Is it just me or have SF vanished?

Truthvader · 08-07-2020 11:16AM

Intrigued by all the posters seeking apologies from Sinn Fein/ IRA Mary Lou or Michelle on various issues.

The value of an apology is very much dependent on the integrity and moral character of the person issuing it.

An apology from any of these people is worthless. Can we move on?

FrancieBrady · 08-07-2020 11:18AM

blackwhite wrote: »

Bad phrasing on my part maybe - but they did their best to give it all the trappings of a burial, when no burial was taking place.

All for the sake of a Trump-style political rally

Funny how all the SF die-hards get worked up over poor phrasing - but the key point will be ignored over, and over and over.

Gotta defend the cult no matter what :rolleyes:

These type of funerals have been taking place for decades.

Incidentally, I have been in the graveyard for a gun salute over a coffin...and that was for an old FFer who was in what is known as the Old IRA. My dad, a friend of the man, was given an engraved bullet casing after. It is still about the house here somewhere.

SafeSurfer · 08-07-2020 11:19AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

What regs were broken in organising the funeral?

I think you'll find it was the same as the regs that a blind eye was turned to in other circumstances too and given a pass by EVERYONE who could see it happening. for empathetic reasons (in my case anyhow)

But once again, we have the climb up on to the high moral ground.

SF should take whatever criticism and penalties are appropriate for breaches of the regs.

The high moral grounders using a funeral for political gain will soon go back from whence they came.

Sinn Fein are the only ones “using a funeral for political gain”” as you put it.

FrancieBrady · 08-07-2020 11:20AM

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Sinn Fein are the only ones “using a funeral for political gain”” as you put it.

:D yeh sure.

blackwhite · 08-07-2020 11:24AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

These type of funerals have been taking place for decades.

Incidentally, I have been in the graveyard for a gun salute over a coffin...and that was for an old FFer who was in what is known as the Old IRA. My dad, a friend of the man, was given an engraved bullet casing after. It is still about the house here somewhere.

How many of those funerals involved calling to someone else's grave for a round of political speeches? How many of those brought a coffin to a graveyard with no intention of interring the coffin there?

And how many of those were during a pandemic?

FrancieBrady · 08-07-2020 11:29AM

blackwhite wrote: »

How many of those funerals involved calling to someone else's grave for a round of political speeches? How many of those brought a coffin to a graveyard with no intention of interring the coffin there?

And how many of those were during a pandemic?

Cremation, especially for Catholics, is a relatively new thing.

I fully accept that this was organised to eulogise a significant figure in republican circles.
But there was zero sinister about it. Those there knew it was symbolic, and serving the purpose of interring the ashes. Which is normally a separate ceremony after time has passed.

In other words they wanted to eulogise the man and pay tribute to him.

Mortelaro · 08-07-2020 11:31AM

Its a story refusing to go away understandably

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-53319231

Speaking for the Alliance Party, Kellie Armstrong said an apology for the ministers' attendance would not have been enough and she does not believe people can trust executive messaging again on Covid-19 because of their actions.

Daniel McCrossan said assembly members had to practise "what we preach".

The SDLP assembly member added that his party had wanted to pay a bigger tribute to long-standing MLA John Dallat, who died in May, but chose not to because of the coronavirus guidance.

He said to many people there was a "hierarchy of pain".

Meanwhile, Belfast City Council has strongly denied allegations 61 people attended Mr Storey's cremation.

The claim was made by UUP Belfast city councillor Jim Rodgers.

joeguevara · 08-07-2020 11:34AM

joeguevara wrote: »

What are the Regulations in Northern Ireland for funerals on the date of the funeral.

Similarly what are the Regulations in Republic of Ireland for travel to Northern Ireland and return to the Republic of Ireland on the date of the funeral.

Anyone?

blackwhite · 08-07-2020 11:39AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Cremation, especially for Catholics, is a relatively new thing.

I fully accept that this was organised to eulogise a significant figure in republican circles.
But there was zero sinister about it. Those there knew it was symbolic, and serving the purpose of interring the ashes. Which is normally a separate ceremony after time has passed.

In other words they wanted to eulogise the man and pay tribute to him.

It's a bit hard to inter the ashes before cremation - no doubt Johnny will be along soon to call you out on that "easily disproved deliberate and intentional lie" :rolleyes:

Not saying it was "sinister" - just that it was nothing more than SF putting on a show for a photo op beside someone else's grave - and highlights the hypocrisy of the SF cheerleaders who constantly whine that Varadkar is obsessed with photo ops.

Bonniedog · 08-07-2020 11:42AM

Hadn't realised that Big Bobby wasn't actually in the fkn box!

When the Beard dies they will probably embalm him and place him in a glass case in the Felons.

Mortelaro · 08-07-2020 11:47AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

In other words they wanted to eulogise the man and pay tribute to him.

