but somehow a few still don't seem to understand this) not so much.

07Lapierre · 21-07-2020 03:19PM

Spook_ie wrote: »

Well that depends, in minor collisions, where you get knocked off the bike then a helmet probably will save you more serious head injuries, in a 120kph accident (say on the motorway where we know cyclists aren't supposed to be, but somehow a few still don't seem to understand this) not so much.

Agreed, injuries (to everyone) vary depending on lots of factors...speed being one of the biggest factors. Other factors include lack of observation/awareness, phone use etc.

07Lapierre · 21-07-2020 03:21PM

SeanW wrote: »

I'd imagine that a cyclist can go faster than a golf cart. Plus, bicycles are not limited to golf courses. Besides, that pokey little frame does provide the occupant with some protection.

Golf carts are allowed on the road in Michegan! God bless America!

https://www.michiganautolaw.com/blog/2013/05/27/can-i-ride-my-golf-cart-or-orv-on-the-road/

Spook_ie · 21-07-2020 03:29PM

07Lapierre wrote: »

Agreed, injuries (to everyone) vary depending on lots of factors...speed being one of the biggest factors. Other factors include lack of observation/awareness, phone use etc.

No argument from me on that, especially about the phone use, is it time we introduced a ban on cyclists using their phones or other mobile devices, I see the Dutch think if worthwhile to delegitimise phone use by cyclists. As of July 2019 you face a €95 fine if they charge you.

https://dutchreview.com/culture/cycling/goodbye-to-two-wheeled-texting-five-things-you-need-to-know-about-the-electronic-device-ban-for-cyclists-in-the-netherlands/

Cycling on paths and other cycling issues (updated title)

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