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Covid19 Part XIX-25,802 in ROI (1,753 deaths) 5,859 in NI (556 deaths) (21/07)Read OP

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  • #4592
    quartz1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 397 ✭✭quartz1


    69,000 New Cases announced in one day in the US and we are allowing them fly in here .....the mind boggles . Not even an attempt to legislate for mandatory quarantine for them ..Texan guy interviewed yesterday arriving into Dublin on Newstalk offering his view that Covid is overblown .......


  • #4593
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Assetbacked wrote: »
    This is an incredible testing regime. Could Ireland learn from it?
    Did you have something in mind?


  • #4594
    Eod100
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,235 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    stephenjmcd wrote: »
    Another protest let go ahead in Dublin this time its antifa and the so called patriots. But sure blame everyone else. How on earth is this allowed to go ahead and then everyone else gets threatened with not moving onto phase 4

    https://twitter.com/eire_saoirse/status/1281942432154779649?s=19

    Presume that's the far-right one? Is there a counter-protest? Haven't heard of any. These guys are like the Qanon stuff in US, spreading vile and unhinged stuff about politicians.


  • #4595
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    quartz1 wrote: »
    69,000 New Cases announced in one day in the US and we are allowing them fly in here .....the mind boggles . Not even an attempt to legislate for mandatory quarantine for them ..Texan guy interviewed yesterday arriving into Dublin on Newstalk offering his view that Covid is overblown .......
    Saw somewhere that it was 16 people on the flight. That all sounds a bit like the "huge" numbers invading our ports back in March.


  • #4596
    ShineOn7
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,550 ✭✭✭ShineOn7


    JJayoo wrote: »
    A few months ago 200,000 deaths was predicted as the worst possible outcome for deaths in America from this Virus.... I think they are gonna hit this by the end of September the way the cases are accelerating.


    In the early days of this the CDC estimated 500,000 to 1.5 Million Americans would pass away due to Covid


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  • #4597
    stephenjmcd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,459 ✭✭✭✭stephenjmcd


    Eod100 wrote: »
    Presume that's the far-right one? Is there a counter-protest? Haven't heard of any. These guys are like the Qanon stuff in US, spreading vile and unhinged stuff about politicians.

    Yeah handful of counter appearently getting a bit rough so more Gardai been sent in.

    But what really annoys me is despite all the warnings to businesses and people they're still allowing protests, we were basically told behave this weekend or no phase 4. Makes the blood boil


  • #4598
    bb1234567
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,513 ✭✭✭bb1234567


    ShineOn7 wrote: »
    In the early days of this the CDC estimated 500,000 to 1.5 Million Americans would pass away due to Covid

    But how unlikely is 500k deaths in say 18 months time as they pandemic continues? Surely the CDC estimate figure is a prediction for the very end of the pandemic, not after just a few months, widespread infection in the US only began 4 months ago.


  • #4599
    Eod100
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,235 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    is_that_so wrote: »
    Saw somewhere that it was 16 people on the flight. That all sounds a bit like the "huge" numbers invading our ports back in March.

    That's only 1 flight though. I just think the risk is there if it's from area with very high concentration of virus to low. It might be blown out of proportion but with current guidelines there's literally nothing stopping people travelling for non-essential reasons and not self-isolating. No piece of paper of phone calls (even if everyone is called) will change that so can understand people's concerns.

    I know government said they couldn't do mandatory quarantine because they wouldn't have enough hotel rooms but if it's for high risk areas, it might discourage people meaning less would travel.


  • #4600
    JJayoo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,862 ✭✭✭JJayoo


    is_that_so wrote: »
    Saw somewhere that it was 16 people on the flight. That all sounds a bit like the "huge" numbers invading our ports back in March.




    "Four flights arrived in Dublin Airport from the US this morning - from New York, Chicago, Newark and Dallas"

    "The flights from Chicago and New York had about 70-80 people on board - they had been sold out, but many passengers did not show up at the airport in the US.

    The Newark flight had around 50 people on board, while the flight from Dallas had 16 passengers."

    So 226 people landing in from the states in the morning, would be Interesting to know the full amount for the day.

    But ya a bit more than 16



    https://www.newstalk.com/news/came-ireland-essentially-avoid-florida-passengers-arriving-ireland-us-1044223


  • #4601
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Eod100 wrote: »
    That's only 1 flight though. I just think the risk is there if it's from area with very high concentration of virus to low. It might be blown out of proportion but with current guidelines there's literally nothing stopping people travelling for non-essential reasons and not self-isolating. No piece of paper of phone calls (even if everyone is called) will change that so can understand people's concerns.

