Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - Read OP for Mod Warnings

_Kaiser_ · 29-06-2020 11:08AM

Listening to Radio 1 here and they are speaking to someone in a creche at the moment. This whole "pod" thing sounds miserable. Poor kids

Theboinkmaster · 29-06-2020 11:11AM

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Listening to Radio 1 here and they are speaking to someone in a creche at the moment. This whole "pod" thing sounds miserable. Poor kids

Not really - a lot of creches are organised in groups anyway.

My kids went back to creche this morning and they're just going back to normal rooms aka "pods". They are delighted with themselves.

29-06-2020 11:17AM

skelly22 wrote: »

Agreed, your personal situation is absolutely no business of mine. But it does help me better understand why you continue to cheerlead restrictions. You can word that any way you want but you can't pretend it's not true.

Again you have not read what I have written. Wife has no work. My hours and pay has been reduced 20% through a corporate decision to save cash as role is not direct production even though workload is unchanged and sales are strong. Have seen dozens of contractors lose their jobs.

And for the umpteenth tine, I do not cheerlead continued restrictions. Since when do many on here, on both sides of the argument by the way, let facts get in the way of a good rant

Ginger n Lemon · 29-06-2020 11:25AM

RIP Irish tourism.

"Coronavirus: Easing of overseas travel rules may be delayed

The planned easing of restrictions on overseas travel from next month could be delayed, Ministers in the incoming Government have signalled.

Under pressure from public health officials concerned about a possible resurgence of Covid-19 cases linked to foreign travel, key Ministers on Sunday urged caution in any loosening of the restrictions."

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/coronavirus-easing-of-overseas-travel-rules-may-be-delayed-1.4291001?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fnews%2Fhealth%2Fcoronavirus-easing-of-overseas-travel-rules-may-be-delayed-1.4291001

Very disappointing. Oh well, 203 euros for all, but our new cases are in single digits so we are sorted there! :rolleyes: Casual 150,000 - 250,000 employed in the sector.

opinionated3 · 29-06-2020 11:27AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

RIP Irish tourism.

"Coronavirus: Easing of overseas travel rules may be delayed

The planned easing of restrictions on overseas travel from next month could be delayed, Ministers in the incoming Government have signalled.

Under pressure from public health officials concerned about a possible resurgence of Covid-19 cases linked to foreign travel, key Ministers on Sunday urged caution in any loosening of the restrictions."

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/coronavirus-easing-of-overseas-travel-rules-may-be-delayed-1.4291001?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fnews%2Fhealth%2Fcoronavirus-easing-of-overseas-travel-rules-may-be-delayed-1.4291001

Very disappointing. Oh well, 203 euros for all, but our new cases are in single digits so we are sorted there! :rolleyes: Casual 150,000 - 250,000 employed in the sector.

Careful now or the Doom and gloom merchants will have you shot for caring about people's employment!

29-06-2020 11:32AM

opinionated3 wrote: »

Careful now or the Doom and gloom merchants will have you shot for caring about people's employment!

Who are the doom and gloom merchants now? By and large with the exception of the few continuing to peddle fear, those who recognise the impact of the restrictions in controlling the virus are those showing positivity. Are also those who see businesses getting back on their feet as the underlying strength of the Irish economy is strong. It’s a nine to 12 month journey however and was always going to be.

GocRh · 29-06-2020 11:39AM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

RIP Irish tourism.

"Coronavirus: Easing of overseas travel rules may be delayed

The funny part is that govt claims to be following international guidelines.
Germany has been open for EU visitors for 2 weeks now, and longer for neighbouring countries, and there's no sign of a resurgence because of travel.

We will be the last country in the EU to allow travel. Just as we were the last EU country to reopen the economy. Seems to be a pattern...

Ginger n Lemon · 29-06-2020 11:40AM

opinionated3 wrote: »

Careful now or the Doom and gloom merchants will have you shot for caring about people's employment!

I am used to it. I am enemy number 1 in this thread.

People find it much more appealing and noble to keep talking about saving 1 life than worry about 15% GDP fall and consequences that come as a result of that.