As did 1000's of others in 100's of funerals but couldn't because of the rules

FrancieBrady · 08-07-2020 11:51AM

blackwhite wrote: »

It's a bit hard to inter the ashes before cremation - no doubt Johnny will be along soon to call you out on that "easily disproved deliberate and intentional lie" :rolleyes:

Not saying it was "sinister" - just that it was nothing more than SF putting on a show for a photo op beside someone else's grave - and highlights the hypocrisy of the SF cheerleaders who constantly whine that Varadkar is obsessed with photo ops.

Do you understand the meaning of 'symbolic'?

Yes, the cynical could say it was a 'photo op' opportunity. I am under no illusions about 'politics' and how funerals are used in Ireland generally.

I do think this was in the tradition of eulogising a big contributor to the party and that community.

To see the high moral grounders suddenly get sniffy about death and funeral etiqutte in Ireland is funny to watch though as if it was only SF who did or do these things around funerals (we all know the 'attending funeral jokes about the local TD/councillor of any hue)

blanch152 · 08-07-2020 11:54AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I fully accept that this was organised to eulogise a significant figure in republican circles.
But there was zero sinister about it.

What makes him so ****ing special, compared to thousands that have died during this pandemic?

The arrogance displayed by Sinn Fein and their supporters on this issue will have been an eye-opener. The pigs are just like the humans.

FrancieBrady · 08-07-2020 11:56AM

Mortelaro wrote: »

As did 1000's of others in 100's of funerals but couldn't because of the rules

No bother doing it when it was a 'servant of the state' though.
Which I would fully agree with and had absolutely no problem with the many visible breaches that happened there btw.

I can use empathy and compassion when it is appropriate and I think EVRYONE did around that event.

Bobby Storey was a huge figure in the community. His death was sudden and a shock.
If you want to discard your empathy fair enough.
I accept SF got it wrong and made mistakes, but trying to make it a bigger thing than it actually was is a bit disgusting of the people involved in that.

blanch152 · 08-07-2020 11:56AM

McMurphy wrote: »

In this case the "someone else being at fault" would be Mr Blackwhite for telling a fairly easily disproved deliberate and intentional lie.

The details of his funeral arrangements were widely known and planned for well in advance, you deliberately said a "pretend burial" and a "staged burial" - an out and out lie which is extraordinarily easy to disprove.

His funeral arrangements always had the crystal clear arrangements for a "short commemoration and oration" after the mass at Milltown republican plot.

There's plenty to criticise Sinn Fein over the funeral, but there's no need for blatant lies.

Are you going to withdraw the lie, or would you like the funeral arrangements posted on the thread?

So you accept that it was for political reasons that an oration was held at the graveside, because there was no other reason for it to take place?

Sinn Fein using a funeral for political purposes during a pandemic. Quelle surprise.

FrancieBrady · 08-07-2020 11:58AM

blanch152 wrote: »

What makes him so ****ing special, compared to thousands that have died during this pandemic?

The arrogance displayed by Sinn Fein and their supporters on this issue will have been an eye-opener. The pigs are just like the humans.

What makes anyone 'special' in death? Are we going to pretend now that everyone is treated equally in death and how they are buried?

It wasn't YOU who was burying him blanch, it was his family and his community and the party he belonged to.

FrancieBrady · 08-07-2020 12:03PM

blanch152 wrote: »

So you accept that it was for political reasons that an oration was held at the graveside, because there was no other reason for it to take place?

Sinn Fein using a funeral for political purposes during a pandemic. Quelle surprise.

It was a graveside oration at the place where his ashes would be interred later.

I am full sure there would be political content, politics and SF were a more than significant part of the man's life after all. But I am also sure the character of Storey the man and what he meant to people would have been addressed too. MON recited a Robert Frost poem I believe, hardly party political, is it?

Bonniedog · 08-07-2020 12:09PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It wasn't YOU who was burying him blanch.

Nobody buried him!

It was a piece of crass street theatre.

How many people who attended and lined the route knew this, that they were unpaid extras in some weirdness?

Mortelaro · 08-07-2020 12:19PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

No bother doing it when it was a 'servant of the state' though.
Which I would fully agree with and had absolutely no problem with the many visible breaches that happened there btw.

I can use empathy and compassion when it is appropriate and I think EVRYONE did around that event.

Bobby Storey was a huge figure in the community. His death was sudden and a shock.
If you want to discard your empathy fair enough.
I accept SF got it wrong and made mistakes, but trying to make it a bigger thing than it actually was is a bit disgusting of the people involved in that.

You are comparing Bobby Storey to a murdered Garda's state Funeral
Well done for the gaul
Your leader doesn't do that because she has more sense

FrancieBrady · 08-07-2020 12:19PM

Bonniedog wrote: »

Nobody buried him!

It was a piece of crass street theatre.

How many people who attended and lined the route knew this, that they were unpaid extras in some weirdness?

All funerals are a form of theatre Bonnie.
His funeral notice said that 'afterwards there would be a short ceremony and oration'.

Bonniedog · 08-07-2020 12:22PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

All funerals are a form of theatre Bonnie.
His funeral notice said that 'afterwards there would be a short ceremony and oration'.