    I know government said they couldn't do mandatory quarantine because they wouldn't have enough hotel rooms but if it's for high risk areas, it might discourage people meaning less would travel.
    As was the flight of Bulgarian fruit pickers but the country lost the plot over that. Ultimately, it's down to personal responsibility and accepting that people will exercise that.


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  • #4602
    Eod100
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,235 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    stephenjmcd wrote: »
    Yeah handful of counter appearently getting a bit rough so more Gardai been sent in.

    But what really annoys me is despite all the warnings to businesses and people they're still allowing protests, we were basically told behave this weekend or no phase 4. Makes the blood boil

    I think it's a tricky one for the Gardai. Laws don't allow groups like that and can penalise organisers but very hard to find and prove who organises these things.

    Also not sure how they could break them all up or arrest them all with the size of the crowds. Probably don't want to go in hard with riot police because would look bad and put Gardai at more risk of violence and virus so it's a tricky one tbh


  • #4603
    Beechwoodspark
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,050 ✭✭✭✭Beechwoodspark


    Since Around March I’ve been calling for them to close off the borders for a list of countries such as America and Brazil and yes the UK and any other countries with a higher rate of infection. I emailed the taoiseachs office and got a simple note of acknowledgment but nothing further


  • #4604
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    JJayoo wrote: »
    "Four flights arrived in Dublin Airport from the US this morning - from New York, Chicago, Newark and Dallas"

    "The flights from Chicago and New York had about 70-80 people on board - they had been sold out, but many passengers did not show up at the airport in the US.

    The Newark flight had around 50 people on board, while the flight from Dallas had 16 passengers."

    So 226 people landing in from the states in the morning, would be Interesting to know the full amount for the day.

    But ya a bit more than 16



    https://www.newstalk.com/news/came-ireland-essentially-avoid-florida-passengers-arriving-ireland-us-1044223

    No information there on the breakdown of nationalities. Our own are entitled to come back anyway.


  • #4605
    Renjit
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 949 ✭✭✭Renjit


    is_that_so wrote: »
    No information there on the breakdown of nationalities. Our own are entitled to come back anyway.
    .
    One couple flew in to Ireland to see family and "essentially avoid Florida", saying they wanted to get out of the state as the COVID-19 situation there is 'pretty bad'.

    One of those passengers explained: "We got out while we could, and we went somewhere where the COVID was more contained.


  • #4606
    Eod100
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,235 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    is_that_so wrote: »
    As was the flight of Bulgarian fruit pickers but the country lost the plot over that. Ultimately, it's down to personal responsibility and accepting that people will exercise that.

    The poster above me as the figures so it's clear it's not just 16 people that have come in during 1 morning, nevermind a day.

    If people are doing everything in their responsibility to prevent getting the virus and holiday abroad as encouraged, think it's fair that at a minimum they shouldn't have to worry about people coming from high risk areas who haven't self isolated. Obviously it's not something in anyone's control but I can understand it as a legitimate concern.

    US doesn't allow in non residents or non citizens. Not sure why we don't have a reciprocal arrangement until US gets this under control.


  • #4607
    GerryFog
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69 ✭✭GerryFog


    JJayoo wrote: »
    "Four flights arrived in Dublin Airport from the US this morning - from New York, Chicago, Newark and Dallas"

    "The flights from Chicago and New York had about 70-80 people on board - they had been sold out, but many passengers did not show up at the airport in the US.

    The Newark flight had around 50 people on board, while the flight from Dallas had 16 passengers."

    So 226 people landing in from the states in the morning, would be Interesting to know the full amount for the day.

    But ya a bit more than 16



    https://www.newstalk.com/news/came-ireland-essentially-avoid-florida-passengers-arriving-ireland-us-1044223



    The vast majority of Americans arriving here are older and white and therefore disproportionately Trump supporting.

    That's important because it means they are far more likely to be the type to not wear masks and publicly gather in a country that has the highest infection rates in the world.

    Americans should not be allowed entry. Its completely insane. To be honest if I see an American tourist I am going to tell them exactly how I feel....That they are selfish ***** putting the health of my country people at risk so they can vacation


  • #4608
    Ficheall
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,038 ✭✭✭Ficheall


    is_that_so wrote: »
    Ultimately, it's down to personal responsibility and accepting that people will exercise that.
    Therein lies the rub.