Also, an easy way out, blame worldwide recession! Things are bad here because of troubles abroad, yeah well how the f*ck do you explain below?? Is it French minister imposing quarantine in Ireland? no, its Irish govt decimating Irish tourism

“We were running over 50 buses,” Finn says.

“We had 150 staff. We had six hostels. We had four BnBs. We had service departments. We had six gift shops and tourist information centres around the country. We had 10 new buses coming into the fleet for 2020 and business was very strong.

“Now, not one of the staff is working, not one vehicle is moving, not one shop is open, not one hostel is open, not one BnB is open.”

“We can’t have a plan until the government gets back to us about what they’re doing with the 14-day quarantine period,” Finn says.

“If I could tell my customers on my website that the 14-day quarantine period is finishing on 31 July or 1 September and we’ll be open for business thereafter, then we could do all our marketing and all our pushing. Then we could do all our sales. Then we could tell people who have tours booked for the end of the year that they can come over.”

https://www.thejournal.ie/tourism-businesses-phase-three-5132684-Jun2020/

But dont worry, classic response to all of this "yeah the new number of cases is low because of restrictions! We dont want any foreign tourists without 14 day quarantine until a vaccine is rolled out! Do a stayacation if you want to support Irish jobs" :rolleyes:

Ginger n Lemon · 29-06-2020 11:45AM

GocRh wrote: »

The funny part is that govt claims to be following international guidelines.
Germany has been open for EU visitors for 2 weeks now, and longer for neighbouring countries, and there's no sign of a resurgence because of travel.

We will be the last country in the EU to allow travel. Just as we were the last EU country to reopen the economy. Seems to be a pattern...

There is a pattern alright, we are the slow Irish afterall. Did we get 1.91 bn out of 750bn recovery fund? yes. Why? Well why would you give money to someone who is incompetent? just going to piss it away like. And thats what we have been doing since 1st of May when that idiotic 2 week extension was announced, pissing money away on empty hospitals, giving 350 euro a week to part time workers who were earning less than 350 before covid, doing our best to get to that 250bn national debt, for a country of 5 million. :rolleyes:

FintanMcluskey · 29-06-2020 11:53AM

Deleted User wrote: »

It’s a nine to 12 month journey however and was always going to be.

What is a 12 month journey???

I think its a complete lack of understanding some have regarding the point of restrictions. They are only effective at "flattening the curve" and preventing overwhelming the ICU's.

Covid will be here forever, like influenza. A safe vaccine will be years away. Are you willing to undertake these restrictions every year for the rest of your life?

When do we understand its dangerous to the same people that are vulnerable to influenza and act accordingly?

29-06-2020 12:11PM

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

What is a 12 month journey???

I think its a complete lack of understanding some have regarding the point of restrictions. They are only effective at "flattening the curve" and preventing overwhelming the ICU's.

Covid will be here forever, like influenza. A safe vaccine will be years away. Are you willing to undertake these restrictions every year for the rest of your life?

When do we understand its dangerous to the same people that are vulnerable to influenza and act accordingly?

12 months to return to a growing economy. I neither believe there should or will be the need for large scale restrictions in the absence of a vaccine.

average_runner · 29-06-2020 12:14PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

RIP Irish tourism.

"Coronavirus: Easing of overseas travel rules may be delayed

The planned easing of restrictions on overseas travel from next month could be delayed, Ministers in the incoming Government have signalled.

Under pressure from public health officials concerned about a possible resurgence of Covid-19 cases linked to foreign travel, key Ministers on Sunday urged caution in any loosening of the restrictions."

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/coronavirus-easing-of-overseas-travel-rules-may-be-delayed-1.4291001?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fnews%2Fhealth%2Fcoronavirus-easing-of-overseas-travel-rules-may-be-delayed-1.4291001

Very disappointing. Oh well, 203 euros for all, but our new cases are in single digits so we are sorted there! :rolleyes: Casual 150,000 - 250,000 employed in the sector.

Travel in Ireland if you want to protect irish tourism.