Any funeral i was ever at did not pretend that the person who had died was going to be buried there but wasn't

FrancieBrady · 08-07-2020 12:25PM

Mortelaro wrote: »

You are comparing Bobby Storey to a murdered Garda's state Funeral

I didn't compare 'Bobby Storey' to anyone or anything Mort. Your subtlety isn't very good.

I compared 'funerals'.

Funerals and the bull**** that goes on around them, the fake eulogising etc makes me cringe tbh.

My own instructions are to chuck me on a rubbish tip somewhere and go to the pub. No church or ceremony.

Won't happen no doubt. But it will give you an idea what I think of them all, a SF one included.

Mortelaro · 08-07-2020 12:26PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I didn't compare 'Bobby Storey' to anyone or anything Mort. Your subtlety isn't very good.

I compared 'funerals'.

Funerals and the bull**** that goes on around them, the fake eulogising etc makes me cringe tbh.

My own instructions are to chuck me on a rubbish tip somewhere and go to the pub. No church or ceremony.

Won't happen no doubt. But it will give you an idea what I think of them all, a SF one included.

yeah right

FrancieBrady · 08-07-2020 12:28PM

Bonniedog wrote: »

Any funeral i was ever at did not pretend that the person who had died was going to be buried there but wasn't

There is NO 'person' there Bonnie, at any funeral, there is a body. You fell for the theatre!

You are assuming those there did not know he was to be cremated and ignoring the fact the crematorium was ready as were the PSNI and that a delagation of family and friends left the graveyard to go to the fecking crematorium. :rolleyes:

rdwight · 08-07-2020 12:30PM

There was no reason why the Milltown part of the extravaganza couldn't have been postponed until the first anniversary of Storey's death. Even Putin postponed the WWII victory parade for a few weeks.

Bonniedog · 08-07-2020 12:49PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

There is NO 'person' there Bonnie, at any funeral, there is a body. You fell for the theatre!
You are assuming those there did not know he was to be cremated and ignoring the fact the crematorium was ready as were the PSNI and that a delagation of family and friends left the graveyard to go to the fecking crematorium. :rolleyes:

"The person who had died," I believe I said. Storey was dead I assume so the Milltown thing could have been staged at a ballad session in the Felons. It made a mockery of a ceremony many people take seriously.

Only people offhand i can think of who might have been buried alive were republicans tortured and murdered by Scap to protect the Belfast Brigade traitors and touts.

blanch152 · 08-07-2020 01:11PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

What makes anyone 'special' in death? Are we going to pretend now that everyone is treated equally in death and how they are buried?

It wasn't YOU who was burying him blanch, it was his family and his community and the party he belonged to.

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It was a graveside oration at the place where his ashes would be interred later.

I am full sure there would be political content, politics and SF were a more than significant part of the man's life after all. But I am also sure the character of Storey the man and what he meant to people would have been addressed too. MON recited a Robert Frost poem I believe, hardly party political, is it?

So, we have now established that it was a singularly unique funeral during the pandemic.

He wasn't buried, it was all for show, for a political oration.

Can we get an apology from you and the other SF fans for the comparisons with Garda Horkan who died while serving his country, unlike that criminal thug you are defending. We have had to put up with nauseating post after nauseating post comparing the funeral to Horkans, when all along, you, Bowie, McMurphy and others knew all along that the two funerals were very different in that he wasn't being buried, and that it was all for a political show.

blanch152 · 08-07-2020 01:15PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

No bother doing it when it was a 'servant of the state' though.
Which I would fully agree with and had absolutely no problem with the many visible breaches that happened there btw.

I can use empathy and compassion when it is appropriate and I think EVRYONE did around that event.

Bobby Storey was a huge figure in the community. His death was sudden and a shock.
If you want to discard your empathy fair enough.
I accept SF got it wrong and made mistakes, but trying to make it a bigger thing than it actually was is a bit disgusting of the people involved in that.

I have said already that while Bobby Storey was a criminal thug who caused misery to many people, and that the world will be a nicer and safer place without him, to his family, he would be something else.

If you want an empathy deficit, you just have to listen to the words of the two leaders of Sinn Fein, unapologetic for going to the funeral.

joeguevara · 08-07-2020 01:20PM

blanch152 wrote: »

I have said already that while Bobby Storey was a criminal thug who caused misery to many people, and that the world will be a nicer and safer place without him, to his family, he would be something else.

If you want an empathy deficit, you just have to listen to the words of the two leaders of Sinn Fein, unapologetic for going to the funeral.

Was there any laws broken by anyone in Northern Ireland or for people returning to Republic of Ireland?

FrancieBrady · 08-07-2020 01:22PM

blanch152 wrote: »

I have said already that while Bobby Storey was a criminal thug who caused misery to many people, and that the world will be a nicer and safer place without him, to his family, he would be something else.

If you want an empathy deficit, you just have to listen to the words of the two leaders of Sinn Fein, unapologetic for going to the funeral.

To more than 'his family', as evidenced by the turnout at his funeral.

Is it just me or have SF vanished?

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