  • #4609
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Renjit wrote: »
    Suddenly Ireland is a more lucrative tourist destination. Wonder why?
    It's their choice but they need to respect what we are expecting of them. Being American doesn't automatically make you infectious any more than the Italians meandering around Dublin in March were.


  • #4610
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Ficheall wrote: »
    Therein lies the rub.
    More to do with what your go-to judgement mindset is!


  • #4611
    ACitizenErased
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,767 ✭✭✭✭ACitizenErased


    If Dublin isn’t careful they’ll lock it down. The big cluster Dr. Glynn spoke about Thursday was in Dublin, then the drinking last week and protests today. Have to be very careful.


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  • #4612
    Eod100
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,235 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    I think a lot it is airlines flying flights because it's cheaper to run quieter flights, pay staff and pay fuel than refund all tickets booked.

    If someone has paid a few grand on flights and accommodation here and not getting refunds for the flights, they some will still come.

    Airlines should have allowed postponing of flights to next year if they hadn't already if they weren't refunding. Should have been more pressure from governments. Presumably if Ireland could and did close borders then airlines would have to refund anyway so surely there was some leverage there?


  • #4613
    YellowBucket
    Closed Accounts Posts: 491 ✭✭YellowBucket


    Inbound travel is fine, as long as it's safe. You can't really turn facts into politics. The simple reality is that there's a significant issue in the US, Brazil and a few other places at the moment. The US situation is being made worse by the way it's being handled, or rather not handled, there at present at a federal level and by quite a number of states too.

    If we were looking at this in terms of domestic policy, had we similar outbreaks we'd be isolating ourselves to avoid spread.

    If there are small numbers of people coming in (be they Irish or American or any other nationality) on US flights, we should be including an isolate (for a couple of days) pending a test result system. Or, requiring pre-departure tests done in commercial labs.

    The ideal scenario would be pre-departure screening.

    It would add maybe €100 - €200 to the price of a flight, but that's fairly insignificant given the risks and those costs could probably be reduced if you get improvements in commercial testing services.

    The situation in most European and the Asian countries we tend to have most contact with is far more pragmatic and sane about COVID-19 and most of them have it at least as under control as we have. So, the risks are likely not much different to moving between Kerry and Dublin.

    The US, or certainly certain parts of it, are unfortunately a mess right now and a bit of sensible precaution would be advisable.
    The same applies to Brazil and to a range of other countries that may have difficulties controlling spread.

    The US is really bizarre as the spread is happening due to political notions and reality denial, not lack of resources. It should be well able to contain this but hasn't got the leadership or societal cohesion to do it anymore.

    In my view, unless and until the US gets this under control, we have to take sensible precautions and the most logical one would probably be testing.

    Ideally it should be a couple of swabs at a US testing clinic before departure, stay at home until you're going to the airport and your proof of having no COVID-19 would be logged and you'd be clear to go.

    I'm pretty sure most people coming into Ireland on vacation or people returning to visit families and so on aren't likely to want to inadvertently carry in COVID-19 either. It's not like it's some kind of terrible burden to ask them to get tested. In general we don't have the kind of mass-market, low budget sun-seeking tourism that say Spain or Florida have, so it's unlikely to be an extremely difficult thing to achieve.

    For business travellers it probably makes a hell of a lot of sense to be getting tested anyway to avoid picking it up or spreading it around. It would open up business travel a lot more widely if we could get to a stage where testing was convenient and frequent.

    It looks to me like we are going to be dealing with the reality of this situation for at least another 12 months and possibly longer, so we need (globally) to start coming up with strategies to contain it properly. Being offended by the notion someone might be tested or quarantined isn't really going to achieve anything. The reality of it is we need to manage this properly and with least impact on day-to-day life.


  • #4614
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    GerryFog wrote: »
    The vast majority of Americans arriving here are older and white and therefore disproportionately Trump supporting.

    That's important because it means they are far more likely to be the type to not wear masks and publicly gather in a country that has the highest infection rates in the world.

    Americans should not be allowed entry. Its completely insane. To be honest if I see an American tourist I am going to tell them exactly how I feel....That they are selfish ***** putting the health of my country people at risk so they can vacation
    Bit of a mad post this but splendid idea. Let's keep the unclean out and shout at any that get through.