Spain wants everyone over there now, so they make their money and what happens afterwards dont matter.

But if we enter another lockdown, bye bye even more jobs.

acequion · 29-06-2020 12:19PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

RIP Irish tourism.

"Coronavirus: Easing of overseas travel rules may be delayed

The planned easing of restrictions on overseas travel from next month could be delayed, Ministers in the incoming Government have signalled.

Under pressure from public health officials concerned about a possible resurgence of Covid-19 cases linked to foreign travel, key Ministers on Sunday urged caution in any loosening of the restrictions."

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/coronavirus-easing-of-overseas-travel-rules-may-be-delayed-1.4291001?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fnews%2Fhealth%2Fcoronavirus-easing-of-overseas-travel-rules-may-be-delayed-1.4291001

Very disappointing. Oh well, 203 euros for all, but our new cases are in single digits so we are sorted there! :rolleyes: Casual 150,000 - 250,000 employed in the sector.

Extremely disappointing from the new Government.:(

Quite apart from the enormous economic cost and putting aside people's right to freedom of travel, there is also a huge social cost as families are being kept apart. My cousins buried their father in February just before all this,they all live abroad in EU countries. They've not been able to come back to Ireland to visit their mother since so she has been grieving alone. Fair enough all along as we had to flatten the curve but now? There will be families like that all over the country as being a nation of emigrants, so many have loved ones abroad.

The irony is that in the height of the pandemic there was no passenger locator form or 14 day quarantine but there is now that the curve is successfully flattened.

average_runner · 29-06-2020 12:22PM

GocRh wrote: »

The funny part is that govt claims to be following international guidelines.
Germany has been open for EU visitors for 2 weeks now, and longer for neighbouring countries, and there's no sign of a resurgence because of travel.

We will be the last country in the EU to allow travel. Just as we were the last EU country to reopen the economy. Seems to be a pattern...

German numbers have increased over the last 2 weeks, small spikes but has gone up.

drunkmonkey · 29-06-2020 12:22PM

The problem is we have to keep the curve flat, our hospitals are back in a mess with people on trolleys again. If we get a resurgence were in awful trouble.
"Number of patients on trolleys in Irish hospitals at highest level since before lockdown began"
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/number-of-patients-on-trolleys-in-irish-hospitals-at-highest-level-since-before-lockdown-began-1008070.html

Ginger n Lemon · 29-06-2020 12:23PM

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

Spare us the victim complex. You're a hypocrite who claims to care about jobs yet won't say a word against the people who won't support local businesses because they can't be arsed queueing.

Meanwhile I've been getting takeaways from local bars and restaurants, I'll be staying in a hotel and getting a haircut next week, yet according to the black and white picture you want to paint of people I'm a lockdown merchant who is scared to go outside and doesn't care about the economy because I'm in favour of a cautious reopening.

:pac:

Brilliant.

Okay, let me take on your role for a minute:

"ohh you dont want to queue? whats wrong with you!! Stand in the queue, in pissing rain and support Irish jobs!!!! People have died like! What the hell?! What is wrong with you?? Its only a 30 minute queue. If you need to queue multiple times per day - fine, do it and stop complaining!!!"

In theory yes. In practice, thousands of customers just dont go. Or go elsewhere. I am very happy you if you have so much patience, but tons of people will not be arsed queuing this is simple logic.

Also, if I tell you now that our cautious re opening will cost 150,000 jobs lost permanently, will you still be in favour of cautious re opening?

Ginger n Lemon · 29-06-2020 12:29PM

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

Let me take on your role for a minute

"The economy is in danger, but don't do anything to help it. Sure that's too much work. Just give out about it on boards."

Answer my question please.

bucketybuck · 29-06-2020 12:33PM

Deleted User wrote: »

It’s a nine to 12 month journey however and was always going to be.

This is just another meaningless slogan, they seem to be very popular these days. "In this together", "Stay strong by staying apart", "Its a journey", "The new normal". Nice on billboards but **** all use in the real world.