  • #4615
    stephenjmcd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,459 ✭✭✭✭stephenjmcd


    ACitizenErased wrote: »
    If Dublin isn’t careful they’ll lock it down. The big cluster Dr. Glynn spoke about Thursday was in Dublin, then the drinking last week and protests today. Have to be very careful.

    Sorry but the drinking issue is everywhere. Plenty of pictures online of other towns and cities but none making the front page of the papers. Its not just a Dublin issue.

    2 of the above issues you've listed are fairly straight forward public order issues for the Gardai but they seem to not be doing much. Anyway Dame Lane is I'm told at the moment fairly quiet. Looks like the tactic of give everyone a scare by telling them we won't move to phase 4 is working.

    The cluster of 9 in Dublin I've a funny feeling is the Kerry cluster.


  • #4616
    Eod100
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,235 ✭✭✭✭Eod100


    is_that_so wrote: »
    It's their choice but they need to respect what we are expecting of them. Being American doesn't automatically make you infectious any more than the Italians meandering around Dublin in March were.

    It's not just America though or Americans, it's anyone travelling from high-risk countries regardless of nationality. If it's non-essential travel then they shouldn't come nor if they can't self-isolate for 14 days.

    They are the clear travel and health guidelines. They're more than welcome once they have virus in control.

    US isn't letting non residents or non citizens in. Wouldn't seem unfair to have same here.


  • #4617
    ShineOn7
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,550 ✭✭✭ShineOn7


    is_that_so wrote: »
    Saw somewhere that it was 16 people on the flight. That all sounds a bit like the "huge" numbers invading our ports back in March.


    It was 16 Americans?

    What does it matter if it was 6, 16 or 56 of them?

    In my experience they're not a very bright nation overall and the guy on Pat Kenny yesterday only compounds this. Not having decent intelligence and Covid is not a good combination

    Their choices this year to holiday are so, so limited and we're one of only 28 countries of the over 200 affected by Covid still letting them in. America has always had links with Ireland so of course many of them will come here

    Our new "Government" (being very quiet aren't they?) aren't taking action because Michael doesn't want to lose his invite to a White House lunch in the future. It's fairly pathetic to be honest and yet here we are taking it

    I also suspect they know that because Americans will be here in their droves they will boost our tourism this year. An industry that's on it's knees, but it's not worth propping up with people from a country who have ballsed this up like very few others have

    There's 5 Million of us. We shouldn't be taking this lying down after months of the worst mental stress and sacrifice this country has seen in decades


  • #4618
    ACitizenErased
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,767 ✭✭✭✭ACitizenErased


    stephenjmcd wrote: »
    Sorry but the drinking issue is everywhere. Plenty of pictures online of other towns and cities but none making the front page of the papers. Its not just a Dublin issue.

    2 of the above issues you've listed are fairly straight forward public order issues for the Gardai but they seem to not be doing much. Anyway Dame Lane is I'm told at the moment fairly quiet. Looks like the tactic of give everyone a scare by telling them we won't move to phase 4 is working.

    The cluster of 9 in Dublin I've a funny feeling is the Kerry cluster.

    I don’t agree with everywhere. I have seen zero incidents in Cork City or even from friends in Killarney in the past two weeks.


  • #4619
    blade1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,807 ✭✭✭✭blade1


    Passed through a seaside village on my bike and could see a queue inside and out for 99s etc.
    They were crammed into the place.
    Plenty of camper vans and loads of tourists.
    The signs aren't looking good.


  • #4620
    US2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,651 ✭✭✭US2


    ShineOn7 wrote: »
    In the early days of this the CDC estimated 500,000 to 1.5 Million Americans would pass away due to Covid

    Pass away with covid not due to.


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  • #4621
    LawBoy2018
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,162 ✭✭✭LawBoy2018


    I was in Galway yesterday doing a little shopping. I'd say around 10% of people were wearing masks, if even. A woman ahead of me in the check out line in Tommy Hilfiger was coughing and spluttering and then she goes, "I think I've come down with something" while pissing herself laughing. The young clerk humoured her but was visibly uncomfortable.

    There were also loads of Americans around? They're predominantly old white guys but wtf. We can't vilify young people for enjoying themselves here in Ireland while we're simultaneously importing the virus from all over the world. The government can't have their cake and eat it. Personally, if there's a second wave and the restrictions are introduced again, I will be far less likely to comply. It sounds terrible but it's human nature. What an absolute slap in the face to everyone who complied with the regulations for the last 5 months and essentially eradicated the virus from the island...


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