The problem is that even if this was a "journey", people don't seem to realise that the damage done now increases the length of that journey exponentially. Every week and month delayed now isn't just another week or month onto the end of the "journey", we can't just sit tight for another month and think that the journey will still be the same.

Every week we wait means another business going bust, another family in debt, another child losing their education. 9 to 12 months? What use is that when the business has already failed and gone because others just wanted to sit on their hands a bit longer? Gone is gone, might as well be 9-12 years.

Elmer Blooker · 29-06-2020 12:35PM

opinionated3 wrote: »

Careful now or the Doom and gloom merchants will have you shot for caring about people's employment!

The 'Stockholm syndrome' merchants might be another description.

Many psychologists and medical professionals consider Stockholm syndrome a coping mechanism, or a way to help victims handle the trauma of a terrifying situation.

Surely even the lockdown brigade realise by now that the economy is in shreds and a winter of discontent is ahead.

Ginger n Lemon · 29-06-2020 12:35PM

Can someone please explain to me why are we so concerned with foreign tourists when below is happening in our own back yard?

"Dubliners voice disgust as hundreds break lockdown restrictions for session in St Stephens Green

‘Here not to be that person but what the f*** was that in Stephen’s green tonight ?? People are still dying the virus isn’t gone and not one single f*** was given. I just watched a video of a conga line. Clearly none of them has had sick relatives or friends,’ wrote one Twitter user.

https://extra.ie/2020/06/26/news/irish-news/hundreds-rave-st-stephens-green

And ministers are concerned with foreign travel? You can see why one would laugh at Ireland cant you

bucketybuck · 29-06-2020 12:37PM

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

Let me take on your role for a minute

"The economy is in danger, but don't do anything to help it. Sure that's too much work. Just give out about it on boards."

What is more important and relevant to the economy, the punitive restrictions in all sectors or one guy not queuing for a chip? I would suggest some peoples focus is misplaced.

bodhrandude · 29-06-2020 12:38PM

When are we likely to see trad music sessions and live music again, would it be after the August phase.

Allinall · 29-06-2020 12:39PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Can someone please explain to me why are we so concerned with foreign tourists when below is happening in our own back yard?

"Dubliners voice disgust as hundreds break lockdown restrictions for session in St Stephens Green

‘Here not to be that person but what the f*** was that in Stephen’s green tonight ?? People are still dying the virus isn’t gone and not one single f*** was given. I just watched a video of a conga line. Clearly none of them has had sick relatives or friends,’ wrote one Twitter user.

https://extra.ie/2020/06/26/news/irish-news/hundreds-rave-st-stephens-green

And ministers are concerned with foreign travel? You can see why one would laugh at Ireland cant you

Where did you read that ministers were not concerned about the goings on in Stephens green?

I'd like to have a look.

setanta1984 · 29-06-2020 12:46PM

Just curious - for how long do people think we should keep the whole queuing outside shops and shopping centres and all the multitude of other restrictions on businesses for?

Unless people want to keep them until there is a vaccine and it is totally eliminated like smallpox then I don't see what the point is having them now when we have such minuscule levels of the virus in Ireland at present.
There is no real logic at all when our levels are where they are, not at USA levels or March/April levels here. Unless you want them permenantly.

You either want them forever or we have to accept that where we are now is about the best scenario imaginable without eradication and all the current scenario is all just PR window dressing.

I'm hoping that this only lasts a few more weeks and we collectively come to this realisation pretty quickly.

Ginger n Lemon · 29-06-2020 12:49PM

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

The restrictions aren't just there for the fun of it. By the levels of support people are getting for saying they can't be arsed queueing up it's obviously not just one guy either. The restrictions are in place whether you like it or not. Going out and standing in a queue is going to help a struggling business a hell of a lot more than giving out on boards. Misplaced focus indeed.

We email our TDs. Multiple times, I have anyway.

Government has decimated our economy with over the top restrictions and continues to do so on daily basis, and yet you think me queuing outside a chipper will save it? Can you please tell me why are we waiting for 3 weeks before allowing pubs to re open? What will change in 3 weeks? Please consider that our new cases are in SINGLE digits for last 7 days like more or less.

Also, you want me to stay in Ireland this summer and spend all my money on overpriced hotels? Am i the tourist now in my own country?? Mad beyond belief.

GocRh · 29-06-2020 12:49PM

average_runner wrote: »

German numbers have increased over the last 2 weeks, small spikes but has gone up.

Localised outbreaks, as was expected, and unrelated to international travel (mostly in meat factories).

29-06-2020 12:51PM

bucketybuck wrote: »

This is just another meaningless slogan, they seem to be very popular these days. "In this together", "Stay strong by staying apart", "Its a journey", "The new normal". Nice on billboards but **** all use in the real world.

The problem is that even if this was a "journey", people don't seem to realise that the damage done now increases the length of that journey exponentially. Every week and month delayed now isn't just another week or month onto the end of the "journey", we can't just sit tight for another month and think that the journey will still be the same.

Every week we wait means another business going bust, another family in debt, another child losing their education. 9 to 12 months? What use is that when the business has already failed and gone because others just wanted to sit on their hands a bit longer? Gone is gone, might as well be 9-12 years.

Some people actually understood back in March what was happening and the economic effects were going to be severe irrespective of what was done. They also understood that the number of tourists arriving here this year would be tiny no matter what was done. Others believe all the impacts are as a result of local policies only

29-06-2020 12:57PM

setanta1984 wrote: »

Just curious - for how long do people think we should keep the whole queuing outside shops and shopping centres and all the multitude of other restrictions on businesses for?

Unless people want to keep them until there is a vaccine and it is totally eliminated like smallpox then I don't see what the point is having them now when we have such minuscule levels of the virus in Ireland at present.
There is no real logic at all when our levels are where they are, not at USA levels or March/April levels here. Unless you want them permenantly.

You either want them forever or we have to accept that where we are now is about the best scenario imaginable without eradication and all the current scenario is all just PR window dressing.

I'm hoping that this only lasts a few more weeks and we collectively come to this realisation pretty quickly.

Believe Irekand is the only place with restrictions remaining?

Italy
“Bars and restaurants started sit-down service 1 June. Retailers, museums and libraries opened 18 May, with salons and gyms opened 1 June. Schools, nurseries, day cares and summer camps remained closed, but schools will resume in September.

Social distancing rules are still in effect”

Some things there that we have opened that are still closed in Italy. Most of the rest is similar.Can do the same for more places if you wish. The accepted wisdom on here appears to be that mainland Europe is a free for all

Ginger n Lemon · 29-06-2020 01:04PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Some people actually understood back in March what was happening and the economic effects were going to be severe irrespective of what was done. They also understood that the number of tourists arriving here this year would be tiny no matter what was done. Others believe all the impacts are as a result of local policies only

Its because of thinking like that - we got 1.91/750bn of EU recovery fund.

Also - how is it that number of tourists arriving into Spain is not tiny? They had 0 cases 0 deaths? They are covid free? :rolleyes:

Reality is - when it comes to foreign travel, you'd think Gerry Killeen is calling the shots.

TaurenDruid · 29-06-2020 01:05PM

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

We email our TDs. Multiple times, I have anyway.

Government has decimated our economy with over the top restrictions and continues to do so on daily basis, and yet you think me queuing outside a chipper will save it? Can you please tell me why are we waiting for 3 weeks before allowing pubs to re open? What will change in 3 weeks? Please consider that our new cases are in SINGLE digits for last 7 days like more or less.

Also, you want me to stay in Ireland this summer and spend all my money on overpriced hotels? Am i the tourist now in my own country?? Mad beyond belief.

Wait - so we need to end the restrictions to re-open business to get the economy back up and running, and hang the vulnerable. Ok - that's a view, and not too uncommon.

But when restrictions are lifted, you, personally, can't be arsed actually spending you money in the Irish economy, and will instead try to spend it in Spain or France or Greece instead.

Wow.

Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

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Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - Read OP for Mod Warnings